Exactly. And you're right, there will be exceptions. But no company is going to interview all applicants to find the diamond in the rough (unless it's a crap company desperate for employees). Any company worth its weight will save time by going for the applicants who have a better chance of being what they want.
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How important is it to go to a good univ?
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Exactly. And you're right, there will be exceptions. But no company is going to interview all applicants to find the diamond in the rough (unless it's a crap company desperate for employees). Any company worth its weight will save time by going for the applicants who have a better chance of being what they want.
bigdog1218
Golden Member
What you did in high school is absolutly worthless once your in college, and I believe most universities are "truly academic environments." A Harvard degree might get you more interviews, but once you're at the interview where you went to college doesn't mean anything.
But Ivy school graduates have to justify paying an absurd amount for an education you can get at most private schools. Graduate school is a different story, but for undergraduate save yourself the money and get a "Harvard" education at a state school.
silverpig
Lifer
I'm sure I could have gotten in to harvard (98% avg in high school... didn't bother with SATs), but there was no way I could afford to pay the international student tuition. I have a friend from here (Canada) who went to harvard for 4 years and gradded top of his class in pre-med. His first year cost his family $100 000. After that though he got enough in scholarships to pay for the rest of his schooling, as well as cover that initial $$$. When he finished he came back here to UBC to do his med school because he said it was just as good. He's not going to learn anything different about being a doctor. When it comes down to it, you're still getting checked out by the person and not by the school they went to. A genius from Joe State is still a genius, and a cocaine snorting dunce from Yale is still... 😉 hehe.
The American media plays up Harvard to be 10 times better than it really is (it's still a damn good school for sure, but it's not the best school in every category in the world). I'd rather to physics at CalTech or MIT for sure, or compsci at CMU or Waterloo. But yeah, the name does get you a lot.
To the original poster:
It's not important to go to a "good" school per se, but to one that has a good department in what you want to study. If you want to do CS, go to a good CS school (or at least a decent one... but don't go to arts school).
RabidMongoose
Lifer
I agree with you that lots of people should go to a state school and then go on to a good graduate school. However, I think that a Harvard type degree is still worth more than a state school. If you can afford it and assuming that you were accepted to Harvard, I would recommend going to Harvard instead of the state school. Besides its meaning for jobs, a large percentage of good law, medical, etc. schools are comprised of students from elite schools.
RabidMongoose
Lifer
Are you sure that you could have gone to Harvard? Sometimes it's a crap shoot, if you're at the Harvard level. I've known people that have been in magazines, newspapers, etc. as one of the top 100 or so high school students in the US and they were rejected or wait listed by Harvard. They had near perfect SAT scores, tons of activities, were loved by their teachers.
How did your friend manage to spend $100,000 in one year? Sounds pretty strange.
bigdog1218
Golden Member
That may be true, but the point is once you're in the interview it doesn't matter what school you went to, unless you're being interviewd by an alumni or something. So going to Harvard Undergrad for four years spending $38,000 a year will get you more interviews, doesn't seem like a wise investment to me. Would I be willing to spend extra money to go to Harvard Med school? Yes, because at the graduate level Harvard can offer me much more resources than the average university.
I was admitted to Harvard but chose to attend MIT instead. Sometimes with financial aid (for U.S. Citizens), going to a top school can end up not being much more expensive than a state school. Unless of course your parents are somewhat loaded, in which case the price difference can become sizable.
In retrospect, I think I could have gotten just as much or more out of a "full-tuition" deal elsewhere, coming out of the less prestegious school with a much higher net value while having gone through similar experiences. Especially now that anyone can audit MIT courses for free online (no way of knowing they would give away the goods for free when I was making my decision). How much effort you put into your education is the most important factor in terms of actual intellectual growth.
Getting the interview is indeed the most critical stage for landing a job, but that's nothing a little old fashioned networking can't take care of. If your dream employer is only recruiting from top tier schools, then perhaps you should consider trying to get into a school they recruit from. Alternately you could work elsewhere in the same industry, make professional contacts, and get your foot in the door by people knowing about you rather than knowing about your school. Depending on your target employer, there's no guarantee you'll get the job even from a top tier school over other highly competitive classmates. If you establish a name for yourself in your work, you'll get recruited by others in the same field regardless of your Alma Matter.
In retrospect, I think I could have gotten just as much or more out of a "full-tuition" deal elsewhere, coming out of the less prestegious school with a much higher net value while having gone through similar experiences. Especially now that anyone can audit MIT courses for free online (no way of knowing they would give away the goods for free when I was making my decision). How much effort you put into your education is the most important factor in terms of actual intellectual growth.
Getting the interview is indeed the most critical stage for landing a job, but that's nothing a little old fashioned networking can't take care of. If your dream employer is only recruiting from top tier schools, then perhaps you should consider trying to get into a school they recruit from. Alternately you could work elsewhere in the same industry, make professional contacts, and get your foot in the door by people knowing about you rather than knowing about your school. Depending on your target employer, there's no guarantee you'll get the job even from a top tier school over other highly competitive classmates. If you establish a name for yourself in your work, you'll get recruited by others in the same field regardless of your Alma Matter.
Originally posted by: Electric Amish
People should be judged on their abilities, not where they went to school. I mean, George W. Bush graduated from Yale.
They're already judged on their abilities when they're accepted into Harvard. So many of them were class presidents, first in their high school class, etc. There's a reason why people say in the US you have to be a very well-rounded student. You don't just take one test and then go to college like in many other countries.
I'm curious, but where did you go to college? No offense, but most people that go to no-name schools are very offensive against the idea that good-name schools aren't important. But people that did go to big-name schools almost always say it depends, sometimes, maybe, etc. They're not nearly as intense.
Also, a lot of these good universities give out very nice financial aid. It was cheaper for me to go to a private top 20 school than to go to an out-of-state public school.
Undergrad university choice is not as important as where you go to grad school. Go to a decent state school for undergrad (community college for the first year or two is fine), work your ass off to get good grades and learn a lot, take your GREs (and study for them) then apply to several of the better schools for grad school (note: this does not mean they will nec. be private schools, some of the best are probably state schools as well.) Don't go to any that don't offer you a fellowship or grant or some way to cover your tuition and expenses.
Originally posted by: CanOWorms
Originally posted by: Electric Amish
People should be judged on their abilities, not where they went to school. I mean, George W. Bush graduated from Yale.
They're already judged on their abilities when they're accepted into Harvard. So many of them were class presidents, first in their high school class, etc. There's a reason why people say in the US you have to be a very well-rounded student. You don't just take one test and then go to college like in many other countries.
I'm curious, but where did you go to college? No offense, but most people that go to no-name schools are very offensive against the idea that good-name schools aren't important. But people that did go to big-name schools almost always say it depends, sometimes, maybe, etc. They're not nearly as intense.
Also, a lot of these good universities give out very nice financial aid. It was cheaper for me to go to a private top 20 school than to go to an out-of-state public school.
Well he does have real world experience. But, going to a good school many open doors for you and it may not. I have friends that went to UT and graudated with 3.5+ (EE) and one friend that went to Berkeley with a 4.0 (EE). They are currently sitting at home. My cousin graduated from a small school with a Biology major, he is now a network engineer making 100k a year. With the sluggish economy it's hard to tell.
Originally posted by: Synergy
Originally posted by: CanOWorms
Originally posted by: Electric Amish
People should be judged on their abilities, not where they went to school. I mean, George W. Bush graduated from Yale.
They're already judged on their abilities when they're accepted into Harvard. So many of them were class presidents, first in their high school class, etc. There's a reason why people say in the US you have to be a very well-rounded student. You don't just take one test and then go to college like in many other countries.
I'm curious, but where did you go to college? No offense, but most people that go to no-name schools are very offensive against the idea that good-name schools aren't important. But people that did go to big-name schools almost always say it depends, sometimes, maybe, etc. They're not nearly as intense.
Also, a lot of these good universities give out very nice financial aid. It was cheaper for me to go to a private top 20 school than to go to an out-of-state public school.
Well he does have real world experience. But, going to a good school many open doors for you and it may not. I have friends that went to UT and graudated with 3.5+ (EE) and one friend that went to Berkeley with a 4.0 (EE). They are currently sitting at home. My cousin graduated from a small school with a Biology major, he is now a network engineer making 100k a year. With the sluggish economy it's hard to tell.
Well of course. There are no definites.
And honestly, that's probably not the norm. Random examples don't matter. The Berkeley 4.0 should be able to get a job, get into the absolute top grad schools, etc. Maybe he's not looking, waiting for the right job, etc.
Was OP referring to Harvard, or just something better than Northern Michigan? I don't think you necessarily have to go to Harvard or MIT to get a good job. Those grads are the top 1% of society. But I would recommend Michigan over Northern Michigan or Michigan Tech. I have a coworker who got his IE degree from Michigan, and started at $65K.
silverpig
Lifer
I guess I should have been more careful with my wording then 🙂 If I had applied, and been rejected, it wouldn't have been because of my marks 🙂
Well he was an international student (from Canada), the exchange rate blew ass then, and he had to pay for an apartment, food, etc etc. The $100 000 was for everything.
Ok well I didn't realize the EET was different than EE. :frown:
This is the degree requirements. I guess they don't really compare to some of the others. I consider myself smart enough to get through an EE or CE degree somewhere better and didn't realize EET was lower.
They just don't really offer anything good. Their CS degree looks better, but I really don't think I'd like to be stuck in CS. I think EE or CE is where it's at.
This is the degree requirements. I guess they don't really compare to some of the others. I consider myself smart enough to get through an EE or CE degree somewhere better and didn't realize EET was lower.
They just don't really offer anything good. Their CS degree looks better, but I really don't think I'd like to be stuck in CS. I think EE or CE is where it's at.
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