ICD7 vs ICD24?

[soccerballtux]

perhaps ICD24 is harder to spread? Is it not worth paying >2x as much for ($17) / ICD7 is 'good enough' (7!)?

I sent BonzaiDuck a PM about this but perhaps everyone would benefit. For those who don't know, ICD7 is a pretty good TIM...

 

[Burpo]

Céramique2 dropped my temps substantially (7c), allowing me a little more OC headroom.. Just sayin..

 

[BonzaiDuck]

perhaps ICD24 is harder to spread? Is it not worth paying >2x as much for ($17) / ICD7 is 'good enough' (7!)?

I sent BonzaiDuck a PM about this but perhaps everyone would benefit. For those who don't know, ICD7 is a pretty good TIM...

I'll get to your PMs post-haste, after addressing what may be a misconception on your part.

In certain realms of human experience, I'm fairly ignorant. Don't buy jewelry. Wristwatch is a simple CASIO 200m water-resist $60 sports-watch. Not much familiar with precious gems, certainly no more familiar with diamond. But I believe a measure of diamond value or potential diamond value is weight, and I believe a measure of weight is the carat.

To be more specific it is a "unit of mass" applied to measuring "gemstones and pearls."

The Hope Diamond has a lot of carrots. I mean -- "carats." It could purchase the entire commodity-market of carrots, and several art-masterpieces. A single ICD diamond particle has only a teensy-weensy itty-bitty fraction of a carat.

Here are the specs for ICD24 and ICD7, in that order:

ICD24 4.5 W/m-K Thermal Conductance
0.25oC-cm2/W@ 100 ì BLT Thermal Resistance
< 40 ì Maximum Particle Diameter
4.8 Gram

ICD7 Thermal Conductance 4.5 W/m-K
Thermal Resistance0.25oC-cm2/W@ 100 µ BLT
Average Particle Size<40 µ maximum particle diameter
1.5 gram

So when you choose ICD24 over ICD7, you're getting a bigger tube and quantity of the paste. Nothing more; nothing less.

 

[soccerballtux]

heh, silly question. Yes, so ICD24 is supposedly just a bigger tube of 7. I thought the diamonds were packed in tighter or something... :doh:

 

[soccerballtux]

I'll get to your PMs post-haste, after addressing what may be a misconception on your part.

In certain realms of human experience, I'm fairly ignorant. Don't buy jewelry. Wristwatch is a simple CASIO 200m water-resist $60 sports-watch. Not much familiar with precious gems, certainly no more familiar with diamond. But I believe a measure of diamond value or potential diamond value is weight, and I believe a measure of weight is the carat.

To be more specific it is a "unit of mass" applied to measuring "gemstones and pearls."

The Hope Diamond has a lot of carrots. I mean -- "carats." It could purchase the entire commodity-market of carrots, and several art-masterpieces. A single ICD diamond particle has only a teensy-weensy itty-bitty fraction of a carat.

Here are the specs for ICD24 and ICD7, in that order:

ICD24 4.5 W/m-K Thermal Conductance
0.25oC-cm2/W@ 100 ì BLT Thermal Resistance
< 40 ì Maximum Particle Diameter
4.8 Gram

ICD7 Thermal Conductance 4.5 W/m-K
Thermal Resistance0.25oC-cm2/W@ 100 µ BLT
Average Particle Size<40 µ maximum particle diameter
1.5 gram

So when you choose ICD24 over ICD7, you're getting a bigger tube and quantity of the paste. Nothing more; nothing less.

I think it's very nice of you to explain to us nerds how diamonds and julery work, since none of us will be dating much, much less getting married and learning about carrots and stuff.. ;P

 

[sm625]

< 40 ì Maximum Particle Diameter

I am not familiar with this unit of measurement.

 

[BonzaiDuck]

I am not familiar with this unit of measurement.

I think they're talking about microns. Hence the descriptive term "micronized diamond." But it's the same spec in numerical value and meaning. Usually, the greek letter "Mu" which looks like a "u" is the shorthand, and somebody who didn't have a "Mu" or character-generator for it just stuck in lower-case "i". Look at your keyboard, and the sieve of possible explanations expands. More likely, it was just a typo.

 

[BonzaiDuck]

I think it's very nice of you to explain to us nerds how diamonds and julery work, since none of us will be dating much, much less getting married and learning about carrots and stuff.. ;P

I once saw a Discovery, TLC or NGC program overlapping the career interests of Dame Jane Goodall.

There is a primate species closely related to the chimpanzee known as the Benobo monkey or ape. There is a courtship ritual, in which the male offers the female something of value -- a branch of tasty leaves, or a banana if available.

EDIT: One thing about those Benobos, though. They are total sex-addicts. This is a trait that may distinguish them, to some limited noticeable degree, from the chimps. Look the same, though! Bigger ears, I think!

 

[soccerballtux]

..

 

[soccerballtux]

Céramique2 dropped my temps substantially (7c), allowing me a little more OC headroom.. Just sayin..

what were you using before?

 

[BonzaiDuck]

Céramique2 dropped my temps substantially (7c), allowing me a little more OC headroom.. Just sayin..

Aluminum Oxide is a very common component of many TIMs. Zinc Oxide and Boron Nitride are the other components.

In the end, it's all a matter of thermal resistance measurement or its inverse, thermal conductivity.

 

[soccerballtux]

Aluminum Oxide is a very common component of many TIMs. Zinc Oxide and Boron Nitride are the other components.

In the end, it's all a matter of thermal resistance measurement or its inverse, thermal conductivity.

I wonder if impedance matching is necessary in thermal systems like it is in electrical systems

 

[BonzaiDuck]

I wonder if impedance matching is necessary in thermal systems like it is in electrical systems

That, I wouldn't know. I'm neither an electrical nor materials engineer. But the lower thermal resistance -- a fraction less than 1.0 -- or the higher the thermal conductivity -- the better. One could measure TR for a single substance (TIM), or an entire, composite heatpipe cooler.

Some reviews of TIMs actually included thermal resistance measures, as have heatpipe comparisons. It doesn't seem to be much in fashion anymore, but with a carefully controlled test-bed, the difference between idle and load temperatures would still generate the same rank-order. Just be sure to normalize your reading of comparison reviews if they list a varying room-ambient as well. If RA differed by 3C between two coolers, you would add 3C to the other numbers for a cooler measured at the lowest of the two (or more) RA's.

 

[PliotronX]

Céramique2 dropped my temps substantially (7c), allowing me a little more OC headroom.. Just sayin..

Ceramique is a freak of nature though :sneaky: I always keep the large tubes around (amply priced lower than 1-4 grams of "high performance" compound) for application to friends and family members' computers and it has never let me down.

 

[soccerballtux]

That, I wouldn't know. I'm neither an electrical nor materials engineer. But the lower thermal resistance -- a fraction less than 1.0 -- or the higher the thermal conductivity -- the better. One could measure TR for a single substance (TIM), or an entire, composite heatpipe cooler.

Some reviews of TIMs actually included thermal resistance measures, as have heatpipe comparisons. It doesn't seem to be much in fashion anymore, but with a carefully controlled test-bed, the difference between idle and load temperatures would still generate the same rank-order. Just be sure to normalize your reading of comparison reviews if they list a varying room-ambient as well. If RA differed by 3C between two coolers, you would add 3C to the other numbers for a cooler measured at the lowest of the two (or more) RA's.

now I'm a little concerned.

 

[BonzaiDuck]

now I'm a little concerned.

Well . . . JP Morgan fired Thomas Edison. Edison, as I understand, was publishing his own newspaper in a railroad car for delivery to passengers before he was old enough to go to high-school. And I don't think he did.

 

[bryanW1995]

Well . . . JP Morgan fired Thomas Edison. Edison, as I understand, was publishing his own newspaper in a railroad car for delivery to passengers before he was old enough to go to high-school. And I don't think he did.

Edison's job after leaving JP Morgan was only tangentially related to his job while he worked there. OTOH, your expertise regarding this matter would certainly be heightened if you had engineer qualifications.

 

[sm625]

Impedence is a function of frequency. It is a measure of how a coil resists the flow of current when the voltage across it changes. It is completely inapplicable to thermal systems.

 

[BonzaiDuck]

Well, I gave my "safe" answer -- considering my lack of a certain familiarity with electronics.

But a general answer is applicable. "Beware of analogs, howsoever applicable they may seem."

Actually, somewhere along the way, someone mentioned something akin to "heat dam." I think it pertained to heatsinks of a convex shape.

But it's otherwise a comparison of completely different phenomena.

Edison's job after leaving JP Morgan was only tangentially related to his job while he worked there.

It was his mistake over Tesla's AC, long-distance transmission, and his own DC proposals. He just went back to his labs at Menlo Park. Maybe Morgan just listened to good advice; to him is was a calculated crap-shoot: they were building a power generator at Niagara Falls.

 

[soccerballtux]

Impedence is a function of frequency. It is a measure of how a coil resists the flow of current when the voltage across it changes. It is completely inapplicable to thermal systems.

impedance is the measure of (resistance to flow of current) + (resistance to change of flow in current [reactance]) and can be applied to physical systems as well. I was theorizing about a thermodynamic system where this could work-- the latency for 'current' aka 'entropy' flow would be too low for it to matter. However, if you had a material that could absorb heat/cold and transmit it at some non-trivial speed (I imagine a diamond would be closest you could get) you could extend those systems of equivalence to thermodynamics.

I think that would require some very fancy materials that we don't have at the moment...

 

[bononos]

Just be aware that ICD does etch/scratch the heatspreader, and the markings on the cpu will be gone.

 

[soccerballtux]

Just be aware that ICD does etch/scratch the heatspreader, and the markings on the cpu will be gone.

I don't think I'll be using it, for reasons like that. seems involved