I was thinking about numbers this evening.

[lokiju]

Originally posted by: MmmSkyscraper

Originally posted by: lokiju
I've been looking at getting a new car recently and have been trying to find the highest MPG car that has as much room as possible and as far as I can tell, there is just nothing out there that fits my wants and budget.

What's on your wants list, other than space/comfort?

Space mostly.

I have a Tahoe so it'll be hard to go to a subcompact.

Also my wife already has a compact that we use on the weeks for the most part but need something with more room for when we have a baby and want to travel out of town with all the misc crap that needs to be dragged along.

We took her car from Atlanta to South FL for Christmas and realized then that while her MPG is great, the lack of room is a huge issue.

I'm holding out for when Honda releases their new Pilot as theres rumors it'll have a new diesel engine that I'm hoping will get great MPG. But I really want a midsize SUV that gets awesome MPG. Which at this time doesn't exist.

But between Honda and VW, I'm hopeful that this year or next, something will come along.

 

[PingSpike]

I think people are moving towards higher mpg cars. But this process isn't going to happen overnight. If you drive 10 miles to work or something and have a bought and paid for tahoe or silverado or something...you aren't going to save a bunch of money by buying a new insight. Ultimately, all this envirnoment saving stuff doesn't really matter until it starts hitting people in their wallets...and it has been.

But first car makers need to start making some more compelling products. They're working on it...but it seems like any efficiency advancements in the last decade or so have been used to increase horsepower and vehicle size while retaining the same mpg rating.

I like my elantra, and it gets good mileage so I can't complain. But when it comes time for a newer vehicle, I'm going to demand more.

I'm looking for a used truck which, frankly, would see pretty small amounts of driving (less than 5000miles a year) but I'm still having trouble deciding if a i4 is enough, or should I look for one with the more costly v6? And then, full size trucks actually get barely any worse mileage.

Thats the trouble really. When it comes time for people to make buying decisions you've got one car that gets say 26/32 and another that gets 28/34 and its pretty much, who cares? 2mpg isn't going to sway anyone. 5, 10mpg those will make people look closer.

 

[Kelemvor]

Just image if millions of people got smart and figured out they don't actually need to change their oil every 3000 miles and went to 5000 or even higher.

 

[JulesMaximus]

Originally posted by: Kelemvor
Just image if millions of people got smart and figured out they don't actually need to change their oil every 3000 miles and went to 5000 or even higher.

I'll stick with the manufacturer recommended oil change intervals. Anyone deviating much from that is a moron.

 

[JulesMaximus]

Originally posted by: JD50

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus

Originally posted by: bctbct
Yeah, some trade comfort for money.

You don't need to sit alone in a $45k SUV guzzling gas at a rate of 14mpg to be comfortable. That's just complete bullshit. Hell, I'm happy riding a bicycle to work a couple days a week. I was also comfortable and enjoyed carpooling when I did it 3 days a week for almost a year a few years ago...and I did that was alternating between a Toyota Camry/Nissan Pathfinder/Toyota Tundra.

This is a free country and people are free to drive an 18 wheeler to work if they really want to. I don't care if you're happy riding a pogo stick to work, other people might not be and its none of your business what they drive to work.

BTW, I drive a 2000 honda civic but I'm tired of people like you trying to tell everyone else what to do. If someone wants to be an idiot and spend a fortune on gas just so they can drive an SUV that's their choice.

And it's my choice to point out that there are alternatives and maybe make some people think of things they hadn't really considered before.

I remember about a month after Hurricane Katrina walking onto the lot of a Honda dealership and seeing a bunch of used gas guzzling trucks and SUVs for sale and people looking over the fuel efficient Honda Civics, which were selling like hotcakes...you couldn't even find a hybrid, they were getting $5k markups on those and if you bought one you could easily sell it in 3 years for the same money you paid for it.

I also remember seeing hundreds and hundreds of brand new Hummer H2s sitting on overwhelmed dealer lots. They were parking them offsite up in Los Angeles because they didn't want it to seem like they had a surplus of them. We will see this again. Mark my words.

It is amazing how quickly people forget these things though.

BTW-Gas is $3.65/gallon here right now for premium. It hasn't been below $3/gallon in years...at least not for long.

 

[upsciLLion]

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus

Originally posted by: Kelemvor
Just image if millions of people got smart and figured out they don't actually need to change their oil every 3000 miles and went to 5000 or even higher.

I'll stick with the manufacturer recommended oil change intervals. Anyone deviating much from that is a moron.

Way to validate your argument, twerp. The more often you take your car to the dealer, the richer they become. It's a small conflict of interests, but it exists.

 

[JulesMaximus]

Originally posted by: upsciLLion

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus

Originally posted by: Kelemvor
Just image if millions of people got smart and figured out they don't actually need to change their oil every 3000 miles and went to 5000 or even higher.

I'll stick with the manufacturer recommended oil change intervals. Anyone deviating much from that is a moron.

Way to validate your argument, twerp. The more often you take your car to the dealer, the richer they become. It's a small conflict of interests, but it exists.

Read your manual. At the very least you invalidate your warranty if you don't follow their maintenance schedule.

Yeah, I'm going to worry about spending an extra $20-40 every year on an oil change...:roll:

 

[upsciLLion]

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus

Originally posted by: upsciLLion

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus

Originally posted by: Kelemvor
Just image if millions of people got smart and figured out they don't actually need to change their oil every 3000 miles and went to 5000 or even higher.

I'll stick with the manufacturer recommended oil change intervals. Anyone deviating much from that is a moron.

Way to validate your argument, twerp. The more often you take your car to the dealer, the richer they become. It's a small conflict of interests, but it exists.

Read your manual. At the very least you invalidate your warranty if you don't follow their maintenance schedule.

Yeah, I'm going to worry about spending an extra $20-40 every year on an oil change...:roll:

Just imagine how much oil we could save if everybody changed their oil at 5,000 miles instead of 3,000! Only selfish people want over-sized vehicles and manufacturer warranties!

 

[JulesMaximus]

Originally posted by: upsciLLion

Just imagine how much oil we could save if everybody changed their oil at 5,000 miles instead of 3,000! Only selfish people want over-sized vehicles and manufacturer warranties!

Now you're just being ridiculous.

 

[upsciLLion]

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus
Now you're just being ridiculous.

False. I am not wearing any clown makeup (yet).

 

[zerocool1]

Originally posted by: yamadakun
Now imagine if every American lose 20lbs, that's 100lbs in a fully loaded sedan. How much oil are we saving.

I read an article in business week about increases in average weight in the US driving up the cost for air fares

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus

Originally posted by: Naustica

Originally posted by: SlitheryDee

Originally posted by: FoBoT
you assume using less oil is important
why do you want to keep this oil so badly?

I thought it was about spending less money on gasoline. If I spend less money on necessary product X because I need less of it to do what I need to do then I have more money to spend on necessary product Y or even unnecessary luxury Z.

What if by driving a vehicle that gets like 10mpg, one can make multiple more dollars than if one drove a vehicle that got 35-40mpg? Some people actually use vehicles for work and to make money. Incredible I know.

Those people should be really pissed at all the pinheads buying pickups and SUVs just to haul their worthless carcasses to and from their white collar jobs everyday.

you think i'm not, sure i'm for an open economy but this is just stupid.

 

[thomsbrain]

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus

Originally posted by: FoBoT
http://www.pics.bbzzdd.com/beta/users/FoBoT/doom.jpg

Where did I mention doom in my post? This is just about economics.

I guess if I thought oil was a commodity with infinite supply I'd probably respond as you just did...or I'd have never posted this to begin with. Then again, oil is currently $100/barrel...I'm sure you are right.

he was probably referring to the nature of the posts that were sure to come in this thread.

 

[hanoverphist]

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus
Just something to think about the next time you fill your tank as you are driving yourself to work...alone...in your 17mpg SUV/pickup truck.

i dont live near any of my coworkers. i drive in dirt and rocks most of the time. i carry heavy shit in the back of a truck to and from work and job sites. i still dont care how much i could save by driving a 1.2L commuter to and from work, the expense is justified as well as paid for by the company. next time youre on your way to work, think about other people that may drive those big trucks/ SUVs for a specific reason. their job may demand it, their lifestyle may justify it and their preference may allow them the comfort of personal choice.

 

[rgwalt]

Originally posted by: lokiju
I was wondering the other day.

Say everyone one day drives 50MPG cars.

That'd mean that less gas would be bought on average.

As a result, wouldn't the cost of gas have to be raised in order to compensate for the oil companies decline in sales?

If so, that kind of cancels out one of the large reasons for people to get more fuel efficient cars (in the long term).

I've been looking at getting a new car recently and have been trying to find the highest MPG car that has as much room as possible and as far as I can tell, there is just nothing out there that fits my wants and budget.

So in the mean time it's more cost effective for me to continue driving my gas guzzling SUV than to go into more debt and spend more per month than I'd save in gas just to get something thats more fuel efficient.

If demand declines, price will drop to stimulate demand and/or supply will decrease. In truth, as long as refiners are making money on the upgrade to gasoline/diesel/jet, they will produce product at maximum capacity because they will earn incrementally more money. In other words, as a refinery can sell products for more money than they buy crude and have to spend running the refinery, the refinery will run at as close to maximum capacity as possible. The question is whether or not the demand in this country could drop to the point that there would actually be excess supply in the fuel market... We could end up in a situation like in the 1990's where refineries were doing well to turn a profit. Small refineries would close down, there would be little to no investment in capacity, and 10 years later we would be in the exact same position we are in now.

High gas prices are actually not so bad... while it hurts your pocket book, high prices stimulates investment in alternative fuels and transporation research. If gasoline had never gone above $1.50 a gallon, the Toyota Prius and other hybrids wouldn't exist. Frankly there wouldn't be such a big investment in technologies like solar or wind either. Finally, it makes some people think twice about the cars they buy, when/where they choose to drive, and it makes public transportation much more attractive. It is far more efficient for 20 people to take the bus or 200 people to take the train than one person to drive their Honda Civic Hybrid. While the given American may not be able to afford a new, fuel efficient vehicle to replace their SUV (or huge sedan/towncar), public transportation is readily available in many metropolitan areas.

R

 

[jagec]

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus

Originally posted by: upsciLLion

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus

Originally posted by: Kelemvor
Just image if millions of people got smart and figured out they don't actually need to change their oil every 3000 miles and went to 5000 or even higher.

I'll stick with the manufacturer recommended oil change intervals. Anyone deviating much from that is a moron.

Way to validate your argument, twerp. The more often you take your car to the dealer, the richer they become. It's a small conflict of interests, but it exists.

Read your manual. At the very least you invalidate your warranty if you don't follow their maintenance schedule.

Yeah, I'm going to worry about spending an extra $20-40 every year on an oil change...:roll:

And your car really has a 3000 mile change interval? Got a scan of your owner's manual to prove it? Jiffy Lube will tell you 3000 miles, but very few manufacturers recommend such a short interval.

Originally posted by: JD50

This is a free country and people are free to drive an 18 wheeler to work if they really want to. I don't care if you're happy riding a pogo stick to work, other people might not be and its none of your business what they drive to work.

BTW, I drive a 2000 honda civic but I'm tired of people like you trying to tell everyone else what to do. If someone wants to be an idiot and spend a fortune on gas just so they can drive an SUV that's their choice.

That's all very well and good, but their choices affect the rest of the population. You don't have the "right" to burn your garbage within the city limits...is that an infringement of basic Americana?

 

[BUTCH1]

Originally posted by: JD50

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus

Originally posted by: bctbct
Yeah, some trade comfort for money.

You don't need to sit alone in a $45k SUV guzzling gas at a rate of 14mpg to be comfortable. That's just complete bullshit. Hell, I'm happy riding a bicycle to work a couple days a week. I was also comfortable and enjoyed carpooling when I did it 3 days a week for almost a year a few years ago...and I did that was alternating between a Toyota Camry/Nissan Pathfinder/Toyota Tundra.

This is a free country and people are free to drive an 18 wheeler to work if they really want to. I don't care if you're happy riding a pogo stick to work, other people might not be and its none of your business what they drive to work.

BTW, I drive a 2000 honda civic but I'm tired of people like you trying to tell everyone else what to do. If someone wants to be an idiot and spend a fortune on gas just so they can drive an SUV that's their choice.

It's a fundamental tenet of of capitalism that if you make more$$ than you get to drive
the vehicle of your choice.....However, at some point in time the needs of the many out-
-weigh the wants of the few as the crude starts to dry up. Price alone, eventually might
end the era of gas-guzzlers and while there is no denying HP on the road is just plain fun,
I get a kick out of denying $$ to greedy oil co's and greedy utility's, (I put up a clothesline
just to f*** the power co. out of more $$).

 

[vi edit]

Originally posted by: lokiju

Originally posted by: MmmSkyscraper

Originally posted by: lokiju
I've been looking at getting a new car recently and have been trying to find the highest MPG car that has as much room as possible and as far as I can tell, there is just nothing out there that fits my wants and budget.

What's on your wants list, other than space/comfort?

Space mostly.

I have a Tahoe so it'll be hard to go to a subcompact.

Also my wife already has a compact that we use on the weeks for the most part but need something with more room for when we have a baby and want to travel out of town with all the misc crap that needs to be dragged along.

We took her car from Atlanta to South FL for Christmas and realized then that while her MPG is great, the lack of room is a huge issue.

I'm holding out for when Honda releases their new Pilot as theres rumors it'll have a new diesel engine that I'm hoping will get great MPG. But I really want a midsize SUV that gets awesome MPG. Which at this time doesn't exist.

But between Honda and VW, I'm hopeful that this year or next, something will come along.

Kia Rondo, VW Passat Wagon, Mazda5, Malibu Maxx.

Those are 4 cars that offer great first and 2nd row room plus plenty of cargo space. Intown milage is low/mid 20's depending on the car with highways milage from 28-32 or so depending on particular models & transmission choices.

The Rondo and the Mazda5 are two cars in particular that offer significant hauling abilities for their rather small dimensions. They will easily carry as much as any mid size SUV and pull much better fuel averages. We'll be replacing my wife's Highlander with one of them come May. I've got a baby due next month.

 

[JulesMaximus]

Originally posted by: jagec

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus

Originally posted by: upsciLLion

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus

Originally posted by: Kelemvor
Just image if millions of people got smart and figured out they don't actually need to change their oil every 3000 miles and went to 5000 or even higher.

I'll stick with the manufacturer recommended oil change intervals. Anyone deviating much from that is a moron.

Way to validate your argument, twerp. The more often you take your car to the dealer, the richer they become. It's a small conflict of interests, but it exists.

Read your manual. At the very least you invalidate your warranty if you don't follow their maintenance schedule.

Yeah, I'm going to worry about spending an extra $20-40 every year on an oil change...:roll:

And your car really has a 3000 mile change interval? Got a scan of your owner's manual to prove it? Jiffy Lube will tell you 3000 miles, but very few manufacturers recommend such a short interval.

I didn't say I change my oil every 3k miles. Just that I follow the recommended service interval in my owners manual which happens to be 3,750 miles...or 4 times a year assuming 15k miles driven annually. Lexus recommends we change the oil every 5k miles on my wife's car so that's what we do.

 

[FoBoT]

see?

rgwalt > JulesMaximus

I'm just saying...

 

[JulesMaximus]

Originally posted by: FoBoT
see?

rgwalt > JulesMaximus

I'm just saying...

Hardly.

He mentioned nothing about shortages and in reality public transportation is decent in only a handful of cities across this nation...it is woefully inadequate in the majority.

Besides, I can agree with some of the points he made.

 

[FoBoT]

I'm just saying...