Question HWUB revisits the RX 5700 XT in 2022 (versus the 2060 Super and RTX 3060) in newer games.

[VirtualLarry]

"No-one should own one of these. They should have ben sold back to miners, and gamers should have bought a 6700 XT".

Still, an impressive showing for the 5700 XT. Not sure why they often used the Med. preset though.

 

[BoomerD]

Sure were worth mining on in 2021! I had 6 of them, wait, maybe 7.

Miners should TPADIAF for what youse did to the GPU market.

 

[SteveGrabowski]

Sure were worth mining on in 2021! I had 6 of them, wait, maybe 7. Paid themselves off handsomely, at 50MH/sec ea.

I don't care about the money lost there, it's just that turned out to be one incredible card for the money. Ugh why'd I get cheap and buy a 1660S two years ago... my 1660S is great for 1080p and can do 1440p in some games too, but RX 5700 can play 1440p in most games. Don't have the PSU for a 5700 XT so never considered it though. Running a BitFenix Formula 450 Gold and while it's supposed to be a really solid unit, but still it's only 450 Watts. Kind of eyeing a 6600 XT for when POS finally happens since I'm a bit worried next gen is going to be insanely power hungry but 6600 XT should be good for 1440p60 for current console gen ports since it's around the performance of the PS5 gpu. Wouldn't be thinking at all about a gpu upgrade had I just bought the freaking 5700 though.

 

[Shmee]

6600XT is a pretty nice card that can be a good price, but you might be able to do even better with a 6700XT. There are some good deals there, and I don't think they use much power.

 

[Stuka87]

I have been very happy with my 5700 XT. And while I can see his argument of selling it back in January and then buying a 6700 XT to replace it, its a huge risk to deal with eBay. So I opted to just hold onto mine for now. And I might just hang onto it until the 7K series comes out.

And these testing shows just how great AMD cards age. Routinely beating the 3060 is impressive.

 

[jpiniero]

Many gamers settled for a 1050ti, 1060, or 1650 during the recent pandemic. They are the top of the list for Steam. They are still manufacturing and selling the 1050ti and 1650. For myself, that makes the idea of studios leaving the owners out in the cold highly unlikely. It would be bad business. With everyone I have read saying they were prepared to jump ship to consoles due to the last couple of years of madness, I would not give them another shove.

Guess it depends on how a developer views PC, and if they are just going to take into old low end hardware into account when setting the spec for an AAA title. Making the spec be the Series S at upscaled 1080p30 to me seems completely reasonable. VRAM pressure from asset streaming might kill enough cards that the set of GPUs that could run a game like this but don't have RT might not be that many... and RDNA 1 would be the star of that show.

 

[Stuka87]

Guess it depends on how a developer views PC, and if they are just going to take into old low end hardware into account when setting the spec for an AAA title. Making the spec be the Series S at upscaled 1080p30 to me seems completely reasonable. VRAM pressure from asset streaming might kill enough cards that the set of GPUs that could run a game like this but don't have RT might not be that many... and RDNA 1 would be the star of that show.

AAA games would be the last ones to have a hard requirement for RT. The game budgets are so massive, they cannot just blanket require something that a large chunk of the PC market doesn't have. They need the sales. A special version of said game that requires RT would be fine, as its optional. Indy titles could more easily get away with requiring hardware RT support.

Plus the performance hit of RT means people with low/mid range cards that support RT would actually have a worse visual experience than being able to play the game without RT since settings have to be dropped way down. Its going to be a long time before games have a hard requirement for RT.

I suspect future games will use hybrid systems, where RT is only used in areas where it makes sense. Stray is a good example of this. It uses RT in very specific areas, but its done using methods that do not require hardware RT support, so it works on any GPU. And because it is only used in areas that make a visual impact, the performance hit is small.

One of the big issues with the early nVidia sponsored RTX titles is they tried to prove how amazing RT was by using it everywhere, which resulted in terrible performance for almost no visual difference in many cases. And worse yet, the non-RT versions of the games were purposely made to look worse than normal.

EDIT: I should note, you can enable full blown RT in Stray, but it runs really bad as it does not support any upscaling from nVidia or AMD.

 

[SteveGrabowski]

I have been very happy with my 5700 XT. And while I can see his argument of selling it back in January and then buying a 6700 XT to replace it, its a huge risk to deal with eBay. So I opted to just hold onto mine for now. And I might just hang onto it until the 7K series comes out.

And these testing shows just how great AMD cards age. Routinely beating the 3060 is impressive.

Doesn't ebay take a huge cut of the sale too if you're not an established ebay storefront that does a lot of business?

 

[SteveGrabowski]

6600XT is a pretty nice card that can be a good price, but you might be able to do even better with a 6700XT. There are some good deals there, and I don't think they use much power.

I don't think I'd want to use something that spikes to 321W on a 450W psu. Even though it's a good 450W psu that seems like a lot of strain to put on it. Especially when Alder Lake has pretty high power consumption too and I'm running a 12400F. Whereas 6600XT spikes are like 220W which should be fine. I suspect I'll either buy a 6600XT this year if prices fall once POS happens or wait for AMD's lower midrange 7000 series card next year since I'm only looking to run 1440p at 45-60fps. Thank god for FreeSync and having no need to hit 60 fps minimums any more. Don't expect we'll see Nvidia lower midrange cards for a long time with all the 3000 series stock they still have so have pretty much written off the idea of getting another Nvidia card. Especially with how their non halo cards have held up in price.

 

[Stuka87]

Doesn't ebay take a huge cut of the sale too if you're not an established ebay storefront that does a lot of business?

Yeah, the percentage that eBay takes is different based on the type of account making the sale. Though I am unsure as to how big the difference is, or if there are multiple tiers depending on how many items are sold regularly.

 

[Stuka87]

I don't think I'd want to use something that spikes to 321W on a 450W psu. Even though it's a good 450W psu that seems like a lot of strain to put on it. Especially when Alder Lake has pretty high power consumption too and I'm running a 12400F. Whereas 6600XT spikes are like 220W which should be fine. I suspect I'll either buy a 6600XT this year if prices fall once POS happens or wait for AMD's lower midrange 7000 series card next year since I'm only looking to run 1440p at 45-60fps. Thank god for FreeSync and having no need to hit 60 fps minimums any more. Don't expect we'll see Nvidia lower midrange cards for a long time with all the 3000 series stock they still have so have pretty much written off the idea of getting another Nvidia card. Especially with how their non halo cards have held up in price.

Their GPU spike test can be a bit misleading. Its good that they include it now. However, they don't list the scenario that each one spiked under. They just take the highest spike that was recorded during any stage of the test. Which could have been running furmark or the like. Also, spikes this small should be handled by the caps inside the PSU, provided its a quality PSU. Unless it spikes over what they can absorb.

 

[AnandThenMan]

tl;dw: 5700 is 5%+ faster in 24 out of 33 games. Beat down.

 

[jpiniero]

AAA games would be the last ones to have a hard requirement for RT. The game budgets are so massive, they cannot just blanket require something that a large chunk of the PC market doesn't have. They need the sales. A special version of said game that requires RT would be fine, as its optional. Indy titles could more easily get away with requiring hardware RT support.

But the consoles do, that's the thing.

One of the big issues with the early nVidia sponsored RTX titles is they tried to prove how amazing RT was by using it everywhere, which resulted in terrible performance for almost no visual difference in many cases.

That's part of the problem. RT in previous gen games is used only superficially. Ideally it would be used to make developers lives easier and/or make the scene look a lot nicer without having to make raster hacks. The S's RT performance is I'm sure not great so there is only so much they can do though.

I was wondering about asset streaming... and if the game mandates DirectStorage, it looks like RDNA 1 doesn't support that either. Only Turing RTX and RDNA 2. I'm not sure if that's really the case.

 

[jpiniero]

Tangently related, I happened to notice that the 1630's raw fillrate and compute power is comparable to the base PS4. I wonder if that was intentional on nVidia's part?

 

[Stuka87]

But the consoles do, that's the thing.

Currently consoles do not require RT. Majority of games coming out are compatible with current and previous gen consoles. Games that do have RT for PS5/XBSX have a configuration for it so people can adjust for performance or quality.

 

[thilanliyan]

That's how it was back in the day in order to be able to push graphical progress.

I remember I bought an ATI 9600XT to be able to play Prince of Persia...Sands of Time I think.

 

[blckgrffn]

But the consoles do, that's the thing.

That's part of the problem. RT in previous gen games is used only superficially. Ideally it would be used to make developers lives easier and/or make the scene look a lot nicer without having to make raster hacks. The S's RT performance is I'm sure not great so there is only so much they can do though.

I was wondering about asset streaming... and if the game mandates DirectStorage, it looks like RDNA 1 doesn't support that either. Only Turing RTX and RDNA 2. I'm not sure if that's really the case.

Re, Direct Storage 1.1 (which is the one that matters IMHO) - requirements are low:

"DirectStorage 1.1's system requirements are pretty loose. Microsoft says the feature will work on Windows 10 or 11, doesn't absolutely require a particular type of storage, and will run on any DirectX 12-capable GPU that supports Shader Model 6, which should cover the vast majority of Nvidia, AMD, and Intel GPUs launched within the last four or five years. But for the best results, the company recommends Windows 11, an NVMe SSD, and a newer DirectX 12 Ultimate GPU (of those, the speed of your SSD will make the biggest difference)."

Microsoft preps DirectStorage 1.1 with GPU decompression for faster game loads

Update is “coming soon” but requires use of all-new compression format.

arstechnica.com

Looks like RDNA supports DX 12 Shader Model 6.5 per Techpowerup:

AMD Radeon RX 5700 XT Specs

AMD Navi 10, 1905 MHz, 2560 Cores, 160 TMUs, 64 ROPs, 8192 MB GDDR6, 1750 MHz, 256 bit

www.techpowerup.com

FWIW, I traded my blower 5700XT while it was working great for NIB 6700XT right here on the forums. It cost me a bit but at the time I was thrilled to trade a no warranty card for one with a warranty and higher performance too. For some reason I still felt compelled to go out and get a 6800 and my son benefited from my silliness.

It ran great, although the 5700 that my Dad had seemed like the sweet spot in terms of performance and power usage - he bought it for like $240 at Best Buy too which turned out to be genius. He upgraded from a 7950 so it was quite impressive.

 

[DooKey]

That's fair, but they aren't going to severely limit their install base by only releasing an RT version. Going to be a long time before most gamers have a card that can RT well enough for that to make sense.

I give it two more generations of GPU at most. So, 2-4 years (begin game development) from now it may make sense to start going that direction.

 

[jpiniero]

Majority of games coming out are compatible with current and previous gen consoles.

Correct. I'm talking about next generation Series/PS5 only games that also come out on PC. It only makes sense to standardize and mandate everything DX12U gives you... including RT. To me, if a dev wasn't going to do that, they would just continue to make a previous gen game. And there will be plenty of those for some time.

(This of course also being tangently related to RDNA 3 in terms of RT performance)

 

[Shmee]

Anyone here have any experience with SAM on their 5700XT and how much performance increase they get in games, if any?

 

[Stuka87]

Anyone here have any experience with SAM on their 5700XT and how much performance increase they get in games, if any?

I have SAM enabled with my 5700XT. I do not have a wide array of games that I have tested. But it does help on some.

But here is a video with benchmarks. Some games have a pretty substantial increase (Like Gears 5 or Forza Horizon 4). While others have either no difference, or even slightly decreased (though the decreases are within the margin of error).

 

[VirtualLarry]

Greg Salazar doing a recent piece on RX 5700 XT cards currently available cheap right now.

 

[coercitiv]

Greg Salazar doing a recent piece on RX 5700 XT cards currently available cheap right now.

Is he collecting used cards to make a video about failing Navi 10 chips?

 

[Mopetar]

Is he collecting used cards to make a video about failing Navi 10 chips?

Maybe failing to disappoint Navi 10 chips.

 

[Avalon]

This thread's got me looking really hard at a new Powercolor 6700 XT Fighter on Amazon for $369. I've got a vanilla 5700 and according to TPU I'd see roughly a 40-50% uplift at 1440p. Was pretty disappointed with the high end releases price/perf wise from AMD and Nvidia so far, and not sure I want to wait for a 4060 Ti/7700 XT type of card, or that they'd be worth it.

 

[DAPUNISHER]

This thread's got me looking really hard at a new Powercolor 6700 XT Fighter on Amazon for $369. I've got a vanilla 5700 and according to TPU I'd see roughly a 40-50% uplift at 1440p. Was pretty disappointed with the high end releases price/perf wise from AMD and Nvidia so far, and not sure I want to wait for a 4060 Ti/7700 XT type of card, or that they'd be worth it.

At the moment, the 6700 series and ARC A770 16GB are the only 2 cards worth considering in that price range. The 3060 12GB is too slow at raster for the money IMO.