(How) Do divining rods work?

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sao123

Lifer
May 27, 2002
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How large was the area he was in where he was looking for those items ? If you divided that area into a grid how many areas would there be that contained something you wanted vs areas that did not ?
Probability often is at work .


Of those things I know for a fact that the gas lines and the water lines are on file with county records. It is a federal offense to have gas mains buried and in use and not have them mapped.

I would hope someone involved in construction would know about these people:
http://www.call811.com/state-specific.aspx

Again...
1)PA one call isnt going to know where our private lines and conduits are.
2)this wasnt a digging project, it was a rewiring project.
 

Evadman

Administrator Emeritus<br>Elite Member
Feb 18, 2001
30,990
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Seriously sao123, Diving rods don't do squat. There is no technique except the techniques of a con artist. Be happy this guy wasn't trying to con you out of your wallet, because it sounds like you would have not only given him your wallet, but the deed to your house.
 

silverpig

Lifer
Jul 29, 2001
27,708
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100&#37; BS. There is no reason for them to work, and all tests show people can only do it as accurately as expected given random chance.

My old boss used to use them on the golf course. He often found what he was looking for, but he had the plans for the irrigation system in his office, and you could guess where the lines were by drawing a straight line between sprinkler heads.

I tried it out of curiosity a few times there when I was looking for a pipe. Spent all freaking afternoon walking back and forth, digging 4 foot holes wherever the stupid rods crossed and didn't find shit. Yes they crossed but it was likely due to wind or an imbalance in the rods themselves or how I was holding them. Only when I did a methodical search based on a best guess and a straight line across where it had to be did I find the pipe. Oh yeah, and boss man divined me into digging a bunch of empty holes too.
 

sao123

Lifer
May 27, 2002
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No, they appeared to work.

Your private lines on state property?
I am an assistant manager in the IT Office in a state government organization. By "our" private lines I mean the states... my office...my lines.

the data, phone, and television come into the complex at the main demarc location. how they get distributed to the rest of the campus 13 buildings in all, is not owned, run, mapped, or in any way affiliated with the public phone, cable, or internet companies. We have our own wires run in our own underground conduits, pulled by our own contracted certified wiring contractors.



So then apparently i have to go redo all the work I did on friday. The missing 4 inch conduits we located and traced, must obviously not be the ones we were looking for even though their beginning and ends are now located and we put a pull string in them.

Hard to believe that guy could show up with no prior knowledge of the place. I showed him a known end of capped conduits in the ground, and within a few hours we tracked down where each one went and where the other ends of them were, even though none of them were visible to sight and with a tool which according to you guys doesnt work.
 
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sao123

Lifer
May 27, 2002
12,639
197
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Seriously sao123, Diving rods don't do squat. There is no technique except the techniques of a con artist. Be happy this guy wasn't trying to con you out of your wallet, because it sounds like you would have not only given him your wallet, but the deed to your house.
Hardly, since the guy wasnt getting paid for anything. Hard to get paid for a free service.
 
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Aluvus

Platinum Member
Apr 27, 2006
2,913
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I am an assistant manager in the IT Office in a state government organization. By "our" private lines I mean the states... my office...my lines.

the data, phone, and television come into the complex at the main demarc location. how they get distributed to the rest of the campus 13 buildings in all, is not owned, run, mapped, or in any way affiliated with the public phone, cable, or internet companies. We have our own wires run in our own underground conduits, pulled by our own contracted certified wiring contractors.
You describe them as "private" implying that their location is proprietary information that no one outside your organization could have. And yet, as a government entity, that is quite unlikely.

Hard to believe that guy could show up with no prior knowledge of the place.
I think it has been repeatedly suggested that he most likely had prior knowledge of the place.

Hardly, since the guy wasnt getting paid for anything.
Uh...

One of the structural engineers who was assigned to the project
You also previously implied that he was a contractor. Does he work for free?
 

sao123

Lifer
May 27, 2002
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You describe them as "private" implying that their location is proprietary information that no one outside your organization could have. And yet, as a government entity, that is quite unlikely.



I think it has been repeatedly suggested that he most likely had prior knowledge of the place.



Uh...



You also previously implied that he was a contractor. Does he work for free?

lets start from the beginning, since instead of answer the questions all you try to do is pick apart my story because you think he is a fraud.

13 buildings on a campus, each wired for phone and data fed from the main building from underground conduit. in order to get to each building, instead of placing new conduits, they were chained from other nearby buildings.

A to B to C to D etc.
A to E to F to G etc.

conduits crisscross all across the campus since buildingere were built at different times in the last 30 years. Some conduits were abandoned in favor of newer ones, but never removed. Labels are gone (if they were ever labeled i nthe first place)... and complete blueprints DO NOT EXIST. the only actual recent blueprints were lost or destroyed 3 years ago.

the most recent drawings are about 15 years old, and mostly show abandoned conduits which were replaced or abandoned due to new buildings being built, others torn down, repaving, etc.

this contractor was called out to assist us in determining a path to wire all the buildings for a new cable TV service. the change to digital has left the old cable tv infrastructure substandard and unusable.

i have to then map the installation conduits and provide plans to the cable installer.
So... only knowing where the beginning and end of the conduits are... (not knowing which beginnning matched which ending, nor if the conduit is only half remaining/partially removed/dead)... we walked back and forth across the entire area, marking an X every time we crossed something, and finally traced where the conduits go.

you might say, well thats easy, but its not because, our conduits criss cross, feed off of not the most adjacent building, etc. in one instance, 2 buildings each 10 feet apart, but the cable between those 2 buildings, passes through a building about 50 feet away, becasue of the order they were built.



the reason the guy works for free is this:
(this is how many government contracts/contractors work)
I low-bid a contract, for 3-5 years of work of some manner in your field.
Example: Plumber.
the contract stipulates, we pay you the lump sum of money up front for the entire contract, and you are responsible to do all the work necessary for the duration of the contract.

You get X million dollars upfront if we call you to replace 1 toilet in the 5 years, or the same X million dollars upfront if i call you to come out every day for 5 years and move a sink 3 inches to the right . its a flat rate contract. So once the guy has the contract... there is no payment. Its just free.
 

sao123

Lifer
May 27, 2002
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this thread appears to be going nowhere... so if anyone wants to actually discuss the subject at hand... ill be on OT.
 

Red Squirrel

No Lifer
May 24, 2003
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I've always wondered this as well, the only thing I can think of is that it works kinda like geologic surveys or uses similar principles.

What exactly are the rods made of, and is there anything special to it, like do they need batteries or have any type of electronics in/on them? Or is there any kind of prep work to the ground before hand, like some kind of equipment that is placed?
 

sao123

Lifer
May 27, 2002
12,639
197
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I've always wondered this as well, the only thing I can think of is that it works kinda like geologic surveys or uses similar principles.

What exactly are the rods made of, and is there anything special to it, like do they need batteries or have any type of electronics in/on them? Or is there any kind of prep work to the ground before hand, like some kind of equipment that is placed?

It is a pair of L shaped rods of steel or copper. no electronics no batteries or any other equipment.
 

Gibsons

Lifer
Aug 14, 2001
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I've experienced dowsing rods twisting in my hands. It was pretty creepy.

I was at a new jobsite and the plumber handed me the rods and told me how to use them. He had me walk around for a minute while he unloaded his truck. At some point they crossed, I could feel a force being applied to them, and I marked the spot on the ground with a piece of lumber.

He took me about a hundred feet away to an open trench and showed me the end of a 1" PEX water line that headed directly to the spot I marked and continued directly on to the water meter cover at the street.

I had no idea what I was looking for or if there was even anything there to find. It was in a freshly graded area that I had never seen before. For some reason the rods crossed on there own at a spot over a water line buried 4' below the surface.

I don't know what any of it means other than I experienced something that many other people think is BS.
If you can really do this, there's a million dollar prize waiting for you. srsly.
 

Gibsons

Lifer
Aug 14, 2001
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It is a pair of L shaped rods of steel or copper. no electronics no batteries or any other equipment.
If he or you can reproduce this under controlled circumstances, there's a million dollar prize for it.

Not to mention BILLIONS for finding untapped oil reserves.
 

Mr. Pedantic

Diamond Member
Feb 14, 2010
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If you can really do this, there's a million dollar prize waiting for you. srsly.
http://www.randi.org/site/index.php/1m-challenge.html


And there are several more like it, as far as I know.
we have many field theorys and applications, we have the entire electromagnetic field spectrum... and gravity... What makes you think that such a device is impossible to work? just because something is called divine, what makes you think it has to be some faux spiritual device? if you can find 1 or 2 things correctly, that could be considered coincidence. But a dozen? two dozen? At what point do you believe in the reliability of results?
You're looking in the wrong field. Try psychology.
 

wuliheron

Diamond Member
Feb 8, 2011
3,536
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That site is both sad and hilarious.
Why someone would agree to a scientific evaluation while knowing they are a con is beyond my comprehension.
You have to put it in context. The famous physicist John Wheeler argued that the AAAS should revoke the membership of psychic researchers, but they refused. These people want to believe and even a lot of scientists want to believe. They want to believe so badly they'll find any excuse to dismiss any number of scientific studies and they have nothing to loose by being able to associate their cause with serious research.
 

Mr. Pedantic

Diamond Member
Feb 14, 2010
5,039
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That site is both sad and hilarious.
Why someone would agree to a scientific evaluation while knowing they are a con is beyond my comprehension.
Some of them aren't cons; they really believe that they are the real deal; for example, a lot of Ouija practitioners believe they are the real deal because of the ideomotor effect (coincidentally, the same is true of diviners and dowsers). The prize used to be open without any qualification, but they had way too many people that were just nuts, so they made it so people now have to qualify.
 

Matt1

Junior Member
Oct 17, 2012
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I know this is a little late and I can't help you with an explanation as to why they work only that I have had experience of them working. My grandad managed to find the foundations of a building with no knowledge or even evidence of it above ground simply by using these rods, an archeologist who was skeptical that they worked asked him to find it to see if they worked and they did perfectly.
I have also used them to find drains and they work even finding drains that we never even expected to be there. They work without doubt but no clue why
 

sm625

Diamond Member
May 6, 2011
8,172
136
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Isnt it amazing how many people think they "just know" that something is bs, without any actual understanding themselves of what is going on? I see this kind of attitude on display across multiple unrelated disciplines. Why do people just blindly accept everything they is taught in their very limited government (re)education centers? Much of what is taught in public schools is dead flat wrong. From plate tectonics to the most basic properties of matter, its just wrong.
 

Gibsons

Lifer
Aug 14, 2001
12,528
30
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Isnt it amazing how many people think they "just know" that something is bs, without any actual understanding themselves of what is going on?
and yet...
Much of what is taught in public schools is dead flat wrong. From plate tectonics to the most basic properties of matter, its just wrong.
Again, there's a million dollars waiting for anyone that can successfully use divining rods in a controlled test. Many have tried.
 

videogames101

Diamond Member
Aug 24, 2005
6,777
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Isnt it amazing how many people think they "just know" that something is bs, without any actual understanding themselves of what is going on? I see this kind of attitude on display across multiple unrelated disciplines. Why do people just blindly accept everything they is taught in their very limited government (re)education centers? Much of what is taught in public schools is dead flat wrong. From plate tectonics to the most basic properties of matter, its just wrong.
Do you understand burden of proof? Here and Here

You claim something works without any explanation as to how, and despite multiple double blind tests showing me that you're full of shit, you still think the problem is ME? The problem is that I don't know whats going on?

:confused:

Plate tectonics is dead wrong? Hmm... what properties of matter are dead wrong? Where's my tin foil hat...
 

GWestphal

Golden Member
Jul 22, 2009
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Divining water/oil/etc, I have no idea how that could feasibly work. But divining a current carrying wire, that I could see working if your built up a significant charge on the rods and them being repelled or attracted to the live wire. But at more than a few inches I'd imagine the forces were talking about would be minuscule.
 

SMOGZINN

Lifer
Jun 17, 2005
13,615
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Divining water/oil/etc, I have no idea how that could feasibly work. But divining a current carrying wire, that I could see working if your built up a significant charge on the rods and them being repelled or attracted to the live wire. But at more than a few inches I'd imagine the forces were talking about would be minuscule.
One of the problems with dowsing or divining rods is that the practitioners claim to be able to find just about anything. A building foundation, water, empty PVC pipes, oil, bombs, drugs (of any type), human remains (specifically! it doesn't find any other animal remains, just human!).

And not only can it find something, it can distinguish the difference between a empty PVC pipe and one with flowing water!

Really, there is no natural explanation for this. If you believe in divining rods you are believing in magic.
 

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