How's your hope for America?

[dawp]

There is no hope as long as the two main parties have the power. Reduce their power and we may have a chance.

 

[Acanthus]

Cut funding to the US military in half. (we will still be spending more than entire rest of the earth combined)

Leave Iraq and Afghanistan.

Balance the budget, spend the remainder on infrastructure.

Change all welfare programs to workfare unless the person is retired or disabled.

Legalize marijuana and free up police and prison resources for real criminals. Expand addiction treatment programs with the savings.

 

[Moonbeam]

I remember when we used to put all the old catalogs in the outhouse for TP. If you took a sheet (while taking a shit) and crumbled it up and then unfolded and repeated that process 50 times it actually wasn't too bad.

I never understood how folk who owned two houses were too cheap to buy TP.

 

[bamacre]

You conveniently ignore the fact that no one is calling for us to borrow $30 trillion dollars -- that was simply the amount the entire WWII cost us.

The OP was using this as an extreme example of what far more modest deficit spending might do for us now.

But you knew that . . . right?

Modest deficit spending? I think we crossed that line a long time ago.

 

[CycloWizard]

What would government spend $30 trillion on if they borrowed it today? Based on recent historical record, I would guess it would be primarily hookers and blow. Unemployment was also greatly diminished in the 40's because 16 million men went overseas to kill people, leaving a labor vacuum. It's difficult to recreate the conditions of the "miracle" that was the 40's without killing 100 million people again.

 

[Carmen813]

I don't see how they need to spend $30 trillion, but there are plenty of meaningful infrastructure projects we could undertake. Updating the power grid alone could do a great deal to lower our reliance on foreign oil. We could also speed up the building of nuclear power plants.

Could build schools, repair/rebuild our bridges, work on a modernized train system. Build better airports.

Hell, the list of things this country needs that aren't stupid pork projects is pretty damn large. This could all easily cost 2-3 trillion dollars.

 

[CycloWizard]

Doom and gloom. Doom and gloom.

9.6% unemployment is small potatoes. That Bush economy was always a farce. Consumer confidence through that whole fucker was tepid. We all knew the housing bubble was shit. Remember when the DOW went to 14k? Yeah...yall seriously didn't think that was a real economy? Oil speculators, housing bubble and bust, derivatives, and 2 giant parasitic choice wars on the country the whole time. Yeah it may be seesaw politics, but you still got to be one dumb motherfucker to vote Republican. I can see apathy just sit on your butts come Nov. 2nd, but to actually put those bastards back in charge? Madness!

Aside from a Republican and their loss of credibility...Krugman is doing his damnedest to become a kicked to the curb joke. How much more money can Obama give Goldman Sachs Paul??? The Democrats fucked it up, but I do believe a more disastrous depression was somehow staved off. GOD KNOWS HOW THOUGH!

Lastly big business and even small business needs to shut the fuck up get to work. Spend those record troves of cash on something. Blink motherfucker! For example Steve Jobs Apple has 20 billion in cash and this loon doesn't give out a dividend? Are you shitting me jobs? Man fuck these corporations. Squeeze these sons of bitches for mass collusion.

What company is going to make any large investment right now knowing full well that the rules of the game are likely to change the day after the foundation is laid on the new plant? I can't calculate a payback period when the expected return on investment is 10% plus or minus 50%.

 

[CycloWizard]

I don't see how they need to spend $30 trillion, but there are plenty of meaningful infrastructure projects we could undertake. Updating the power grid alone could do a great deal to lower our reliance on foreign oil. We could also speed up the building of nuclear power plants.

Could build schools, repair/rebuild our bridges, work on a modernized train system. Build better airports.

Hell, the list of things this country needs that aren't stupid pork projects is pretty damn large. This could all easily cost 2-3 trillion dollars.

And that's what the original stimulus should have been spent on. Instead, it was squandered. The only tangible gain from it has been an extra trillion dollars in debt.

 

[Nemesis 1]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S2N_uvnvGbI

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IsRUi51QWM4

 

[Acanthus]

What company is going to make any large investment right now knowing full well that the rules of the game are likely to change the day after the foundation is laid on the new plant? I can't calculate a payback period when the expected return on investment is 10% plus or minus 50%.

If your taxes rising 2% is enough to make your business venture unprofitable, maybe your margins are a little thin.

 

[CycloWizard]

If your taxes rising 2% is enough to make your business venture unprofitable, maybe your margins are a little thin.

The problem is that no one knows what their taxes will be. The problem with governments championing radical change is that radical change is inherently unpredictable. Thus, even if said change ends up being positive, it injects lots of uncertainty in the interim period. When all of the rhetoric from those in power is anti-business (which I don't think anyone can legitimately argue at this point), there is little reason for me to start a business thinking that the rules will stay the same as they are now. Why should I risk my pile of money on a venture that the government might bury before it gets underway?

 

[Generator]

American business is too timid and it seems there has been agreement to just take this year off. Well fine then, fuck! But come new year its time to get to work again. After the elections the fight for taxes will take place. There is nothing radical about not extending the Bush tax scheme. Whats radical is watching 10 years of billionaires and hedge fund managers getting taxed at 15%!

Businessman biggest complaint is that they don't know what will happen with taxes. Obama is a meanie because they actually have to offer their employees insurance. Regulation is back and thats not fair. Wah, wah, somebody call the wambulance.

We got alot of phonies who think their businessmen in this economy. Alot of Republicans who want to fuck up the environment, shit where they eat, and stick their dicks in regulators mouths. 2011 is going to be a great year with or without these hacks, these scoundrels. The tax rate whether its Clintons, Obamas, or Bushes will be set come January. Business will blink, they have to! They have to hire, they have to invest. Why? Because real businessmen will getting to work. Its still the same game folks, its still capitalism. Its still about getting the market share and killing your opponents. The tax rate lol...who gives a shit there is money to make.

 

[IGBT]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100911/ap_on_bi_ge/us_poverty_in_america


By HOPE YEN and LIZ SIDOTI, Associated Press Writers Hope Yen And Liz Sidoti, Associated Press Writers – Sat Sep 11, 2:13 pm ET

WASHINGTON – The number of people in the U.S. who are in poverty is on track for a record increase on President Barack Obama's watch, with the ranks of working-age poor approaching 1960s levels that led to the national war on poverty.

Census figures for 2009 — the recession-ravaged first year of the Democrat's presidency — are to be released in the coming week, and demographers expect grim findings.

It's unfortunate timing for Obama and his party just seven weeks before important elections when control of Congress is at stake

 

[UberNeuman]

America is going to be fine.

 

[Jaskalas]

America is going to be fine.

WH: If Republicans win House, they'll shut down government...

 

[UberNeuman]

WH: If Republicans win House, they'll shut down government...

America is going to be fine.

 

[CycloWizard]

American business is too timid and it seems there has been agreement to just take this year off. Well fine then, fuck! But come new year its time to get to work again. After the elections the fight for taxes will take place. There is nothing radical about not extending the Bush tax scheme. Whats radical is watching 10 years of billionaires and hedge fund managers getting taxed at 15%!

Businessman biggest complaint is that they don't know what will happen with taxes. Obama is a meanie because they actually have to offer their employees insurance. Regulation is back and thats not fair. Wah, wah, somebody call the wambulance.

We got alot of phonies who think their businessmen in this economy. Alot of Republicans who want to fuck up the environment, shit where they eat, and stick their dicks in regulators mouths. 2011 is going to be a great year with or without these hacks, these scoundrels. The tax rate whether its Clintons, Obamas, or Bushes will be set come January. Business will blink, they have to! They have to hire, they have to invest. Why? Because real businessmen will getting to work. Its still the same game folks, its still capitalism. Its still about getting the market share and killing your opponents. The tax rate lol...who gives a shit there is money to make.

You're right - the companies should all risk their capital without knowing the extent of the risk or the potential return on investment. There is probably no cause-effect relationship between increased corporate costs due to the healthcare bill and decreased investment, either. In fact, there is probably no relationship between government and corporate policies - just a growing list of coincidences.

 

[Ozoned]

Then came the war.

The historical solution. Repeated over and over and over.
Gota sell it just right though....


Your family is in the war business, aren't they?

 

[Moonbeam]

The historical solution. Repeated over and over and over.
Gota sell it just right though....


Your family is in the war business, aren't they?

As regards selling it, I wonder if folk were left alone would they rather kill or live in peace.

As regards my family, I seem to recall saying that somewhere long ago, no? Don't trust me. I sometimes say things for reasons I don't acknowledge.

 

[Carmen813]

And that's what the original stimulus should have been spent on. Instead, it was squandered. The only tangible gain from it has been an extra trillion dollars in debt.

Honestly, in my view the main problem with the bill they passed was an attempt to do too much with one bill. They tried to appease basically everyone, ended up with a fairly moderate bill which pleased no one. If they had gone for straight infrastructure spending on meaningful projects, it probably would have been a better approach.

 

[Fern]

If your taxes rising 2% is enough to make your business venture unprofitable, maybe your margins are a little thin.

Too simplistic (besides income taxes would rise far more 2% on individuals/consumers if nothing's done).

If you're a corporation any 2% increase on your own taxes is pretty much immaterial compared to a possible reduction in overall demand (for your product especially) caused by a substantial increase in income taxes.

There are other elements injecting uncertainty into the mix also.

How ill states' fund their present budgetary shortfalls? Increase (personal) income taxes and/or sales taxes or property taxes? What will this do to demand?

What will be the cost of the new HC bill? No one knows, but it will find it's way into product costs, and therefor prices. How will this possible price increase affect demand?

Likewise with any cap-n-trade.

There are other factors as well, no need to try and list them all.

Fern

 

[rudder]

Stimulus is stimulus. While I agree that it's retarded to build tanks just to watch them get blown up by German Tiger tanks or build bridges for squirrels, it's still stimulus. Instead of ATOTers masturbating all day in their parents' basement, you can pay them $10/h to build some stupid bridge for squirrels. They then take that $10/h and throw it into the economy to create demand for products.

Where does that $10/h and money for materials come from?

 

[PeshakJang]

If your taxes rising 2% is enough to make your business venture unprofitable, maybe your margins are a little thin.

According to the resident left, if your margins are anything ABOVE 2%, you are making too much money and ripping off the consumer.