How have you dealt with a dying asshole relative?

[slackerinabox]

I know some get worked up about my TMI familial posts - apologies in advanced, I just find the input of strangers at hands distance from the situation very valuable and appreciate feedback. And these new skinny jeans rappers are making talking about feelings more acceptable, I guess...

So I'm a big mess of a person due to many reasons, but recently started therapy's helping me understand my own fault in all of this and how my judgement's been skewed by illogical parental figures growing up. Boo hoo, i'm almost 40 so no time to blame - but having clarity about my upbringing is helping me question the here and now.. i won't go into tedious detail but I went through many years and layers of BS growing up (old school christian and old school third world patriarch), from threats not to integrate or Americanize ("I'll kill myself if you touch a dirty white girl" - guess what, I married one) to violent rages over the most benign stuff.. Especially during my highshool years when he tried to make me his mini-me (matching glasses, forced to wear a tie to public school, etc) and I instead discovered punk rock and drinking.. I have a therapist so I'll stop the whine BUT my point is that I'm unpacking a lot these days, concentrated since my dad was diagnosed with pancreatic cancer this year.

This is where I'd like some input, because I'm sure many of you have dealt with aging parents. With his age and pancreatic cancer's high kill rate, I took his diagnosis back in March as a wake up call - be kind to him, be there for him and my mom, and don't let old gripes ruin what little time we have left. I've tried to be a good son - biweekly trips to the hospital waiting sometimes 8 hours in the too hot or too cold car because I don't want to burn gas... took over his properties he owned like a slum lord and full of issues. rat infestations, leaky roofs, two complete remodels (unrentable), boiler issues, 2 sinks completely rotted out.. All of this for zero reimbursal. He points out the loyalty of "Jewish Sons" in the real estate game. I think he doesn't realize that these "Jewish Sons" are on payroll.. It's been a lot, and I have a wife and 2 little kids of my own..

Through out it he's been a dick, second guessing me (every step of the way i've saved him thousands AND made the right decisions not the quick and cheap ones) and most annoyingly did it last week - one apartment has been under construction and he texts me from there (after not going there for a month) "Disgusting and disappointed" and shows pictures of the unit in "disarray" - why? Because it was worked on by contractors and they left their debris and equipment all around since it's still under construction... He was disgusted and disappointed that I didn't clean the apartment BETWEEN constuction?? He proceeds to document him and my 80 year old mom painfully cleaning the apartment until 3 am, to drive home how I'm a terrible disappointment of a man...during that week I saved him 2 grand on fighting hours with movers over a fridge, drove him a home cooked meal for the holidays, and spent maybe 4 hours taking them to appointments... i also pissed off my wife that morning for canceling on her at the last minute to change my schedule for him at the last minute hours earlier, so his "i'm ashamed of you" REALLY fucking burnede..

So i'm not here just to bitch. I'm asking, some of you must have had awful parents.. What do you do during those final days, when they turn the heat up on their awfulness and everyone from your shrink to wife say "walk away," but you're still full of guilt and conflict?

 

[BurnItDwn]

No useful advice here.

I have no guilt about disowning and hating my father. He abused my mom and its unforgivable. He has been dead to me for a long time, even if he still might technically still be alive.

You didn't choose to be born.
You didn't choose your parents.
Its usually good to be compassionate and have empathy for them, but you need to look after #1 first.

 

[shortylickens]

Nope.
Mom and dad both lingered a long time before dying but they were good people and while I miss them the experience itself was non-confrontational.

 

[slackerinabox]

No useful advice here.

I have no guilt about disowning and hating my father. He abused my mom and its unforgivable. He has been dead to me for a long time, even if he still might technically still be alive.

You didn't choose to be born.
You didn't choose your parents.
Its usually good to be compassionate and have empathy for them, but you need to look after #1 first.

Thank you for sharing, really. I think after spending my 20s estranged and mellowing out and trying very hard these past few years it's all very.. Disappointing? I think I've been drinking the self help cool aid so long that "hate" seemed selfish, but I think you're right. I think as an asian I have this extreme layer of "your responsibility as a son!" dogma and christian forgiveness i'm fighting against, but anger/hate may be more mature in the end in that it brings some sense of closure? does that make sense?

 

[Geekbabe]

How is your relationship with your Mom, if he is this lousy to you he must make her life hell. I would focus on her, also try to arrange for services for your Dad that you don’t have to do, call the cancer center, find out about rides to chemo& any services the social worker can arrange.

Also pancreatic cancer & it’s treatment is a real mother... it’s not going to make him more pleasant. Oh & tell him he needs a property manager, don’t spend any more of your money fixing things he won’t reimburse you for.

 

[slackerinabox]

How is your relationship with your Mom, if he is this lousy to you he must make her life hell. I would focus on her, also try to arrange for services for your Dad that you don’t have to do, call the cancer center, find out about rides to chemo& any services the social worker can arrange.

Also pancreatic cancer & it’s treatment is a real mother... it’s not going to make him more pleasant. Oh & tell him he needs a property manager, don’t spend any more of your money fixing things he won’t reimburse you for.

I think I'm most disappointed in my mom, actually. Growing up I used to view her as an Angelic balance of sort but revisiting everything she'd comfort after the fact (with food, another long story I'm still dealing with) but never stopped him. But then she'd at least used to say "he's crazy, you know he loves you but he's crazy." NOw, to go back to this apartment issue, she mirrors him - when I called to check in that night she said "don't worry about that apartment, you go focus on your wife and let us die alone" sorta nonsense, and in the past she'd straighten him out with a "clean up is done AFTER construction, shut up." This time she stayed there to clean the place for 3 days to reinforce his insanity.

THe property management stuff was my interests (real estate agent and former PM by trade) clouding my better judgement. I thought I could turn things around and bring the investments back around, him refusing to give up control and then bad mouthing me for just trying to adapt (the renovation's happening in phases and taking time because he's cheap and waiting on his jack ass contractor, if it were up to me we'd be done 2 months ago and I gave him 5 estimateS). The selfish, machiavellian part of me wants to dig in anyways because NYC real estate aint cheap. But at what cost, I suppose!

To clarify: I don't pay for the actual work, by "reimbursal" i mean that I'm spending hundreds of hours of time without any compensation and he's oblivious that taking me away from my wife or my job is a sacrifice (she's a full time teacher on cam for distance learning all day, me spending 8 hours babysitting contractors when she could really use help with our 2 kids is a big deal). As a landlords in NYC he has seen the Jewish Son (or son in law) that fights tooth in nails for their father's interests, but they get paid for that loyalty, I work with them every day and they're very good about compensating me for my time too i don't mean to stereotype, I have much respect for the community. And I don't really want compensation for my time from my dad, just being called an utter disappointment for not cleaning up for construction that's STILL IN PROGRESS and was on a short break for the Holidays really burns (and that was his contractors scheduling, not me)

 

[zinfamous]

good lord, your dad sounds like a certain type of common Bay Area slumlord that I sometimes had to encounter.

Anyway, what I can say from experience at this type of moment is that it doesn't really matter what kind of family dynamic you have going into it--people re going to lose control of their emotions a bit, at some point. It always happens. Could certainly be sustained by some individuals longer than others, but the nicest most patient people in your family might just flip out on someone. You just have to expect it and if it surprises you coming from some people, just wait it out and be patient with them. Your dad, well, sounds like a dick going in and a dick going out, sad to say.

Your mom, obviously, she is really dealing with it all more than anyone. She says she is "surprising you" right now with how she is handling things. ...this is all totally normal. Just appreciate that whatever relationship you had with your father, and especially that she understood that and sounds like she extended all capability to do her best, she had a different relationship with him. She's going to be terse and impatient because fear and grief are a hell of a fucking drug. It fucks you up.

Do what you can and be as honest as you can about everything without being too harsh on people. Every human is entitled to lose their shit a bit when dealing with the death, especially under such prolonged illness, with the way they tend to play out over year(s). And if you are all in agreement about these dynamics for a long time, then there's probably not a lot that will surprise you from here on out.

 

[foghorn67]

Be honest, but never cease. Unconditional love is a rare and valuable thing. If you want, I can give a relatable story. Wasn't my family, it was my best friends. I was there the whole time for several years. We spent hundreds of hours debriefing over whisky and beer and wasted the rest on tortilla chips and salsa. Ethnic, superstitious and sociopathic dad. But golly, did she ever stick with it.

 

[slackerinabox]

good lord, your dad sounds like a certain type of common Bay Area slumlord that I sometimes had to encounter.

It's taken me a long long time to realize that his methods are foolish and short sighted - I caught myself doing the same things but after many hard lessons being a landlord myself in Brooklyn NEVER cheap out on certain things... When my father was in the real throws of treatment I took over completely and it was a joy - renovated one place to perfection for thousands less than the budget I was given: brand new granite, highly rated appliances (squeezed a washer and dryer in, which was not thought possible), a dope fridge at 1/2 price, marble vanity, etc. - because I know quality doesn't need replacing. Gold foil expertly apply wall paper accent wall. Nest cameras all around, smart thermostats ...I even paid for the nest shit because I wanted it and I knew he'd frown on the purchase but now I know he plays with the apps daily .Anyways, I under promised and way over delivered. I already have the contacts and know my way around the process and my mom was floored by the success. Now that he's feeling better he completely put the breaks on the work I was doing on another spot, pooed my really meager $3,000 estimate for completion by licensed pros doing quality work and called some jackass to do the work for $1,000. Of course the project is at $4,000 now and counting because this jackass friend of the family ALWAYS under sells labor and over sells parts while finding "latent defects." My mom said she knows the contractor litereally steals supplies (orders much more than he needs and keeps an inventory), and my dad pretends to not notice. The contractor has done this act for 25 years but my dad always fall for in because he's called "Sir" and treated like family by him. All for cut rate work that fails immediately (the basement was renovated by this guy in 2018, the bathroom floors are all peeled- yes, vinyl sticker tiles in a bathroom.. and a sink needed to be replaced already). That's what's really frustrating, his method has a long history of failing. I've landlorded before, was briefly a PM (way too much work for the money, hahahah - sales has been more fun and profitable) and am good at this stuff, and he's awful at it...it's in his best interest to let me finish without stepping in. but i'm learning not to care... it's just like getting fired after doing a fantastic fucking job by your dad, for not cleaning up BETWEEN construction... bleh..

Anyway, what I can say from experience at this type of moment is that it doesn't really matter what kind of family dynamic you have going into it--people re going to lose control of their emotions a bit, at some point. It always happens. Could certainly be sustained by some individuals longer than others, but the nicest most patient people in your family might just flip out on someone. You just have to expect it and if it surprises you coming from some people, just wait it out and be patient with them. Your dad, well, sounds like a dick going in and a dick going out, sad to say.

Your mom, obviously, she is really dealing with it all more than anyone. She says she is "surprising you" right now with how she is handling things. ...this is all totally normal. Just appreciate that whatever relationship you had with your father, and especially that she understood that and sounds like she extended all capability to do her best, she had a different relationship with him. She's going to be terse and impatient because fear and grief are a hell of a fucking drug. It fucks you up.

Do what you can and be as honest as you can about everything without being too harsh on people. Every human is entitled to lose their shit a bit when dealing with the death, especially under such prolonged illness, with the way they tend to play out over year(s). And if you are all in agreement about these dynamics for a long time, then there's probably not a lot that will surprise you from here on out.

I'm going to chew on this more later. Thank you. My mom does this thing that's so maddening these days, so much so that my sister doesn't talk to them much anymore beyond formalities. I"ll spell out the sequence:
1. My dad starts shit out of nowhere
2. My mom supports him very passsively .. "oh, don't call. just let us die alone. it's fine."
3. we defend ourselves for my dad starting shit.
4. She claims this defense is abuse and no matter what our abuse our father love us
5. We say it's not abuse and that we're just standing up for ourselves
6. She starts with the literal "WHAT ARE YOU EVEN TALKING ABOUT!??! YOU"RE CRAZY YOU"RE BRINGING ALL THIS UP!" Like we're insane not recognizing that they started this cycle with step 1.

it's especially madenning for my sister .. they were pretty cruel to my sister growing up and my mom herself said some horrible stuff that for whatever reason she's chosen recently to confront my mom about. Instead of empathy her "you're insane, that never happened?!" act is just causing my sister more psychosis, so she's borderline estranged (his sickness has changed this, she send the occasional polite gift etc). She's at this point in her journey where she still expects justice or justification, so denial is especially cruel. I'm personally at that hard place where Im just realizing my parents loved their strict world order, arbitrary dated values, and selfish narcissism more than us, which has been sad but less maddening I guess. My shrink said the most macabre thing "You're sad with these realizations now, but having them now will make what's coming later easier. Trust me." That sounded so dark and sad at the time. When he was diagnoses I was imagining weekly visits with the kids (this was before the pandemic), board games, movie night. But their little battles and attitude ruined all that, which is sad

 

[slackerinabox]

Be honest, but never cease. Unconditional love is a rare and valuable thing. If you want, I can give a relatable story. Wasn't my family, it was my best friends. I was there the whole time for several years. We spent hundreds of hours debriefing over whisky and beer and wasted the rest on tortilla chips and salsa. Ethnic, superstitious and sociopathic dad. But golly, did she ever stick with it.

Can I ask the blunt question? Why was it worth it to her? I ask that every time they insult me when I'm just trying to help..