Sorry DasFox. Didn't get back on the pc until now.
I see others have echoed my sentiments so I don't mean to pile on. I think an extremely high percentage of Windows problems/reformats can be attributed to reg cleaners.
What I meant by if you can't do it manually you shouldn't do it with a cleaner...I should have said if someone doesn't know what each and every key they are deleting is by manually looking at them, then they shouldn't use a cleaner either. I don't know each and every cleaner inside and out but I wouldn't trust any of them. I bet if you asked 90% of users to name 10 of the last 1,000 keys that their cleaner deleted, none could. I've heard people say that they just delete whatever shows up. That can't be a good thing.
I love using crap cleaner. I allways use the clean registry option as much as possible. Seems like a good idea. Crap Cleaner owns!
I've never had to reinstall except after major parts modifications. Biggest trick I've found is to determine what "windows processes" you really need to have running, and turn off everything else. Worked for me so far, but I'm sure windows will find a way soon to kill my optimization techniques.
i recently reinstalled windows cause my last install went bad (i used incompatible drivers. how was i too know that DivX 6 conflicted with my graphic card drivers). but now, i have properly maintained it, it seems fine even after 3 month. just take care of Windows, and it won't bite u.
I agree. Reg Cleaners suck, and should never be needed. If you need to use one, the problem with the computer is between the machine and the chair. Installing a bunch of crap software or allowing yourself to get infected with something is usually the users fault (though sometimes things do happen. An exception can be allowed for a specific cleanup).
Since XP was released I have installed Windows twice. Both times as a result of total computer rebuilds.
\Dan
Since XP was released I have installed Windows twice. Both times as a result of total computer rebuilds.
\Dan
I reinstall annually...just to clean out all the pop ups/ ad wares.
stability wise, winxp is okay..
stability wise, winxp is okay..
DasFox
Diamond Member
- Sep 4, 2003
- 4,668
- 46
- 91
With JV16, I never said anything about performance improvements, I'm talking system maintenance, you can look at it anyway, call it by any name you like, but it is a fact that a registry that ends up over time getting a massvie amount of useless, dead and bad entries does degrade the system.
And stash we are not talking about removing a few things here and there, I'm talking about when you are at the point of wanting to reinstall the OS, then there is probably and quite possibly in the area of hundreds or thousands of problems in the registry and with that huge of amount, with bad entires, it does do jack.
Contact the developer of JV 16 and speak to him over this matter and if you have experience then pick the guys brain and see what he has to say.
http://www.macecraft.com/contact/
Personally I have been cleaning my registry by hand and with tools for over 10 years without issue, people that spew on over the matter of cleaners don't really know what is going on here.
Yes TRUTH number ONE there are many apps out there for this that are CRAP and it is a difficult area to learn, but once you do know and understand and how to work, with and deal with it, there is no disputing the benefits for system stability.
And I'll REPEAT myself again, with a PROPER Reg Tool you can't destroy anything, because it makes a Reg BACKUP file, so all you do is just click it, if there is any issues.
The fact that people are going on about this and don't understand a registry export file, for backing up the registry, goes to show the lack of experience in this matter.
DBSX it is not just a matter of user intervention and installing crap software, there are plenty of reputable software companies out there where their software at times leaves behind entries in the registry that are not removed on a uninstall. What you have mentioned is not true at all. Plus it is so easy for someone not paying attention to pick up a little spyware here and there.
Also are you aware that all most every action that goes on with the computer is marked in the registry, example download a zip file, unzip it on the desktop and install a application, or just unzip something in that zip, then throw the zip in the trash and delete.
That zip file and application, or whatever was in the zip where marked in the registry and now you threw them away and the registry has that dead entry of all of this that was just sitting on the desktop.
Here is a Zip I just put on my desktop unzipped it then tossed it in the trash, now a dead entry in the registry:
http://img226.imageshack.us/my.php?image=screenshot9ka.jpg
Just those simple little tasks all day long of simply using the computer end up becoming a mess in the system that has nothing to do with a user messing up anything, it is just the way the OS works.
ALOHA
P.S. Here is a picture of what a quality registry application does, make the Registry entry backup:
http://img203.imageshack.us/my.php?image=screenshot2nr.jpg
With this backup it is nearly impossible to mess up the OS, unless for some odd reason the application in question did not create a proper backup and in 7 years of usage of Jv16 I have never once seen this to be the case and it has never once ever messed up anything.
And stash we are not talking about removing a few things here and there, I'm talking about when you are at the point of wanting to reinstall the OS, then there is probably and quite possibly in the area of hundreds or thousands of problems in the registry and with that huge of amount, with bad entires, it does do jack.
Contact the developer of JV 16 and speak to him over this matter and if you have experience then pick the guys brain and see what he has to say.
http://www.macecraft.com/contact/
Personally I have been cleaning my registry by hand and with tools for over 10 years without issue, people that spew on over the matter of cleaners don't really know what is going on here.
Yes TRUTH number ONE there are many apps out there for this that are CRAP and it is a difficult area to learn, but once you do know and understand and how to work, with and deal with it, there is no disputing the benefits for system stability.
And I'll REPEAT myself again, with a PROPER Reg Tool you can't destroy anything, because it makes a Reg BACKUP file, so all you do is just click it, if there is any issues.
The fact that people are going on about this and don't understand a registry export file, for backing up the registry, goes to show the lack of experience in this matter.
DBSX it is not just a matter of user intervention and installing crap software, there are plenty of reputable software companies out there where their software at times leaves behind entries in the registry that are not removed on a uninstall. What you have mentioned is not true at all. Plus it is so easy for someone not paying attention to pick up a little spyware here and there.
Also are you aware that all most every action that goes on with the computer is marked in the registry, example download a zip file, unzip it on the desktop and install a application, or just unzip something in that zip, then throw the zip in the trash and delete.
That zip file and application, or whatever was in the zip where marked in the registry and now you threw them away and the registry has that dead entry of all of this that was just sitting on the desktop.
Here is a Zip I just put on my desktop unzipped it then tossed it in the trash, now a dead entry in the registry:
http://img226.imageshack.us/my.php?image=screenshot9ka.jpg
Just those simple little tasks all day long of simply using the computer end up becoming a mess in the system that has nothing to do with a user messing up anything, it is just the way the OS works.
ALOHA
P.S. Here is a picture of what a quality registry application does, make the Registry entry backup:
http://img203.imageshack.us/my.php?image=screenshot2nr.jpg
With this backup it is nearly impossible to mess up the OS, unless for some odd reason the application in question did not create a proper backup and in 7 years of usage of Jv16 I have never once seen this to be the case and it has never once ever messed up anything.
The main problem that I have with WinXP is its self-corrupting registry. There are too many flaws in it, and when you do anything, it starts to crap up. Then again, because it craps up in new and unexpected ways every day, registry cleaners will mess up sometime. So take your pick.
I think what I said is true. For one thing, I did mention that sometimes things happen that can foul the registry. I'm not so confident in my own habits and the software I use to blindly assume that because I try to be careful and keep updated that spyware won't slip through. And I allowed for that in my post. Also, my point was not that the registry doesn't grow due to poor uninstallers or unzipping a crapload of files or whatever, my point was that the added step of "cleaning" the registry should not be needed. My longest XP install ran perfectly for nearly four years. All without a single registry cleaning. Did I unzip a lot of files? Sure. Install and uninstall software? Sure. Was some of that software programmed with crummy uninstall routines? Sure. Did my Windows XP box slow down as a result? No. At least not in any real world, noticable, measure. Maybe the reality is that Windows XP did slowdown somewhat, but if it does not cause the system to be noticably slower, who cares? If you can't distinguish the end result in a human-measurable way (ie, not a benchmark), it's not important.
It's great you like your registry cleaning tool or choice. I still think they are unneeded for the most part, and I have had no compelling experience with my own, or nearly a dozen other computers that I work with/on, to convince me otherwise.
\Dan
ivwshane
Lifer
- May 15, 2000
- 33,349
- 16,727
- 136
I had a winxp system that I ran for atleast two years installing/uninstalling a ton of programs and I never had issues with my sustem and yes I did use a reg cleaner, jv16 to be exact.
I also have a win2k sytem that has been around for three to four years, again installing/uninstalling programs and I don't have any problems with that system either. On that sytem I don't use a reg cleaner.
Probably the reason I have had such luck is because I don't run any norton crap or similar "security" suites.
I also have a win2k sytem that has been around for three to four years, again installing/uninstalling programs and I don't have any problems with that system either. On that sytem I don't use a reg cleaner.
Probably the reason I have had such luck is because I don't run any norton crap or similar "security" suites.
2000 install over 5 years and my xp install almost 3 years. Keep them clean and defragged and they won't have any problems.
Not sure if I have ever posted here before, however this thread just called to me. I've been messing with computers for a rather long time now. First build was a 386 dx 40 with 4 mb of scrounged ram and a 40 mb hdd, can't remember the video card. Been programming a tad bit longer than that. Hope this may qualify me to join in and add my opinion to this little discussion.
First I don't reinstall windows, have not had to since windows 95 original release, man that was a load of floppies...
If my windows installation starts acting funny I fix it. I would say due to my own stupidity one of my machines needs some extra tlc every 3 months or so.
My latest stupidity was allowing the inlaws to borrow my laptop for two weeks while I fixed thier Hurricane Katrina fried desktop. I didn't make them a non administrative account until day two, pretty stupid I know. Due to this temporary lack of intelligence I had the fun of hunting and killing a particularly nasty strain of cws. Fortunately I had adaware to point out one of the problematic registry keys, which gave me an idea of where to find two other keys related to cws. Now unfortunately adaware couldn't delete these keys as they were protected from all of my accounts. So I fired up regedit and went in to change the permissions of the keys so I could delete them, no dice it was waiting for that move. I had to grab a third party registry editor and use it to change permissions and then delete the keys. Then I ran ashampoo to quickly try and locate any extra keys, it found a couple more that turned out to be related to cws. After that I used the redundant dll search in ashampoo to try and locate the ever changing dll that cws always relies on.
I personally like registry cleaners, or at least the one in ashampoo. Now I will grant you that I know my way around the registry, however in my experience ashampoo's reg cleaner on default settings has never offered to remove anything from my registry that would cause me grief. Yes I always check, but honestly I would have no problems handing it off to my mother and telling her to run it once in a while. As a techer she tries out a lot of programs for the kids at school and they rarely uninstall as they should. To be prefectly honest very few programs uninstall completely cleanly.
This just my opinion on the matter.
On a side note:
I noticed a few of you nay sayers asking for benchmarks to prove this or that.... Considering how many intelligent posts I have read from so many of you, I was disappointed by that response. It's one thing to use a benchmark to get a rough comparison for system performance, however I don't doubt that any one who has so far responded to this thread is above noticing when a system is behaving/performing in even the slightest manner.
First I don't reinstall windows, have not had to since windows 95 original release, man that was a load of floppies...
If my windows installation starts acting funny I fix it. I would say due to my own stupidity one of my machines needs some extra tlc every 3 months or so.
My latest stupidity was allowing the inlaws to borrow my laptop for two weeks while I fixed thier Hurricane Katrina fried desktop. I didn't make them a non administrative account until day two, pretty stupid I know. Due to this temporary lack of intelligence I had the fun of hunting and killing a particularly nasty strain of cws. Fortunately I had adaware to point out one of the problematic registry keys, which gave me an idea of where to find two other keys related to cws. Now unfortunately adaware couldn't delete these keys as they were protected from all of my accounts. So I fired up regedit and went in to change the permissions of the keys so I could delete them, no dice it was waiting for that move. I had to grab a third party registry editor and use it to change permissions and then delete the keys. Then I ran ashampoo to quickly try and locate any extra keys, it found a couple more that turned out to be related to cws. After that I used the redundant dll search in ashampoo to try and locate the ever changing dll that cws always relies on.
I personally like registry cleaners, or at least the one in ashampoo. Now I will grant you that I know my way around the registry, however in my experience ashampoo's reg cleaner on default settings has never offered to remove anything from my registry that would cause me grief. Yes I always check, but honestly I would have no problems handing it off to my mother and telling her to run it once in a while. As a techer she tries out a lot of programs for the kids at school and they rarely uninstall as they should. To be prefectly honest very few programs uninstall completely cleanly.
This just my opinion on the matter.
On a side note:
I noticed a few of you nay sayers asking for benchmarks to prove this or that.... Considering how many intelligent posts I have read from so many of you, I was disappointed by that response. It's one thing to use a benchmark to get a rough comparison for system performance, however I don't doubt that any one who has so far responded to this thread is above noticing when a system is behaving/performing in even the slightest manner.
My new rig's been running 10 months now and its as smooth as day one, never seen a blue screen or a auto restart(disabled). The key to stability is keep your background processes to a minimum. No reason to reinstall if it ain't broke......
If you are getting a lot of spyware, viruses and trojans you are doing somthing wrong. Time to go back to security basics.
As far as regcleaners go i've seen software and driver instalations screwed up because of old entries so its more of a stability precaution.
If you are getting a lot of spyware, viruses and trojans you are doing somthing wrong. Time to go back to security basics.
As far as regcleaners go i've seen software and driver instalations screwed up because of old entries so its more of a stability precaution.
Okay, I'm in the minority here, but I'm going to give the jv16 tools a try. I've been using a registry tool called Registry Mechanic (made by PC Tools) for two years without any problems but jv16 looks like a much more thorough cleaner than RM so what the heck, I'm going to try it.
I can't say that RM makes my system run any faster or more stable, but I can say that it's been deleting all kinds of registry keys in the past two years without any adverse problems.
Oh, and as far as the rebuilding thing, I tend to do it about every 6 months or so...not because my system needs it due to performance issues but just because I'm weird and I like to do it
I can't say that RM makes my system run any faster or more stable, but I can say that it's been deleting all kinds of registry keys in the past two years without any adverse problems.
Oh, and as far as the rebuilding thing, I tend to do it about every 6 months or so...not because my system needs it due to performance issues but just because I'm weird and I like to do it
DasFox
Diamond Member
- Sep 4, 2003
- 4,668
- 46
- 91
stevem326, be sure to UNCHECK the section "Show ignored entries":
http://img485.imageshack.us/my.php?image=screenshot7lb.jpg
Otherwise it's easy to then remove good entries by mistake. Remember if something does go a foul just go to the "Program Files" directory for Jv16 under the "Backups" and just click the reg file in one of the folders to reinstall the entries.
Also everytime you clean with it you'll have continual folders added into the "Backup" directory and so you don't get lost with all of them, it is best to remove them once you know the system is working, otherwise with 20 or 30 directories in there you'll have a heck of a time trying to figure out which one was the last one you made.
ALOHA
P.S. I can only vouch for JV 16 Power Tools 1.4.1
http://img485.imageshack.us/my.php?image=screenshot7lb.jpg
Otherwise it's easy to then remove good entries by mistake. Remember if something does go a foul just go to the "Program Files" directory for Jv16 under the "Backups" and just click the reg file in one of the folders to reinstall the entries.
Also everytime you clean with it you'll have continual folders added into the "Backup" directory and so you don't get lost with all of them, it is best to remove them once you know the system is working, otherwise with 20 or 30 directories in there you'll have a heck of a time trying to figure out which one was the last one you made.
ALOHA
P.S. I can only vouch for JV 16 Power Tools 1.4.1
Thanks a lot for that info. So far this looks like a pretty useful tool but you definitely have to be careful about what you delete. I'm tempted to just stick with Registry Mechanic since it seems a little "safer" with regard to the changes it makes to the registry. I'm not sure I'm enough of a registry expert to be using the jv16 tools!
Anyway, I appreciate your tip above.
Anyway, I appreciate your tip above.
DasFox
Diamond Member
- Sep 4, 2003
- 4,668
- 46
- 91
I've unchecked the "Show ignored entries" and deleted every GREEN entry in the thing for the past 7 years without a problem. As I mentioned you don't have to worry so much, because if something needed to be reinstalled just click the reg backup and put the entries back in and then remove little by little next time, till you figure out what you need, but I have never needed to this ever.
This tool is much better then most people realise or give credit. There use to be in the past and you may be able to get these from the developer showing the results in what are correct and false positives and in all tests I have seen in the past there were no false reports given for JV16, as in it's practically a perfect tool, or as close to being one that you need.
ALOHA
This tool is much better then most people realise or give credit. There use to be in the past and you may be able to get these from the developer showing the results in what are correct and false positives and in all tests I have seen in the past there were no false reports given for JV16, as in it's practically a perfect tool, or as close to being one that you need.
ALOHA
I would say every 4-6 months, sometimes less or more. There are 3 reasons why.
1) Either I mess up windows during a partition, dual booting, installing something I shouldn't.
2) Windows starts messing up, like one time I had explorer.exe crash every so often for no reason, other time windows won't shutdown with out having some .exe hanging.
3) I'm bored, don't feel like cleaning up system with old drivers, etc.
1) Either I mess up windows during a partition, dual booting, installing something I shouldn't.
2) Windows starts messing up, like one time I had explorer.exe crash every so often for no reason, other time windows won't shutdown with out having some .exe hanging.
3) I'm bored, don't feel like cleaning up system with old drivers, etc.
DasFox, it's great that you like the tool and all, but I'm still waiting for you to show me real evidence that a registry cleaner offers any measurable performance benefit. Seat of your pants anecdotal evidence does not count.
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