I have always wondered this since teens:

Discussion in 'Off Topic' started by Zeze, Jan 9, 2013.

  1. Mr. Pedantic

    Mr. Pedantic Diamond Member

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    Gee, look how far you've moved the goalposts.

    It's not magic to predict that things will get better over time.
     
  2. brianmanahan

    brianmanahan Lifer

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    the ones who came before can do it in assassin's creed

    so yeah
     
  3. lxskllr

    lxskllr Lifer

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    I haven't moved the goal posts anywhere. I said you can open your browser and see behavioral tracking this instant. You came back and basically said it's not state of the art finished product. I thought that was ridiculous, because I never claimed it was. I used a ridiculous analogy to match your ridiculous misrepresentation of what I wrote.

    Fact is you're being tracked, and everything you do digitally will soon be kept forever by corporations and governments. That's a matter of record. You don't even have to travel to the more, erm... "esoteric" corners of the web to get that information. Denying it is being willfully ignorant, and careless with your identity.
     
  4. Mr. Pedantic

    Mr. Pedantic Diamond Member

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    :rolleyes:

    This is what you actually said:


    I know that web browsers currently track user information. However, this isn't what you claimed. From your text I can't tell if you were claiming 1) that web browsers can currently track everything about you, or that 2) soon people will be able to know everything about you through your web browser, but I would take issue with both of those.
     
  5. lxskllr

    lxskllr Lifer

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    Rolling eyes. Seriously?! I figured we're all adults here, and I wouldn't have to spell everything out for you. You can consider the browser tracking as a primitive proof of concept you can easily check yourself, since you said...

    Obviously it isn't "unrealistic" or "paranoid" since it's fuckin' happening NOW.
     
  6. UberNeuman

    UberNeuman Lifer

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    add random events into the equation... You'll never be able to map out those random events that will change the equation and steer it into other areas...
     
  7. Zeze

    Zeze Diamond Member

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    ? Why not.

    I'm talking about a device that absorbs ALL external events of every millisecond, and ALL internal physiological & biological events in the brain & body of every millisecond. Then it documents and calculates constantly.
     
  8. UberNeuman

    UberNeuman Lifer

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    Then you assume that everything is predestined to occur - Chaos Theory would go against this idea of yours...
     
  9. Zeze

    Zeze Diamond Member

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    What.
     
  10. UberNeuman

    UberNeuman Lifer

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    That you have a "machine" or something that sees or predicts the all the acts of a future yet untold....

    You're assuming that history has been already laid out - like a highway, like a track for trains....

    \the random events will always disrupt those notions....
     
  11. HamburgerBoy

    HamburgerBoy Lifer

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    Neither the human genome nor computer-archived data are predicted.
     
  12. JulesMaximus

    JulesMaximus No Lifer

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    I'm just waiting for them to make a device that cooks rice for me without me even having to move a muscle. I should just have to think of rice and instantly a bowl of hot rice is in front of me.
     
  13. WHAMPOM

    WHAMPOM Diamond Member

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    Shit no! Human behavor is pretty much just ring bell and salivate.
     
  14. Soundmanred

    Soundmanred Lifer

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    fully mapped human gnome
     
  15. tcsenter

    tcsenter Lifer

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    You can map-out a representative brain but only on a macro function scale. There is too much random or pseudo-random development on a micro scale to do one for every individual. It would be like predicting what your fingerprints are going to be. Or predicting the individually unique features of one's iris. Well, at least its a LONG way off, anyways.
     
  16. Jaskalas

    Jaskalas Lifer

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    You're still working under the false assumption that the brain would be processing and storing information accurately, or even in a consistent way. I assure you it does not.

    Even if you could map the current state of degradation accurately, it would continue to change and evolve its current state after the scan.
     
  17. Jeff7

    Jeff7 Lifer

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    Then your scan was simply incomplete, lacking the proper resolution - at least as far as it can go, until it finds itself hitting the limitations of the Uncertainty Principle. That's about all that would stand in the way of a complete scan. (Besides our own technological limitations at this time - we'd need one heck of a good MRI/microscope/temporal-impression-imager/whatever-itron machine to get this scan.)
    In any case, it's just an electrochemical computer. Its future state changes are a function of its present state, inherent inaccuracies and inconsistencies included. If you could capture that entire state, you could theoretically predict its future actions - again, limited only by the Uncertainty Principle, which may well make a world of difference in the accuracy of a model. Or it may be as feeble an influence as the flapping wings of a butterfly against the force of a freight train, at least over short periods of time.
    The real brain would continue to change state, and the simulated one would experience the same change. (Also assuming identical inputs - but that's expected. Change the inputs, and you can very reasonably expect different outputs. Unless that's what you were referring to in the first place....)
     
  18. tcsenter

    tcsenter Lifer

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    You would still need a few to several dozens of scans under varying conditions in order to capture how the individual brain responds to different stimuli or input, for which a predictable model has already been proven (necessitating millions of scans to form the basis for).

    Even then, you're not going to get the exact same changes across all brains for a given experience or stimuli. e.g. here are two brains, each before and after 90 days of equally intensive immersion in learning the same musical instrument, or a traumatic near-death experience. There are going to be lots of similarities, and differences as well. You're never going to define a model for every input or stimuli that holds true for every brain. The possible permutations are just too many and varied.

    Well, I guess I do hate using the word never, but.....
     
  19. Jeff7

    Jeff7 Lifer

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    I'm talking about something that goes down to the atomic level, or maybe below - as far as you can go before Uncertainty limits you. This wouldn't be a "watch the system and see how it reacts" type of model. This would be a "simple" physics model.

    It'd have to be a more detailed scan than we can do now, and a more sophisticated computer to do the modeling than anything we've got now. I think that eventually, it'd be roughly analogous to a Nintendo emulator. You can do a state save, and as far as the game's concerned, it's operating inside a normal NES unit. You know its state at any one time (the key to the whole thing), you know its configuration, and so you could predict how it will respond to inputs.
    The possible permutations are just too many and varied - for today's computers. I can't properly forecast where computers might go from here, anymore than someone working with the first germanium diode could have seen where semiconductors would lead. We do seem to have a habit of coming up with some pretty impressive ways of storing, processing, and compacting information.
     
  20. Gibsons

    Gibsons Lifer

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    But if you map a brain down to the atomic level, you still might not be able to predict which potassium channel fires how many times and exactly when. Or which DNA repair process goes wrong in which cell. Maybe that's the uncertainty principle at work or just quantum probabilities. Either way, take the first errors in the prediction, however small, and it limits how far ahead you can predict.

    On top of that, you can't predict if they'll get sick, or slip on a patch of ice, outside events that can make dramatic changes in the state of the system.
     
  21. Zeze

    Zeze Diamond Member

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    I think you misunderstood what I wrote.

    No one knows the future, of course. This isn't fortune telling. I'm saying the device only documents EVERYTHING that happens to you both biologically and externally. Using the unimaginable data, it makes endless real time calculations. With that, they can predict your next course of action.