Originally posted by: joohang
Spanking is for the ignorant who are too lazy to properly parent their kids.
Pain is an incredibly efficient teaching tool. The right amount, of course.
nik
Pain is an incredibly efficient teaching tool. The right amount, of course.
nik
Or maybe you are merely seeing a reflection of yourself from datalink7's post.
He just made a statement without showing any sort of disrespect to the way other people were raised. You, on the other hand, clearly do.
Nah. Just seemed like he was throwing it back in his face. If you weren't spanked and you turned out to be fine, that in no way proves that spanking doesn't work.
nik
Originally posted by: ffmcobalt
Originally posted by: joohang
Spanking is for the ignorant who are too lazy to properly parent their kids.
Pain is an incredibly efficient teaching tool. The right amount, of course.
nik
Spanking and pain only made me feel oppressed and it retarded me from discovering myself. I was merely becoming what my father envisioned me to become. Not to mention that spanking often was a result of misunderstanding and miscommunication. It was also often a result of venting their frustrations and has a danger in believing that they are spanking and parenting even though they are clearly becoming child abusers.
I prefer my way of parenting and it doesn't involve spanking. It may look inefficient on the surface but it is an incredibly efficient way of encouraging kids from finding out what they want, asking for help when they have needs and avoiding miscommunications and unnecessary conflicts as much as possible.
Under this system, we ask. If my siblings get increasingly annoying, I don't yell at them. I ask them to be quiet. They say "Yes". Then if they do it again, I accuse them for being liars. It gives them a feeling of guilt. I also encourage them to blame themselves and look into themselves before blaming others. This worked beautifully as well. My brother takes video games a bit too seriously and gets all pissed off if I beat him. I could've yelled and spanked him to stop that but recently I merely asked him a couple of times to not do that and explained why he shouldn't. Then when he did it again, I turned off the game and said that I don't want to play games with liars. Now he no longer yells and he constantly keeps an eye on himself in case he gets too carried on.
It is all about communicating the message across to the kid. Spanking will only send them the message of pain.
I didn't spank my siblings once and I now yell at them far less (almost never do nowadays) and we are overall much much better. When they were in Korea, on the other hand, they were spanked and bossed around. They prefer their life here much better.
Spanking is efficient only in the sense that it involves very little thinking from the parents. It is efficiently ignorant.
Well, since that was just you, then all anyone can do is duely note your opinion. Just like they do with my opinion which greatly differs.
nik
nik
Okay, when I say spanking, there's more to it than just a few swings. It's sitting them down and explaining to them the difference between the right and the wrong. It's reinforcing pain with love and caring. Fscking beating a child gets you nowhere in any healthy direction. Punishment should <U>NEVER</U> be done out of anger or irritation. Only out of wisdom to help the young one learn what is right and what is wrong.
nik
nik
Originally posted by: joohang
Spanking is for the ignorant who are too lazy to properly parent their kids.
This is why so many "children" are becoming criminals before they reach 10
So then how should spanking be controlled, when should it be ideally used and how is it better than not spanking?
I am not completely against spanking, but I strongly believe that it should be the last measure to take should everything else fail.
I am not completely against spanking, but I strongly believe that it should be the last measure to take should everything else fail.
Well, I mostly agree. Spanking should be somewhat of a last resort. There's always chopping off a hand or something. I think I'd spank before going that far.
Yes, spanking is something that needs to come after other methods have failed. But, in this guy's case, his 18 month old is HITTING BACK and the guy doesn't have the freaking balls to stand up to his own daughter and tell her "NO!"nik
OK. That clarifies a lot then.
I still find it dangerous, though. Some people take the "pain with love and caring" crap a bit too far and end up beating up their children for "love". It could be because I rarely saw good results of spanking. Most spanking parents I saw just build up their frustrations and vent it all at once at the kid. Then when the kid does things wrong, they tolerate it for a while. And then they vent all of a sudden and beat the crap out of them. That's not parenting.
But then there are some kids who just won't fscking sit down and listen no matter how old they are. I haven't figured out if this is a result of poor parenting or some kids are born like that.
But in case of my siblings, they are fairly good at listening to me and taking me seriously, so spanking is unnecessary.
My guess is poor parenting. I have a 7 year old nephew who curses with the best and will fight you physicall over taking a bath/shower. Sometimes, spanking is necessary.
SagaLore
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- Dec 18, 2001
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I agree.
During a child's developmen they will test their boundaries to see how far they can push the envelop. The second child has nothing to do with her behavior - it's because she is 2. Around this age is when she learns what the rules are, who's the boss, etc. She doesn't have to "understand" anything, she will learning understanding when she is more mature (and this is not about her intelligence). When she is bad, you give her a little spanking - if you rarely do that, then she won't be expecting it. If she bites you, slap her. And when you want to spend time together, try to do it one-on-one occasionally, so she still feels important.
"Spanks" and a "slap in the face" will not harm your child, not psychologically, not emotionally, not physically. They learn respect - you said she was really smart so she'll learn it really fast - and then you won't have to do it anymore. But most importantly you have to discipline her at this age or it will get harder years from now. She just needs to know who her authority is... somebody mentioned a family being a "team", that's far from reality, there is no democracy in a family, you have a mother and a father who compromise to make decisions, and "raise" their kids, so you just need to remember you're the boss, not your pre-adolescent daughter. She's no boss until she's moved out of the house and paying her bills.
another spanking thread.
anyway, here's my 2cents worth take it or leave it.
i have 2 sons 5 yrs and 19 months and 1 daughter 28 months.
I love my kids dearly.
I believe that spanking is a necessary part of child rearing.
this kind of generalization if for the ignorant who are too lazy to properly parent their kids.
it is just as dangerous to take an absolute no spanking line as it is to take a physically abusive stand.
children learn behavior. you as a parent have a duty to guide the behavior they learn. parents have to establish boundaries for their kids. like it or not, the younger they are the less effective talking is. duuhh. i never spank my 5 yr old. don't need to, we have established the bounds of our relationship and with him only a few words are necessary. i sometimes spank my 28 month old, but she has learned to communicate very effectively and the only time i spank her is when she throws a tantrum and refuses to use her ability to communicate her desires thru words and does it with outlandish behavior, screaming hitting etc etc. there has definitely been a reduction of that type of behavior over the last 6 months, now before anyone jumps in here, she learned to talk VERY WELL, VERY EARLY.
my 19 month old still gets some spankings. he is learning tho and he is learning to talk. he communicates reasonably well now and as that ability to communicate thru words increases the need to communicate thru physical pain decreases.
the biggest mistake most parents make is to start spanking TOOO LATE, in this sense joohang is correct, spanking is for the lazy.
i believe that if you lay the groundwork at a VERY YOUNG age it is no longer necessary to spank by a certain age.
edit
finally, sorry about the long post. IF a parent hasn't used spanking as an effective means of communication by the age of say 3 or so, then it's TOOO LATE. to start spanking kids after they've reached that ability to communicate thru words pretty effectively is waay too late and will not be effective AT ALL.
one of the things that i hate most is seeing parents losing their tempers with children in public, children (5 or 6 yr old children) and because they can't reason with their children will resort to spanking. again, if they haven't instilled certain norms of behavior within their kids by that age, ITS TOO LATE TO DO IT WITH SPANKING.
anyway, here's my 2cents worth take it or leave it.
i have 2 sons 5 yrs and 19 months and 1 daughter 28 months.
I love my kids dearly.
I believe that spanking is a necessary part of child rearing.
this kind of generalization if for the ignorant who are too lazy to properly parent their kids.
it is just as dangerous to take an absolute no spanking line as it is to take a physically abusive stand.
children learn behavior. you as a parent have a duty to guide the behavior they learn. parents have to establish boundaries for their kids. like it or not, the younger they are the less effective talking is. duuhh. i never spank my 5 yr old. don't need to, we have established the bounds of our relationship and with him only a few words are necessary. i sometimes spank my 28 month old, but she has learned to communicate very effectively and the only time i spank her is when she throws a tantrum and refuses to use her ability to communicate her desires thru words and does it with outlandish behavior, screaming hitting etc etc. there has definitely been a reduction of that type of behavior over the last 6 months, now before anyone jumps in here, she learned to talk VERY WELL, VERY EARLY.
my 19 month old still gets some spankings. he is learning tho and he is learning to talk. he communicates reasonably well now and as that ability to communicate thru words increases the need to communicate thru physical pain decreases.
the biggest mistake most parents make is to start spanking TOOO LATE, in this sense joohang is correct, spanking is for the lazy.
i believe that if you lay the groundwork at a VERY YOUNG age it is no longer necessary to spank by a certain age.
edit
finally, sorry about the long post. IF a parent hasn't used spanking as an effective means of communication by the age of say 3 or so, then it's TOOO LATE. to start spanking kids after they've reached that ability to communicate thru words pretty effectively is waay too late and will not be effective AT ALL.
one of the things that i hate most is seeing parents losing their tempers with children in public, children (5 or 6 yr old children) and because they can't reason with their children will resort to spanking. again, if they haven't instilled certain norms of behavior within their kids by that age, ITS TOO LATE TO DO IT WITH SPANKING.
SagaLore
Elite Member
- Dec 18, 2001
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Not good.
Well, this might break your heart when you do it, but you're going to have to slap her face, hard enough so she feels it (and that it hurts!). If it's just a love tap then she won't feel that it's painful, then she'll just repeat it across your face.Anything you do still won't compare to the way kids were punished years ago - with belts, sticks, and paddles. Your child has it lucky even with a firm slap.
I agree. Spanking is quite often used inappropriately as the first resort rather than the last resort. It is often used as a convenience or simply because the parents do not know another form of discipline. Spanking is okay when used sparingly and appropriately. I have a 15 month old daughter and have never spanked her and I hope I never have to, but I will not think twice about it if I deem it necessary.
Of course I also feel the same about taking things away as punishment and time outs. Again, other forms of discipline that are used as a convenience and no less detrimental to the child as spanking is when used inappropriately. I prefer the real life method of discipline: suffering the responsibility of your actions. This requires a lot of communication and effort, and it of course has to be tempered with the learning process of the child, but in the long run I hope she'll grow up to be a responsible, caring adult and well prepared for the world.
actually, with my kids i found that it wasn't how hard i hit them, it was the realization that i disapproved and showed it throw spanking, eg. slap on the back of the hand, a flick on the forehead was usually enough to bring my kids to tears.
those tears weren't from physical pain but from parental disapproval.
I understand what your trying to say, but i disagree. i think parents should know which types of things deserve spankings and which don't. if i'm arguing with my child about what he/she is going to wear, well, either i can lose that argument or i convince him, spanking is DEFINITELY NOT APPROPRIATE.
If my older child hits the younger child, it is appropriate to show extreme disapproval, my children know that in our house spanking is the ultimate form of disapproval.
understand this, my spankings have never left my children with broken skin (obviously) or even welts. it is rare that the skin even gets red. it isn't how HARD i hit, but the fact that i've shown the EXTREME MEASURE OF DISAPPROVAL that is effective with my kids.
once again, it's how you've laid the groundwork. if you haven't established this ground work already, then it will just be too the kids that you lost your temper and your hitting because your bigger. this is different and not as effective.
i was spanked once as a child.
after that i learned to respect (or fear maybe, who knows?) my father.
i would never dream of disrespecting my parents now. but i dont know if thats because of that one spanking that made me realise i need to listen to my parents or if its because my parents treat me with respect.
i think spanking/hitting a child is a last resort sort of deal. i dont think i will ever spank my child but i dont see anything wrong with it to a degree.
i have no idea if you can take anything from this post, i do use the word i a lot even though this thread is about you.
but i do agree that this is not the place for kid advice.
*kat. <-- back and forth in her liberalism lately.
after that i learned to respect (or fear maybe, who knows?) my father.
i would never dream of disrespecting my parents now. but i dont know if thats because of that one spanking that made me realise i need to listen to my parents or if its because my parents treat me with respect.
i think spanking/hitting a child is a last resort sort of deal. i dont think i will ever spank my child but i dont see anything wrong with it to a degree.
i have no idea if you can take anything from this post, i do use the word i a lot even though this thread is about you.
but i do agree that this is not the place for kid advice.
*kat. <-- back and forth in her liberalism lately.
SagaLore
Elite Member
- Dec 18, 2001
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Your parents were blessed. :Q
It really depends on the environment, the situation, the family dynamic... you weren't a brat because you were lucky enough to mimick good examples of how your parents wanted to behave.
I suppose this does bring up a good point - perhaps the 2 year old child is hanging out with other 2 year olds with attitude problems... or maybe you're the one hanging out with someone that isn't a good influence.. or maybe it's the type of shows she watches? But that doesn't mean you shouldn't spank. It's basically "damage control".
SagaLore
Elite Member
- Dec 18, 2001
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Now, you're in a very interesting situation that calls for the type of teamwork you are suggesting. Your method works well especially since your not the parent, but a fellow sibling. But because it works for you, doesn't mean it will work for other family structures. Not everyone needs to spank, but some do. Teams won't always work, but they sometimes can.
Bottom line - - IT DEPENDS.
She's two, is being bad, it's time for a spanking.
Just wondering, but did your parents ever at anytime raise you kids? Do your younger siblings remember them? Were they already installed with a form of discipline? If you had them since they were still babies, then that's great your method of teamwork works - but if they were old enough to walk and talk then 100% of the congratulations can't go to you by default.
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