I give up on FX-4100/4130 due to rising costs, moving on to Phenom II X2 570 unlocked

[TeknoBug]

I'd use a Chromebook but what holds me back on that is the lack of MS Office programs, I'm not resorting to using it online.

 

[dave_the_nerd]

Phenom II X2 570 is the highest-end model in Callisto series, behaves very-similar to Core 2 Duo E8600 in pricing. Many sellers in China want to charge $60 for it. It's expected to hold its resale-value higher than FX-4100 in 2017.

I don't own a single Skylake board at this moment, still waiting for prices to drop. No DDR4 as well. Thanks for your concern, and go enjoy your pricey Core i5/i7.

Expected by whom?

 

[XavierMace]

By him. He lives in this alternate universe where there's a huge market for old bottom end equipment.

 

[Shivansps]

I would agree with that. Stick to newer hardware, if you can afford it. Usually, it's better. Though, not with pre-built PCs, and the introduction of Atom into the mainstream Celeron and Pentium lines, and the race to the bottom. In that case, a used / refurb Core2 / Athlon II rig makes perfect sense for someone on a tight budget, as compared to a brand new Walmart Acer special with an Atom in it.

Core 2 has a mayor issue with an crap old IGP, those crap Intel igp are really bad, what ever happen with all those Nvidia IGP for 775? Where are all those 630i, 730i and MCP7A?

 

[cbn]

I paid $130 for my Chomebook with a Haswell dual core. In fact, I'm typing on it right now.

It's really nice to have 11 hours of battery life and excellent performance. I can't run Windows programs, but I don't frequently want or need to on my laptop.

Frankly, I'm considering replacing my father's aging Core2 machine with an Atom or Kabini SFF PC, not because it's too slow, but because it's big, noisy, and power hungry, and I can probably break even by selling the objectively slower Core2 machine to someone like Waltchan, who presumably will flip it for a profit to some uninformed customer.

If wanting something newer I would wait till AMD Stoney Ridge comes out (re: it should have single thread comparable to one of the faster C2D processors...plus the iGPU supports H265). Either that or be on the look for a SFF With at least an Intel ULV dual core.

P.S. I don't know what processor your Father's C2D machine has, but I am assuming your chromebook has the 2955U since you mentioned it has a Haswell dual core.

A processor comparison using Passmark:

Haswell 2955U: 1461 CPU marks http://www.cpubenchmark.net/cpu.php?cpu=Intel+Celeron+2955U+@+1.40GHz

A E8400 (a higher end C2D, but starting at a mere $6 shipped on ebay buy it now listings): 2180 CPU marks http://www.cpubenchmark.net/cpu.php?cpu=Intel+Core2+Duo+E8400+@+3.00GHz)

E6550 (a middle of the road C2D): 1504 CPU marks http://www.cpubenchmark.net/cpu.php?cpu=Intel+Core2+Duo+E6550+@+2.33GHz

E2180 (one of the slowest C2D processors): 1082 CPU marks: http://www.cpubenchmark.net/cpu.php?cpu=Intel+Pentium+E2180+@+2.00GHz

 

[waltchan]

By him. He lives in this alternate universe where there's a huge market for old bottom end equipment.

Oh yes, there's a huge market for cheap CPUs, believe or not.

 

[MajinCry]

Oh yes, there's a huge market for cheap CPUs, believe or not.

Is it some Alibaba-esque I've-got-all-these-chips-that-needed-to-be-gone-yesteryear, or is it more of a market for developing/rural areas where they don't need the latest-and-greatest, but do want build quality and easily repaired machines?

...Wonder if China has anything to do with it. Didn't they have some sorta official x86 ban that was lifted recently?

 

[VirtualLarry]

...Wonder if China has anything to do with it. Didn't they have some sorta official x86 ban that was lifted recently?

I think it does. I've been figuring that Waltchan is Chinese, and he buys cheap chips here in the USA and sends them back to China.

Which is kind of weird. It was the opposite in the 90s. Chinese immigrants to the USA, would open computer shops, and get all kinds of cheap PC parts made in China shipped here for sale, because of their connections. I would say that 90% of the vendors at computer shows were probably Chinese, at least most of the system-builders were.

 

[LTC8K6]

Core 2 has a mayor issue with an crap old IGP, those crap Intel igp are really bad, what ever happen with all those Nvidia IGP for 775? Where are all those 630i, 730i and MCP7A?

They were fine for their intended purpose when released.

They are crap now, for sure.

 

[VirtualLarry]

Core 2 has a mayor issue with an crap old IGP, those crap Intel igp are really bad, what ever happen with all those Nvidia IGP for 775? Where are all those 630i, 730i and MCP7A?

Even if there were a market for NVidia-chipset S775 boards, they couldn't be produced, because NV lost the license to Intel's bus.

 

[Shivansps]

Even if there were a market for NVidia-chipset S775 boards, they couldn't be produced, because NV lost the license to Intel's bus.

But what happen to all these producced? if i look for used boards i mostly gona find 945s and G31, and some G41, finding a Nvidia one is rare and expensive.

I could understand it about the Geforce 9300, 9400 chipset, and 730i, those where produced at 775 last moments. Strange thing that geforce 8100 and 8300 for AM2/AM2+ produced at about the same moment are far easier to find.

But i do remember that 630I, where in producction for a long time, do you remember this one?
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813500012
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813500010
it was cheap

This one was great
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813500022

Zotac was not the only one, Gigabyte also released a LOT of Nvidia 775 boards, including a GF9400 http://www.gigabyte.us/products/list.aspx?s=42&jid=0&p=2&v=7

Biostar also had 630i boards

and we could go on... petty much all OEMs had boards, its specially strange about 630i because is was used on cheap low end boards because of behing limited to single channel, and low end boards are generally the easier ones to find. So its strange those are that hard to find used today. Maybe people does dont want to give them up because they are still used today as main?

 

[SPBHM]

the geforce 6/7 based IGPs are pretty poor
the 9300/9400 was fine (the 8300s had half the cuda cores I think, also the Nvidia AMD IGPs had a performance penalty due to the memory controller being on the CPU), but my "dream IGP" was the 320M that Apple used to have around 2009 I think for C2Ds, I don't think they ever made a 775 board using it, which is a shame... but judging by the 9300 boards, they would never make it affordable enough anyway.

 

[Shivansps]

I whould pick a GF7050/610i over a G31/G41 of that era any day.

GF9300 chipset was already beating a DDR2 780G and nearly matching a discrete HD3450, what was kind of impresive for that era.

 

[PG]

My memory is a bit foggy, but I know some of those nvidia chipset boards had big issues, mostly laptops though. I would steer clear of Nvidia stuff for that reason myself.

 

[nerp]

If waltchan is shipping stuff to China than that presents a different scenario than one I was visualizing in which he was selling old hardware to American buyers for prices close to the bottom end of the market for new hardware. It is a totally different story and I apologize if I came across as overly harsh.

 

[waltchan]

If waltchan is shipping stuff to China than that presents a different scenario than one I was visualizing in which he was selling old hardware to American buyers for prices close to the bottom end of the market for new hardware. It is a totally different story and I apologize if I came across as overly harsh.

Thank you for that speculation, but I don't have any business with China to deal with, only for my pleasure or hobby, and how to save money. Yes, I'm Chinese (like Jackie Chan), and we're all cost-conscious people.

 

[nerp]

Well, then you're just a bit crazy, I suppose. But hey, it's a hobby and if it makes you happy.

What's the fastest machine you own or ever used?

 

[VirtualLarry]

Well, there was this used computer dealer that sold my mom an original Pentium PC years ago for $1000. When I think the P4 was the current CPU.

So, I suppose, if you find the "right buyer", you can foist obsolete junk on them for a profit.

That's all I'm saying.

Edit: Just so I don't give potential customers the wrong idea about me - I consider that to be a bit borderline unethical to do.

I do sell some older tech., or try to, at times, depending on what stock I have on-hand, but I charge prices that are commensurate with both age and condition. I definitely don't rip people off like that computer dealer did to my mom. For example, for my Q9300 rig that I recently refurbished, with 8GB RAM, an SSD and a WD Black HDD (still under warranty), and a R7 260X 2GB GDDR5 video card, I wouldn't charge $1000 for it. I might charge $400 though, with a legit copy of Windows 7 64-bit, or $300 with Linux. Some people here that are enthusiasts, or buy bulk at auction, might see that as too much, but I think that's fairly reasonable. (Newegg wants over $100 for the CPU alone!)

http://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/history/historic-timeline.html
Ok, according to this, the original Pentium came out in 1993, and the Pentium 4 in 2000.

So maybe I am overcharging, I don't know.

 

[XavierMace]

Oh yes, there's a huge market for cheap CPUs, believe or not.

You'll note I stated old bottom end, not specifically cheap. I was very specific when I said that.

 

[waltchan]

Well, there was this used computer dealer that sold my mom an original Pentium PC years ago for $1000. When I think the P4 was the current CPU.

Do you mean original new Pentium 1, or used Pentium 1 in 2005 when Pentium 4 was available? For $1,000 new, it was a very reasonable price considering I saw many new Pentium 1 machines for over $2,000 back in 1997. Computers were very expensive at that time, in addition, 90s were lower inflation back then. Many Asian PC stores earned big profits, of course.

 

[XavierMace]

Some people here that are enthusiasts, or buy bulk at auction, might see that as too much, but I think that's fairly reasonable. (Newegg wants over $100 for the CPU alone!)

So maybe I am overcharging, I don't know.

You're making a false assumption there. Just because the CPU is listed on Newegg for $100, doesn't mean it's selling for $100. I see it all the time with servers. Old (but still newer than the systems we are talking about in this thread) system listed on eBay for 10x the actual going rate. Just because you can find somebody listing it for $10,000 doesn't mean it's worth $10,000.

As I've said before, I understand the desire here. I used to do the same thing with servers. But eventually I saw the light. I know we butt heads and I'm really not trying to be mean here but you and walt are fooling yourselves if you think this equipment you are buying (and selling) are good deals.

Personally as a professional, I'd never sell a system that old to somebody. You're trying to milk a few more years out of a very dated platform by putting some upgrades in it. It's like putting new tires and a coat of paint on an old car with 500,000 miles on it then trying to sell it for nearly new prices. Yeah, it's nice and clean but at the end of the day, it's got very little life left in it.

Take your above system that you said you might charge $400 for with Windows. On the surface, that sounds reasonable. However, 5 seconds of searching:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16883280708&leaderboard=1

That system is 5 generations newer and obliterates the CPU in your system. It uses less power while doing it as well. That system is only a 5% cost increase. Even without an SSD I'd recommend that in a heartbeat.

Most the SSD's I've seen you mention cost you around $30 if memory serves. So $50 more (including SSD) and you're still only at about a 12% price increase and that system is basically a rocket by comparison at that point plus has all the new shiny stuff like USB 3 and UEFI. Your system only needs a dGPU because it's so old. The Intel HD4400's on the quads are more than enough for standard desktop usage and light gaming. I've played CivV and Endless Legend on mobile versions more than once.

At the $300-ish mark:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produ...kLogic-_-Desktop+PC-_-Acer+America-_-83101193

Still twice as fast in single threaded operations and still over a 50% increase overall.

It would be different if you already had the system and were just trying to keep it going on a budget. But selling 6 year old computers for anything more than garage sale prices just rubs me the wrong way personally. You complain about that guy ripping off your mom by selling her a 7 year old computer while you are happily selling 6 year old computers. Would you have been fine with it if she only paid $400? Don't get me wrong, I know you aren't trying to rip people off. I just think you are overvaluing those systems.

 

[waltchan]

What's the fastest machine you own or ever used?

Fastest CPU I've ever owned was i7-4790 in new Acer PC I bought from Costco for $450, used for only 15 minutes to get recovery USB, and then I sold the CPU immediately on eBay for $280 shipped.

In my hand right now, fastest I have is a i5-4690s to complement with new Asus Vanguard B85 TUF motherboard in case I need a PC for durability, but it's currently not in use or never removed from box because I fear this combo costs too much to operate, and I haven't listed on eBay yet.

In use right now, fastest CPU I have is Pentium G3258 paired with Gigabyte B85 board.

 

[XavierMace]

Costs too much to operate? What?

 

[waltchan]

Costs too much to operate? What?

It's a pricey combo, $110 Asus board and $180 i5-4690s. Cost too much to operate.

 

[XavierMace]

That's how much it costs to purchase, not operate.