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How will Russia act on Muslim terrorism in their own backyard?

BiggieC

Senior member
AP) - The body of a young woman shot by Chechen rebels was dragged from a Moscow theater Thursday while two other captives raced to freedom under fire as insurgents holding hundreds threatened to kill themselves and their hostages if the Russian army does not pull out of Chechnya Story
Will this change Russia's position on our harsh stance on Iraq? Or will they take a weak stance like the rest of the world seems to against Muslim terrorists, pleading with pansies like the French to get their approval before they fight back? Bali, Moscow, beltway sniper, Farakan... where will fundamentalist islam rear its ugly head next, and who will be next to simply ignore the problem?
 
rolleye.gif
 
I hope the Russian Alpha team can somehow go in and shoot every single one of those terrorists in the head.
 
Originally posted by: Que-TiP
I hope the Russian Alpha team can somehow go in and shoot every single one of those terrorists in the head.

I hope they don't stop with just THOSE terrorists.
 
You're not looking at the problem in the right perspective. Chechnya is a small enclave on Russian territory, and indeed, its inhabitants are mostly Muslim. They're probably between 1 and 2 million. Russia formed "around" them and included them, at times in which things like "national identity" were at best nebulous. The average Russian sees Chechnya as Russian territory... !

The fact is that the Chechens are asking for independence, while at the same time, even if they'd get it, they would be surrounded by Russia anyway - now try to imagine how the Chechen economy would perform in such a case! Nevertheless, the Russians are reluctant to leave the Chechens go away, because that would establish a precedent, and there are many little republics that could splinter, and bleed the Russian "national pride" to death.

The Russians are in a worst pinch than the Americans post-9/11. At least, when the Towers collapsed, and the 5,000 people were dead, tthe choice was clear. Right now, the Russian authorities still need to take care of the hundreds of citizens trapped in the theatre, while at the same time, the demands made by the hostage-holding Chechens cannot be met: The people holding the theatre say that Russia must exit from Chechnya - and if that is agreed to, the hostages will be flown along with their captors to the enclave, and held for other ransoms...

I don't think it has to do much with religion. If, on the other hand, you choose to look at things almost exclusively from a religious point of view, I must say that helping the KLA a few years ago (now widely seen as terrorists, or at least, drug and weapons-trafficants) in former Yugoslavia was not the best move for the American government...
 
Originally posted by: AnitaPeterson

I must say that helping the KLA a few years ago (now widely seen as terrorists, or at least, drug and weapons-trafficants) in former Yugoslavia was not the best move for the American government...

Damn right about that! KLA is a bunch of crooks.

<--- serb, if you didn't notice 😛



edit: Almost forgot to mention.. It's not like the Russians haven't had problems with this before, it's nothing new.. still sh1tty though 🙁

I sure hope they don't pull out of chechnya..
 
They wont act in regards Iraq. It's not economiccally smart for them. Once Iraq is occupied by the US and all the American oil companies occupy all the oil reserves, it will change a lot of things. Is it still going ot be part of OPEC? How many non US companies are going to be allowed in? Russia is kinda hoping that the world will start venturing into getting oil in Siberia (which is expensive though.) So if Iraq is occupied and the oil is more open and cheaper, then theres gone all possibility of oil in Sibera.
 
Originally posted by: BiggieC
AP) - The body of a young woman shot by Chechen rebels was dragged from a Moscow theater Thursday while two other captives raced to freedom under fire as insurgents holding hundreds threatened to kill themselves and their hostages if the Russian army does not pull out of Chechnya Story
Will this change Russia's position on our harsh stance on Iraq? Or will they take a weak stance like the rest of the world seems to against Muslim terrorists, pleading with pansies like the French to get their approval before they fight back? Bali, Moscow, beltway sniper, Farakan... where will fundamentalist islam rear its ugly head next, and who will be next to simply ignore the problem?

Just to make sure that nobody gets it the wrong way ... they weren't murdering that woman, they killed that woman b/c she was trying to escape ...

 
What does this have to do with Iraq? Nothing. But it has a lot to do with Saudi Arabia and neigboring states, whose citizens are funding Wahabbi mercenaries in Chechnya and terrorists everywhere. Until Americans wake up and see that, the War On Terrorism is going to be no more successful than the war on drugs.
Funny how the Terrorists are taking people hostage in Moscow, but making press releases on Al Jezeera in Qatar. Think about that.
 
Originally posted by: hergehen
Originally posted by: BiggieC
AP) - The body of a young woman shot by Chechen rebels was dragged from a Moscow theater Thursday while two other captives raced to freedom under fire as insurgents holding hundreds threatened to kill themselves and their hostages if the Russian army does not pull out of Chechnya Story
Will this change Russia's position on our harsh stance on Iraq? Or will they take a weak stance like the rest of the world seems to against Muslim terrorists, pleading with pansies like the French to get their approval before they fight back? Bali, Moscow, beltway sniper, Farakan... where will fundamentalist islam rear its ugly head next, and who will be next to simply ignore the problem?

Just to make sure that nobody gets it the wrong way ... they weren't murdering that woman, they killed that woman b/c she was trying to escape ...

I hope my lack of sleep is making me miss your sarcasm.

 
Originally posted by: BiggieC
AP) - The body of a young woman shot by Chechen rebels was dragged from a Moscow theater Thursday while two other captives raced to freedom under fire as insurgents holding hundreds threatened to kill themselves and their hostages if the Russian army does not pull out of Chechnya Story
Will this change Russia's position on our harsh stance on Iraq? Or will they take a weak stance like the rest of the world seems to against Muslim terrorists, pleading with pansies like the French to get their approval before they fight back? Bali, Moscow, beltway sniper, Farakan... where will fundamentalist islam rear its ugly head next, and who will be next to simply ignore the problem?

You must be really ignorant about world events. This has NOTHING to do with Iraq or Russia's stance on it. Russia has supported the war on terrorism all along. It doesn't want to support the US' war on iraq because it has business interests (the signed a trade agreement worth over 40billion just a few months ago!). Attacking Iraq will not do anything about the chechen situation. The two situations are so different only an idiot would try to link the two.

And yes, as Colt45 mentioned, let's not forget that it was NATO lead by the US that supported the KLA, which are the same scum as these stupid chechen fsckers :|

I hope the russians kill each and everyone of these chechen lowlives and then tell georgia to fsck off and wipe out all this scum from the Pankisi Gorge.


Btw biggieC, tell me: Why does the US oppose Russia attacking the Pankisi Gorge?
 
It doesn't want to support the US' war on iraq because it has business interests (the signed a trade agreement worth over 40billion just a few months ago!).
Wait, wait!
You mean that a government would make foreign policy decisions based on business interests??!!
Impossible!
 
Iraq does not or ever has funded Chechen Terrorists.

Nor has Iraq EVER funded Al Queda or Abu Safaey or Hezbollah. Hamas maybe but who does not fund Hamas ?

Majority money to Hamas comes from US Palestinians ... living right near you

Dumb fools on this board think every Terrorism incident has a link with Iraq.

Well wake up sonny boys. Take it from someone whos been to a lot of middle eastern states and lived there.

Iraq is the least fundamentalist, non taliban, modetare Islam nation. They have jews and christians living in there, YES EVEN now.

Untill 1991 you had bars, discos and open air concerts in Baghdad. Beaches were western type. Saddam is ANTI moslem fundamntalist.
Also he is anti monarchy ... and hence does nto get along with other Kingdoms.

Try that in Saudia Arabia. Do you monkeys know our own female soilders in KSA are required to wear that tent when they go into civilian areas ? Also they cannot drive in public.

OIL power and lobby is IMMENSLY strong and G W Bush and his thieves will bend over backwards to please the monarchs.

Sad day for Americans with oil lobby having such a say in the legislative.

The list of nations that ACTIVELY fund islamic terror are :

1) KSA or Kingdom of Saudia Arabi our biggest ally .. what a joke
2) PAkistan another ally ..seems after it went nuclear, we bend over backwards to them too.
3) Syria & Iran
4) UAE
5) Oman
6) Quatar Bahrain Yemen and other OPEC small nations
7) Egypt
8) South east asian moslem states like Malayasis, Indonesia and Phillipines
9) Moslems in ROW

Prior to 9/11 if you visited most big mosques in NY/NJ/Detroit ........every friday the mullahs collected donations for Jihad in Chechnya and other parts including Kashmir, East Timor, China's western provinces.

Go to UK today and in most major mosques still after 9/11 ACTIVE jehad donations are openly sought. Young educated moslems urge peopel to donate and distribute tapes, VCD's, CD;s etc etc ..

Misguided fools here link every terrorism activity to Iraq. Seems Osama and Mollah Omar gave them the slip. Now its Saddam's turn.
At least CIA admits the truth and in a very diplomatic way refuted the President right on his face. :disgust:


Generally a lot of Americans are gullible GOOD people and they are being misguided that every action GOP takes will be in their interest.

Well slap yourselves in the face and wake up tp reality.

It is for those rich and powerful that the governemnt works for. Not you 9to5 coupon begging ones.


Iraq is a economic affair. Energy and market dominance. And its not US alone that wants it. Inside info from GCC says that all Arab nations woudl love to get Iraq into shape .. for more stable oil supply.
Being an ex oil man myself, I fully support what Bush admin is doing irrespective of how hollow, bogus and stupid their rhetoric propoganda may sound.
Oil is for those who can use it and respect its true value. Not for dictators who are good for nothing and out of control.

 
1) KSA or Kingdom of Saudia Arabi our biggest ally .. what a joke
2) PAkistan another ally ..seems after it went nuclear, we bend over backwards to them too.
3) Syria & Iran
4) UAE
5) Oman
6) Quatar Bahrain Yemen and other OPEC small nations
7) Egypt
8) South east asian moslem states like Malayasis, Indonesia and Phillipines
9) Moslems in ROW

We will not win the War on Terror until rulers in every single one of these countries fear us more than they fear the extremists at home.
When they know that if they don't kill the terrorists, they will be killed themselves, then they will act.
Right now they are just going through the motions without doing anything for fear of being overthrown.
Saudi Arabia got a free pass from the US because of oil.
 
Originally posted by: Astaroth33
MinorityReport: What do you propose? What would you like to see happen in the long run?

Dear Astaroth,

I would suggest a balance between economic interests and safety of citizens.

Mr Tennet, CIA director, mentioned that the threat to US and its interests remains as bad as it was the summer of 2000, just before 9/11, today on TV.

So what does this signify ? Islamic Terrorism is a truly global wave. From Bali to Manhattaan, Moscow to Delhi, everywhere they can strike. But that does not mean they will ever win. Or terrorists will ever give up.

What I propose ( with my limited qualifications, education and humble understanding ) is this :

1) Recruit people of similar cultures, look, qualities and penetrate the enemy with intelligence than might

2) Take off ambuiguity : For example Bali, Indonesia. Its a well known that Indonesia, the most populous moslen nation has some terror sympathizers.
But does it mean we brand whole of Indonesia as evil ? Now take Pakistan at other end. Most of pakistan is pro Taleban and Osama. Yet they are allys.


3) Arab Frustration and modern Slavery :
I have spoken to several young, educated Arabs (when i was in KSA, working for ARAMCO, in Dahran. ). Their hate for the Kings and monarchs is more than their hate for infediels.
US supports regiemes that torture, exploit, kill, their own citizens and are dicatorial monarchs. Not is it US who is responsible for this dilema. No we are not. It is upto the citizens of those nations to establish democracy. But easier said than done.
Try registering an anti- Saudi Monarch website or publish anti monarch voews on any US newspaper.
Within a week you will get calls from the lobby groups and their lawyers. IF you are a Saudi citizen, forget your family.
Hundreds of young men are taken to the desert and left there to the vultures every year.
Hell, even Saudia Arabia beheads people in public, lynches women and stones adulters to death in year 2002.

What would you do if you were a young educated Arab from KSA who cannot live the way the want to ? To millions of them, Osama and terror or Jihad is the weapon to freedom and liberty. It is immense frustration and brain washing that leads to support for terror.

To every moslem, Saudia is the holy land and thsi even makes matters worse.

Saudia Arabia is the root cause of Islamic terrorism in the world. Fix Saudia, terror will reduce by 50%.

By fix means throw present govt, establish democracy and let the citizens be busy with their own affairs. Keep them busy with stuff and they will forget terror. Also with M16's in every corner, terror will be in their own homes. In the meantime, drill as much oil as possible.

Now everything requires money and brains.

If Saudia is the wallet then, the brains of the Islamic terror is Pakistan.
Do not forget Pakistan is the only moslem nation to have nukes. And they have no worries to use them on neighbours and elsewhere.

Mark my word : IF there EVER is a nuke on western targets by terrorist, it will be "made in pakistan".

Fix Pakistan next. Just bomb it from top to bottom .... they do not have oil so nothing to lose. Ask Israel / India for help. Use them as canon fodder like we did with the allies in Gulf War.

If all this is real hard to comprehend, use a dirty way.

3) For example today 60 armed Chechens took over 600 russians in Moscow.

The next day, use your OWN terrorists ( make sure they do not turn against you ) and capture 6000 Chechens and kill 10 times they did.
Use a diamond to cut another.
If you can show a nation that supports terror that you TOO can do it in THEIR backyard, TEN fold, they will not sleep every night.

But all this is theory and the US politicians have no use of such strategies.

This is how present day US works :

1) 9/11 : US attacked : 3000 dead .. pentagon/ DC etc etc attacked
2) Launch investigation
3) find scape goat/ hide errors, weakness, lacks
most improtant >> 4) think of a way to PROFIT from this situation

My dear friend PROFIT is what counts .. not deaths of Americans. Who profits ? Maybe we common middle class people do in someway. But those at top benefit the most.

To the government machinery, it means profit to its funders and supporters. Incresase defense spending. Military contractors happy.
Make Homeland Security a $100 billion a year : more companies happier.
Oil companies pulling your pants down ? Oh well .. give them Central Asia and Iraq.
Media hanging you down > Pay them and play with human emotions post 9/11

What I mean to say is terrorism will never end considering present cirumstances. And this is just the begining. God forbid a nuke goes off in US soil.
Whom, and where to retaliate ? Iraq ? Indochina ? KSA ?

Lets hope that option never shows up and our intelligence, military and govenment tackle this the best way possible in balancing both safety and economic interests.


As a note : The amount of firepower US has, it does not need any ally or support for ANY war. We have to be prepared to die thats it.
If we can sacrifice 5,000 lives, entire Arab peninsula will be ours in a year.
Hell even all moslem nations unite and fight as a billion against US, they would last a month max.

But no need. Make them fight each other .. and keep DRILLING 🙂


















 
I fell bad abit for the Chechen's. They do have every reason to do this in reality, this isnt the same case with Afganistan. I belive the Russian Goverment should look at themselves. Many of there bombing on Chechen Soil have resulted in many 'unexpected civillian causalities'.
 
Originally posted by: Tabb
I fell bad abit for the Chechen's. They do have every reason to do this in reality, this isnt the same case with Afganistan. I belive the Russian Goverment should look at themselves. Many of there bombing on Chechen Soil have resulted in many 'unexpected civillian causalities'.

???

And you don't think that there have been "unexpected civilian casualities" with US bombings in Afghanistan and Iraq? We could also go back to the example Vietnam which by far weren't exactly the most "accurate" missiles. Heck we bomb farm and sheep.. even our fellow allied soldiers. Remember, its completely tragic that 10 people die by a sniper in America, but its completely justifiable that hundreds of civilians Afghans and Iraqis die as long as the job gets done.
 
Originally posted by: Tabb
I fell bad abit for the Chechen's. They do have every reason to do this in reality, this isnt the same case with Afganistan. I belive the Russian Goverment should look at themselves. Many of there bombing on Chechen Soil have resulted in many 'unexpected civillian causalities'.


Ohhh nice, very astute sense of analogy you have there... are you American by the way?

Sonny boy, these Chechens you see now will one day blow up your own buildings and kill hundreds of your own brothers and sisters. In the name of Jihad you will see bombs, bullets, kiddnappings, halal style beheadings like Pearls' ... all for you fresh and nice.

Dual ambiguity : Palestinans are evil. Isreal is right. BUT Chechens are all good. They are Freedom fighters. Russia evil here.

Good thing you are not a part of US intelligence network. God forbid if you were !!!



 
I feel bad for majority of Chechens too. A number of extremists and terrorists have taken their independence goals hostage. Also this latest attacks will make life very hard for hundreds of thousands of Chechens living in Russia who are just trying to make ends meet. But what can you do. That's something the terrorists should have thought about.
 
Rat-tat-tat-tat tat ta tat like that, and I
Never hesitate to put a chechan on his back


Kill all of the Chechan terrorists and let Allah sort them out
 
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