"I actually know people who have no debt."

[StageLeft]

Originally posted by: rufruf44
Dave Ramsey's rules are not much more than basic financial suggestion than anyone with a good sense of logic can figure out themselves. His debit card suggestion otoh, is one of the stupidest suggestion. Credit card is much superior than debit card, and comes with nice perks too. Then again, he cater to those who can't control their own finances, it might be good for them.

Baby steps for the financial babies

 

[faZZter]

Originally posted by: Hector13

Originally posted by: Skoorb
Wow, really? I heard this from a guy on Friday. He spoke as if he was shocked at it - maybe the same way I'd say I know of people who can fly. He went on to say that "These people have a different mindset than the rest of us. Their thoughts are that if you can't pay for something, then don't buy it. They don't use credit to buy things.". Man, is that ever sad to hear from a 35 year old father of 3, making at least $70k/year. I know that his savings is in the range of $0-2000.

This sort of attitude will guarantee that he never has much money to his name, because he spends at the limits of what he takes in.

If you ask me (which no one did...) people who shun all debt are just as ignorant as people who never live without any debt.

Money is just like any other asset: it can be lent or borrowed. The ability to "rent" money from others (or yourself in the future) is one of the greatest achievements of our society. The interest you pay on any debt is just the cost of using money now that you may not have access to otherwise. If this cost is worth it to you (and you can pay it), then by all means, spend away.

What the hell is the point of dying an old rich man who has lived frugally his old life? $10,000 is worth a lot more to me now in my early 20s than $20,000 will be to me in 10 years (or $40,000 by the time I am 50). If this concept doesn't make sense to you, than I fear you may be living a very boring life that you may regret in the future.

Agreed.

I have some credit card debt, but I also have real estate that appreciates at a huge rate compared to what some of the home improvements I financed on credit cards are costing me. Besides I like to enjoy life, NOW, when I'm healthy and young enough to do stufff. I guess it's fine if you wanna retire someday and have tons of money in the bank so you can hobble onto a cruise ship and admire the view with all the other old folks, but to me that isn't much to look forward to. Then you can go play golf at the country club with the other old men. (I hate golf) Oh yeah you could buy some awesome TV and watch Jeopardy too in between doctor appointments. It is indeed a balancing act and it sounds like alot of you are way too tight with the money.

You can't take it with you........

 

[BlueWeasel]

Originally posted by: Descartes

Originally posted by: xmellyx
It was great that my parents paid for my undergrad and not having to have that debt hanging over my head when I left school. What kind of way is that to start a life, anyway? Now I have a decent job with decent pay and my current 'debts' if you want to call them that are my car lease and soon to be mortgage.

The life of those not privileged with such parental affluence.

I couldn't have said it better myself. While it would have been nice to leave college having it all paid in full by my parents, they couldn't do it.

Growing up, they gave me the stuff I needed, but not always what I wanted. It was one of the best things they have ever done for me.

 

[Parrotheader]

Originally posted by: Skoorb
BTW guys, I've never heard of Dave Ramsey. My opinions on the matter have been formed by reading a couple of books some years ago and, most importantly, applying grade 4 math skills with common sense.

He's just a personal finance radio personality (there's tons of them out there.) He basically was saying the same things a lot of people were saying here. I didn't know who he was either until my parents sent me and my fiancee (now wife) to one of his seminars here in Birmingham. They wanted to make sure we learned sound financial principles before we got married. What's funny is we'd already learned them through both our parents and didn't actually need the seminar (although it was helpful in reinforcing what we thought - although I disagree with his debit-card only, no credit cards, stance.) The best thing I took away from it was a line he used talking about how common sense is now a marketable commodity (in reference to his radio show's success and the common sense spending advice he gives.)

 

[yukichigai]

I personally never plan to accumulate debt on purpose. As it is I only use credit cards when absolutely necessary, or when I suspect the seller of pulling something fast, in which case I use AmEx so I can dispute the charges later. Maybe I'll take out a loan to purchase a house or a car, but that'll be a ways down the line. I have an apartment and a car right now that are fine.

Debt means you're living outside your means. That's bad.

 

[StageLeft]

It is indeed a balancing act and it sounds like alot of you are way too tight with the money.

Nah, I have as much in the way of toys and junk as anybody else my age, except no credit card debt and a quickly appreciating savings account, simply because a few years ago when those I am now comparing to were racking up CC debt like it was going out of style, I decided not too. So, now I have the same things, and no debt. If two equal people come out of school and start working and person 1 spends like a fool right away, and then balances for the rest of his life his spending and income and interest payments, and person 2 is thrifty out right, by several years into it he'll be buying just as much stuff as person 1. Except, given that he has no legacy consumer debt sucking his life away, give him another 10 years and he'll blow by person 1, and never be caught in the rat race like the average person a couple of pay checks away from financial disaster. If you don't make your money work for you you'll never become very wealthy.

 

[rufruf44]

Originally posted by: Skoorb

If you don't make your money work for you you'll never become very wealthy.

Forget very wealthy, you will be stuck in much worse situation if you don't handle your finance accordingly.

I view it as a challenge, how much can I turn this $1 to? $2, $5? $1M ?

Guess there's a reason some ppl called me greedy

 

[Squisher]

Originally posted by: Squisher
Hmm, if I had no debt I'd be living in a crappy house driving crappy cars that I'd be spending a huge chunk of my life fixing, but that would be fine because I wouldn't be having any fun saving every cent with nothing going for entertainment.

Married, 46 yrs. old, no CC debt(yet, I charge everything), 2 car payments.(soon to be 1 on a total of 4 cars), $70K left on 15yr mortgage(on a $205K house).

Does anybody love me?

 

[faZZter]

My money is working for me in my 401K and like I already mentioned my home/real estate investments.

I just have more fun along the way. I don't get off on micro managing money and worrying in general.

You should have seen all the guys that had "awesome" investments in the stock market stressing out when the market crashed about 4 years ago. I swear some of the guys the same or a little younger than me are already greying alot and have tons of wrinkles around their eyes. I suspect alot of this is from worrying about all their money. Whatever. I refuse to worry so much about money. I watch what I spend to a point but refuse to save every penny for a rainy day.

Alot of guys at my job work as much overtime as possible to get their mortgages paid off and put more in the stock market. While they are working their day off I am BBQ ing at the beach with friends riding ATV's having a great time. Sure, they will retire sooner than I will, have more money in the bank, etc. but they may regret missing out on so many weekends and stuff they could have enjoyed when they were relatively young. No matter how much money they collect, they can't buy time back, and you or I may not make it to tomorrow.

I guess like another person already said, it is just a different mindset. I am not bagging on anyone who saves money religiously and lives frugally. That is fine if it makes ya feel good. Just don't think your way is the only and/or best way to live.

 

[cchen]

Originally posted by: faZZter
My money is working for me in my 401K and like I already mentioned my home/real estate investments.

I just have more fun along the way. I don't get off on micro managing money and worrying in general.

You should have seen all the guys that had "awesome" investments in the stock market stressing out when the market crashed about 4 years ago. I swear some of the guys the same or a little younger than me are already greying alot and have tons of wrinkles around their eyes. I suspect alot of this is from worrying about all their money. Whatever. I refuse to worry so much about money. I watch what I spend to a point but refuse to save every penny for a rainy day.

Alot of guys at my job work as much overtime as possible to get their mortgages paid off and put more in the stock market. While they are working their day off I am BBQ ing at the beach with friends riding ATV's having a great time. Sure, they will retire sooner than I will, have more money in the bank, etc. but they may regret missing out on so many weekends and stuff they could have enjoyed when they were relatively young. No matter how much money they collect, they can't buy time back, and you or I may not make it to tomorrow.

I guess like another person already said, it is just a different mindset. I am not bagging on anyone who saves money religiously and lives frugally. That is fine if it makes ya feel good. Just don't think your way is the only and/or best way to live.

Werd. Congrats on enjoying life and finding a nice balance between work and play. I hope I find that when I graduate.

 

[Mallow]

Originally posted by: Orsorum

Originally posted by: Skoorb
Wow, really? I heard this from a guy on Friday. He spoke as if he was shocked at it - maybe the same way I'd say I know of people who can fly. He went on to say that "These people have a different mindset than the rest of us. Their thoughts are that if you can't pay for something, then don't buy it. They don't use credit to buy things.". Man, is that ever sad to hear from a 35 year old father of 3, making at least $70k/year. I know that his savings is in the range of $0-2000.

This sort of attitude will guarantee that he never has much money to his name, because he spends at the limits of what he takes in.

I dated a girl in high school whose parents made $55k a year, yet had $2000 in savings. Their daughter insisted on going to a $22,000 a year university. When I broke up with her, I let her know exactly what I thought of her and her selfishness and her attitude towards her parents. This girl is racking up $100,000 in debt for undergrad, let alone the two extra years grad school will cost her - all to be a teacher. This girl's going to be in debt until she's 50.

This culture of "I want it now, I'll pay later" - it's revolting and irresponsible.

Orsorum, I couldn't agree w/ you more. For someone to go to a 22K/yr school only to be a teacher and rack up 100K in debt is the most crazy thing and it happens all the damn time!