How do you justify (ethically) consuming animals and animal products when you don't need to?

[jaqie]

This thread may even surpass the bulk beef thread in posts...

 

[PieIsAwesome]

With barbecue sauce.

 

[Jeff7]

Originally posted by: jaqie
This thread may even surpass the bulk beef thread in postaliciousness...

It pales in comparison to others, such as the Ikariam thread.

 

[OdiN]

Originally posted by: thirtythree
So I'm in the process of going vegan. While I'm sure it would be less work not to be vegan, I haven't come across any arguments that would justify consuming animals when I don't need to. What do you think?

If we were not meant to be omnivores, we wouldn't have the teeth of omnivores. Meat is good for you.

By the way - if you want to be a vegan and not use anything made with animals - good luck. Here's a short list of some things for you to avoid:

Hide and Hair:
Sports Equipment - baseballs, soccer balls, gloves...
Glue
Leather Goods - Couches, shoes, luggage, jackets....
Paint Brushes

Bone, Blood, Horns, Hooves, and Gelatin (connective tissues):
Beverages - clarifies and extends shelf life
Confectionery - Ice cream, marshmallows, gel-based candy - Keeps sugar from crystallizing
Fire Extinguishing Foam
Frozen Foods - Prevents crystallization
Camera Light Filters
Mayonnaise - thickner and stabilizer
Vitamin Capsules - gel cap coating

Fats/Fatty Acids:
Candles
Soaps
Cosmetics - lipstick, face creams, (Stearic Acid helps retain moisture)
Many Cosmetics also contain dried red blood cells...
Crayons
Deoderant
Floor Wax
Hydraulic brake Fluid
Plastics
Rubber - tires, gloves, shoes, boots....
Shampoo
Shaving Cream

Antifreeze contains glycerol derived from animal fats
Asphalt contains a binding agent derived from beef fat

Pharmaceuticals:

Vitamin B-12
Insulin - treats high blood sugar
Chymotrypsin - promotes healing of burns and wounds
Collagen - used in plastic surgery
Cortisol - anti-inflammatory
Glucagon - treats low blood sugar



How do you justify trying to shove your views of what you think people should and should not eat down others throats?

 

[Atomic Playboy]

Originally posted by: OdiN
How do you justify trying to shove your views of what you think people should and should not eat down others throats?

I see what you did there...

 

[Aquaman]

Variety is the spice of life.

Cheers,
Aquaman

 

[0roo0roo]

Originally posted by: waffleironhead

Originally posted by: AgaBoogaBoo

Originally posted by: BladeVenom

Originally posted by: yowolabi
You have to work a lot harder, but you can get protein from plant sources. Vitamin B12 on the other hand only comes from animals.

And B12 deficiency causes brain damage, which explains animal rights activists.

Again, a whole country (India) till recent times has been mostly vegetarian, and they've been doing just fine.

Yep and they got B12 from either eggs or milk products. NOT vegetables.

yup, they are smart enough not to be vegans.

 

[Enig101]

Originally posted by: waffleironhead
I cry for all the bacteria and yeast that you daily destroy. At what level do you cease to care about living organisms?

This is my view. I carelessly slaughter microorganisms by the thousands each time I wash my hands. It seems very hypocritical to start feeling squeamish about killing animals because they are cute and fluffy.

 

[CrimsonChaos]

Do you realize these animals we "kill" are BRED by us. We are the ones who create these animals. If there were no demand for products that required animals, many of these animals would not have existed anyway. It's the same argument with trees these days. We actually plant and create acres and acres of trees in order to cut them down (for production purposes).

There are many plants and animals that are nearing extinction that humans do not consume. Our mere presence, exponentional growth, and industrial ways have created an environment that cannot sustain them. Therefore, every action you take that participates in the evolution of mankind is in fact killing plants and animals. How do you justify your actions that make you part of a species that indirectly (or directly) causes this type of destruction?

 

[sash1]

i'm a vegetarian

 

[moshquerade]

Originally posted by: OdiN

Originally posted by: thirtythree
So I'm in the process of going vegan. While I'm sure it would be less work not to be vegan, I haven't come across any arguments that would justify consuming animals when I don't need to. What do you think?

If we were not meant to be omnivores, we wouldn't have the teeth of omnivores. Meat is good for you.

By the way - if you want to be a vegan and not use anything made with animals - good luck. Here's a short list of some things for you to avoid:

Hide and Hair:
Sports Equipment - baseballs, soccer balls, gloves...
Glue
Leather Goods - Couches, shoes, luggage, jackets....
Paint Brushes

Bone, Blood, Horns, Hooves, and Gelatin (connective tissues):
Beverages - clarifies and extends shelf life
Confectionery - Ice cream, marshmallows, gel-based candy - Keeps sugar from crystallizing
Fire Extinguishing Foam
Frozen Foods - Prevents crystallization
Camera Light Filters
Mayonnaise - thickner and stabilizer
Vitamin Capsules - gel cap coating

Fats/Fatty Acids:
Candles
Soaps
Cosmetics - lipstick, face creams, (Stearic Acid helps retain moisture)
Many Cosmetics also contain dried red blood cells...
Crayons
Deoderant
Floor Wax
Hydraulic brake Fluid
Plastics
Rubber - tires, gloves, shoes, boots....
Shampoo
Shaving Cream

Antifreeze contains glycerol derived from animal fats
Asphalt contains a binding agent derived from beef fat

Pharmaceuticals:

Vitamin B-12
Insulin - treats high blood sugar
Chymotrypsin - promotes healing of burns and wounds
Collagen - used in plastic surgery
Cortisol - anti-inflammatory
Glucagon - treats low blood sugar



How do you justify trying to shove your views of what you think people should and should not eat down others throats?

great list!

 

[Iron Woode]

go ahead and eat whatever the hell you want.

Just don't come here and post a bunch of vegetarian/animal rights/environmentalist propaganda that we all know is just bullshit.

and your obvious lack of biological science knowledge is not helping you either.

Just stop now, before you make a bigger idiot of yourself.

 

[DrPizza]

Wow, 335 posts and this trolling thread is still going strong.

But, I guess everyone is simply feeding the troll to help supplement his vegan diet.

 

[BladeVenom]

Originally posted by: OdiN

Originally posted by: thirtythree
So I'm in the process of going vegan. While I'm sure it would be less work not to be vegan, I haven't come across any arguments that would justify consuming animals when I don't need to. What do you think?

If we were not meant to be omnivores, we wouldn't have the teeth of omnivores. Meat is good for you.

By the way - if you want to be a vegan and not use anything made with animals - good luck. Here's a short list of some things for you to avoid:

Pharmaceuticals:

Vitamin B-12
Insulin - treats high blood sugar
Chymotrypsin - promotes healing of burns and wounds
Collagen - used in plastic surgery
Cortisol - anti-inflammatory
Glucagon - treats low blood sugar



How do you justify trying to shove your views of what you think people should and should not eat down others throats?

Especially pharmaceuticals. Even if they don't use animals in the final product, all modern medicines have been extensively tested on animals.

Vaccines are made with animals. Without vaccines plagues could devastate populations.

Unless you live out in the middle of nowhere, and make everything you use, you are going to be using animal products.

 

[jaqie]

Who is that one woman? that second in command at PETA? she uses insulin which is partly made with animal products. Her justificiation? she has to use it so that she can be here to stop the rest of us from using animal products.

Can you say hypocryte?

 

[jaqie]

Originally posted by: DrPizza
But, I guess everyone is simply feeding the troll to help supplement his vegan diet.

He's eating spam?

 

[TallBill]

Because it fucking tastes good and fuels my body you moron. Why do you drink water?

 

[SirStev0]

Originally posted by: thirtythree

Originally posted by: SirStev0

Originally posted by: thirtythree
So I'm in the process of going vegan. While I'm sure it would be less work not to be vegan, I haven't come across any arguments that would justify consuming animals when I don't need to. What do you think?

I have a good amount of friends who went vegan or tried it out for a bit and none of them have ever been able to answer this question that has plagued me...

Can vegan's swallow? We are animals and it is an "animal product".

wrap your noogin around that one...

Man, your friends aren't very smart. Humans can give their consent for such things; animals cannot. It's fine to swallow.

I don't pretend to know the Vegan philosophy, but I didn't think non-consent had anything to do with it.

You can't get consent from a plant either.

 

[interchange]

Originally posted by: waffleironhead

Originally posted by: AgaBoogaBoo

Originally posted by: BladeVenom

Originally posted by: yowolabi
You have to work a lot harder, but you can get protein from plant sources. Vitamin B12 on the other hand only comes from animals.

And B12 deficiency causes brain damage, which explains animal rights activists.

Again, a whole country (India) till recent times has been mostly vegetarian, and they've been doing just fine.

Yep and they got B12 from either eggs or milk products. NOT vegetables.

Actually they probably get plenty from vegetables. Or at least the soil that the vegetables grow in. In the US, we're too cautious about washing our vegetables thoroughly to get any B12 the way that herbivores in the wild get it.

 

[mrSHEiK124]

Originally posted by: uberman
My cattle kept reproducing and eating all the grasses and hay. We had to kill some of them because there were too many.

I've been a cattle rancher and butcher and I enjoyed eating them. I also ate the eggs that my ducks would lay. They're great eggs just bigger than a chicken egg.

I like to eat bunnies too. They have no cholesterol.

Kill cattle: Grass keeps growing and the cows don't live in a unsanitary mud pit.

Don't kill cattle: The grass is eaten so that the cattle live in an unsanitary mud pit. They wallow in their own feces. They overpopulate and create crowded conditions in which disease flourishes.

How can you justify not killing cattle?

Man, bunnies are awesome. It's like chicken, but even LEANER.

 

[PlasmaBomb]

Originally posted by: Baked
What is the definition of animal? Everything you eat is a living organism, so your vegan ideal is a lie. I think it would be better if you just cut yourself and eat your own flesh and drink your own blood if you wanna go hardcore vegan.

Hardcore vegans should really learn photosynthesis.

 

[Iron Woode]

Originally posted by: interchange

Originally posted by: waffleironhead

Originally posted by: AgaBoogaBoo

Originally posted by: BladeVenom

Originally posted by: yowolabi
You have to work a lot harder, but you can get protein from plant sources. Vitamin B12 on the other hand only comes from animals.

And B12 deficiency causes brain damage, which explains animal rights activists.

Again, a whole country (India) till recent times has been mostly vegetarian, and they've been doing just fine.

Yep and they got B12 from either eggs or milk products. NOT vegetables.

Actually they probably get plenty from vegetables. Or at least the soil that the vegetables grow in. In the US, we're too cautious about washing our vegetables thoroughly to get any B12 the way that herbivores in the wild get it.

maybe you should look up vitamin B12 before posting stuff.

It doesn't come from plants or animals.

Vitamin B-12 cannot be made by plants or animals[5] as only bacteria have the enzymes required for its synthesis. The total synthesis of B-12 was reported by Robert Burns Woodward[6][7] and Albert Eschenmoser,[8][9] and remains one of the classic feats of organic synthesis.

also:

Finally, so-called Pseudo-B-12 refers to B-12-like substances which are found in certain organisms, including spirulina (a cyanobacterium) and some algae. These substances are active in tests of B-12 activity by highly sensitive antibody-binding serum assay tests, which measure levels of B-12 and B-12-like compounds in blood. However, these substances do not have B-12 biological activity for humans, a fact which may pose a theoretical danger to vegans and others on limited diets who do not ingest B-12 producing bacteria, but who nevertheless may show normal "B-12" levels in the standard immunoassay which has become the normal medical method for testing for B-12 deficiency.

also, if the bacteria required are in the soil and are on the vegetables, they can be absorbed. But that is not always the case, whether washed or not. Far easier would be to use a vitamin supplement.

 

[PlasmaBomb]

Originally posted by: thirtythree

Originally posted by: JM Aggie08
simply because this looks 1000x better than this

Biased sampling. What is that, boiled tofu? Who eats boiled tofu? I don't claim that these are the best examples of vegan cooking, but here are the first results on Google images:

Text
Text
Text
Text

Again, taste isn't really an ethical argument.

We have those too-
Chicken, broccoli and red pepper stir fry
Chocolate muffins (proper cakie ones with eggs)
Sausage and eggs with pancakes and toast (we can even add bacon :thumbsup
Duck spring rolls with asparagus

 

[interchange]

Originally posted by: Iron Woode

Originally posted by: interchange
Actually they probably get plenty from vegetables. Or at least the soil that the vegetables grow in. In the US, we're too cautious about washing our vegetables thoroughly to get any B12 the way that herbivores in the wild get it.

maybe you should look up vitamin B12 before posting stuff.

It doesn't come from plants or animals.

Vitamin B-12 cannot be made by plants or animals[5] as only bacteria have the enzymes required for its synthesis. The total synthesis of B-12 was reported by Robert Burns Woodward[6][7] and Albert Eschenmoser,[8][9] and remains one of the classic feats of organic synthesis.

And? I'm saying it comes from the bacteria in the soil.

Originally posted by: Iron Woode
also:

Finally, so-called Pseudo-B-12 refers to B-12-like substances which are found in certain organisms, including spirulina (a cyanobacterium) and some algae. These substances are active in tests of B-12 activity by highly sensitive antibody-binding serum assay tests, which measure levels of B-12 and B-12-like compounds in blood. However, these substances do not have B-12 biological activity for humans, a fact which may pose a theoretical danger to vegans and others on limited diets who do not ingest B-12 producing bacteria, but who nevertheless may show normal "B-12" levels in the standard immunoassay which has become the normal medical method for testing for B-12 deficiency.

also, if the bacteria required are in the soil and are on the vegetables, they can be absorbed. But that is not always the case, whether washed or not. Far easier would be to use a vitamin supplement.

[/quote]

No argument that it would be easier. But I was talking about members of a non-western society and saying that they probably get plenty from the soil they eat from non-washed vegetables. I can't prove this is how it works for those people. All B12 comes from those bacteria, whether it passes through another animal first or not (or if those bacteria inhabit the gut of those animals).

 

[meltdown75]

Wow this thread is long now, and I'm assuming just as delicious as yesterday!