I think China is really going to do it...

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R0H1T

Platinum Member
Jan 12, 2013
2,582
162
106
I'm actually surprised you liberals are perfectly OK with China's expansionist plans, their takeover of Tibet, etc. I thought you guys were against these sort of imperialist ambitions? Is it OK because America / Europe did it at one time so let China have its fun too?
Kind of amusing how some (many?) in the west take refuge in their guilty conscience & then question whether BLM, Muslims & other minorities should be given more leeway because the west did no good (to them) in the past. This is pretty much what China has been doing for the past 70 years, minus the war & ensuing deaths, but it's okay to turn a blind eye to them because they have you by the balls &/or you feel guilty?

The annexation of Tibet was one such black mark, I wonder when the rest of the world will call their bluff & see what they do when push comes to shove? They have no shame in stealing IP, copying products, devaluing currency, extorting neighbors, occupying territory & to top it off their govt mouthpiece glorifies such conducts & instead blames neighboring countries!

I've got no doubt that if it came to a full scale war China will be the first one to blink, if they were to face a formidable foe & there's three in Asia that I can think of.
 

agent00f

Lifer
Jun 9, 2016
12,203
1,242
86
Frankly people who can't understand the relatively succinct history of the tibet issue above aren't going to get far analyzing intl relations, or anything really. Fortunately for them they can just parrot some agitprop for dummies.

Take currency exchange for example, where "currency manipulation" elicits some kind of pavlovian response with american conservatives. In your own opinion, are these people really in any position to argue the economics of this?
 

R0H1T

Platinum Member
Jan 12, 2013
2,582
162
106
Frankly people who can't understand the relatively succinct history of the tibet issue above aren't going to get far analyzing intl relations, or anything really. Fortunately for them they can just parrot some agitprop for dummies.

Take currency exchange for example, where "currency manipulation" elicits some kind of pavlovian response with american conservatives. In your own opinion, are these people really in any position to argue the economics of this?
What do you mean by succinct history of Tibet? If Tibet had an army would China have been able to take over that nation so easily, so just because they got away with it doesn't make it right. If you're going by ancient history then the whole of South Asia must be a single nation, similarly the Arabian peninsula would be much better with a Caliphate in place, what about Europe or Africa?

Territorial disputes with China only go one way, it's their way or the highway as far as I see it. As for currency manipulation I couldn't care less for the conservatives. The point is still valid though, by pegging their currency to the dollar & not allowing appreciation, over the last two decades, they've not only made their exports cheap but undercut every other exporting nation & especially their Asian counterparts. It's come to a point where they're basically exporting deflation with state subsidies for various industries, major steel overcapacity, certain tariff & non tariff barriers on imports & of course a cheaper currency that always helps them.
 
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agent00f

Lifer
Jun 9, 2016
12,203
1,242
86
What do you mean by succinct history of Tibet? If Tibet had an army would China have been able to take over that nation so easily, so just because they got away with it doesn't make it right. If you're going by ancient history then the whole of South Asia must be a single nation, similarly the Arabian peninsula would be much better with a Caliphate in place, what about Europe or Africa?

I mean the one you either didn't read or couldn't understand. The secession of Tibet was basically your typical colonial dick move by the British, at a time when the country was getting carved up by foreign powers. When mao came out on top after the mess, his first order of business was to show that china wasn't the sick man of asia anymore by taking back what was perceived to have been stolen, or at least what he feasibly could.

Territorial disputes with China only go one way, it's their way or the highway as far as I see it. As for currency manipulation I couldn't care less for the conservatives. The point is still valid though, by pegging their currency to the dollar & not allowing appreciation, over the last two decades, they've not only made their exports cheap but undercut every other exporting nation & especially their Asian counterparts. It's come to a point where they're basically exporting deflation with state subsidies for various industries, major steel overcapacity, certain tariff & non tariff barriers on imports & of course a cheaper currency that always helps them.

The major early component of the miracle plan mentioned above is export success, and importers do love a stable exchange rate. The counter parties that benefit the most are walmart & such, without which the current material quality of life in the US isn't possible. It's what every success story in the region does, some more effectively than others, and china is rather successful. Once the plan gradually shifts to domestic consumption, the currency correspondingly goes back up, as it's doing right now.

So have you pondered how exactly people who have no idea what's going on are supposed to analyze the situation?
 

R0H1T

Platinum Member
Jan 12, 2013
2,582
162
106
I mean the one you either didn't read or couldn't understand. The secession of Tibet was basically your typical colonial dick move by the British, at a time when the country was getting carved up by foreign powers. When mao came out on top after the mess, his first order of business was to show that china wasn't the sick man of asia anymore by taking back what was perceived to have been stolen, or at least what he feasibly could.
So I take it you're fine with redrawing the map of Asia, even today, presumably by force & then any other country who feels threatened by China's continued expansionist plans has very little to fall back to!
The major early component of the miracle plan mentioned above is export success, and importers do love a stable exchange rate. The counter parties that benefit the most are walmart & such, without which the current material quality of life in the US isn't possible. It's what every success story in the region does, some more effectively than others, and china is rather successful. Once the plan gradually shifts to domestic consumption, the currency correspondingly goes back up, as it's doing right now.

So have you pondered how exactly people who have no idea what's going on are supposed to analyze the situation?
Miracle plan just for the Chinese, what about the rest of the world do they follow the same model or would China preach the WTO rules to them?

I've never been a fan of consumerism & in fact wouldn't shy away from saying that US is the most wasteful nation on this earth. It's not something to revel in, anyone following that model of prosperity (like China these days) should have a good hard look where the world's heading & it's not just because of American wars, as many would like to stress upon.

Not every success story, you're mistaken if you think fixing one's currency was the way every nation, especially from Asia, has prospered. If you're simply taking about exports then yes that's the way to go, but to have to peg your currency to make exports uber competitive is the wrong way to go & shows where China has failed. You still haven't answered why China is (still) subsidizing many of their exports & as I've said basically exporting deflation to the world economy, why don't they take care of the excess capacity? Also copying, stealing, negative propaganda against much of their neighbors, how does that not paint China in a bad light?

I'm not sure who you're referring to but as I am from this region, & live here, I do know more than most other posters on this forum about China's regional problems & naked aggression.
 
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Flapdrol1337

Golden Member
May 21, 2014
1,677
93
91
I think the chinese leadership really made a mistake dredging up that island airbase. I wouldn't be surprised if the other countries around that sea +south korea and japan end up in some kind US backed anti china alliance.
 

Svnla

Lifer
Nov 10, 2003
17,999
1,396
126
Mods, you've got three people trolling Snvla and failing at it, hard. Is there some point where you restore order in a thread or do you like seeing these 3 post the lulz? (I confess, I get entertainment from Nickie, so I can understand if you like seeing Svnla slap them around)

LOL. No need for mods action. I am having fun with those individuals by providing facts with back up by well known sources and links. Funny how they could NOT dispute my statements or my sources/links as not true. I will explain further later. This is so easy, more easy than drink a cup of water. :D
 

norseamd

Lifer
Dec 13, 2013
13,990
180
106
I think the chinese leadership really made a mistake dredging up that island airbase. I wouldn't be surprised if the other countries around that sea +south korea and japan end up in some kind US backed anti china alliance.

"might possibly end up in the future"?

ROFL

http://thediplomat.com/2016/06/us-japan-and-india-kick-off-malabar-2016/

http://thediplomat.com/2016/04/us-c...ith-japan-australia-after-indonesia-exercise/

http://thediplomat.com/2015/09/the-real-significance-of-the-japan-vietnam-strategic-partnership/

http://nationalinterest.org/blog/the-buzz/moving-the-us-vietnam-relationship-the-future-16361
 

norseamd

Lifer
Dec 13, 2013
13,990
180
106
I mean the one you either didn't read or couldn't understand. The secession of Tibet was basically your typical colonial dick move by the British, at a time when the country was getting carved up by foreign powers. When mao came out on top after the mess, his first order of business was to show that china wasn't the sick man of asia anymore by taking back what was perceived to have been stolen, or at least what he feasibly could.

Love how you just completely ignore and trample over thousands of years of Tibetan history and independence.
 

norseamd

Lifer
Dec 13, 2013
13,990
180
106
No one is saying that it's "okay" for them to be flexing their muscles. The point is that the parties involved should sort their own shit out. That means China/Vietnam/Japan/Phillipines/etc.

That does NOT mean the USA should get involved and start a catastrophic conflict with China. We are done being the mall cops of the world. People need to fight their own wars, we of all peoples should know that by now.

Are you ignoring the fact that those countries want us to work with them?
 

zinfamous

No Lifer
Jul 12, 2006
110,515
29,100
146
It's certainly amusing to see their attacks bouncing off him while he valiantly sticks to his subject. Notice how all the attacks are basically the same - belittling his points about wiki, his intelligence, showing off their possibly student-loan-funded liberal arts chops, lamenting his lack of application of precious Liberal College Peer Approved groupthink all the while brushing away the original point of China's expansionist plans.

The irony is even more keen when you consider the same gang rise in vicious outrage if as much as an Israeli stone falls past UN defined borders.

But hey, China taking stuff from its neighbors and flexing muscles? A-OK

A couple of things, because you have no idea where I'm coming from:

This "liberal" has no love for China and their expansionist plans. I have no tolerance for their past atrocities and their current atrocities. I'm clearly not even commenting on that, because I am "with you" and even SVNLA or whatever he calls himself.

If you've seen this guy post, he's claimed/denied being whatever ethnicity he purports to be. He isn't a "southern redneck" yet some threads some months ago, it was revealed and I recall him supporting the suggestion that he was Vietnamese. Honestly, I don't give a rat's ass--but he clearly does. This is the type of melon that demands to know where others stand and where they come from: "Are you a chinese? You must be! of course you would say that!" "Those little cockroaches invading!" etc, yet when challenged and asked about his own provenance in order to gain perspective--you know, maybe approach things rationally--he turtles up with the 3rd grade "You don't know me! you will never know me! haha-I am on the internet! I am perfectly safe and happy in my anonymous safe space!" His points about wiki are easily challenged because his points are a frank denial of very real facts--do you often engage in arguments with people that try to point out to you that 2+2 = 4? That is the sum total of his specific charge against wikipedia (which shows that he really has no idea what he's talking about--just a passionate assumption that is trounced by data)

It's a behavioral pattern that he is forever called on, because he has never once engaged honestly with a single individual when called into discussion about any issue. Always right, never failing--any challenges directed his way are forever weak and wrong, because that person "is probably chinese and doesn't know anything about me!"

It's the same thing over and over again. Christ, just look at the signature on that dude: an admitted brick wall that repeals reason and maturity. Do you know anyone like that in real life? Do they have friends?

So, please, before you pretend to know where I am coming from, please gain a little perspective on these BS forum shenanigans. Or not--it really doesn't matter. :D

and fwiw: chucky is an admitted and proud racist around here. I'm not calling him out or tossing any fuel here, it's something I imagine that wouldn't bother him, as it's well publicized in these forums. Point being--it is no wonder that he would be on Svnla's side here in this racially-tinged topic. (I've actually been on Svnla's side of things several times before...it's just this childish behavior of his and refusal to engage honestly with people brings this out of me)
 
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Svnla

Lifer
Nov 10, 2003
17,999
1,396
126
A couple of things, because you have no idea where I'm coming from:

This "liberal" has no love for China and their expansionist plans. I have no tolerance for their past atrocities and their current atrocities. I'm clearly not even commenting on that, because I am "with you" and even SVNLA or whatever he calls himself.

If you've seen this guy post, he's claimed/denied being whatever ethnicity he purports to be. He isn't a "southern redneck" yet some threads some months ago, it was revealed and I recall him supporting the suggestion that he was Vietnamese. Honestly, I don't give a rat's ass--but he clearly does. This is the type of melon that demands to know where others stand and where they come from: "Are you a chinese? You must be! of course you would say that!" "Those little cockroaches invading!" etc, yet when challenged and asked about his own provenance in order to gain perspective--you know, maybe approach things rationally--he turtles up with the 3rd grade "You don't know me! you will never know me! haha-I am on the internet! I am perfectly safe and happy in my anonymous safe space!" His points about wiki are easily challenged because his points are a frank denial of very real facts--do you often engage in arguments with people that try to point out to you that 2+2 = 4? That is the sum total of his specific charge against wikipedia (which shows that he really has no idea what he's talking about--just a passionate assumption that is trounced by data)

It's a behavioral pattern that he is forever called on, because he has never once engaged honestly with a single individual when called into discussion about any issue. Always right, never failing--any challenges directed his way are forever weak and wrong, because that person "is probably chinese and doesn't know anything about me!"

It's the same thing over and over again. Christ, just look at the signature on that dude: an admitted brick wall that repeals reason and maturity. Do you know anyone like that in real life? Do they have friends?

So, please, before you pretend to know where I am coming from, please gain a little perspective on these BS forum shenanigans. Or not--it really doesn't matter. :D

and fwiw: chucky is an admitted and proud racist around here. I'm not calling him out or tossing any fuel here, it's something I imagine that wouldn't bother him, as it's well publicized in these forums. Point being--it is no wonder that he would be on Svnla's side here in this racially-tinged topic. (I've actually been on Svnla's side of things several times before...it's just this childish behavior of his and refusal to engage honestly with people brings this out of me)

Another day, another wild accusation from zin WITHOUT any proof, just like many times from him before.

Again, show me the thread and exact quote from me that you accused me from above (bolded and underlined part). And of course, more whining and bitching from you about my sig. Do you need a new girl pantie? Safe space from my evil sig? Bigger sucker to suck so you can calm down from my big bad sig?

I will wait, just like I am still waiting for proof about your accusation that I said I was never wrong. Anytime now...anytime..... <snickering>

Oh, and I already addressed your so called " why can't he engage honestly" bullcrap above.

:D
 
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agent00f

Lifer
Jun 9, 2016
12,203
1,242
86
So I take it you're fine with redrawing the map of Asia, even today, presumably by force & then any other country who feels threatened by China's continued expansionist plans has very little to fall back to!

This implies you didn't understand the previous post rather than didn't read them. This is the worse case since it demonstrates explanations of historical realities are futile against the barrier of willful ignorance.

Today china is just flexing its muscles like some mini-me version of the US. So if you're genuinely concerned about countries in its sphere of influence, imagine how those places in the western hemisphere particular those with the least white populations feel about this.

Miracle plan just for the Chinese, what about the rest of the world do they follow the same model or would China preach the WTO rules to them?

I've never been a fan of consumerism & in fact wouldn't shy away from saying that US is the most wasteful nation on this earth. It's not something to revel in, anyone following that model of prosperity (like China these days) should have a good hard look where the world's heading & it's not just because of American wars, as many would like to stress upon.

I'm just pointing out their type of plan doesn't work without creating a win-win situation for many other parties. In sum, americans & friends are among the major beneficiaries of these policies, so they should be careful about those cheap imported bricks they're hurling from that castle built from cheap imported glass.

Not every success story, you're mistaken if you think fixing one's currency was the way every nation, especially from Asia, has prospered. If you're simply taking about exports then yes that's the way to go, but to have to peg your currency to make exports uber competitive is the wrong way to go & shows where China has failed. You still haven't answered why China is (still) subsidizing many of their exports & as I've said basically exporting deflation to the world economy, why don't they take care of the excess capacity? Also copying, stealing, negative propaganda against much of their neighbors, how does that not paint China in a bad light?

I'm not sure who you're referring to but as I am from this region, & live here, I do know more than most other posters on this forum about China's regional problems & naked aggression.

China is going to do what's good for china, and their execution of the plan has been anything but a failure, wishful thinking notwithstanding. If you're from the region, you should be aware of where they were couple decades ago vs now so ignorance won't be an excuse. Expansion & enforcement of their sphere of influence goes hand in hand with that success.

LOL. No need for mods action. I am having fun with those individuals by providing facts with back up by well known sources and links. Funny how they could NOT dispute my statements or my sources/links as not true. I will explain further later. This is so easy, more easy than drink a cup of water. :D

When you've been nominated to be the new dunning kruger posterchild, living up to that reputation isn't the best plan of action for your own sake. I would hope that IRL you have some redeeming qualities, so if you reflected on both situations hard enough (yours and china's), perhaps it becomes clear that a picture of only a subject's negatives might not paint an accurate portrayal.

Love how you just completely ignore and trample over thousands of years of Tibetan history and independence.

Tibet has had an in/out relationship with china since forever. Given they're dependent on china anyway for moving past religious feudalism, the exact nature of the political relationship is largely a matter of optics.
 

DrunkenSano

Diamond Member
Aug 8, 2008
3,892
490
126
Snvla is simply a dumbass with an agenda. He's clearly never been to china or know anything about it, yet feels compelled to share every piece of right wing agit-prop or such he can find on the web. Facts evidently don't matter to these people, so the conversation as usual turns to the underlying problem. It's the same deal with the islamophobe threads or others where the usually suspects come out of the woodwork when some minority does anything untoward. It's basically their chance to "I told you so" about segregation/exclusion-act/etc.

Also:

I was pondering these sorts of thread and had an idea. In the interest of better organization, this forum should have a thread for every foreign ethnicity, where records of their uppidiness can be recorded for posterity & reference. For logistical purposes, we should assign a member who ostensibly hates each race/creed the most to their respective responsibility. A foreseeable issue though is that these bigotries tend to overlap, for example, some might hate all asians, but others only the chinese, similarly arabs/muslims or hispanics/mexicans. So the bigots will have to work out some kind of system for deduplication & such.

Funny enough, reading this thread, Snvla is the only one providing facts and links while your posts, like this one, just want to focus on insults. You should also provide some substance if you want to argue that what Snvla is saying is wrong.
 

Svnla

Lifer
Nov 10, 2003
17,999
1,396
126
Funny enough, reading this thread, Snvla is the only one providing facts and links while your posts, like this one, just want to focus on insults. You should also provide some substance if you want to argue that what Snvla is saying is wrong.

Thank you. I am glad my multiple links and sources are readable to others. For a while, I thought my links did not work (so everyone would be able to see) with this new forum software.

Here is another link from a well know source about how a small nation can fight back against china naked aggression = http://www.popularmechanics.com/military/weapons/a22420/vietnam-weapons-defense-china/

The power of the mighty US Air Force is coming to the Pacific = http://www.popularmechanics.com/mil...-forces-bombers-are-operating-in-the-pacific/

Japan newest aircraft carriers = http://www.businessinsider.com/how-...tack-up-to-other-world-powers-flattops-2016-8

I better watch out because popularmechanics site could be a biased conservative right wing site per agent00f's accusation as he did multiple times before in this thread yet unable to provide anything to debunk/dispute my links. :D
 
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agent00f

Lifer
Jun 9, 2016
12,203
1,242
86
Funny enough, reading this thread, Snvla is the only one providing facts and links while your posts, like this one, just want to focus on insults. You should also provide some substance if you want to argue that what Snvla is saying is wrong.

I understand the appeal of threads where simpletons repost anything favorable they can find on the web for some subject. The most popular revolve around uppity minorities as mentioned, in addition to science denial and general quackery. It's not a coincidence that a merge of their contents is remarkably similar to going to brietbart.com. Whether these clowns cherry-pick brietbart & co, or all happen to branch another common source is still a mystery to me, but that detail isn't critical.

As you might've seen & repressed from memory, sometimes thinking types come along and debunk various claims with actual knowledge & such, as I've done on occasion like here with some actual history of tibet along with others for whatever else. But in the scheme of thing it's a futile game of whack-a-mole, as the simpleton strategy is their usual tard strength approach, and it simply takes more effort to think than to mass-repost.

In sum, it makes sense people of differing ability take different approaches to arguing a case, but the underlying mechanisms aren't created equal and it's important to understand why.
 

chucky2

Lifer
Dec 9, 1999
10,038
36
86
snip

and fwiw: chucky is an admitted and proud racist around here. I'm not calling him out or tossing any fuel here, it's something I imagine that wouldn't bother him, as it's well publicized in these forums. Point being--it is no wonder that he would be on Svnla's side here in this racially-tinged topic. (I've actually been on Svnla's side of things several times before...it's just this childish behavior of his and refusal to engage honestly with people brings this out of me)

A couple of things:

1.) Svnla for all the trolling you guys are doing is essentially making you all look stupid. I know this is hard for Intellectuals to understand (panic puppy horrifying) but, there it is. It's not just me pointing this out, others are as well.

2.) Yet again you cannot get it right. I've readily said I'm racist. A proud racist? That just sounds...strange. I'm proud I'm not an indoctrinated sucker Whitey, or kowtow to the various racial agendas like dumbass sucker Whiteys do, but that doesn't make me a proud racist, that just makes me not a sucker or indoctrinated. I know this is horrifying, as it means the White Guilt / SJW BS just doesn't work on me, and that's mainly the tactics used on these poor f*ckers now a days to ensure Whitey (and especially male Whitey) is marginalized to whatever is extant possible in favor of <insert not Whitey/maleWhitey>. Worse, I actually acknowledge just how racist minorities are (more racist than normal Whitey will ever be), which sorta kills the entire 'Be worried about being racist Whitey, be really worried!' as WhoTF would be worried about being racist when the groups they'd be racist against are more racist - and often, openly racist, with no backlash - than they'll ever be. So do I view racism a problem? Sure. Am I worried about not wanting things destroyed in areas that haven't been affected by a certain "minority" (they're a majority where I'm at) and calling it like I see it? Nope. Do I some kind of worry that when I do that it's racist? Nope. If people don't like that, a.) I don't give a sh1t, and b.) maybe they can actually work to change why I'd need to take that stance. Instead, they just work to make sure Whitey is subservient. O'Bummer, I get what the game is and I'm not buying in. ' Bu bu bu he's ra ra ra ra raaayyycist!!!!!shift+1!!!'...yeah, OK...
 

agent00f

Lifer
Jun 9, 2016
12,203
1,242
86
A couple of things:

1.) Svnla for all the trolling you guys are doing is essentially making you all look stupid. I know this is hard for Intellectuals to understand (panic puppy horrifying) but, there it is. It's not just me pointing this out, others are as well.

The verdict is still out whether this new anti-intellectual/anti-expertise/anti-brain right is better or worse than the old monied elite one. On the one hand, mocking them is easier, but on the other, their side of the conversation is dreadfully repetitive & dull.

2.) Yet again you cannot get it right. I've readily said I'm racist. A proud racist? That just sounds...strange. I'm proud I'm not an indoctrinated sucker Whitey, or kowtow to the various racial agendas like dumbass sucker Whiteys do, but that doesn't make me a proud racist, that just makes me not a sucker or indoctrinated. I know this is horrifying, as it means the White Guilt / SJW BS just doesn't work on me, and that's mainly the tactics used on these poor f*ckers now a days to ensure Whitey (and especially male Whitey) is marginalized to whatever is extant possible in favor of <insert not Whitey/maleWhitey>. Worse, I actually acknowledge just how racist minorities are (more racist than normal Whitey will ever be), which sorta kills the entire 'Be worried about being racist Whitey, be really worried!' as WhoTF would be worried about being racist when the groups they'd be racist against are more racist - and often, openly racist, with no backlash - than they'll ever be. So do I view racism a problem? Sure. Am I worried about not wanting things destroyed in areas that haven't been affected by a certain "minority" (they're a majority where I'm at) and calling it like I see it? Nope. Do I some kind of worry that when I do that it's racist? Nope. If people don't like that, a.) I don't give a sh1t, and b.) maybe they can actually work to change why I'd need to take that stance. Instead, they just work to make sure Whitey is subservient. O'Bummer, I get what the game is and I'm not buying in. ' Bu bu bu he's ra ra ra ra raaayyycist!!!!!shift+1!!!'...yeah, OK...

In all fairness, even if someone is kinda racist that is not a valid ad hom per se. In this situation it's more that you can't even come up with an argument except that breitbart-level "facts" are awesome.
 

werepossum

Elite Member
Jul 10, 2006
29,873
463
126
I wonder if the Clinton Family Foundation has a line item for "Take over South China Sea" or that's the sort of thing that has to be built up a la carte? Could get expensive if the latter.
 

agent00f

Lifer
Jun 9, 2016
12,203
1,242
86
I don't understand why the alt?

Since you're also ignorant of this, be aware that this accusation leveled by many of the dummies here had been investigated by the admins and found to be lacking. Personally I really doubt someone else here happens to write like I do, but feel free to be specific since it piques my own curiosity.
 

chucky2

Lifer
Dec 9, 1999
10,038
36
86
Since you're also ignorant of this, be aware that this accusation leveled by many of the dummies here had been investigated by the admins and found to be lacking. Personally I really doubt someone else here happens to write like I do, but feel free to be specific since it piques my own curiosity.

Why the alt though?
 

agent00f

Lifer
Jun 9, 2016
12,203
1,242
86
Repeating yourself is not going to change reality, despite what you might imagine in your head. The retort is also a complete non-sequitur, since someone posting under another accord has no effect on you own ineptitude.