How do we block people from tunneling under our new wall?

[alien42]

........the truth as you know it i'll accept.

fantastic, great to see you accept the fact that Obama was the toughest President on immigration from Mexico ever in the history of our great nation.

doesn't it feel good to acknowledge the truth instead of your usual lies?

Obama had so much dignity, respect, selflessness, all traits Trump is the polar opposite of.

 

[Jhhnn]

One of the more interesting things about all of this is that Trump voters mostly don't deal with immigrants at all, legal or otherwise.

http://static1.businessinsider.com/...a-lot-of-immigration-from-other-countries.jpg

http://static2.businessinsider.com/...ives-in-a-handful-of-super-dense-counties.jpg

Which roughly corresponds with Trump voters-

http://www.latimes.com/projects/la-...sults-by-county/static/margin_plus_breaks.png

What they know about immigrants is what they get from the media. Given their taste in such things all they see is scary shit.

Immigrants go to the jobs & that's basically not where Trump voters live.

 

[Murloc]

Well we could just put a bounty on each ones head and see how many people rise up to the occasion. If private citizens could earn a reward for catching them I'd bet that our return rate would skyrocket and it would serve to discourage those who might be contemplating an illegal crossing..

Some empowered neonazis could beat up perfectly legal cross-border commuters or visitors or even american citizenship with the excuse of apprehending them.

This should be left to uniformed police forces. Of course, volunteers for MONITORING (not arrest) of the border or reporting on illegal gathering spots inside the country (is there an app for that?) could always be used.

Have you ever researched what they do to immigrants crossing their southern border from south America?

the US can afford to hold itself to a decent standard.

 

[Puffnstuff]

Some empowered neonazis could beat up perfectly legal cross-border commuters or visitors or even american citizenship with the excuse of apprehending them.

This should be left to uniformed police forces. Of course, volunteers for MONITORING (not arrest) of the border or reporting on illegal gathering spots inside the country (is there an app for that?) could always be used.

I agree that the law should be upheld but since DHS is falling short they obviously need some help.

the US can afford to hold itself to a decent standard.

I never said they shouldn't. Rounding up illegals doesn't have to be abusive in nature but it has to be done.

 

[Jhhnn]

I agree that the law should be upheld but since DHS is falling short they obviously need some help.

Which doesn't explain the reduction in the number of illegal immigrants in this country at all.

I never said they shouldn't. Rounding up illegals doesn't have to be abusive in nature but it has to be done.

Why does it need to be done? ~2/3 of illegal immigrants have been here 10 years or more indicating that they've integrated well, not to mention that they have millions of American citizen children who would basically be deported with them.

http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2016/11/03/5-facts-about-illegal-immigration-in-the-u-s/

Not to mention that they have little to no effect on the lives of people living in Trump country.

 

[imported_tajmahal]

fantastic, great to see you accept the fact that Obama was the toughest President on immigration from Mexico ever in the history of our great nation.

doesn't it feel good to acknowledge the truth instead of your usual lies?

Obama had so much dignity, respect, selflessness, all traits Trump is the polar opposite of.

I'm just glad he's out of power. I know i'll have to put up with his narcissistic blather and pointless emoting for the next few years, but who cares? The asshole is gone and he pretty much destroyed the Democratic party during his 8 years in power.

 

[Muse]

Of course, the answer is, you don't. They tunnel effectively already, it would be moreso with a new wall. There will be tunnels.

 

[imported_tajmahal]

Of course, the answer is, you don't. They tunnel effectively already, it would be moreso with a new wall. There will be tunnels.

Go back to the old days of sappers. Ought to be great fun.

 

[sdifox]

Have you ever researched what they do to immigrants crossing their southern border from south America?

What are you referring to? The Israeli West Bank wall that somehow got moved to Mexico?

 

[Puffnstuff]

What are you referring to? The Israeli West Bank wall that somehow got moved to Mexico?

In context we were speaking purely of Mexico.

 

[mxnerd]

Unfinished US-Mexico border wall is a costly logistical nightmare in Texas

Finishing the some 1,300 miles of fencing proposed in the state is daunting since most border land is privately owned and materials alone could cost $10bn

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news...-us-mexico-border-wall-texas-secure-fence-act

 

[Puffnstuff]

Unfinished US-Mexico border wall is a costly logistical nightmare in Texas

Finishing the some 1,300 miles of fencing proposed in the state is daunting since most border land is privately owned and materials alone could cost $10bn

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news...-us-mexico-border-wall-texas-secure-fence-act

I can solve that for you with two words: Eminent Domain

 

[MongGrel]

I'm just glad he's out of power. I know i'll have to put up with his narcissistic blather and pointless emoting for the next few years, but who cares? The asshole is gone and he pretty much destroyed the Democratic party during his 8 years in power.

Can you actually post that and be serious

 

[MongGrel]

I can solve that for you with two words: Eminent Domain

I guess your down with building a useless wall and dumping it on peoples property for no reason then ?

If Texas was so worried about it they should have done it long before now.

 

[Puffnstuff]

I guess your down with building a useless wall and dumping it on peoples property for no reason then ?

If Texas was so worried about it they should have done it long before now.

The Don has spoken.
http://constitution.findlaw.com/amendment5/annotation14.html

 

[sdifox]

In context we were speaking purely of Mexico.

So was I. Mexican farm hands come up to USA, Guatemalan ones go to Mexico.

http://www.snopes.com/mexico-guatemala-border/

 

[mxnerd]

I can solve that for you with two words: Eminent Domain

I guess Mexico will pay for it according to Trump?

 

[Victorian Gray]

Well we could just put a bounty on each ones head and see how many people rise up to the occasion. If private citizens could earn a reward for catching them I'd bet that our return rate would skyrocket and it would serve to discourage those who might be contemplating an illegal crossing..

Maybe you guys could set up a system like this:

http://www.spiegel.de/international...ance-went-far-beyond-the-stasi-a-1042883.html

 

[Murloc]

the fact that they weren't expelled means the was lax enforcement in the past, of course if they're going to change it and make it strong again and abolish sanctuary cities and what not, they should explore an amnesty for those who have always held jobs and have been in the US for longer than 10 years and have no criminal record and have american children, but it's not a god-given right they have, they know they've been living in the US illegally.
Actually the fact that illegals can have american children is just weird too. That should be fixed as part of the package as well.

Grandfathering in the older illegals, and cleaning up the act for the future, meaning strong enforcement with immediate arrest and deportation if identified, no birthright etc. would be the most humane way to go about it.

The stasi accusations are overblown, the problem with the stasi is that it was an instrument of dictatorship. Reporting on breachers of democratically estabilished laws would not be on the same level at all. Calling the police when you see a crime does not make you a stasi snitch, it's expected behaviour. This is like accusing someone who doesn't want immigration to be literally hitler. It's intellectual abuse.
His absurd proposal of letting citizens catch illegals is blackshirt level stuff which is even worse than stasi surveillance.

Eminent domain still means spending money to compensate land owners, too expensive.
Ad-hoc flexible solutions in the difficult areas of the border, with surveillance, collaboration with land owners etc. depending on the situation, would be a better way of going about it.

 

[John Connor]

How do we block people from tunneling under our new wall?


I wrote a four page letter to Trump on this and I told him I wanted to see a wall ten years ago. I also told him we need technology as well. That means drones with FLIR, more border guards, federal mandated E-verify and with that we can use vibration detectors.

Lets face it. It's gonna be a hell of a lot harder to tunnel under and not get caught (eventually) then it is to walk right on over with drugs, etc. The wall is needed and should have been done many, many years ago. Besides, Israel has a wall and it works...

 

[BoomerD]

So was I. Mexican farm hands come up to USA, Guatemalan ones go to Mexico.

http://www.snopes.com/mexico-guatemala-border/

But they don't stay in Mexico. The area where I live is chock full of Guatemalans...some legal, some illegal.

Possibly more Guatemalans than "real" Mexicans.

 

[John Connor]

And I hear if caught they serve a ten year prison sentence.

 

[compuwiz1]

The world monitors seismic activity. Tunnel monitoring shouldn't be that great a task. Getting over the wall should be easy, until you figure out how the gauntlet of death causing instruments awaits on the other side, including shoot to kill orders. Any enemy invader would be warned, then shot down. When trespassing becomes a crime punishable by death, upon sight, probably won't be many folks willing to risk it. You only have to make an example out of a couple, then it stops.

 

[trenchfoot]

Ah yes, "The Wall". The very comforting and bigot pleasing costly wall that is so much more of the vote-getting distraction that it was always meant to be.

Never mind that it will be nothing more than a very expensive monument to the absurdity that building a wall will keep out those more than desperate, distraught and destitute souls who want to hook up with those American employers who are more than willing to break the law in order to turn the sweat of those illegals into higher profits for themselves.

By all means, build that wall. And a couple of years after it's built, let's go check the stats on illegal immigration and see if that wall actually stemmed the flow of illegals like the GOP fear and hate mongers and Trump said it would, at least to the point where the cost of building, maintaining and "making improvements" to it was arguably justified.

And by then we'll also know if Trump actually got the Mexicans to pay for it too, ha-ha. Oh, and we'll also know how badly affected those businesses who relied on the slave labor those illegals provided for them was. I can see these business folks screaming at their bought and paid for legislators and at Trump himself for how badly their bottom lines got hit. But really, these patriotic business folks are going to make absolutely certain that their source of dirt cheap illegally sourced labor is not going to get affected at all.

Trump, himself a critter of the same odor and habit as those big business folks who readily exploit the illegal labor market knows not to mess with a good thing, and he will make sure that "That Wall" will have enough holes and revolving doors in it to keep his business buddies happy.

 

[K1052]

The world monitors seismic activity. Tunnel monitoring shouldn't be that great a task. Getting over the wall should be easy, until you figure out how the gauntlet of death causing instruments awaits on the other side, including shoot to kill orders. Any enemy invader would be warned, then shot down. When trespassing becomes a crime punishable by death, upon sight, probably won't be many folks willing to risk it. You only have to make an example out of a couple, then it stops.

Major legal and ethical issue aside, what you describe would cost tens of billions annually to maintain.