HTPC

[James Bond]

I'm building an HTPC and I would like to accomplish the following one way or another:

Watch live TV (we have a Comcast Digital box now - switching to Fios soon, not sure what to expect)
Record TV
Watch another channel while recording
Stream movies,audio,pictures

I have the following components to think about:
DLP TV with ONE HDMI input
Z-5500 Speakers with several inputs
Xbox360
(soon to be) HTPC

What is the best way to hook all of these things up and ensure functionality? If I hook the HTPC up to the DLP via HDMI, and hook the DLP to the speakers via Optical, will I have sound through the speakers?

Do I need a TV tuner in the HTPC? Or should the cable hook to the DLP??

Any advice welcome! Feel free to draw a pic!

 

[mpilchfamily]

For the HTPC to record TV you'll need a tuner card in the system. Now if the video card in the system doesn't offer sound threw its HDMI port you'll need to use optical or some outher sound output from the system to the TV.

Its recommended that you connect the Xbox dirrectly to the TV. If you connect it to the HTPC then you will have some issues. There is almost alway a bit of lag when you try to go threw a tuner card. This can effect your consol gaming.

 

[James Bond]

Originally posted by: mpilchfamily
For the HTPC to record TV you'll need a tuner card in the system. Now if the video card in the system doesn't offer sound threw its HDMI port you'll need to use optical or some outher sound output from the system to the TV.

Its recommended that you connect the Xbox dirrectly to the TV. If you connect it to the HTPC then you will have some issues. There is almost alway a bit of lag when you try to go threw a tuner card. This can effect your consol gaming.

Thank you for the info, much appreciated.

I will connect the Xbox to the TV using component, so this shouldn't be too much of an issue.
I will connect the HTPC to the TV using HDMI. Does HDMI carry audio and video? The motherboard I plan on getting has onboard HDMI - will I need a video card in addition to a tuner card? I want to stream 1080P.

How do I choose a tuner card, will any one do?

 

[dmw16]

Are there ways to record cable programming in HD?

 

[yh125d]

You'll need a tuner card with dual TV tuners on it, or two tuner cards, since you want to watch while recording.

Xbox to TV through component, with the optical audio to your speakers or TV (hopefully has optical in)
Cable from cable box to TV tuner
Digital audio (optical or coax) from motherboard to your speakers. If your motherboard doesn't have digital out, either use the analog outputs or get a dedicated sound card
HDMI from motherboard IGP to TV.

What motherboard are you getting?

 

[James Bond]

Originally posted by: yh125d
You'll need a tuner card with dual TV tuners on it, or two tuner cards, since you want to watch while recording.

Xbox to TV through component, with the optical audio to your speakers or TV (hopefully has optical in)
Cable from cable box to TV tuner
Digital audio (optical or coax) from motherboard to your speakers. If your motherboard doesn't have digital out, either use the analog outputs or get a dedicated sound card
HDMI from motherboard IGP to TV.

What motherboard are you getting?

The TV only has one optical port, and right now its plugged into the speakers so that whenever we watch a TV or Movie, it uses optical. The Xbox is just using red/white... it never occurred to me that we were getting shitty sound when streaming movies!

I'll have to find the motherboard I had in question. So will the cable box have a coax out (or two of them?) that I plug into the tuner?

 

[yh125d]

The cable box sends the audio along with the video to the TV tuner, just like if you hooked it directly to TV.

 

[coolVariable]

Get an HD Homerun to record SOME HD channels (essentially your broadcast channels).
ALL OTHER CHANNELS you will only be able to record/view in SD through the HTPC, unless Comcast offers cablecard and you get a pre-build cablecard HTPC.

You will only be able to watch/record more than one channel at the same time with cablecard or through the HD Homerun. Your cablebox only has 1 output ... that is all you get to the HTPC.

I don't think there is ANY WAY to use a HTPC with Fios and get HD. You will be limited to connecting your HTPC to the SD output on your Fios box.


Be warned! If you go HTPC, you will likely never go back ... but you will be majorly pissed off at cable co technology and the limitations stupid DRM put on you!!!!!

 

[coolVariable]

Originally posted by: James Bond
I'm building an HTPC and I would like to accomplish the following one way or another:

#1 Watch live TV
#2 Record TV
#3 Watch another channel while recording
#4 Stream movies,audio,pictures
#5 to Fios soon, not sure what to expect

To add to my above post ...

#1 - Yes. SD via a tuner ... HD via an HD Homerun (only select channels) or Cablecard PC (all channels but $$$$$ and DRM).
#2 - Yes. SD via a tuner ... HD via an HD Homerun (only select channels) or Cablecard PC (all channels but $$$$$ and DRM).
#3 - No. Unless you get an HD Homerun (only select channels) or Cablecard PC (all channels but $$$$$ and no Picture-in-Picture)
#4 - Yes
#5 - No. SD ONLY! Fios doesn't support cablecard or HD Homerun.

 

[James Bond]

Originally posted by: coolVariable

Originally posted by: James Bond
I'm building an HTPC and I would like to accomplish the following one way or another:

#1 Watch live TV
#2 Record TV
#3 Watch another channel while recording
#4 Stream movies,audio,pictures
#5 to Fios soon, not sure what to expect

To add to my above post ...

#1 - Yes. SD via a tuner ... HD via an HD Homerun (only select channels) or Cablecard PC (all channels but $$$$$ and DRM).
#2 - Yes. SD via a tuner ... HD via an HD Homerun (only select channels) or Cablecard PC (all channels but $$$$$ and DRM).
#3 - No. Unless you get an HD Homerun (only select channels) or Cablecard PC (all channels but $$$$$ and no Picture-in-Picture)
#4 - Yes
#5 - No. SD ONLY! Fios doesn't support cablecard or HD Homerun.

Thank you for all the info - I have a few more questions to ask you if you don't mind. For now-: What are cablecard and homerun?

 

[zerogear]

cablecard is to decrypt Encrypted QAM signals (essentially, almost all cable digital signals are encrypted except for the public channels, FOX,ABC,NBC,CBS... and the likes). While HD HomeRun basically is a workaround to receive the ClearQAM (unencrypted channels) so that it works within Vista Media Center or other softwares.

 

[s44]

Originally posted by: coolVariable
Fios doesn't support cablecard

Dead wrong.

 

[James Bond]

Originally posted by: s44

Originally posted by: coolVariable
Fios doesn't support cablecard

Dead wrong.

So cablecard does work on Fios? Will I be able to view/record all channels that I'm subscribed to?

How much do these normally cost? Are they PCI? Is this the same thing as a Tuner Card? Does the cable company supply them or B&M?

 

[DoubleHelix747]

You would be able to watch/record all unencrypted over-the-air (OTA) SD/HD channels - you don't need cable or FiOS for these. You would need to connect a rabbit-ear antenna to one of your tuner cards for this. You can then connect the other tuner card to your cable box. This way one records while other provides output for watching on TV. Alternatively, you can spit the signal from the rabbit-ear antenna into two and feed each split into the two tuners. This way you don't even need a cable/FiOS.

I don't think there is an easy/inexpensive solution, if any, to watching/recording encrypted HD channels. This is a major shortcoming of HTPC.

In addition to the tuners, you will need software to manage it all. Vista's MCE is OK. For more sophistication/control, you can consider BeyondTV or Sage TV ($$$). Or if you are a bit adventurous, go with Linux/Ubuntu and install very highly regarded MythTV. The Linux option is absolutely free.

Re: cable cards -

http://www.crutchfield.com/S-u...er/home/cablecard.html

 

[DoubleHelix747]

dp

 

[James Bond]

Originally posted by: DoubleHelix747
You would be able to watch/record all unencrypted over-the-air (OTA) SD/HD channels - you don't need cable or FiOS for these. You would need to connect a rabbit-ear antenna to one of your tuner cards for this. You can then connect the other tuner card to your cable box. This way one records while other provides output for watching on TV. Alternatively, you can spit the signal from the rabbit-ear antenna into two and feed each split into the two tuners. This way you don't even need a cable/FiOS.

I don't think there is an easy/inexpensive solution, if any, to watching/recording encrypted HD channels. This is a major shortcoming of HTPC.

In addition to the tuners, you will need software to manage it all. Vista's MCE is OK. For more sophistication/control, you can consider BeyondTV or Sage TV ($$$). Or if you are a bit adventurous, go with Linux/Ubuntu and install very highly regarded MythTV. The Linux option is absolutely free.

Re: cable cards -

http://www.crutchfield.com/S-u...er/home/cablecard.html

Thank you for all the info. This is all starting to make sense

Is there ANY solution to watching encrypted HD? Why are these ones encrypted, so that you have to pay to have access?

 

[zerogear]

Yes there is, there are various certified PC builders with cablecard solution. Basically they can do this because they have
1. Custom version of Windows Vista
2. Custom ver of Vista Media Center
3. Custom BIOS so that only when this BIOS is on the computer, said Vista can be used.

Builders list, blatantly ripped from AVSForum

HTPC Style:

NiveusMedia
Velocity Micro
S1Digital
Okoro Media Systems


Desktop Style:

Dell XPS 420 (I dunno if its still in production, I'm sure other XPS system might offer an option).

These HTPC systems are usually pretty expensive. And can take a cablecard right in the back of the PC or the ATI Tuner, so no other STB (Set-top box) is needed.

 

[James Bond]

Originally posted by: zerogear
Yes there is, there are various certified PC builders with cablecard solution. Basically they can do this because they have
1. Custom version of Windows Vista
2. Custom ver of Vista Media Center
3. Custom BIOS so that only when this BIOS is on the computer, said Vista can be used.

Builders list, blatantly ripped from AVSForum

HTPC Style:

NiveusMedia
Velocity Micro
S1Digital
Okoro Media Systems


Desktop Style:

Dell XPS 420 (I dunno if its still in production, I'm sure other XPS system might offer an option).

These HTPC systems are usually pretty expensive. And can take a cablecard right in the back of the PC or the ATI Tuner, so no other STB (Set-top box) is needed.

Ok. So it sounds I'll be limited to unencrypted HD.

 

[zerogear]

Do you already have all the parts you need to build a HTPC?

 

[heyheybooboo]

OEM builds are required because of the system's BIOS for OCUR (Open Cable Unidirectional Receiver). OCUR is supplied to OEMs only to ensure that you don't move an OCUR device to another system. If the correct key is not present in the BIOS, OCUR will not work and you will not get CableCARD support - and no encrypted HD.

On the Vista COA for OCUR systems there are two product keys. The original Vista product key and one labeled "Digital Cable Support for Windows Vista". The second key registers the unit and system with CableLabs and periodically verifies the activation.

I did a quick config at HP .... rite cheer for $1,180

Components

* ? Genuine Windows Vista Home Premium with Service Pack 1 for digital cable tuner (64-bit)
* ? Intel(R) Core(TM) 2 Quad processor Q8200 [2.33GHz]
* ? 3GB DDR2-800MHz SDRAM
* ? 500GB 7200 rpm SATA 3Gb/s hard drive
* ? 512MB ATI Radeon HD 4650 [DVI, VGA, HDMI]
* ? Blu-ray player & SuperMulti DVD burner
* ? LAN port on system board (10/100/1000Base-T), no wireless LAN
* ? 15-in-1 memory card reader, 2 USB, 1394, audio, video (for TV Tuner)
* ? ATI TV Wonder external digital cable tuner + internal TV tuner
* ? Integrated 7.1 channel sound with front audio ports

You could drop the Bluray player and save $100 - Power DVD will cost yah $50 and I didn't include that (not sure if it included 'Ultra', anyway) ... buying a Silverstone case for $150 and moving all the components over would be a nice touch.

Comcast CableCards

Google

If you have the cash and are willing to put up with an occasional hassle, it's probably worth it ..... as would adding a second cable card if possible ($300 - so you can watch one HD channel while recording another - or record 2 HD channels at the same time) and 3Tb of storage (to start-LOL) for that massive HD library you will build

 

[DoubleHelix747]

I think HD/cable card kills DIY HTPC market if things stand as today.

 

[coolVariable]

Originally posted by: James Bond

Ok. So it sounds I'll be limited to unencrypted HD.

Make sure you are fine with that ... it might be only 20 or so channels (20-30% of those being actual useful channels).
Check which channels you get via ATSC in your area ... those are the only ones you will likely get via QAM.

 

[s44]

Just buy a HDTivo. Every channel, two tuners, replaceable internal drive, and -- particularly with pytivo -- streaming of everything. Also Netflix and Amazon unboxed.

Unit = $200. Lifetime service = $400. Terabyte HD = $100. Not having to worry about endless HTPC kludges = priceless.

And yes, Tivo works with Cablecard over FIOS. Just have the installer bring two cards (or one multi-card) instead of a set-top box. They are actually cheaper than the boxes.

 

[DoubleHelix747]

Originally posted by: s44
Just buy a HDTivo. Every channel, two tuners, replaceable internal drive, and -- particularly with pytivo -- streaming of everything. Also Netflix and Amazon unboxed.

Unit = $200. Lifetime service = $400. Terabyte HD = $100. Not having to worry about endless HTPC kludges = priceless.

And yes, Tivo works with Cablecard over FIOS. Just have the installer bring two cards (or one multi-card) instead of a set-top box. They are actually cheaper than the boxes.

How much for two cable cards? $150?

And installation? $45?

It seems we are looking at ~$880-$900!

 

[s44]

Originally posted by: DoubleHelix747
How much for two cable cards? $150?

Free -- you rent them from Verizon, as you would the cable box. First one free, second one ~$2/month.

And installation? $45?

Also free.