I want YOU to help me build a better system!

[Gozu]

Ok, guys! guys! gather around and let me show you my preliminary model.
i decided to go with AMD for obvious cost reasons (besides, i've been a faithful AMD supporter these last 6 years and i'd hate to go intel)

The difference between the "crappy" and the "Quality" versions are the CPU/RAM/Monitor

Crappy Version:

Gigabyte 7VRXP Retail $107
XP1900+ oem $109
512 PC2100 generic $107
Ti 4200 Prolink $140
Floppy $008
Pioneer 106S slot $050
HD WD 100Gb (2mb) $125
Monitor 19" generic $178
Koolance complete kit $362
-------------------------------------
Total $1186

Quality Version:

Gigabyte 7VRXP Retail $107
XP1900+ retail $129
512 PC2100 kingston $136
Ti 4200 Prolink $140
Floppy $008
Pioneer 106S slot $050
HD WD 100Gb (2mb) $125
Monitor 19" NEC $205
Koolance complete kit $362
------------------------------------
Total $1262



what i called the koolance complete kit is composed of the following:

KOOLANCE PC2-C MID TOWER WATER COOLING CASE $175
Power Supply: 350W CodeGen P4/AMD Certified $ 45
CPU Cooler: CPU-200 Cooler $ 50
Hard Drive Cooler: Hard Drive Cooler $ 35
2nd Hard Drive Cooler $ 22
MB/Vid Cooler: 1 Cooler $ 25
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Total $362


As you can see. i managed to go my limit which is 1000$
what i would need you to do now is tell me which components i better get retail.which i should just get oem. where i can cut costs painlessly...that kind of things.

Comments on the cooling system are required as well.
i'm not a decent overclocker and i know little about those things.

Also, i have compiled this list of prices using Pricewatch exclusively.
for the koolance however i used Xoxide so if you can find better prices elsewhere for certain components, u'd save my life.

for those who really want to get involved, these are the things i do with my computer:

-running an ftp server (uploading/downloading 24h a day)
-divx ripping and watching
-rar unpacking
-occasional gaming
-running tons of applications at the same time...

 

[CrazySaint]

You can get all the drives OEM as well as the RAM, I wouldn't get an OEM motherboard, not that there are very many. If you get OEM graphics card, make sure it has all the extras you want. If you're paying $50 (!) for a HSF, get get the OEM CPU. If you aren't going to overclock, a watercooling system is serious overkill. Get a decent case (Antec, Lian-Li, Enermax, etc) some good fans and a decent HSF. A good HSF combo might be a Thermalright AX-7 paired with a nice quiet fan like the Panaflo L1A or Vantec Stealth 80mm fans. Also use L1A or Stealth 80mm fans for your case. If you get a $200 19" monitor, your eyes will never forgive you for it. You would be better spending that $200 on a good quality flat screen 17" monitor, IMO (the NEC FE700 series comes to mind) or spending another $100 and getting a good quality 19" flat screen (NEC FE950+ or Samsung 900NF). I haven't kept up with AMD boards too much for the last month or two, so I don't know if the GA-7VRXP REV. 2.0 is out yet, but if its not, you may want to stay away from that board because a lot of people have had problems with it. If you aren't gong to overclock, the Abit NV7-133R based on the nForce 415-D chipset might be the ticket for you and sells for around $90. Get the 8MB version of the WD Caviar drives, they're not much more expensive and are a HELL of a lot faster. Not much need for a floppy anymore these days since you can install your OS from the CD. Be careful buying off pricewatch, there's a lot of shady companies on there. Check the prices at places like newegg.com googlegear.com tcwo.com and mwave.com which are all reputable companies and you can probably come pretty close to the prices you listed.

 

[chilled]

I believe there is not much point buying the retail Athlon. Since the quality of the heatsink/fan is not amazing, I would buy the oem version and buy a separate heatsink/fan that is better for overclocking purposes. Someone here can probably recommend a good brand for that.

Also purchase Kingston RAM. It will be far better quality than the generic stuff especially if u are interested in overclocking. Maybe Crucial/Mushkin is better for these purposes.

By the 19" NEC monitor instead of the generic option. U will appreciate the dfference while gaming or watching movies. I think u should also consider the 19" Samsung monitor anand reviewed a few months ago......that seemed good as well.

 

[Gozu]

Reply to Crazy Saint:

i do want to overclock. i mean, sure, the case looks cool and it's silent but overclocking is still the main goal.
my quality list includes a nec 19" monitor. i'll follow your advice and get either that or the samsung u mentionned.
i don't have another 100 to spend. lol, i need to cut nearly 200 bucks from the cost actually....
it is imperative that the mobo i get includes sound/lan/raid. and i want to overclock too...what MOBO would you recommend?
i already have a WD 100 GB 2mb buffer....and i want to get an additional hd for a Raid0. i was told i should get the exact same.
i knew about newegg and googlegear, the 2 others are new though. thanks for the tip

very useful reply crazy saint, thanks a bunch.



Reply to chilled

i actually thought there was an "overclockability" difference between OEM and Retail cpus. thx for enlightening me, OEM it is!

hmm, i guess that if i want to overclock the video card, i got to overclock the mobo and that means the ram as well. i will check the prices for crucial/Mushkin then.

Nec or Samsung 19" it is. both you and Crazy Saint agreed on that one. i shall obey


nice input guys. stick with me for a little while longer eh?

 

[Zugzwang152]

Crucial is I believe the cheapest quality RAM available, plus it used to have a special AT discount, dunno if that's still ongoing or not. Screw retail HSF's in general, you dont want to use that junk on your cpu. definitely invest in a quality monitor, you're going to have to stare at it, not the case

 

[Zugzwang152]

Thermalright or Alphas are generally well-recommended heatsink brands. You might be able to find a cheaper brand, but I believe protecting your cpu is something that also shouldnt be skimped on. If you want to cut down the price, save by buying a cheaper brand vid card, on your sound card, and case. You dont need watercooling for a stock, or even a OC'd 1900+, since you cant get them very high anyway.

 

[CrazySaint]

Originally posted by: Gozu
Reply to Crazy Saint:

i do want to overclock. i mean, sure, the case looks cool and it's silent but overclocking is still the main goal.
my quality list includes a nec 19" monitor. i'll follow your advice and get either that or the samsung u mentionned.
i don't have another 100 to spend. lol, i need to cut nearly 200 bucks from the cost actually....
it is imperative that the mobo i get includes sound/lan/raid. and i want to overclock too...what MOBO would you recommend?
i already have a WD 100 GB 2mb buffer....and i want to get an additional hd for a Raid0. i was told i should get the exact same.
i knew about newegg and googlegear, the 2 others are new though. thanks for the tip

very useful reply crazy saint, thanks a bunch.



Reply to chilled

i actually thought there was an "overclockability" difference between OEM and Retail cpus. thx for enlightening me, OEM it is!

hmm, i guess that if i want to overclock the video card, i got to overclock the mobo and that means the ram as well. i will check the prices for crucial/Mushkin then.

Nec or Samsung 19" it is. both you and Crazy Saint agreed on that one. i shall obey


nice input guys. stick with me for a little while longer eh?

Just make sure you get the NEC FE950+ or the Samsung 900NF models, they're the good ones. The 955DF isn't a very good 19" monitor, and its not really a flatscreen. They just placed a piece of flat glass over a standard curved monitor. If you're going to overclock, get the XP 1600+ which should OC to around 1.8GHz (XP 2200+). I just checked, and I see that the 7VRXP V. 2.0 is out, so it should be a good board. I still say that a water cooling setup is too much for a first time OC'er (especially if its also the first time you've built your own PC) and its also expensive when you're trying to keep costs down. Just get a case with good ventilation and some good case fans. Definitely get the Thermalright AX-7, since its the best Athlon HSF. You're gonna need some good RAM, if you're gonna OC. Get some PC2700. If you can't spend the $$ for PC2700, then get some Crucial PC2100 which I think OCs pretty well, but it might still limit your OC. This won't be as much of an issue if you unlock your CPU and increase the multiplier. Check out this thread where Insane3D OC'd his 1600+ to 1.8GHz (2200+).

 

[CrazySaint]

I just read your post in the OC forum asking me to update my suggestions taking a 1.6A into consideration, so here ya go:

CPU: 1.6A (obviously) - $153 (from newegg)
Motherboard: EPoX 4G4A+ (includes sound, RAID, LAN, USB 2.0) - $116 (from mwave.com)
RAM: Either Corsair XMS PC2700 CAS2 (512MB = $180 at googlegear.com) or Corsair XMS PC3000 CAS2 (512MB = $200 at googlegear.com) if you're lucky, with the PC3000 you can run DDR400 at CAS2
HS/F: See how far you can get with the stock cooler. Most people have been able to get at least 2.4 with it.

You can offset some of the additional costs of the CPU, RAM, and mobo by taking into the account that you won't need to buy that expensive water cooling setup anymore. The only cooling you'll need to buy is a couple case fans (if you don't get a case that comes with them) and maybe a HD cooler. Btw, take a look at the Antec cases, they're high quality and provide good airflow. You can get the Antec PP660 for about $105 shipped from newegg and it has a fan slot in the HD bay so you could just stick a regular case fan in there to blow onto the HDs instead of a HD cooler, if you'd like. Check out svcompucycle.com for your fans and coolers, they have very good prices. Also be sure to pick up some ASIII ($5 shipped from svcompcycle.com). Oh, one other thing. The PP660 case only has a 330w PSU which may be enough, but may also limit your OC, so you may want to get a Chieftec case (same case as an Antec, but with no PSU) and then buy a Antec 380 or 400w PSU seperately (make sure you get a Antec True Power PSU). One note about the motherboard is that its picky about RAM, but people have been getting successful OCs on it with the Corsair RAM, but you also may only be able to use 1 stick of RAM in it while OC'd since some people have had stability issues with more than one stick of RAM in there, though at least person has been able to OC it with 2 sticks so YMMV.

 

[Gozu]

ok, so this is the new system

EPoX 4g4A+ $116
P4 1.6A $153
512 PC3000 CorsairXMS $200
Ti 4200 Prolink $140
Floppy $008
Pioneer 106S slot $removed
HD WD 100Gb (2mb) $removed
NEC FE950+ $315
Antec PP660 $105
Cpu Fan (for O/Cing) $???
Arctic Silver III $005
Case Fans??? $???

total: $1042

it seems i still need a couple components.
the monitor is really expensive...my eyes better be grateful or i'll rip them off, fry them and dip them in tabasco before eating them.
the price is slightly over the limit still...
so what do i need for cooling if i want to overclock the cpu?
is overclocking the ram really worth it or is it juts a secondary effect of overclocking the cpu/videocard ?

 

[Actaeon]

I'd hate to sink your boat, but what about shipping?

 

[Gozu]

shipping is included of course.

 

[CrazySaint]

Originally posted by: Gozu
ok, so this is the new system

EPoX 4g4A+ $116
P4 1.6A $153
512 PC3000 CorsairXMS $200
Ti 4200 Prolink $140
Floppy $008
Pioneer 106S slot $removed
HD WD 100Gb (2mb) $removed
NEC FE950+ $315
Antec PP660 $105
Cpu Fan (for O/Cing) $???
Arctic Silver III $005
Case Fans??? $???

total: $1042

it seems i still need a couple components.
the monitor is really expensive...my eyes better be grateful or i'll rip them off, fry them and dip them in tabasco before eating them.
the price is slightly over the limit still...
so what do i need for cooling if i want to overclock the cpu?
is overclocking the ram really worth it or is it juts a secondary effect of overclocking the cpu/videocard ?

It looks like you can save $30 and get the NEC FE991SB which, near as I can tell, is the replacement for the FE950+. Like I said before, you can ditch the floppy and save $8 there. From what I've read, you can OC in the 2.4-2.55GHz range with the stock HS/F, I think I even read where one person got to like 2.7GHz with stock cooling, but that's pushing it. If I were you, I'd start with the stock cooling and then consider getting another HS/F (like the Tt P4 Volcano 7) later if cooling becomes a limiting factor. You would probably be fine if you saved $20 and went with the Corsair XMS PC2700 CAS2 instead of the PC3000. The PC2700 should be able to handle DDR400 at CAS 2.5 just fine, which means you can either run 150FSB at 3:4 mem ratio or 160FSB at 4:5 mem ratio. The PC3000 would afford you the option of possible running DDR400 at CAS2 or going over 400 at CAS2.5 (I think THUGSROOK is running his PC3000 at DDR442), but you would only really need to go very far beyond DDR400 if you get a "golden chip". As for case fans, just pick up a couple Panaflo L1As or Vantec Stealth fans from svcompucycle. The case already comes with one fan, and only has 3 fan slots, so you would only need 2 fans (unless you plan on replacing the Antec fan, which is a good fan, but runs at 30dB(A) as opposed to the L1As which run at 21db(A). Also, unless you really need the front USB and firewire ports on the PP660, you could probably do just as well with one of the cheaper cases like the SX630 or SX640. Or maybe get the Chieftec version (Antec and Chieftec use the same cases) with a 400w PSU (no idea how good the PSU is) for only $50.

 

[AdamDuritz99]

My personal suggestion on things you should really change:
MSI KT3 Ultra $81.00 (newegg)
XP1800+ oem $83.00 (tcwo.com)
WD 80GB SE $112.00 (newegg)

 

[Gozu]

What can i say CrazySaint...you made my day. if i ever become owner of big Computer company, i'll hire you to build cool systems all day long for no reason. lol . til then, u have all my gratitude.

adam:
an athlon 1800+ can only be overclocked to 2200+ which is 1.8Ghz while a P4 1.6A can be o/ced up to 2.7Ghz. i pick the P4.
i already have a WD 100Gb so i wanted a 2nd one to raid0 them. since i don;t have cash, i will delay that purchase until further notice.

i appreciate your input however. thanks

 

[CrazySaint]

Originally posted by: Gozu
What can i say CrazySaint...you made my day. if i ever become owner of big Computer company, i'll hire you to build cool systems all day long for no reason. lol . til then, u have all my gratitude.

No problem, its all in a day's work for...Computer Repairman

 

[Gozu]

It looks like you can save $30 and get the NEC FE991SB which, near as I can tell, is the replacement for the FE950+.

are you sure? i find the 950+ for $315 and the 991SB for $323 . i'd be actually spending a little bit more.

 

[Gozu]

bump

 

[CrazySaint]

Here ya go. Unfortunately, they're out of stock right now

 

[Gozu]

very good price indeed. it's a shame the black model costs 20 more bucks that the white one. because i decided to go with a black shieftec case so i'd need a black monitor to match (already have a dark blue mouse and i can get black speakers. all i need now is a good black keyboard). i know it's stupid but a black PC looks soooo much cooler than a white one. lol

 

[CrazySaint]

Originally posted by: Gozu
very good price indeed. it's a shame the black model costs 20 more bucks that the white one. because i decided to go with a black shieftec case so i'd need a black monitor to match (already have a dark blue mouse and i can get black speakers. all i need now is a good black keyboard). i know it's stupid but a black PC looks soooo much cooler than a white one. lol

lol so true, I decided to go with a black PC myself

 

[Gozu]

what are you doing awake at this time of the night CS ? i thought i was the only one.

 

[CrazySaint]

Originally posted by: Gozu
what are you doing awake at this time of the night CS ? i thought i was the only one.

lol I'm a bonified night owl!

 

[Gozu]

memory prices just went up.

WHY GOD WHY??????????????????