HP with Intel i5-460M or AMD Phenom II Quad N950

[QuantaDJ]

Hello guys... need simple advice here. Amazon has two of the newest version of the HP dv6 laptop:

dv6-3150us @ $798 with:

- Intel Core i5-460M Processor (2.53GHz)
- 4 GB Ram
- 500 GB HD
- Intel Integrated Graphics

dv6-3160us @ $895 with

- AMD Phenom II Quad-Core Mobile Processor N950 (2.10GHz)
- 4 GB Ram
- 640 GB HD
- ATI Mobility Radeon HD 5650 with 1GB dedicated DDR3 memory


What would you advice to get based on this:

- The $100 difference is not a concern for me
- Laptop I'm replacing: HP dv5 with Intel Core2 duo (2 Ghz) and Intel Integrated Graphics
- Normal use: Web browsing, movies, music
- Work use: Software development, Eclipse, Netbeans, etc
- Gaming use: Don't currently play games on my laptop due to the crappy Intel Integrated Graphics, but I'd like to do some gaming from time to time
- Entertainment use: I do DJing with Traktor (but that runs completely fine with my current laptop since most sound processing takes place on external dedicated sound card)


My main concerns are:

- My two previous HP laptops had Intel CPUs and worked great. Never had a problem with them.
- I once owned an AMD Turion X2 HP laptop a few years ago and the dang thing was so hot that it first burned the Wifi chip and then it burned the video chip. So my main concern about an AMD CPU would be not wasting my hard earned money on a thing that will blow away a few months down the road because of heat.

What do you think?. Has AMD solved on their modern mobile CPU the heat and power consumption problems they had a few years ago?

Some BTWs:

- Amazon does not have an Intel i5 with dedicated ATI Radeon chip. (that would be perfect)
- I would've order an Intel i5 with dedicated ATI Radeon chip from HP.com directly, if it wasn't for their long "build time" (I need the laptop next week max).

Thanks in advance,

QuantaDJ

 

[xd_1771]

The N950 will destroy the i5-460M in multitasking performance (true cores vs. hyperthreading). Do it. Not to mention Intel HD, like all Intel integrated de-accelerators, cannot game most of the time; the 5650 definitely will.

 

[CurseTheSky]

If you want to do any gaming at all, the HD 5650 is no slouch when it comes to mobility gaming. It won't play everything, but you should manage most recent titles on medium settings, perhaps even high.

The AMD Phenom II is no doubt going to eat the battery faster and give you less single-threaded performance than the i5-460m, but it's a fair trade if you value the graphics card.

 

[QuantaDJ]

Thanks for the advice!!!

So supposedly the single-thread performance of the AMD would be in par with a Core2 Duo of the same speed? (like my current T5800)

I'm leaning towards the AMD... too bad it went up in price $15 since morning hehe

 

[CurseTheSky]

I THINK Phenom II's were roughly on par or perhaps very slightly slower than Wolfdale-based Intel parts (E8400, etc.). If the same holds true for mobility processors, the Phenom II should beat your (Conroe-based) T5800 in single-threaded apps by a small margin (5-10% or so), depending on clock speed, and absolutely blow it away in multitasking / multi-threaded applications.

Just FYI, the i5-460m is going to be significantly better at power efficiency then Phenom II. Intel Integrated vs. discrete ATI card will also lower your battery life. So, if you're planning on keeping this thing plugged in most of the time or don't mind only getting 2-3 hours on a charge tops, it should be perfect for you. If you really need something that will last several hours on a charge, the Intel combo would be better (and even then, I'd probably suggest something like an ASUS U/UL series for better battery life).

 

[tdelaveau]

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16834115866

 

[kowalabearhugs]

Has anyone seen a review/write up of the AMD Phenom II Quad-Core Mobile Processor N950 or the Phenom II X920 BE?

Do you think the imagine the N950 is about as powerful as a i7-720QM?

 

[13Gigatons]

The N950 was on par with the 1.6Ghz i7 but it doesn't have the benefit of turbo mode like the i7 does.

That being said having that GPU would be more important to me. Whether it games, videos or newer software, the GPU is becoming important.

 

[cbn]

Has anyone seen a review/write up of the ...snip....Phenom II X920 BE?

AFAIK, no laptop (in the US) even uses that processor.

 

[Austin10]

Did I get this right: In a non quad core optimized game the brand new N950 would be slower than my three years old Core2Duo T7800 @2.2GHz?

 

[xbanzai89]

Did I get this right: In a non quad core optimized game the brand new N950 would be slower than my three years old Core2Duo T7800 @2.2GHz?

Yes that is true. The Phenom II Deneb core on the desktop does rival the Intel Core 2 series. Though the mobile platform uses Propus core that lacks L3 cache and that causes it to be slower then the Deneb core. I think it was around 10% at most. Going with that you will see that old C2D beat the N950 on some games.

 

[Austin10]

So the overall recommendation for gaming would be the 460M? I don't want to be unable to play games which I was able to play on my old laptop...
And is it correct that the newer the games get the bigger the advantage of the N950 against the 460M will be?

And: How many tasks would be necessary to make the N950 better than the 460M?

Is Propus core the same as Champlain?

 

[xbanzai89]

Between the two laptops the OP listed I would go for the one with the 5650 mobile and N950 due to having a far better GPU. If you're looking at a laptop with a 460M with a 5650 or better I would go for that. What laptop are you looking at?

The N950 will have the edge in game that make use of quad cores.

For tasks you're refeering to multitasking? I think the only way you're going to notice that is having either a ton of programs open at once or if you're using several demanding programs at one time. With my uses so far in everyday stuff I didn't notice much of a difference with my 955 BE vs E8400, though in games I did see a boost. I guess I don't do much for demanding apps. Be it virus scanner, encoding, and other stuff.

Champlain is just the code name for Propus core for laptops.

 

[Austin10]

I have to decide between a 460M+5650 combo and a N950+5650 combo.
http://www.amazon.com/HP-Pavilion-d...ORZU/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1287447886&sr=8-1
http://www.amazon.com/Acer-AS7741G-...XX1K/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1287447917&sr=8-1

If the performance difference in games will only be slight I'll go for the N950 since it has got some additional features.
If there's a significant difference I'll reconsider that...
What I really want to avoid is not being able to play the games that have been published before quad support became popular... I would bang my head on the table if I wouldn't be able to play a game I was able to play on my old T7500...

 

[cbn]

Is Propus core the same as Champlain?

Yes.

 

[Accord99]

And: How many tasks would be necessary to make the N950 better than the 460M?

Looking at the Anandtech review of the 1.6GHz P920 versus i5s and comparing it in Cinebench R10, the benchmark that responds best to threads and clock scaling. If you scale the scores of the P920 and the i5-430m by the clock speed ratio of the P950 and the 460M respectively, the 460M would have a higher score.

http://www.anandtech.com/show/3883/toshiba-satellite-a660d-amd-phenom-ii-p920/4

The significantly more powerful cores of the i5, higher clockspeed, combined with the modest boost of Hyperthreading can make up for the 4 to 2 disadvantage in cores even in well-threaded applications.

 

[Austin10]

Did I get this right:
You compared 2260MHz(430M) to 2530MHz(460M), got a factor of 1.1 and multiplied the benchmark with it, so that you gain 8344 for 460M.
Likewise with 1600MHz (P920) and 2100MHz(N950) leading to 1.3 and a benchmark of 8140 for the N950.
Correct? Or is that method absoultlely wrong due to some non-linear effects I don't know?

Edit:
This would be a difference of under 5% between these two for the test you mentioned... I would be fine with this...
For others tests the scores sometimes show more fluctuations. Futuremark PC Mark 05 would be 20% better for 460M, but on the other hand the N950 wins for 3DMark06 at 1280*768...
Which one would be closest to games?

 

[Accord99]

Did I get this right:
You compared 2260MHz(430M) to 2530MHz(460M), got a factor of 1.1 and multiplied the benchmark with it, so that you gain 8344 for 460M.
Likewise with 1600MHz (P920) and 2100MHz(N950) leading to 1.3 and a benchmark of 8140 for the N950.
Correct? Or is that method absoultlely wrong due to some non-linear effects I don't know?

Yes, this is what I did. You can use this method because Cinebench scales almost perfectly with clockspeed. However, it won't work with things like 3DMark06 which is significantly influenced by the GPU, so a 30% increase in clock speed may only increase total score by 15% for example. Games would be the same way and not possible to accurately predict without more data points.

But from Cinebench and video encoding, you can see that the 460M would have roughly comparable multi-threaded performance with the N950 while giving much better performance for 1-3 threads.

 

[wwswimming]

is the HP that much better than the Acer ?

Newegg has the Phenom 2 N950 with a 17" screen in an Acer for $749.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16834115864

or is Acer the Kiss of Death ?

 

[Austin10]

My preference for the HP is just a personal question. The only things that the Acer really misses are Bluetooth, eSATA and the Fingerprintreader I think.
One further thing I also considered is the native resolution: The Acer has got 1600*900 which is a little bit more than HP with 1366*768. If you don't want to interpolate in a really demanding game, the HP would be a little bit safer.
And following the discussion above: The 460M is better than the N950. I bought this one now:
http://www.walmart.com/ip/HP-HP-DV6-3152NR/15074460

 

[RobsTV]

Be aware that not all HD 5650's used in laptops are the same.

Many, such as the HP Envy, underclock the graphics card.
This results in some owners reporting that a HD5650 might not be as powerful as it really could be. Some reasons for this include compensated for a system that does not provide adequate cooling for stock GPU speeds, or to gain battery life, or to reduce excessive fan noise. If the system is properly designed though, it could run at stock or faster than stock speeds, have excellent battery life, and be ultra quiet. But that comes at a cost, so lower GPU clock speed and you can then use cheaper parts for a larger profit.

Others, such as the $750 (Newegg keeps coming back in stock for a couple hours every couple days) Acer TimeLineX 4820tg with i5-460m and HD5650 is not underclocked, with many TimelineX owners reporting 3dm2k6 scores of more than 10,000.

The unit I received from Newegg last week scores

3dm2k6 = 10124 (750/1200), sm2-3857, sm3-4791, cpu-2979 (max temperatures = cpu-86c, gpu-72c)

Not bad for a light laptop that gets 8 hours on battery power..

You can find more info and compare these laptops before purchasing from other laptop owners at notebookreview dot com. (no, I am not affiliated with them in any way, just another friendly forum). I would link but links seem to get screwed up here.

 

[Austin10]

@RobsTV:
I changed my mind and bought the very same one now. Bu 3DMark2006 only got to 7549! Have you overclocked anything?

 

[PlasmaBomb]

10k sounds high for a 5650 @ 1280 x 1024...

7.5k sounds more in line with what I would expect.

If you are running a 1366 x 768 screen you will see a higher score IIRC.