How long should the school day be?

[MagnusTheBrewer]

So why force the people who are capable of taking math and science classes to waste their time with those classes?

Because if your read these forums, you'd know that all too many have few if any life skills. Most ATOTers are unable to cook for themselves, light a pilot, adjust a bicycle, read a map, do their laundry or, have any idea about home maintenance just to name a few.

 

[Puddle Jumper]

Because if your read these forums, you'd know that all too many have few if any life skills. Most ATOTers are unable to cook for themselves, light a pilot, adjust a bicycle, read a map, do their laundry or, have any idea about home maintenance just to name a few.

Fair enough, although those people probably wouldn't take advantage of those classes even if they had the option.

That's probably the biggest issue with school, getting the kinds to actually benefit from it.

 

[MagnusTheBrewer]

Fair enough, although those people probably wouldn't take advantage of those classes even if they had the option.

That's probably the biggest issue with school, getting the kinds to actually benefit from it.

That's why you require they take those classes although, it didn't keep me from never going to English.

 

[Puddle Jumper]

That's why you require they take those classes although, it didn't keep me from never going to English.

Yeah, that's what I meant. Even if you force them to take those classes you can't make then actually learn it.

 

[repoman0]

Most people learn best from actually studying and doing homework. Problems sets for science and math classes, writing for English, etc. The actual school day could be compressed quite a bit with how much bullshit goes on, it could easily be 4-5 hours with the same amount of useful class time. Then 2-3 hours of homework wouldn't be unreasonable and I bet most would come out a lot more knowledgeable. Start at 8AM, out by 1..

 

[Dedpuhl]

-9 hours (1 hour lunch)
-6 to 9 hours of homework a week...not including study time

The only class I considered to be a COMPLETE waste of my time was PE (I was average in sports and not overweight).

 

[DrPizza]

a long school day is not going to solve the issues. Its culture more then anything.


those saying PE is worthless are idiots (or fat and didn't do anything in it anyway). PE is great not just for the body. Having a way to release the energy little kids have is needed. Doing so helps most focus.




I agree students should have PE, shope and home ec. I would love to see more of those class's offered. not every person is geared for so much math and science they push.

I think there would be a lot of advantages in being able to offer students a lot more opportunities to explore different things. As it stand now, a lot of students are faced with choices about which classes to take. Not that having to make choices is bad, but at this age, they should have as many opportunities as possible to explore a wider range of options.

As far as "release energy" - you haven't taught in a school, have you? They're twice as wound up after a gym class as they are before a gym class.

To Chicago's mayor: the students in my school apparently learn twice as much in 6 1/2 hours as the students learn in your schools. Therefore, logically, you have to increase your days to 13 hours.

 

[Chaotic42]

Most people learn best from actually studying and doing homework. Problems sets for science and math classes, writing for English, etc. The actual school day could be compressed quite a bit with how much bullshit goes on, it could easily be 4-5 hours with the same amount of useful class time. Then 2-3 hours of homework wouldn't be unreasonable and I bet most would come out a lot more knowledgeable. Start at 8AM, out by 1..

But what would happen to the kids before and after? It's common for both parents to work these days, and they often work long hours. The kids need a place to be during those times.

 

[ShawnD1]

do you not see how many fat kids there are? exercise and i think health education should be mandatory from 1st grade to 12th. Waaay too many unhealthy, unfit indivduals out there.
nothing is more important than your health.

Then watch someone try to apply the same logic to adults. Mandatory exercise or you can't renew your driver's license. OUTRAGE. BIG GOVERNMENT NEEDS TO FUCK OFF.

It doesn't even matter what political party you are. Dems and republicans say the same thing about kids and PE but both would shit bricks if the government forced the parents to exercise too.

 

[Atty]

Why argue with time? I'd rather them get a quality education, not a time constrained one. If that can be done in 2 hours a day or 10, I don't care, just teach them something.

 

[Newbian]

9 hours, no homework, mandatory PE in the morning (outside if possible)

The problem with that is pe that early will mean you will be inside with kids that stink after getting exercise as many kids do not use the school showers, even if they have any.

 

[bhanson]

Then watch someone try to apply the same logic to adults. Mandatory exercise or you can't renew your driver's license. OUTRAGE. BIG GOVERNMENT NEEDS TO FUCK OFF.

It doesn't even matter what political party you are. Dems and republicans say the same thing about kids and PE but both would shit bricks if the government forced the parents to exercise too.

While I don't think that is entirely a terrible idea, it's really not the same thing.

Children are forced to go to school under the premise that every person should have a basic education. Until they reach an age (18~) where society deems them able to make decisions for themselves we make them go to school. I don't think it's that much of a stretch to say that for the same duration we make them exercise at some minimal level.

Children don't really understand the ramifications of living an unhealthy lifestyle; unfortunately by the time many of them reach the age of consent, so many of them are 6-feet under.

How is a child really supposed to have a chance to understand living healthy if their parents never exercise? The most common form of exercise for children is sports, but most kids won't play unless they're decent at it. There is no education with respect to "health for life."

I think this is an excellent responsibility to pass onto the schools because so many parents are clearly failing in this area. Obesity rates have been rising and I really don't see another way to resolve this problem other than starting with the children--and their parents have already shown they can't handle this responsibility.

 

[PieIsAwesome]

Mon-Thurs 4 hours.

Give lots of homework. Cut the BS.

 

[shortylickens]

While I don't think that is entirely a terrible idea, it's really not the same thing.

Children are forced to go to school under the premise that every person should have a basic education. Until they reach an age (18~) where society deems them able to make decisions for themselves we make them go to school. I don't think it's that much of a stretch to say that for the same duration we make them exercise at some minimal level.

Children don't really understand the ramifications of living an unhealthy lifestyle; unfortunately by the time many of them reach the age of consent, so many of them are 6-feet under.

How is a child really supposed to have a chance to understand living healthy if their parents never exercise? The most common form of exercise for children is sports, but most kids won't play unless they're decent at it. There is no education with respect to "health for life."

I think this is an excellent responsibility to pass onto the schools because so many parents are clearly failing in this area. Obesity rates have been rising and I really don't see another way to resolve this problem other than starting with the children--and their parents have already shown they can't handle this responsibility.

And unfortunately, they grow up into adults who dont understand the ramifications of living an unhealthy lifestyle. Who raise children of their own, etc, etc.


And in the Minnesota school system of the 90's we did have health classes starting in 1st grade and all the way to 12th, ON TOP OF regular gym.
Thats why we are routinely 7th place or higher in the country.

 

[Exterous]

There's so much fucking wasted time in school, why else would they give homework? lols.

Damnit - if only there were numerous studies that show homework actually increases acedemic proficiency esp in secondary eduction...oh wait....:awe:

10 hours.

Start at 7:30am, end at 5:30pm to allow parents who work 8-5 jobs to drop-off and pick up without inconvenience.

1 hour for lunch, 3 hours allotted for monitored study and homework. 2 three hour class periods, or 3 two hour periods per day. Homework assignments do not leave the monitored study rooms.

All student attire must fall between business casual and business formal.

shock collars optional

I think younger kids would suffer much more from school days being longer. You would have a lot of hours of just daycare because their attention spans aren't as long

It would be better to get rid of the summer break or make it much smaller and I am definately all for uniforms

 

[Exterous]

How is a child really supposed to have a chance to understand living healthy if their parents never exercise?

Hold their lazy worthless parents responsible? We coddle parents too much so now we have an epidemic of really fucking horrible parents. The schools can't resolve every failing of parents because society won't give the schools the means to do so (see: Discipline)

 

[bhanson]

Hold their lazy worthless parents responsible? We coddle parents too much so now we have an epidemic of really fucking horrible parents. The schools can't resolve every failing of parents because society won't give the schools the means to do so (see: Discipline)

You just agreed that a lot of parents are lazy and not responsible. Do you really think the solution lies outside of government? How do you propose we "hold them responsible" when they're clearly not responsible?

 

[Exterous]

You just agreed that a lot of parents are lazy and not responsible. Do you really think the solution lies outside of government? How do you propose we "hold them responsible" when they're clearly not responsible?

I think there are solutions insided and outside the government. I would hope that we reach a breaking point in how we collectivley view parenting and societal pressure would encourage better parenting. I think I see this to some extent among people I know. A lot of new parents see how other children have been acting and say 'Oh no! Not my kid!' but obviously my sample size for that is much to small.

Too much emphasis on each child is a unique snowflake and can do no wrong. This touchy feely friend rather than parent approach was not concieved within the government

 

[purbeast0]

So why force the people who are capable of taking math and science classes to waste their time with those classes?

wtf ... why are you under this impression that you can't have math, science, AND physical education classes?

anyone who thinks PE is not important is either fat, lazy, stupid, or all 3.

 

[MrPickins]

maintaining physical fitness is a skill. your not born with knowledge of proper fitness and discipline.
Your health is far more important than your knowledge of math or science, those do you no good layed up in a hospital, coffin or even attached to a sofa.

lack of PE creates ignorance of fitness, leading to fat, diseased kids who will further burden the health industry.
good health makes you feel good and in turn leads to happier, more productive people.

This.

Physical Education shouldn't be looked at (or taught) as a way to force kids to exercise, it should be about teaching them how to maintain their physical fitness.

We don't expect parents to teach their kids algebra, why should we expect them to teach their kids how to develop a proper exercise regimen?

 

[busydude]

When I was in school we used to have 4 hours of pe session.. 2 hours of art/music/dance.. And 2 hours of carpentry/diy. Even though I was an average student at best.. I freaking loved school.

 

[JimmiG]

Teenagers need more sleep than adults (9-10 hours). Also, their circadian rhythm is different, delayed by several hours when compared to adults. They learn the best in the afternoon. So the school day should last from about 9:30 am. to 4 pm IMO. It should not be longer than ~6 hours - a workday may be 8 hours, but you don't work constantly for 8 hours...

 

[ShawnD1]

It should not be longer than ~6 hours - a workday may be 8 hours, but you don't work constantly for 8 hours...

Depends on the job. At my engineering job, we get up and get a coffee any time we want. At a construction job, you stand around when waiting for someone else to finish something. If you're a politician, you stand around and do nothing even though you're not waiting for anyone.

 

[bhanson]

I think there are solutions insided and outside the government. I would hope that we reach a breaking point in how we collectivley view parenting and societal pressure would encourage better parenting. I think I see this to some extent among people I know. A lot of new parents see how other children have been acting and say 'Oh no! Not my kid!' but obviously my sample size for that is much to small.

Too much emphasis on each child is a unique snowflake and can do no wrong. This touchy feely friend rather than parent approach was not concieved within the government

Why do we always have to reach "rock bottom" before action is taken? Are we not an advanced enough society to foresee some problems and proactively address them? Isn't it already bad enough? Why should we "wait and see" when there are clear interventions that have a good chance at improving outcomes.

We have standards to drive a car because there is a minimum level of competency required for community health.

We have standards for hunting because one person cannot possibly have the insight needed to regulate animal populations.

Is raising a human being not as important as these issues? Why is there virtually no regulation on it? Nearly anyone can become a parent regardless of their competence. We give up certain freedoms with the acceptance of our social contract. We have the right to own a gun, but we have to follow certain rules such as registering it, and we certainly gave up the right to shoot someone at will. We have the right to freedom of speech, but if one exercises this right in an incredibly disruptive manner, such standing up in the middle of your workplace and yelling, there are repercussions.

We give up certain elements of freedom in order to have a civilized society. What at all is civilized about having a child when you have a drug addiction? When you have no means to support yourself financially? When you're underage?

I believe your idea that societal pressure will influence parents enough to have better outcomes is incredibly optimistic. This ostensible presentation of negative feedback I truly think does not have the self-regulating capacity to be an outright solution. I think elements of this concept play an important role in the creation of capable parents, but I also think it should be included as part of a multidimensional concentrated effort to standardize what it means to be a competent parent. I think we can all agree that we desire more parents to be competent, it's just the means to the end that have differing opinions. This multidimensional approach implements redundancies--people respond differently to the same modalities, therefore I think it is important to not rely on one approach.