• We should now be fully online following an overnight outage. Apologies for any inconvenience, we do not expect there to be any further issues.

i love Zero tolerance!

waggy

No Lifer
Dec 14, 2000
68,143
10
81
http://www.thedenverchannel.co...s/18677952/detail.html

DENVER -- For Marie Morrow, the equipment left in the back seat of her car was for an upcoming competition. She said she never expected it would lead to her being suspended from school -- or possibly expelled.

"I take responsibility, it was my mistake," Morrow told 7NEWS. She left three drill team "practice" rifles in plain view of passing students last week.

Morrow, who says she has a 3.5 grade point average, is a member of the Douglas County Young Marines. She said she spins the practice rifles for the organization?s drill team

Staff members at Cherokee Trail High School were alerted by concerned students who thought they might be real, said a Cherry Creek Schools spokeswoman.

"They went inside. They were anxious. They were frightened," school district spokeswoman Tustin Amole said.

The mock rifles are made of wood, with duct tape, to resemble a real rifle.

Amole explained the school district?s policy mirrors state and federal laws about weapons in schools, and calls for "mandatory expulsion" when possessing a dangerous weapon in any school building.

A student conduct handbook states a dangerous weapon includes "a firearm, whether loaded or unloaded, or a firearm facsimile that could reasonably be mistaken for an actual firearm."

"You have to remember these laws were implemented in the years after Columbine," Amole said, and added the school was left with no choice.

"We follow the state law," Amole said.

"I understand exactly why the policy is there," Morrow said on the east steps of the state capitol Monday.

Chris Proctor, commanding officer of the Douglas County Young Marines, praised Morrow's commitment to the program and school.

"For her to have to go through this is completely insane," Proctor said.

The Young Marine Organization is the official youth program of the U.S. Marine Corps and focused on drug reduction and leadership, Proctor explained.

Morrow, dressed in her drill team uniform, visited the capitol to visit with lawmakers about the possibility of changing the state statute relating to weapons in schools.

"It should be up to the discretion of the school board to say, 'OK, there's no intent, it was just a mistake,'" Morrow said with her mom, brother, and friends looking on.

Morrow, who plans to attend the United States Merchant Marine Academy, met briefly with and gained support from several legislators on the hill.

Sen. Scott Renfroe, (R-Weld County,) said the 17-year-old was the topic of discussion among fellow senators.

"We need to look at this and add some common sense to our statute," Renfroe said.

Reps. Cindy Acree, (R-Aurora,) and Frank McNulty, (R-Highlands Ranch,) held an impromptu meeting with Morrow and her family inside the capitol.

Acree told 7NEWS she doesn't fault the school district for enforcing state laws.

"We just have to make sure it's not overbearing for our administrators and students, so they can still be kids," Acree said.

She explained she may seek to amend the state statute with a late bill during the current legislative session.

Acree added she is also writing a letter to colleagues "so we can support (Marie) before she goes to her hearing."

Amole said an expulsion hearing will be held within 10 days of a student suspension. An expulsion officer will make a recommendation to the superintendent, who will rule on the length of expulsion.

Morrow said she her expulsion hearing is Feb. 20.

"I'm just hoping I can go back to school and graduate with my class and take my AP tests and all that," she said.




OK this is just nuts. really its silly. they want to suspend her for a good program and doing something good.

sigh at least there are people trying to help her and changet he rules. Zero tolerance was/is a stupid rule.
 

Brovane

Diamond Member
Dec 18, 2001
6,390
2,582
136
Apparently School Administrators have had there common sense surgically removed.
 

tasmanian

Diamond Member
Dec 22, 2006
3,811
1
0
Originally posted by: Brovane
Apparently School Administrators have had there common sense surgically removed.

I think its more law makers. Gotta protect the kids!
 

RichardE

Banned
Dec 31, 2005
10,246
2
0
Sounds like a smart kid who is going through the proper channels to get this changed instead of screaming bloody blue murder.
 

dainthomas

Lifer
Dec 7, 2004
14,935
3,914
136
I'm shocked that the legislature is actually looking to amend the statute. That makes way too much sense for government!

And the students afraid of fake drill rifles made with duct tape are fail.
 

actuarial

Platinum Member
Jan 22, 2009
2,814
0
71
How hard is it for the administrators to say that it could not be REASONABLY be mistaken for a firearm (ie. the students who thought that it was were idiots). That is the one subjective part of that 'zero tolerance' rule, and is exactly for this situation. Furthermore, this stuff HAS to happen a lot more than it is reported (the action, not the punishment). I'm sure the vast majority of administrators let 'zero tolerance' crap slide all the time, but the idiots who don't REALLY end up negatively impacting students lives.

Zero tolerance makes no sense, and is so backwards to any modern civilized society's legal system. It takes the notion that it's better to let 1,000 criminals walk free than have one innocent man in prison, and basically flips it.
 

JDub02

Diamond Member
Sep 27, 2002
6,209
1
0
Originally posted by: Brovane
Apparently School Administrators have had there common sense surgically removed.

My wife is a teacher. I've learned that it is a mandatory procedure for all school superintendents and optional, but encouraged, for all principals.
 

Chryso

Diamond Member
Nov 23, 2004
4,039
13
81
Originally posted by: waggy
A student conduct handbook states a dangerous weapon includes "a firearm, whether loaded or unloaded, or a firearm facsimile that could reasonably be mistaken for an actual firearm."

How is a fake gun a dangerous weapon?
 

spidey07

No Lifer
Aug 4, 2000
65,469
5
76
I'd say the real shame here is this.

"They went inside. They were anxious. They were frightened," school district spokeswoman Tustin Amole said.

But really good of the student to try to get the state law changed.
 

Anubis

No Lifer
Aug 31, 2001
78,712
427
126
tbqhwy.com
Originally posted by: Chryso
Originally posted by: waggy
A student conduct handbook states a dangerous weapon includes "a firearm, whether loaded or unloaded, or a firearm facsimile that could reasonably be mistaken for an actual firearm."

How is a fake gun a dangerous weapon?

it could be used as a club
 

SunnyD

Belgian Waffler
Jan 2, 2001
32,675
146
106
www.neftastic.com
Originally posted by: Chryso
Originally posted by: waggy
A student conduct handbook states a dangerous weapon includes "a firearm, whether loaded or unloaded, or a firearm facsimile that could reasonably be mistaken for an actual firearm."

How is a fake gun a dangerous weapon?

Because someone is gonna call the coppers and the coppers are going to shoot said student. Hence, dangerous (for the student).
 

Deeko

Lifer
Jun 16, 2000
30,213
12
81
Originally posted by: Brovane
Apparently School Administrators have had there common sense surgically removed.

Its not their fault the law is wrong. If they don't follow it, they lose their jobs.
 

mugs

Lifer
Apr 29, 2003
48,920
46
91
Are these the practice rifles that are all wood, no metal parts at all?

Edit: Yeah, the article says wood and duct tape. I guess that duct tape is probably black...
 

xanis

Lifer
Sep 11, 2005
17,571
8
0
Originally posted by: mugs
Are these the practice rifles that are all wood, no metal parts at all?

Edit: Yeah, the article says wood and duct tape. I guess that duct tape is probably black...

Why use metal when you could use duct tape? Realism FTW!
 

irishScott

Lifer
Oct 10, 2006
21,562
3
0
Back in elementary school I brought in a replica of a musket for a project when we were studying the revolutionary war. Granted I cleared it with the administration first, and it was pre-columbine, but I just walked in carrying it; and what kind of yuppie/pussy students are these? When I was walking through the halls with mine all of the kids thought it was awesome. This was 4th grade (late 90s). :confused:
 

xanis

Lifer
Sep 11, 2005
17,571
8
0
Originally posted by: irishScott
Back in elementary school I brought in a replica of a musket for a project when we were studying the revolutionary war. Granted I cleared it with the administration first, and it was pre-columbine, but I just walked in carrying it; and what kind of yuppie/pussy students are these? When I was walking through the halls with mine all of the kids thought it was awesome. This was 4th grade (late 90s). :confused:

Times have changed. Years of pussification and fear-mongering have changed everything.
 

hanoverphist

Diamond Member
Dec 7, 2006
9,867
23
76
Originally posted by: dainthomas
I'm shocked that the legislature is actually looking to amend the statute. That makes way too much sense for government!

And the students afraid of fake drill rifles made with duct tape are fail.

unless they dont know what real guns look like, then it is perfectly understandable. those rifles are painted wood with duct tape on them, not made of duct tape.
 

AnonymouseUser

Diamond Member
May 14, 2003
9,943
107
106
The only logical solution to prevent this kind of situation in the future is to ban weapons from the Marine Corps. until actually needed. Let them practice with twirling batons.

/PC "protect the children" solution
 

fuzzybabybunny

Moderator<br>Digital & Video Cameras
Moderator
Jan 2, 2006
10,455
35
91
I can kinda see how such a law was passed, and understand that it just needs to be amended due to unforeseen consequences. When the original law was passed the legislators probably couldn't think of any good, sensible reason for a kid to bring a fake gun to school. They just saw it as a huge liability. They couldn't have predicted that a youth Marine with a practice drill rifle would fall into the net.

And it's hard to pass judgment on the looks of the rifle without seeing a pic. Considering that people mistook them for real ones means they were "a firearm facsimile that could reasonably be mistaken for an actual firearm." Real rifles can be made out of wood and someone with the intent of bringing a real rifle to school could reasonably wrap it with duct tape to make it look as fake and unassuming as possible to get the element of surprise. I've seen people do this with their expensive bicycles. They wrap their $1500 titanium road bikes in duct tape and bumper stickers to make them look like cheap unassuming crap to any bike thieves.

And what if the school had let it slide and something bad did happen? They can't afford the liability of not following the law.
 

Gooberlx2

Lifer
May 4, 2001
15,381
6
91
Yeah it's stupid. Especially in the Colorado/Denver area, zero-tolerance laws implemented after Columbine were many and unwaivering, and people are still all too willing to panic. It's caused all kinds of problems, and this is a perfect example. Obviously, the principle or school board or administrator or someone should be able to inject some subjectivity/reason into the case. Honestly, the MOST this offense deserves is a warning.

Hopefully someone at the Capital will listen.

edit:
I'm not quite sure why the teacher, principle, VP, etc.. didn't just keep it off the books, take the girl aside and quietly warn her...
 

SarcasticDwarf

Diamond Member
Jun 8, 2001
9,574
2
76
Originally posted by: fuzzybabybunny
I can kinda see how such a law was passed, and understand that it just needs to be amended due to unforeseen consequences. When the original law was passed the legislators probably couldn't think of any good, sensible reason for a kid to bring a fake gun to school. They just saw it as a huge liability. They couldn't have predicted that a youth Marine with a practice drill rifle would fall into the net.

Nope, that is a bullshit excuse. It is their JOB to make sure that the laws they are creating will work correctly.