How to purchase a new car ...

[d3n]

Originally posted by: compuwiz1

Originally posted by: trmiv

Originally posted by: compuwiz1
It's not a big mystery. Financing is probably the biggest mystery many folks face, ie, best interest rate, terms, payments, etc.
Where the most mis-understandings take place, are, in properly calculating the price / value of the car. Information is available, but sometimes it's out dated.

If you go into a dealership and offer $15,000 for a car with a sticker price of $32,000, you will get a good buy. Who you are dealing with will quickly extend his hand, while he says; goodbye!

Understand what car fits your budget, then be prepared to offer a fair profit. You don't work for free, and neither does your sales person. Generally, if you ask to see the invoice, so you can ascertain what cost is, most credible dealers will oblige you. Then, depending on the model, supply, and demand, you should be able to make a fair offer.

A couple hundred over invoice on, say, a Mazda 3, or Honda Civic, may very well work, and at the outside, $500 max, should do the trick. OTOH, don't expect to buy a flagship model for that short of a margine. If you are looking at a Pilot, or an Accord, well those are not "cheap sell" models. Depending on where you live, you could expect to pay sticker for them.

But it's not that mysterious.

Originally posted by: trmiv
Never, ever, ever deal with the greasy salesmen on the lot. Always email the internet/fleet manager about the car you are interested in and get a price from them. Your best bet is to email a few internet/fleet people at different dealerships and see what price they offer on what you want. I did this for the vehicle we just bought, and ended up paying about $300 under what carsdirect.com and edmunds said was the best I could expect to pay. Buying from the internet/fleet manager is the best way to buy a car, and will change your opinion of car buying.

Are you jealous of those "greasy salesmen"? They work very hard, long hours, in the sun, standing on their feet, waiting for A-holes to come in with attitudes like yours. When all is said and done, I can assure you that in every 20 houses on your block, you usually have one of those "greasy salesmen". You know, the one with the nicest house, the nicest yard, and the nicest cars parked out front.

Infact, in the nicer golf course districted homes, usually the nicest home is owned by, either the most prominent plastic surgeon, or a sales manager at a car store.

A-holes like me? That's rich. I'm an a-hole because I don't want to be raped when I make a large purchase? I'm guessing you're a salesman. I'm sorry, I don't give two sh!ts how many "very hard, long hours, in the sun, standing on their feet" you spend, that doesn't make it my responsibilty to pay dealer suggested prices so you can get your money. I'm sorry if I actually do research and get the best price for a car, I don't exist to pay your salary. Yea, what an a-hole I am, being an informed consumer who wants to save his own hard earned money. You can get the next uninformed person that comes in the lot to pay MSRP (well, depending on the car, you may pay that regardless if you buy through the internet or not) or dealer price and make your money.

Dealing with the internet/fleet manager is the easiest way to buy a car, period OP. Do your research online first at carsdirect and edmunds. Find the best prices for the car you want with the options you want, email the internet people at the dealers in your area, and deal with them only. Make an appointment with them, go into the lot and meet with that person only. You'll be amazed how low pressure buying this way can be

I was fine with everything you said, but the greasy salesmen part, as you speak of them, as though they are some lower form of life, than yourself. That was generalizing.
There are some good honest folks out there, who are of genuine assistance.

I had read the Edmunds article 'Confesions of a Car Salesman' before. I re-read it. I prefer to see the bigger issue as the management at the dealerships and the 'stupid high numbers' LOL

 

[fbrdphreak]

Having just gone through purchasing my first new car, I have to say everyone here is spot-on. The thing I want to emphasive most is this: RESEARCH, RESEARCH, RESEARCH. Find what cars you're interested in, read reviews about them. Once you narrow down to your few models you definitely are interested in, find some good discussion forums about these cars. Post on AT and ask what forums are good. Read, research, search, and eventually post with any questions you have. ESPECIALLY post about pricing, see what other people are getting. Most forums have a "regional" section where you can post in your geographic region and ask about pricing.

Good luck and read everything posted here carefully!

 

[trmiv]

Originally posted by: compuwiz1

Originally posted by: trmiv

Originally posted by: compuwiz1
It's not a big mystery. Financing is probably the biggest mystery many folks face, ie, best interest rate, terms, payments, etc.
Where the most mis-understandings take place, are, in properly calculating the price / value of the car. Information is available, but sometimes it's out dated.

If you go into a dealership and offer $15,000 for a car with a sticker price of $32,000, you will get a good buy. Who you are dealing with will quickly extend his hand, while he says; goodbye!

Understand what car fits your budget, then be prepared to offer a fair profit. You don't work for free, and neither does your sales person. Generally, if you ask to see the invoice, so you can ascertain what cost is, most credible dealers will oblige you. Then, depending on the model, supply, and demand, you should be able to make a fair offer.

A couple hundred over invoice on, say, a Mazda 3, or Honda Civic, may very well work, and at the outside, $500 max, should do the trick. OTOH, don't expect to buy a flagship model for that short of a margine. If you are looking at a Pilot, or an Accord, well those are not "cheap sell" models. Depending on where you live, you could expect to pay sticker for them.

But it's not that mysterious.

Originally posted by: trmiv
Never, ever, ever deal with the greasy salesmen on the lot. Always email the internet/fleet manager about the car you are interested in and get a price from them. Your best bet is to email a few internet/fleet people at different dealerships and see what price they offer on what you want. I did this for the vehicle we just bought, and ended up paying about $300 under what carsdirect.com and edmunds said was the best I could expect to pay. Buying from the internet/fleet manager is the best way to buy a car, and will change your opinion of car buying.

Are you jealous of those "greasy salesmen"? They work very hard, long hours, in the sun, standing on their feet, waiting for A-holes to come in with attitudes like yours. When all is said and done, I can assure you that in every 20 houses on your block, you usually have one of those "greasy salesmen". You know, the one with the nicest house, the nicest yard, and the nicest cars parked out front.

Infact, in the nicer golf course districted homes, usually the nicest home is owned by, either the most prominent plastic surgeon, or a sales manager at a car store.

A-holes like me? That's rich. I'm an a-hole because I don't want to be raped when I make a large purchase? I'm guessing you're a salesman. I'm sorry, I don't give two sh!ts how many "very hard, long hours, in the sun, standing on their feet" you spend, that doesn't make it my responsibilty to pay dealer suggested prices so you can get your money. I'm sorry if I actually do research and get the best price for a car, I don't exist to pay your salary. Yea, what an a-hole I am, being an informed consumer who wants to save his own hard earned money. You can get the next uninformed person that comes in the lot to pay MSRP (well, depending on the car, you may pay that regardless if you buy through the internet or not) or dealer price and make your money.

Dealing with the internet/fleet manager is the easiest way to buy a car, period OP. Do your research online first at carsdirect and edmunds. Find the best prices for the car you want with the options you want, email the internet people at the dealers in your area, and deal with them only. Make an appointment with them, go into the lot and meet with that person only. You'll be amazed how low pressure buying this way can be

I was fine with everything you said, but the greasy salesmen part, as you speak of them, as though they are some lower form of life, than yourself. That was generalizing.
There are some good honest folks out there, who are of genuine assistance.

True, there are many different types. It seems in SF Bay Area, we encounter the greasy ones far more frequently. I used to work at a car lot (not sales), and there were greasy salesmen, and there were good salesmen (of which you sound like you are). Of course the management of the place was rather greasy, and looking to F people all they could.

 

[compuwiz1]

Originally posted by: trmiv

Originally posted by: compuwiz1

Originally posted by: trmiv

Originally posted by: compuwiz1
It's not a big mystery. Financing is probably the biggest mystery many folks face, ie, best interest rate, terms, payments, etc.
Where the most mis-understandings take place, are, in properly calculating the price / value of the car. Information is available, but sometimes it's out dated.

If you go into a dealership and offer $15,000 for a car with a sticker price of $32,000, you will get a good buy. Who you are dealing with will quickly extend his hand, while he says; goodbye!

Understand what car fits your budget, then be prepared to offer a fair profit. You don't work for free, and neither does your sales person. Generally, if you ask to see the invoice, so you can ascertain what cost is, most credible dealers will oblige you. Then, depending on the model, supply, and demand, you should be able to make a fair offer.

A couple hundred over invoice on, say, a Mazda 3, or Honda Civic, may very well work, and at the outside, $500 max, should do the trick. OTOH, don't expect to buy a flagship model for that short of a margine. If you are looking at a Pilot, or an Accord, well those are not "cheap sell" models. Depending on where you live, you could expect to pay sticker for them.

But it's not that mysterious.

Originally posted by: trmiv
Never, ever, ever deal with the greasy salesmen on the lot. Always email the internet/fleet manager about the car you are interested in and get a price from them. Your best bet is to email a few internet/fleet people at different dealerships and see what price they offer on what you want. I did this for the vehicle we just bought, and ended up paying about $300 under what carsdirect.com and edmunds said was the best I could expect to pay. Buying from the internet/fleet manager is the best way to buy a car, and will change your opinion of car buying.

Are you jealous of those "greasy salesmen"? They work very hard, long hours, in the sun, standing on their feet, waiting for A-holes to come in with attitudes like yours. When all is said and done, I can assure you that in every 20 houses on your block, you usually have one of those "greasy salesmen". You know, the one with the nicest house, the nicest yard, and the nicest cars parked out front.

Infact, in the nicer golf course districted homes, usually the nicest home is owned by, either the most prominent plastic surgeon, or a sales manager at a car store.

A-holes like me? That's rich. I'm an a-hole because I don't want to be raped when I make a large purchase? I'm guessing you're a salesman. I'm sorry, I don't give two sh!ts how many "very hard, long hours, in the sun, standing on their feet" you spend, that doesn't make it my responsibilty to pay dealer suggested prices so you can get your money. I'm sorry if I actually do research and get the best price for a car, I don't exist to pay your salary. Yea, what an a-hole I am, being an informed consumer who wants to save his own hard earned money. You can get the next uninformed person that comes in the lot to pay MSRP (well, depending on the car, you may pay that regardless if you buy through the internet or not) or dealer price and make your money.

Dealing with the internet/fleet manager is the easiest way to buy a car, period OP. Do your research online first at carsdirect and edmunds. Find the best prices for the car you want with the options you want, email the internet people at the dealers in your area, and deal with them only. Make an appointment with them, go into the lot and meet with that person only. You'll be amazed how low pressure buying this way can be

I was fine with everything you said, but the greasy salesmen part, as you speak of them, as though they are some lower form of life, than yourself. That was generalizing.
There are some good honest folks out there, who are of genuine assistance.

True, there are many different types. It seems in SF Bay Area, we encounter the greasy ones far more frequently. I used to work at a car lot (not sales), and there were greasy salesmen, and there were good salesmen (of which you sound like you are). Of course the management of the place was rather greasy, and looking to F people all they could.

Well, I don't subscribe to, or ever want to be a party to that way of doing business. I have been in the business for most of the past 25+ years, and worked my way up, from washing cars, up thru sales, sales management, as well as finance, and finance director.
Many people believe that selling is something you do to people, vs. something you do for them.

 

[funboy6942]

Originally posted by: LS20
so the way i see it, people get "deceived" by this "4 square" thing, and having the dealer manipulate payment, pay term, downpayment/trade-in, and interest rate, ultimately leading to a higher final price than planned.

now, i cant fathom how so many people are stupid and naive enough to be "mislead" by something like that. look, youre buying 1 car, so look at 1 dollar figure: the final one. hopefully, one would already know the desired car, with appropriate features and options. then, it takes about 20 keystrokes and 5 minutes to find out retail and invoice price. then, decide on 'fair' price willing to pay. wow, 10 minutes gone. negociate on that price. how is that so difficult for many?

Dood it gets so confusing by the time 10 minutes goes by with numbers all over the paper the customers litterally forgot what price they wanted to pay. Then they are all pissed off too.

And getting up and heading for the door works and dont be afraid to try it. I have bought many cars myself and for friends and family at dealerships for them. I tell them just do what i do and dont question me.

1 time I had $350 and needed a car, went to the dealership (Ford place in Joliet IL) told them what I had, played with them for a bit, told them look this is it and my friend and I went for the door. Got in the car and was ready to drive off to the next dealership when the salesman litterally came running to my car telling me I had a deal. I picked up a 92 Ford Tempo with low milage for $350 out the door.

I can get some really great deals most of the time when looking for a used car at a dealership. Need to know how to play them and how they work. You dont look at the stuff on the front line, you got to the back where all the fresh trade ins and stuff going to auction is sitting. There is gold to be found back there and super cheap when looking for a cheap dependable ride. And most of the time when they see you back there there is no pussyfooting around because they know your broke or you wouldnt be looking back there at the rusty junkers

Now keep in mind though Im a cheap bastard and wouldnt catch me looking on the front line even if I had alot of money. But for the most part it will work on new and used if thats what your looking for. Hell I would say if your in need of a cheap ride 90% of the time it a dealership that will give you one on one of the cars in the back of the lot. Thoes are the ones with a dent or two, some rust, or maybe in need of brakes and a tune up they stole from a customer and have no money in at all, and would rather sell it cheap to someone off the street then bring it in do any work to it, cost money, or all the paper work and bs to get it to auction on a chance it may sell if at all. And you may be giving them a few bucks more or less for them not to go through all that crap, so yeah, they rather pimp it off on you first if they can for a few pennies.

 

[d3n]

So, raildogg, Are you planning on doing any car shopping still?

 

[Vic]

Originally posted by: RossMAN
http://www.tfnn.net/forum/index.php?topic=12262.0

Good read. Nice work from CSG.

Originally posted by: trmiv
Never, ever, ever deal with the greasy salesmen on the lot. Always email the internet/fleet manager about the car you are interested in and get a price from them. Your best bet is to email a few internet/fleet people at different dealerships and see what price they offer on what you want. I did this for the vehicle we just bought, and ended up paying about $300 under what carsdirect.com and edmunds said was the best I could expect to pay. Buying from the internet/fleet manager is the best way to buy a car, and will change your opinion of car buying.

Solid advice. Phone and email are the way to go (after research and test drives of course). This is how I bought my last car. Except that carsdirect.com didn't win out for me (they could even beat the fleet managers I spoke with), but AAA Autosource did and with excellent service.

Originally posted by: akshatp
Dont buy a new car. It depreciated 32% in the first year. Buy a 1 year old used car with 10k miles on it. Save that 1st yr deprciation and still get a basically new car...

That's what happens when you get hosed on price and pay more than MSRP! My nearly 4 year-old car has barely depreciated 32% off what I paid for it brand new (but then again, I paid under invoice).

Originally posted by: jhayx7

Originally posted by: SketchMaster
Confessions of a Car Salesman.

Wow, great read. Thanks!

It's an absolute crock, just targeting the worst dealerships and telling us what we wanted to hear and already knew anyway. Remember that Edmunds is a competing auto buying service.

 

[raildogg]

Excellent posts everyone. I like them a lot.

Yes, I am still looking to buy a car in a few months. I just went to carsdirect.com and looked at some numbers - it is around what the dealers are asking for. Honda cars seem to not sell below MSRP, according to the website. I did see the Mazda 3 selling for a few hundred dollars under it.

Are there any more websites like this?

 

[RossMAN]

Originally posted by: Vic
but AAA Autosource did and with excellent service.

Good to know, thanks.

http://www.aaa.com/AAA_Travel/AutoBuying/car_buying_service.htm

 

[d3n]

The new civic, especially the Si is not going to go for anything other than MSRP right now. That would include fleet dealers. In cases like that most dealers are asking above MSRP by 500 to 1500 bucks. I would wait till Dec 20th or so then hit the dealers and fleet managers hard. They would be trying to meet end of month, end of quarter, and end of year sales goals. They might let you get by for a few hundred under MSRP.


Edit, Wow looked into AAA auto source. Looks like a steal from them. Impressive

 

[raildogg]

Thank you very much.

I am leaning towards the Mazda 3 GT hatchback and with the options I picked, such as moonroof and BOSE audio, the target price CarDirect.com gave me is $21,637. The MSRP is $22,675 and invoice is $21,337. Is this a good deal?

Also, when will be the best time to buy the Mazda 3?

Again sorry, I'm a car amateur and especially a new car buying amateur since I have not bought a new car before.

 

[Reckoner]

Whatever you do, don't buy on the first trip to the dealership!!!!!!!!

Find out the invoice price of the particular model you're interested in. Start at invoice and work your way up to $100-$300 above (try to remain closer to the 100 side obviously). Get some quotes via dealerships through their online agents. Take those figures to several dealerships in your area to see if they'll match (or even beat) the rival dealerships. Chances are, you WILL find a place willing to do so.

It's not that hard. Don't be afraid to walk out if you get a bad vibe. Buy towards the end of the month, since dealers are trying to reach their quotas.

Oh yeah, don't go alone. Some of these places will try to gang up on you using several different people.

 

[thomsbrain]

Originally posted by: akshatp
Dont buy a new car. It depreciated 32% in the first year. Buy a 1 year old used car with 10k miles on it. Save that 1st yr deprciation and still get a basically new car...

depends on the car. a new honda driven for 15 years costs about as much over the long haul as two 7-year-old used hondas. this only works for cars that aren't pieces of sh!t, though. tough luck for domestic or european buyers.

 

[AznAnarchy99]

My aunt just bought a 2007 E350 Special Edition (only 17 in the US) for 57,500 out the door. Sticker price was 59,900 before tax. I dont know how she does it but im taking her when im buying a car.

 

[d3n]

Originally posted by: AznAnarchy99
My aunt just bought a 2007 E350 Special Edition (only 17 in the US) for 57,500 out the door. Sticker price was 59,900 before tax. I dont know how she does it but im taking her when im buying a car.

Customers like that get a diffrent view from high end dealers. They are pretty reliable for coming to get a new car every three or four years. Some, even change out cars every year. I can see dealerships not trying to stick it to that kind of customer.