how to prevent school shootings?

[xanis]

Originally posted by: mrrman
install metal detectors etc

On a college campus? That's not even remotely practical.

 

[Bateluer]

I'm not reading this entire thread, I'm sure some inane comments would piss me off.

Let teachers go through concealed weapons training, as well as psychiatric evaluations, and carry a small concealed handgun. Not 100% fool proof, but would you want to bring a gun to school if half the teachers were carrying weapons of their own?

I think we need to identify the root cause and then address that. Personally, I think its a lack of discipline, both the part of the parents and on the teachers. Parents need to discipline their children, and teachers need to be able to rap some knuckles with a ruler if the student gets out of line. If a teacher were to do that today, they'd be fired and sued. Even some parental discipline meets with BS lawsuits today.

 

[TehMac]

arming students and teachers.

That and accept guns as a part of society, and set classes apart in school for gun training and reinforcing the responsibility of gun bearing. Maybe bring it into Health class.
The Swiss do it, and they have some of the lowest crime rates for a country.

 

[Linflas]

Originally posted by: dullard
Even with shootings like this, schools are one of the safest places to be. The question you are asking is like "How do I make Keira Knightley skinnier?". Sure, you could do it by starving her to death, but that "cure" is worse than the current situation. She is skinny enough. Schools are (for the most part) safe enough. To make them any more safe, will require taking away massive amounts of freedom at a massive cost. That cure isn't worth the costs.

:thumbsup:

 

[91TTZ]

Originally posted by: TehMac
arming students and teachers.

That and accept guns as a part of society, and set classes apart in school for gun training and reinforcing the responsibility of gun bearing. Maybe bring it into Health class.
The Swiss do it, and they have some of the lowest crime rates for a country.

The Swiss also have a homogeneous population.

 

[Gigantopithecus]

Originally posted by: randomint
the only to prevent something like this would be to have a secured fence around the entire campus and to check each and every person coming in for weapons etc. somehow i don't think that would work.

It works in South Africa... Kinda...







Not really.

 

[Fayd]

Originally posted by: dullard

Originally posted by: DrPizza
And, it'd be nice if we quit sensationalizing these stories. Now, when someone is emotionally on the edge, the thought of going on a mass-killing rampage will probably come to mind a little more often.

Is there any data to support that theory? Shool related violent deaths after Columbine dropped, raised, then dropped. There doesn't seem to be any clear correlation to me. But I haven't really looked at the data.

on something as uncommon as school shootings, most changes are going to be statistically insignificant.

 

[miniMUNCH]

I also think, in general, that campus police are underpaid, underarmed, and *PROBLEM* not qualified to be real cops. 75% or more of the cops on all the campus' I've been on were/are overweight and/or old.

If I understand correctly, the shooting spree in Norris Hall went on for over 20 minutes. Cops (VT, blacksburg, whatever) should've been in the building and armed to the teeth within 5 minutes. I am going to be pissed if it turns out no cops were killed or injured in the shooting...because it means they didn't do enough to try to stop the gunman.

My wife's uncle works for the FBI... he carries a handgun on his person pretty much 24/7. He has a M-4 with a scope and lots of ammo, an armor vest & helmet, and flash bangs in a lock box in the trunk of his 'company car'.

All police should have similar equipment on hand, know how to use it, and be ready to use it at a moments notice.

 

[mrrman]

Originally posted by: Xanis

Originally posted by: mrrman
install metal detectors etc

On a college campus? That's not even remotely practical.

Why not??? Ive seen them in hospital entrances

 

[50cent1228]

you will have to make school just as bad as going to the airport

 

[AgentJean]

Originally posted by: 91TTZ

Originally posted by: TehMac
arming students and teachers.

That and accept guns as a part of society, and set classes apart in school for gun training and reinforcing the responsibility of gun bearing. Maybe bring it into Health class.
The Swiss do it, and they have some of the lowest crime rates for a country.

The Swiss also have a homogeneous population.

We can too if we close the fraken borders and expell all forginers.



It's for the saftey of our children so we have to do it.

 

[bob4432]

personally i wasn't too impressed with johnny law sitting around the building hearing the gun shots inside on the phone video. it looked like they didn't move in until the shooting stopped - you be a cop and react like that? wtf? that is part of your job, if you don't like it, get into another line of work.

 

[Midlander]

We take chances every day. Driving, walking, eating, .... There is no way to eliminate chances for things like this. If someone wants to shoot a lot of people, he/she will find a way. How about the local McDonald's? Or movie theater? Or Main Street?

You can't prevent people from carrying guns, tire irons or pool cues. If they want to do it, they'll do it.

So, we go on taking chances and hope for the best. I'm certainly not going to hole up in my home in an attempt to stay alive.

"Get busy living, or get busy dying." I choose to live life, not let it pass me by.

 

[moshquerade]

Originally posted by: bob4432
personally i wasn't too impressed with johnny law sitting around the building hearing the gun shots inside on the phone video. it looked like they didn't move in until the shooting stopped - you be a cop and react like that? wtf? that is part of your job, if you don't like it, get into another line of work.

ffs, no matter what the college officials do or the cops do they are always going to be doing something wrong in the eyes of some people.

 

[TehMac]

Which is why you let the locals arm themselves.

 

[Soybomb]

All you can do is let the people who want to protect themselves do so. You can't keep weapons out of jail, you certainly can't keep them out of college buildings. Recently a bill was killed that would have let students there with a concealed carry permit carry on campus. Thats truly a shame.

 

[BigToque]

The way to prevent school shootings is to find he underlying causes of the shootings.

Why do these kids get to the point that they want to kill someone?

Everyone has had thoughts of killing or hurting someone at times. Some are better able to handle the emotions their environments present than others.

We have to be active in preventing things like bullying, helping people who feel isolated and helping make sure that people are not exposed to senseless violent acts.

Movies and video games glorify this kind of horrible behaviour. In the right environment this media can be a great form of escape. Let it go to far and you end up with kids getting horrible ideas and having no sense of ability on how to cope with bad situations.

This is just as much a reflection on the person that did this today, the people involved in his upbringing and society as a whole.

 

[us3rnotfound]

Have you seen Minority Report? Yeah, something like that...

 

[WHAMPOM]

Now we wait for the kopycats that have just been pushed over the edge.

 

[AnthroAndStargate]

I knew the anti-gun control people would troll this thread. So typical. Liberals say it is guns fault, conservatives say that we need more guns stop it, and cynics say make bullets 5,000 USD.

All of that is wrong.

This crap doesn't happen in any other country but America. In Japan when someone goes crazy they just kill themselves or make a suicide pact with someone else, they don't kill innocents. In China when someone goes crazy... oh wait they can't - only the government can kill people. In Canada when people go crazy.. I don't know what the do - but they don't kill innocent random people even though they have tons of guns. England the same. Almost all of Europe.

This is definitely something wrong with our culutre (and no its not video games, gays, or the Jewish lobby) - perhaps it is how we conceptualize ourselves and others and our rights versus others - who knows.

The last thing we need is a bunch of vigaliante gun nuts wielding pistols ready to drop someone that looks like a threat. I'm more afraid of them then the occasional wacko. We also don't need to liberal argument of 'banning guns'.. that wont help anything.

Anyway may these kids RIP.

 

[fierydemise]

You can't it really that simple. Letting people carry guns won't stop the shooters, look at this guy he killed himself in the end, he wasn't afraid to die.

 

[AnthroAndStargate]

Also it seems like the cops boondoggled this. They should have locked the campus down and locked all the buildigns after the FIRST shooting. or the SECOND. Not waited till the ****** truly hit the fan.

 

[AnthroAndStargate]

Oh yeah and Agent Jean - I hope you are the first to be expelled. Unless you are Native American STFU you xenophobe.

 

[Soybomb]

Originally posted by: fierydemise
You can't it really that simple. Letting people carry guns won't stop the shooters, look at this guy he killed himself in the end, he wasn't afraid to die.

Of course if he died sooner, maybe 32 people wouldn't have been killed. Who knows if that would have happened or not, it just seems wrong to me to not give people the option to defend themselves and to force them to be helpless victims.

The last thing we need is a bunch of vigaliante gun nuts wielding pistols ready to drop someone that looks like a threat. I'm more afraid of them then the occasional wacko.

Why would you have such an irrational fear? 48 states allow concealed carry, some have for decades. We have tons of data on it and we know that just doesn't happen.

In Florida there have been 1.1 million concealed carry licenses issued since 1987, and 157 (0.01%) revoked due to firearm crimes by licensees. http://www.txdps.state.tx.us/administra...ords/chl/ConvictionRatesReport2004.pdf If you'd like to browse the conviction rates of texas permit holders there that data is for 2004. I sure don't see anything to make me think they're a threat. Heck lets even look at wikipedia and see what some other states are like that I don't feel like looking up data on:

North Carolina reports 0.2% of their 263,102 holders had their license revoked in the 10 years since they have adopted the law ? a lower proportion than the crime rate among North Carolina police officers. Revocation of license is for any criminal conviction, and need not involve an illegal firearm usage. Revocations typically arise from DUI.
Of the 14,000 licenses issued in Oregon, only 4 individuals (0.03%) were convicted of criminal (though not necessarily violent) use or possession of a firearm.

So there you go, you've got a wacko who murdered 32 innocent people and you've got no murders out of the entire state of texas concealed carry permit holder list in 2004. And you're afraid of the law abiding gun owners. Perhaps the nuts aren't the gun owners, but the people who have an unjustified fear of someone who feels like they should be allowed the means to defend themselves against executions by strangers while trying to finish their education.

Seriously, don't speculate or imagine, the data is out there from real unbiased sources like the FBI and the permit issuing department of each state, use it to show me that your fears are justified.

Now if you want to really show how nutty the gun owners are lets talk about Suzanna Gratia Hupp who had to watch her parents get executed at the Luby's diner shooting because she obeyed texas state law at the time and left her handgun in the car. Or maybe the school principal in Pearl, MI who ended a school shooting by getting his gun from his car. If they're hurting things, its sure hard to tell it.

 

[roguerower]

There's no way to prevent any crime. If a human being is motivated enough, there is always a way to do something, be it steal a piece of work, break into a house, or even commit murder/rape. The brain is our biggest strength and biggest flaw at the same time. It allows us to intelligently interpret a situation and then act on the scenarios that we come up with but in the case of a mentally unstable or psycopath it has the ability to create evils that cannot be matched in the world by any animal.