How many U.S. and Israeli flags do you think have been set on fire in protest over the past 30 years?

[Random Variable]

My guess would be 2 million (plus or minus a few hundred thousand).

EDIT: I think I want to move my guesstimate up to 3 million.

 

[glenn1]

I didn't know that burning the Israeli flag was a significant problem. I thought that those kind of folks who would burn a flag preferred burning something more substantial, like an Israeli person.

 

[Random Variable]

<< I didn't know that burning the Israeli flag was a significant problem. I thought that those kind of folks who would burn a flag preferred burning something more substantial, like an Israeli person. >>


No comment.

 

[mikebb]

<< How many U.S. and Israeli flags do you think have been set on fire in protest over the past 30 years? >>



How many other countries' flags have 1/10th the significance and symbolism of the American flag?

Answer: NONE

 

[Nemesis77]

Hah

 

[FrancesBeansRevenge]

Ummmm.... 10?

What do I win?

 

[ThePresence]

<<

<< How many U.S. and Israeli flags do you think have been set on fire in protest over the past 30 years? >>



How many other countries' flags have 1/10th the significance and symbolism of the American flag?

Answer: NONE >>



I'm gonna go out on a limb and guess that you're American.

 

[syzygy]

at least for the isrealis and palestinians, they have ample justiifcation to burn not flags but
effigies of political leaders who have failed them in recent time.

arafat, sharon, bush junior, all should be ashamed for their direct mistakes and their idiotic
negelct (as in the case of neophyte bushie) who've used their collective skills to worsen a
crisis that was on the brink of some form of resolution.

clinton at least had them at the table, keenly understood america's strategic and moral responsibility,
and even exercised a little arm twisting (on arafat - and rightly so), even if it did backfire on him. the
man had the cajones to take needed risks while our current spineless know-nothing fumbles around
in the dark, answers only to the obvious, and has proven to be a master procrastinator.

 

[ThePresence]

<<
clinton at least had them at the table, keenly understood america's strategic and moral responsibility,
and even exercised a little arm twisting (on arafat - and rightly so), even if it did backfire on him. the
man had the cajones to take needed risks while our current spineless know-nothing fumbles around
in the dark, answers only to the obvious, and has proven to be a master procrastinator. >>



Our President now might care about something else than making a legacy for himself, or a Nobel Prize. Our president now might realize that dealing with terrorists like Arafat is kinda pointless, because whatever he signs he's bound do break within a week after he signs it. Our president now might not have to wag the dog. HAHA Clinton got the cajones and Bush doesnt, well I needed a laugh this morning, thanx.

 

[Spike]

lol, yes, clinton did have balls, he also had a dick. We see ample evidence of that dick making alot of choices for him, like screwing around in the oval office and not telling the truth to investigators. Or did everyone forget that clinton was impeached? He was a master politician, there is no doubt about that. He knew how to play everyone and look so good doing it, but as for actually doing anything worthwhile?

 

[Texmaster]

<< Our President now might care about something else than making a legacy for himself, or a Nobel Prize. Our president now might realize that dealing with terrorists like Arafat is kinda pointless, because whatever he signs he's bound do break within a week after he signs it. Our president now might not have to wag the dog. HAHA Clinton got the cajones and Bush doesnt, well I needed a laugh this morning, thanx. >>



That was amusing I agree And I believe Clinton poured his heart out in the negotiations trying to erase 8 years of fraud and treason.
But in the end, he was never anywhere close to his mentor Jimmy Carter in negotiation tactics.

And one more thing, why is it that only America has a "moral responsibility"? Why can Europe sit by and watch Hitler try to extinguish the Jews then side with another governemnt 60 years later whose people have said and participated in the exact same goal?

 

[syzygy]

arafat signed 2 pace treaties (oslo I and II), sharon none, ever - and we can excuse bush jr here.
arafat tried to negotiate with hamas following the oslo I in attempt to bring them into the political
process - and consoldiate his own control. he was naive and underestimated their hatred. and
why would hamas have listened to him ? politically, they were their own masters, and their financial
patron, then and now, are the rogue anti-reformist mullahs of iran. you can't fault arafat for not
trying.

his sincerity for peace and his courage to make the difficult decisions was noted by the chief isreali
negotiator, uri savir. arafat failed miserably in 2000 when he refused barak's proposal. his political
gamble failed and now he must assume responsibility.

clinton, if your putrid memory is of any service, shepherded all three of those peace efforts. the man
was pro-active. he was always there, in the middle, not aloof, off on some high-minded tangent. bush
began his term with a policy of benign engagement, refusing to stick his ol fingers in the imbroglio
for the half-ass schoolbook reason 'that the parties should handle their own affairs' (paraphrasing).
no duh. the man is just dumb. its not just a question of inexperience any more.

 

[ThePresence]

<< arafat signed 2 pace treaties (oslo I and II), sharon none, ever - and we can excuse bush jr here.
arafat tried to negotiate with hamas following the oslo I in attempt to bring them into the political
process - and consoldiate his own control. he was naive and underestimated their hatred. and
why would hamas have listened to him ? politically, they were their own masters, and their financial
patron, then and now, are the rogue anti-reformist mullahs of iran. you can't fault arafat for not
trying. >>



You're damn right Sharon never signed anything, because when he became PM people were trying to blow themselves up and kill as many Israeli citizens as possible. Signing something then is showing that terrorism works, and any group who ever wants anything will just follow in those footsteps. Peace-loving Arafat tried to curb Hamas, eh? And you say HE was naive.



<< his sincerity for peace and his courage to make the difficult decisions was noted by the chief isreali
negotiator, uri savir. arafat failed miserably in 2000 when he refused barak's proposal. his political
gamble failed and now he must assume responsibility. >>



It could have been noted by Ehud Barak and it would mean the same to me. Arafat didn't accept the proposal, not because it was a political gamble, but because nothing less than the destruction of Israel will do for this terrorist bastard. That was his goal during all his years as a terrorist leader, and it's his goal now when he somehow became a political leader (although to me he is still the same terrorist bastard).



<< clinton, if your putrid memory is of any service, shepherded all three of those peace efforts. the man
was pro-active. he was always there, in the middle, not aloof, off on some high-minded tangent. bush
began his term with a policy of benign engagement, refusing to stick his ol fingers in the imbroglio
for the half-ass schoolbook reason 'that the parties should handle their own affairs' (paraphrasing).
no duh. the man is just dumb. its not just a question of inexperience any more. >>



My putrid memory tells me that Clinton was desperately trying to make something out of his years of partying in the White House. The man was/is a buffoon.

 

[Texmaster]

<< clinton, if your putrid memory is of any service, shepherded all three of those peace efforts. the man
was pro-active. he was always there, in the middle, not aloof, off on some high-minded tangent. bush
began his term with a policy of benign engagement, refusing to stick his ol fingers in the imbroglio
for the half-ass schoolbook reason 'that the parties should handle their own affairs' (paraphrasing).
no duh. the man is just dumb. its not just a question of inexperience any more. >>



The man was trying to save his legacy nothing more. I'll give him kudos for trying but I can't Believe you brought up Arafat's past.

The guy has broken every single treaty he has agreed to and when it was most generous, he refuses to end the war. Now his own political party is directly funding the terrorists and you still side with him. Thats just incredible.

 

[vi edit]

If you really want to prove a point, you set yourself on fire. Some of those Buddhist monks really knew how to "light up" a reaction.

 

[mikebb]

<< << How many U.S. and Israeli flags do you think have been set on fire in protest over the past 30 years? >>



How many other countries' flags have 1/10th the significance and symbolism of the American flag?

Answer: NONE >>



I'm gonna go out on a limb and guess that you're American. >>



Yes I am, but I made my statement out of fact, and not pride or "American arrogance." The fact is, we are the only country on the face of the earth that simultaneously inspires so much reverance and yet so much hatred amongst citizens of the rest of the world. How many flags of other countries have you seen burned outside of that country? (I'm sure the Iraqis are burning tons of Canadian flags and we're just not seeing news coverage of it )

 

[308nato]

<< clinton at least had them at the table, keenly... >>



Keenly getting his little knob twisted under the table by Monica while Arafat waited in the Rose Garden if I remember the timeframe correctly.

 

[UltraQuiet]

<< his political gamble failed >>


I love it. Arafat turns down the best offer he's ever going to see and you call it a political gamble and yet in the same moronic rant you praise clinton the felon for doing nothing and call Bush "dumb" because he's not doing "something". clinton was no more effective than anyone else in the ME or anyone else ever will be until the extremists on both sides are gone. Bush is obviously not our smartest President but he is smart enough to surround himself with very good people, not pollsters and whores like your boy clinton. Of course compared to you, GW is the smartest man in the universe. The ME problem is very complex. We must simultaneously support the only democracy in the region so that they don't dissapear under a putrid horde of Muslim ethnic cleansing and not be too overt about our support (and be hypocrits and ask Israel to "back off") so that the entire region doesn't do what Iraq is doing and cut off the oil, kick out the military, etc, etc, etc. It is a difficult problem at best, one that no administration has been able to figure out and probably (sadly) never will.

 

[Texmaster]

<<

<< his political gamble failed >>


I love it. Arafat turns down the best offer he's ever going to see and you call it a political gamble and yet in the same moronic rant you praise clinton the felon for doing nothing and call Bush "dumb" because he's not doing "something". clinton was no more effective than anyone else in the ME or anyone else ever will be until the extremists on both sides are gone. Bush is obviously not our smartest President but he is smart enough to surround himself with very good people, not pollsters and whores like your boy clinton. Of course compared to you, GW is the smartest man in the universe. The ME problem is very complex. We must simultaneously support the only democracy in the region so that they don't dissapear under a putrid horde of Muslim ethnic cleansing and not be too overt about our support (and be hypocrits and ask Israel to "back off") so that the entire region doesn't do what Iraq is doing and cut off the oil, kick out the military, etc, etc, etc. It is a difficult problem at best, one that no administration has been able to figure out and probably (sadly) never will. >>



Wow. Dave doesn't get irratated often. But he is right as usual

Be mindful of both of these things.

 

[BoltCase]

Simple, let's stop spending free money and weapons on Israel and no one were burn our flag, if that matters.

You don't see Arabs for example burning a German, say, or a Danish flag?

 

[Texmaster]

<< Simple, let's stop spending free money and weapons on Israel and no one were burn our flag, if that matters.

You don't see Arabs for example burning a German, say, or a Danish flag? >>



They don't burn it because of our support of Israel. They do it because they are envious of our money and our power which they used to have in the late 19th century.

And if they did, why didn't Bin Laden and the other nuts only complain about Israel and the US involvement over the last few years?

And what have the Arabs done for the Palestinians besides sell them arms?


Answer those questions before you come to that conclusion.

 

[BoltCase]

<< They don't burn it because of our support of Israel. They do it because they are envious of our money and our power which they used to have in the late 19th century. >>



Looooooooooooool. Thank you, I needed a laugh. What money and power? why would someone burn a flag because a nation is "richer" ? This is retarded. Sweden has better standards than the US in living, and so is Switzerland and other counties around the world. Do you think the Arabs check UN reports on GDP for countries of the world before they pick a flag to burn? hehehe

Have you seen Barbra Walters show when she went to Saudi Arabia? The most talked about think in the Arab world is the Israeli/Palestinian conflict. Arabs watch everyday videos of Palestinian civilians, women, children getting beaten up by Israelis and sometimes killed infront of the camera, they show the demolition of homes, whole towns and Palestinian living in refugee camps. This is never shown in our media, though you'll find it in European and other media. Actually, ABC showed some of those videos.

Even the Pope said that Palestinian are put in a situation where only anger, disparity, and a loss of hope arise. I made another post earlier about Israelis attacking Christians in Palestine, check the video yourself.



<<
And if they did, why didn't Bin Laden and the other nuts only complain about Israel and the US involvement over the last few years? >>



Oh they did, Arabs always objected and destested the US support of Israel, and this has been growing year after another but we didn't care, until 9/11 when it got our attention.



<<
And what have the Arabs done for the Palestinians besides sell them arms? >>



This is an irrelevant question, the question is why Arabs detest the US. We're not going to turn this thread, hopefully Israeli vs. Palestinians. This is about US image, at least to me.

 

[UltraQuiet]

<< Sweden has better standards than the US in living, and so is Switzerland and other counties around the world >>


They do huh. By what standard? Have you ever been to either one of these countries? Have you ever been out of your mother's sight?


<< Arabs watch everyday videos of Palestinian civilians, women, children getting beaten up by Israelis and sometimes killed infront of the camera, they show the demolition of homes, whole towns and Palestinian living in refugee camps >>


Yes I'm sure they do. Shown by the same media that makes heros out of suicide bombers and has most of the Arab world convinced that Bin Laden isn't responsible for 9/11.


<< This is an irrelevant question, the question is why Arabs detest the US >>


Why Arabs detest the US will always be irrelevant to me as long as their answer to everthing is terrorism. Fsck 'em and fsck anyone who wants to waste time with the "why do they hate us" handwringing bullsh!t.

 

[BoltCase]

<< They do huh. By what standard? Have you ever been to either one of these countries? Have you ever been out of your mother's sight? >>



I actually did travel to Sweden and the Netherlands. The world is not "US" to me. We're so isolated from the world that it disgusts me sometimes.

Anyway, standard of living compares GDP, health, education, crime, prosperity, economic growth...etc.

If you want to go into detail about ranking of world countries with those prospects in mind, I'm willing too, but it seems that you are the one who has never been out of his mom's sight.



<< Yes I'm sure they do. Shown by the same media that makes heros out of suicide bombers and has most of the Arab world convinced that Bin Laden isn't responsible for 9/11. >>



Irrelevant. Such videos are shown world wide in europe and other countries, they just never make it to us.



<< Why Arabs detest the US will always be irrelevant to me as long as their answer to everthing is terrorism. Fsck 'em and fsck anyone who wants to waste time with the "why do they hate us" handwringing bullsh!t. >>



You, Sir, are ignorant of the crises history and the aspects of the problem that I cannot lower myself more to communicate with "things" like you.

 

[UltraQuiet]

<< I actually did travel to Sweden and the Netherlands. The world is not "US" to me. We're so isolated from the world that it disgusts me sometimes. >>


If you like it there so much feel free to go back.


<< If you want to go into detail about ranking of world countries with those prospects in mind, I'm willing too, but it seems that you are the one who has never been out of his mom's sight. >>


Yeah OK whatever junior. Rank 'em however you want, then figure out the one more people are trying to get into the most. Either way the U S is the most desirable place to live. Sorry I've been to enough countries to make an intelligent comparison. You have neither the intelligence or the experience to do either.


<< You, Sir, are ignorant of the crises history and the aspects of the problem that I cannot lower myself more to communicate with "things" like you. >>


What exactly does the "crisis history" have to do with anything. Having been alive during a lot more of this crisis than you I'm sure my history of it isn't the selective perception that you seem to have. The terrorists need to die. Anyone who is sympathetic to their cause can die with them. Hold it in their mouth till it goes limp handwringers like you can go with them.