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I have to be honest, from a religious standpoint I can't really single out gays

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Originally posted by: judasmachine
Originally posted by: LunarRay
Originally posted by: judasmachine
god apparently hates us all so what does it matter?
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In equal measure you shall receive what you give..
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apathy for apathy, sounds fair.

btw that part was a joke.
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Right.. it is fair by all accounts.. Love your neighbor AS you love yourself.. that is what that fellow said.. He should know these things.. assuming he said them.. and I assume he did..
As it applies to God.. I'm quite sure that God will apply that standard as well to those who believe in him.. those that don't.. God knows.. maybe just worm food.. but heck worms gotta eat too.. so.. well .. there it is.. (btw that part was a joke too... 🙂 worms don't eat dust.. well they may.. worms are sorta dumb... fish eat em.. and ya know how dumb they are... )

 
I find no special comfort that I am in a vast majority----as a male I want to have sex with females---and I have found a female who wants to have sex with me as a male. I am happy but I sure don't want some censor in our bedroom giving a thumbs up or down for proper sex.

What totally baffles me is why I should feel threatened in any way by males or females who do not share our hetrosexual preferences. I have better things to worry about.
Among them a religious right that is every bit as freedom threatening as the Taliban. After all, that minority in question are also still the sons and daughters of America. Why should I go out of my way to make their lives miserable? Will it make me feel any better to flaunt my credentials as the sex police?
 
Well I don't think from a theological standpoint that all sins need to be equal. I don't think the bible says anywhere that all sins are of equal weighting in the eyes of God. Also, homosexuality isn't even in the ten commandments so I think that makes it less of a sin.

So disrespecting your parents, working on Sunday, cheating on your taxes, and being jealous of your best bud's XBox360 are all greater sins than homosexuality.
 
Originally posted by: LunarRay
Originally posted by: michaels
Or homosexuality for the matter to be any worse than any other sin. Scholarly types please correct me if needed. But doesn't the Bible say something along the lines of all sins being equal? if so, how can you elevate homosexuality over something like lying or something similar?
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A fellow answered your question a long time ago.. I'm told..

He said... "the greatest commandment was to love God with all your heart and soul and another equal to it... to love your neighbor AS you love yourself" and he went on to say... " Upon these two are all the laws of the prophets"...

Love God.. and love your neighbor... simple.. IF your neighbor is anyone you are to love them... and remember to not look for the splinter in the eye of another and neglect the log in your own...

Edit... Read Matt 23 and then ponder what hate is all around us using God as the reason to allow that hate.. amazing
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Amen and well said!! I would only add 1 Corinthians, Chapter 13 verses 4-7(?). This is one of the few passages from the bible that I think sums up everything religion is supposed to be about.
Homosexuality is just the latest in a long line of things to condemn. As others have stated, this doesn't affect me one whit and, quite frankly, some of the best "christians" I know are gay.
It's this type of hypocrisy against our "neighbors" that has me more and more looking at alternative forms of spirituality!
 
To say that something is a sin is not to judge them. Defining one's morality is a human obligation, and there is no human body of governance that rules how individuals set their moral standard and on what.

To set oneself above "sinners", as though you are flawless and in a position to condemn, is when judgment begins. No human has a right to that. I think that is where the OP is trying to go - that if sin is sin, nobody has the right to cast a stone.
 
Originally posted by: michaels
Or homosexuality for the matter to be any worse than any other sin. Scholarly types please correct me if needed. But doesn't the Bible say something along the lines of all sins being equal? if so, how can you elevate homosexuality over something like lying or something similar?
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No, not all sin is equal. There is a mention in the NT specficially about sexual sin being worse then normal sin, but outside of natural consquences, the spritial ramifications are the same.

A poster referenced Billy Graham mentioning divorce being the worse sin - Bibically i am not sure about that. I do know it specifically states that God hates divorce. Is it because it is a 'worse' sin? or because it can be more damaging to a person's well being? I can't give a definitive answer either way.


Christians make a huge mistake when they single out homosexuality. Period. It drives people away, creates hard feelings, but more importantly it lets Christian's (and wrongly at that) compartmentalise sin. The classic "i am be a sinner, but at least i'm not like XXXXXX, which is much worse."

To answer your question: practicing homosexulity is no different then any other sexual sin. The only differnce is, Christians just get hung up on it.

 
Originally posted by: michaels
Or homosexuality for the matter to be any worse than any other sin. Scholarly types please correct me if needed. But doesn't the Bible say something along the lines of all sins being equal? if so, how can you elevate homosexuality over something like lying or something similar?
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If you request scholarly-type responses, you will likely receive several different "correct" ones. New Testament vs Old Testament etc.

The New Testament identifies one sin that is above all others (the others can be forgiven), that is to reject Jesus Christ (seems to be referred to as "Blasmiphy). It cannot be forgiven.

As far as "elavating homosexuality" over other sins, it seems to me they don't. From what I read in the paper (I don't go to church), they always say "practicing homosexual".

I believe the term "practicing" is of importance. Would you wanna hang out with a practicing liar, or practicing thief, or practicing murderer (i.e., someone who does NOT believes those are "sins" and does them constantly)? So, just as there is a prohibition on active homosexuals from becoming clergy, so would there be for active thieves and active liars etc. I could be wrong, but from what I read, that seems to be their position.

Fern



 
This is one thing that i have long wished more people would realize. Everything that I understand from the bible would suggest that there is no difference between sins. Every single sin has only one consiquence: seperation from God. Therefore I cannot say that I'm better than a homosexual, or a porn star, or a kleptomaniac, or anybody else who constantly sins. It is a human idea to charactarize some things as being worse, but I have not seen anything in the bible that says that murder, lying, lust, homosexuality (or any other sexual sin for that matter) are different. The net result is always the same, the only difference between me any anybody else who does these things is my belief that sin exists and therefore seperates me from God, and therefore I need God's forgiveness.
That said i think that the recent christian backlash against homosexuality comes *in part* from the recent push for the idea that homosexuality is perfectly normal, needs to be accepted, etc... Once you start pushing for the acceptance of anything that was not always accepted by mainstream society and is also considered a sin the result will be a backlash from the group that consideres it to be a sin.
 
Originally posted by: HotChic
To say that something is a sin is not to judge them. Defining one's morality is a human obligation, and there is no human body of governance that rules how individuals set their moral standard and on what.

To set oneself above "sinners", as though you are flawless and in a position to condemn, is when judgment begins. No human has a right to that. I think that is where the OP is trying to go - that if sin is sin, nobody has the right to cast a stone.
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That is the thing about homosexuality: Those who are not homosexual feel they really do have the right to cast the first stone.
 
Originally posted by: Astaroth33
Originally posted by: HotChic
To say that something is a sin is not to judge them. Defining one's morality is a human obligation, and there is no human body of governance that rules how individuals set their moral standard and on what.

To set oneself above "sinners", as though you are flawless and in a position to condemn, is when judgment begins. No human has a right to that. I think that is where the OP is trying to go - that if sin is sin, nobody has the right to cast a stone.
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That is the thing about homosexuality: Those who are not homosexual feel they really do have the right to cast the first stone.
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When they do that, ignoring their own sin, it undermines their entire theological position. Unfortunately, not enough people stop to think about that. Props to the OP for considering this - it's the starting point for a better understanding of the relationship between all humans and God, as well as the relationships all humans should have with each other.

As Banzai said, you either are or are not a sinner. There's no set of "degrees" in the spiritual consequence. It's like saying you are or are not living. There is no "kinda" and there are no degrees. You're alive or not alive. From a material standpoint, there are definitely degrees of consequence though.
 
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