how does nintendo revolution controller work?

[her34]

details of new nintendo revolution controller have been released. it's just the wand controller and 2 sensors placed next to tv. yet it detects 3d motion, as well as twisting/rotating, and you can use it as a pointer (as in fps games). how do you think it works?

don't you need 3 sensors to localize an object in 3d space?



i can think of 2 ways they can do it

1) there's 1 detector inside the controller and 2 perpindicular tilt sensors (like in wario ware twisted)

2) there are 2 detectors inside the controller, 1 at top and 1 at bottom of controller


http://cube.ign.com/articles/651/651559p1.html

The remote-like peripheral... interacts with two motion sensors placed on the left and right sides of a user's television.

The sensors read the pointer's every move in real-time space. They can detect up, down, left and right motion, and also translate forward and backward depth.

Q: Won't potential light gun add-ons fail to work correctly with Revolution owners who use high-definition televisions?

A: No. Revolution's sensory technology does not interface with TV scan lines, as is the standard with traditional light guns. Because of that, light gun games are entirely possible with Revolution regardless of television type.

video of revolution controller in action: http://media.cube.ign.com/articles/651/651334/vids_1.html


how they did powerglove in past:
http://www.angelfire.com/ok2/stepinto/PowerGlovePage.html

The designers settled on two ultrasonic transmitters spaced about 3 inches apart on the glove above the knuckles, and two receivers on a 1 ft-long "L-bar" placed on the television's top.
.
"Each one of the receivers, or microphones, on the TV set has its own little stopwatch," explains Gentile. "We throw out a beep from the transmitters on the glove and clock them. When each of the microphones receives the signal, it stops the clock. Based upon the difference in time between when each of the microphones detects the beep, we use a triangulation formula to determine where the hand is in 3-D space."

http://www.gamesradar.com/news/default....id=2&articleid=37344&subsectionid=2504

How is movement of the controller detected?

We use Bluetooth technology to communicate between the controller and what we call a 'sensor bar', which has two little sensors on it that are maybe a foot apart. These sensors can be detached from the bar and they can be above the TV or below the TV - it doesn't really matter.

There's really no set-up other than just putting the bar by the TV. There's no calibration for size or type of TV or anything like that.

 

[BigfootsMonk]

u got an article on it? And are you sure it detects coordinates in a 3d coordinate system? Cuz when u aim in FPS games that's over a plane, which is 2d

 

[Shalmanese]

Uh, oops, I posted a similar thread just a few minutes after yours. I have a bit more detail about it in mine.

 

[corpseofworms]

I wouldn't believe it's 3D unless I saw it. That would mean you would not only have to move the controller up/down and left/right, but also kind of thrust it. And to answer your question, I'm guessing a large amount of triangulation is involved.

 

[BigfootsMonk]

[copy and pasted from the other thread]

Hey,

I searched for an article on the controller and from the little that I have read, it seems like all the position technology depends on the twists that you make with the controller. That's how it detects the positioning. Correct me if I'm wrong. So if it only detects twists there will always be acceleration. I think this might be something that takes a little learning to get used to like the control stick of the N64. And the stuff about fishing and baseball, it might not be as fun as it sounds. It might be like a swing with ur wrist but not a swing with ur arm. IDK. I'm just BSing with what I know.

 

[BigfootsMonk]

The video makes it seems like it detects position and not just the acceleration of the controller. Maybe it has to do with the angle it receives the signal from the controller

copy and pasted from IGN.com

Iwata speaking about Revolution controller
Iwata unveils Revolution controller
IGN will post high-resolution pictures, hands on impressions, feature breakdowns, roundtables, and more at 7:50 PM -- fewer than 15 minutes.
Revolution controller looks like futuristic television remote.
Glossy white design.
Looks Apple iPod inspired.
Controller is held in one hand. Attachments in the other.
Attachments connect to the bottom of the controller. Iwata shows analog stick attachment.
Sensors included with device are placed atop television. They detect movement.
Controller acts like a mouse in real-space 3D. Pefect for FPS games!
Thinking about packing Revolution with the main controller and attachment, Iwata says.
Future attachments planned.
Nintendo showed a video designed to higlight the features of the controller. Footage offers viewers a view from inside a television looking out. See people playing the Revolution controller.
Footage shows them using the device in various ways. Playing instruments. Cutting sushi. Making Mario jump by tilting the controller up. Slashing a sword. Using the remote as a light gun. Performing surgery. It showed an older couple conducting a concert with two remotes. Four girls catching bugs with remotes. Even showed a single person playing with two remotes.
Audience loved it.
No demos shown. However, Shigeru Miyamoto previewed tech demos to IGN behind-closed-doors. Read our full report on the front page.
Praise for Revolution controller from Hideo Kojima and Square Enix.

 

[BigfootsMonk]

I think its a combo of cheap gyro technology just to detect the MAGNITUDE of the vectors being inputed and then the direction is supplied by some sort of directional sensor

 

[Shalmanese]

Originally posted by: BigfootsMonk
Sensors included with device are placed atop television. They detect movement.

Hrmm... maybe they do have a flock-of-birds in there. Thats what it sounds like at least. I can't see them doing that for cheap though... and the position is only sub-cm which is still about 3x larger than ideal.

 

[BigfootsMonk]

Either way, I think there will be a lot of ways to "cheat" through those mini games in that video

 

[klah]

http://www.gamecubicle.com/news-nintendo_gyration.htm

From this post: http://episteme.arstechnica.com/groupee...7000735731/r/738001835731#738001835731

 

[her34]

http://www.gamesradar.com/news/default....id=2&articleid=37344&subsectionid=2504

We use Bluetooth technology to communicate between the controller and what we call a 'sensor bar', which has two little sensors on it that are maybe a foot apart. These sensors can be detached from the bar and they can be above the TV or below the TV - it doesn't really matter.

could the bluetooth signal receiver on the console serve as the third triangulation point?

There's really no set-up other than just putting the bar by the TV. There's no calibration for size or type of TV or anything like that.

no calibration for tv size?

 

[MrPickins]

I'm no expert in positions sensing, but I seem to do pretty good using only 2 inputs: my eyes. How are people able to triangulate a position using only those 2? Could the revolution controller work the same way?

 

[CycloWizard]

The term 'triangulate' - pinpointing the 2-dimensional coordinates of something - can be accomplished with only two sensors if the object that you're tracking is not collinear with the sensors. Thus, unless you're moving the object in the same plane as the two sensors, you can map it in a 2-d plane.

Originally posted by: MrPickins
I'm no expert in positions sensing, but I seem to do pretty good using only 2 inputs: my eyes. How are people able to triangulate a position using only those 2? Could the revolution controller work the same way?

Generally, your brain 'guesses' for depth perception. For example, if you have two photographs of a city with the appropriate shadows and such, then look at them both when they're a certain distance apart (angle depends on the angles at which the photos were taken), then your brain thinks it's seeing a real city and projects a 3-d image. I believe 'stereoscopic vision' is the relevant field for this.

 

[her34]

Originally posted by: CycloWizard
The term 'triangulate' - pinpointing the 2-dimensional coordinates of something - can be accomplished with only two sensors if the object that you're tracking is not collinear with the sensors. Thus, unless you're moving the object in the same plane as the two sensors, you can map it in a 2-d plane.

Originally posted by: MrPickins
I'm no expert in positions sensing, but I seem to do pretty good using only 2 inputs: my eyes. How are people able to triangulate a position using only those 2? Could the revolution controller work the same way?

Generally, your brain 'guesses' for depth perception. For example, if you have two photographs of a city with the appropriate shadows and such, then look at them both when they're a certain distance apart (angle depends on the angles at which the photos were taken), then your brain thinks it's seeing a real city and projects a 3-d image. I believe 'stereoscopic vision' is the relevant field for this.

i'm talking about 3d triangulation since the console/controller can detect 3d motion

 

[klah]

http://research.microsoft.com/~awilson/wand/default.htm :Q

last edited on 04/26/2004

The XWand hardware device includes a custom printed circuit board (PCB) with a variety of off-the-shelf sensors, including a 3-axis magnetometer, a 2-axis MEMS accelerometer, and a 1-axis piezoelectric gyroscope. The output of these sensors is collected and formatted by an onboard PIC microcontroller and passed to a 418MHz FM transceiver. A base station (not shown) receives data packets from the wand at about 50Hz, and passes the sensor readings to the host PC via RS-232. The wand also has 2 visible LEDs for feedback, a pushbutton for user input, and two IR LEDs for position tracking.

http://www.newscientist.com/article.ns?id=dn7890 :Q

23 August 2005

Sony?s new idea is to plug a webcam into the console, and give the gamer a handheld wand similar to a pocket flashlight. The wand has a battery, a few mouse-like buttons and several different coloured LEDs that can be switched on and off in various combinations.

By pressing the buttons and waving the wand towards the webcam, the gamer can click to shoot aliens, drag-and-drop images on screen and navigate menus.

The webcam is tuned to see only pure bright colours and map their motion in space, so it can ignore ordinary room lights. And if two people have wands with different coloured LEDs, they can play against each other.

Read about Sony?s gaming wand here (pdf format).