IBM to Power future XBOX products (XBOX2 ??)

[codehack2]

Ripped from ve3d.ign.com... they didn't provide a source, but I'm assuming this is legit.

IBM Powers The Xbox 2 07:54 am - Andrew Burnes - consoles: xbox 2 (0 comments)
Announced today, in a round-about way:

Microsoft Corp. today announced that it has entered into a semiconductor technology agreement with IBM Corp. Under the agreement, Microsoft has licensed leading-edge semiconductor processor technology from IBM for use in future Xbox products and services to be announced at a later date.
"Microsoft is already developing the software and services that will drive the Digital Decade," said Robbie Bach, senior vice president of the Home & Entertainment Division at Microsoft. "By combining our vision, software experience and R&D resources with IBM's computer and semiconductor technologies, we plan to deliver unprecedented and unparalleled entertainment experiences to consumers while creating new engines of growth for the technology and entertainment industries."

According to Bernie Meyerson, IBM Fellow and chief technologist for IBM's Technology Group, the new Xbox technologies will be based on the latest in IBM's family of state-of-the-art processors.

"IBM's advanced chip technologies are in demand across a wide range of industries and applications," Meyerson said. "We're excited to be working on a project of this magnitude and that Microsoft has chosen IBM to provide technologies that will power future consumer devices and expand the boundaries of what's possible in entertainment."

 

[IncredibleHutch]

Great Scotts! So an Xbox powered by ATI and IBM... I'll be looking forward to more info about IBM's play in this one.

 

[Schadenfroh]

AMD did not get the contract


WTF, the xbox is going to be a gamecube with IBM and ATI

 

[mjuarez]

AMD did not get the contract

That's old news, IMHO. What was surprising was that Microsoft decided to go without Intel. So, basically, they are starting from scratch again, will probably need some way to run current games (since obviously the Power chip would not be x86 compatible), and hope that the whole project is not delayed a couple more years than the 2006 deadline.

Weird, if you ask me.

Marcos

 

[Stunt]

hey isn't the big thing about ps3 the "cell technology"
if i remember correctly, ibm and toshiba have rights to it as well.
maybe MS wants cell too :S
anyways, just a thought

 

[mchammer187]

Originally posted by: Stunt
hey isn't the big thing about ps3 the "cell technology"
if i remember correctly, ibm and toshiba have rights to it as well.
maybe MS wants cell too :S
anyways, just a thought

yep and IIRC IBM made the Gecko processor for the gamecube

so is IBM and ATI making the hardware for the PS3 , Xbox2 and Nintendo's big console?

 

[buleyb]

yes, the infamous cell technology...great in theory...

I'll reserve my enthusiasm till they have people to code up games at a reasonable cost and timeline that are still highly parallel.


Oh, and I imagine MS already has their HAL libraries already running on the Power3/Power4 chips, hell, I bet they even have some in house kludge on a PPC based system. Why not, thats what NT was made for...

 

[Stunt]

sony will do everything in house
cell tech sounds great on paper yes, but i agree the game code sounds insane.
although if all games are made on same platform i assume crossover would be easier.
i thought cell was able to do anything processing wise, like gpu, proc, internet stuff...
if ms implemented cell, whe need ati?

 

[OddTSi]

This article from CNET makes it seem like it's not certain if IBM will provide the main processor of the system.

 

[Diable]

Originally posted by: mjuarez

AMD did not get the contract

That's old news, IMHO. What was surprising was that Microsoft decided to go without Intel. So, basically, they are starting from scratch again, will probably need some way to run current games (since obviously the Power chip would not be x86 compatible), and hope that the whole project is not delayed a couple more years than the 2006 deadline.

Weird, if you ask me.

Marcos

Last year Microsoft bought the company that makes Virtual PC. That app lets you run x86/Windows software on PPC machines.

 

[Eug]

Yeah, who knows if IBM will be the main processor or not, but it's interesting anyway. G5 PPC 970 derivative maybe?

What is going on? Apple writing Windows software? Microsoft using PPC chips? The world is going to end soon...

BTW, here is the IBM press release

 

[Maverick]

Interesting to say the least...IBM and MS are competitors in a number of other fronts but they seem to be united in gaming.

 

[IncredibleHutch]

Actually after thinking about it.... I don't see IBM making the main CPU of "Xbox the 2nd". To me it just sounds like more trouble. A non X86 processor in a new system that is most likely going to have backward compatibility with current Xbox games. If emulation is the case (which maybe it'd be better in the end) then we'd see an extremely powerful main CPU that could emulate the 733MHz CPU in Xbox and then be an even better performer when it comes to "Xbox the 2nd" games. Although I don't see that happening... it's possible that IBM chips will be used for I/O chips or some other use could be in works. But that is kind of weird seeing that IBM is seemingly getting its hands into all 3 console companies. And ATI for sure already has its hands in two. This might be the challenge ATI needs to better itself as a company to stand against NVidia. We all know that NVidia in a sense has an advantage over ATI due to the fact that they tried to do their own version of the DirectX 9 spec and went overboard with their GPU... Sure it doesn't perform on par with ATI's current best but if the "Game Makers" wanted to they really could design games to take advantage of the current NVidia hardware which would really leave ATI's cards useless. However, that is extremely doubtful considering "Game Makers" want to see as large of a profit as possible and from what've I've read most of the DirectX 9 spec isn't really being fully utilized.

On another note: If the Cell technology is put to use in the "Xbox the 2nd" then there would be no need for ATI, except maybe to take the load off the Cell technology. Maybe the Cell Technology will be what's used to emulate the X86. I for one don't know the full potential of this new Cell stuff but it might be what Microsoft wants... which would be really weird to see two consoles boasting the new technology.

 

[dvinnen]

Well IBM is designing AMD chips now and fabbing some of them. Might be a roundabout way to use AMD. As metioned before, using PPC chips when you used x86 before dosen't make a whole lot of since

 

[OddTSi]

Originally posted by: dvinnen
Well IBM is designing AMD chips now and fabbing some of them. Might be a roundabout way to use AMD. As metioned before, using PPC chips when you used x86 before dosen't make a whole lot of since

If they were going to use AMD chips the announcement would read "Microsoft and AMD Announce Technology Agreement". IBM is a fab for some of AMD's chips, they don't own the rights to their technology.

 

[Eug]

Financial Times article:

IBM will provide its PowerPC microprocessor technology and is expected to combine several other chips into one or two core chips for the next Xbox.

I will remain a skeptic though, until I get clearer information from MS or IBM.

 

[IncredibleHutch]

With this new article brought to light (new to me) I guess it's almost safe to say that the "Xbox the 2nd" will in fact use a PowerPC chip and will be incredibly powerfull to emulate the effects of the intel 733 chip at the same time being able to perform extremely well for "Xbox the 2nd" software. There was some mention of combining chips too... I wonder if that doesn't mean that the proprietary GPU from ATI and the IBM chip won't some how work hand in hand as one.


IBM will provide its PowerPC microprocessor technology and is expected to combine several other chips into one or two core chips for the next Xbox. This would most likely include graphics chip technology from ATI Technologies of Canada, which in August won the contract from Nvidia, of the US.

Info Provided from same link as above.

 

[ElFenix]

could just be something to help shrink the current xbox

 

[Eug]

Originally posted by: IncredibleHutch
With this new article brought to light (new to me) I guess it's almost safe to say that the "Xbox the 2nd" will in fact use a PowerPC chip and will be incredibly powerfull to emulate the effects of the intel 733 chip at the same time being able to perform extremely well for "Xbox the 2nd" software. There was some mention of combining chips too... I wonder if that doesn't mean that the proprietary GPU from ATI and the IBM chip won't some how work hand in hand as one.

That's assuming:

1) The PowerPC processor used is necessarily the main processor. It may be, but we don't know for 100% sure.
2) Backwards compatibility is a requirement. It would be bonus, but not a must IMO.

 

[IncredibleHutch]

You're right... we don't know for sure if IBM's chip will be used for the main processor... But we do know that Intel had no comments, and that IBM beat out Intel... So we know that Intel isn't going to be in the Xbox except maybe a mother board. We do know that Microsoft aquired emulation technology from Connectix...

Link
Compatibility with older Xbox software could be provided by emulation technology Microsoft acquired in February from Connectix, which sells Virtual PC, allowing Intel-based software to run on PowerPC chips


No word if AMD will be in there... We definitely got word of ATI... mostly due to NVidia wanting more profits and Micorsoft wanting a cheaper part... They got tired of NVidia's mouth and said... okay... we're moving on... Next in Line!

It really is pointing toward a PowerPC chip which will emulate the 733MHz Intel chip. Sorry but the facts are there... you just have to read into them. I mean something could change, someone else could jump into the picture. But as of now it doesn't look like it's going to be any other way. We'll see soon enough though... I very well could be wrong. Any other links sure would be intersting to read... Any proof proving me wrong... I like everyone else would like to see what's really gonna happen.

 

[Macro2]

A MAJOR BLOW FOR INTEL. EOM.

 

[Macro2]

Dow Jones Business News
Microsoft Xbox Chip Deal With IBM Thwarts Intel
Monday November 3, 5:18 pm ET
By Mark Boslet, Of Dow Jones Newswires
PALO ALTO, Calif.(Dow Jones)--Microsoft Corp. (NasdaqNM:MSFT - News) delivered a blow to Intel Corp. (NasdaqNM:INTC - News) Monday by selecting International Business Machines Corp. (NYSE:IBM - News) to supply the processor for its next generation Xbox game machine.
Analysts said the technology agreement signed by the two companies puts IBM's Power chip inside the second version of the popular machine, which is expected to be on the market during 2005. Intel's Pentium III chip powers the present Xbox console.

"Symbolically, it's a staggering loss for Intel," said Fred Zieber, an analyst at Pathfinder Research. Intel had muscled out competitor Advanced Micro Devices Inc. (NYSE:AMD - News) to win the first Xbox contract, only to be pushed aside itself this time around.

An Intel spokesman declined comment. IBM contact Scott Sykes also declined to discuss the deal other than to refer to an announcement of the agreement released Monday.

But analysts said Microsoft and IBM will jointly develop a chip for the product based on IBM's Power4 or planned Power5 processor. Both the Power4 and Power5 have models that make use of dual cores, where two computing engines are installed on a single chip. A single-core version of the Power4 runs inside computers from Apple Computer Inc. (NasdaqNM:AAPL - News) .

IBM is expected to manufacture the chip after it is designed.

A Microsoft spokesman declined to comment.

The new Xbox is Microsoft's next weapon its in battle with game machine leader Sony Corp. (NYSE:SNE - News) . For that reason, the chip contract is a high-profile deal.

IBM is presently working on chip designs with Sony and supplies chips to game machine producer Nintendo Co. .

-By Mark Boslet, Dow Jones Newswires; 650-496-1366; mark.boslet@dowjones.com

 

[UCSDHappyAsian]

YEP YEP.. HOW MUCH IS THE SYSTEM??

 

[IncredibleHutch]

Yup, wouldn't we all like to know. For now I think it's too soon... I mean we could add the price of say ATI's midrange card with the price of IBM's PPC 4 and then 60 bucks say for a motherboard and maybe another 60 just for the casing... But then that wouldn't be very realistic considering that the technologies that'll actually be implemented are new for now but may be cheaper once they are finally released in the form of the "Xbox the 2nd" Also in history we have seen many consoles underpriced just so that consumers will purchase them... then the money is made back in Software Titles. In short... it's too far off to really tell. But I think we can assume this much: an IBM PPC and an ATI R4xx with most likely 128MBs of RAM. Definitely more than 64 just because of the emulation software having to run too for current Xbox games. I'll guess a 20GB hard drive just because that'll be better than what Xbox has now but not pushing it too far, though it most likely will be bigger and will probably run at 7200RPMs. The DVD Rom will probably be on the lines of 8x.


"We plan to deliver unprecedented and unparalleled entertainment experiences to consumers while creating new engines of growth for the technology and entertainment industries..."

Taken from the above posted link

With the above quote said... I think the "Xbox the 2nd" will have a lot more features planned for it than people would expect as of yet. hmmm.... Tivo, S-Video In and Out, Web TV, who knows... just some ideas

 

[Eug]

Originally posted by: Macro2
Dow Jones Business News
Microsoft Xbox Chip Deal With IBM Thwarts Intel
Monday November 3, 5:18 pm ET
By Mark Boslet, Of Dow Jones Newswires
PALO ALTO, Calif.(Dow Jones)--Microsoft Corp. (NasdaqNM:MSFT - News) delivered a blow to Intel Corp. (NasdaqNM:INTC - News) Monday by selecting International Business Machines Corp. (NYSE:IBM - News) to supply the processor for its next generation Xbox game machine.
Analysts said the technology agreement signed by the two companies puts IBM's Power chip inside the second version of the popular machine, which is expected to be on the market during 2005. Intel's Pentium III chip powers the present Xbox console.

Link?