This is the crux of the discussion, isn't it? Here are some of the reasons (in my mind). Since guns are so prevalent in society a good portion of people have them.
People are known to do stupid things under the right circumstances. Everyone has a breaking point or a set of buttons that can be pressed to where they do things less than rational (road rage is an example).
If they have easy access to guns, then those stupid things have the potential for being escalated. There are a ton of murders every year that were crimes of passion that would probably have been less serious had the there been no guns around. At a minimum, people are less likely to die from other wounds than they are from gun shot wounds. Ideally, the person comes to their senses before commiting any crime.
Without easy access to guns, those stupid things are just that stupid.
This is exacerbated by people's mentality to "one up". If criminals knew that almost no one had guns, then they would be less likely to carry them and would be less likely to feel the need to use them if they did carry them.
This doesn't account for the crimes that would never have occured if guns weren't readily available.
I'm not. I'm just trying to rationalize how or why someone is killed accidently in the house with a gun. Since we know no one would willingly walk into a room with someone who had a gun pointed at them with the intention of using it. There has to be some reason. I'm just trying to determine what it is.
Amused
Elite Member
- Apr 14, 2001
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That's an awfully big assumption. First, that the crimes wouldn't be committed, and second that there is any law or ban you could pass that could possibly keep criminals from taking advantage of a simple 500 year old technology.
Does your ass hurt after pulling that whopper out of it?
The US has banned drugs, spent trillions of dollars fighting their use, manufacture and distribution and have slowly erroded our rights... and we still have a wide spread drug problem. A drug problem so bad, a school child can get drugs easier than they can get tobacco or alcohol.
It's fairy tale thinking to believe that more laws or outright bans will stop criminals from obtaining guns.
Drugs are addictive. They make people feel good when they take them and then they are habit forming. A lot of people cannot stop taking drugs once they start.
These items are not even close.
Not really. Look at a country like Canada where guns are restricted. Per capita, the murder rate is a ton lower. There are other factors involved, but lack of easy access to guns is a prime contributor.
Again the people who want to commit crimes are going to do so anyway. It's the people who lose their head, go grab their gun and then do something they wouldn't have normally done.
Amused
Elite Member
- Apr 14, 2001
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An illogical assumption. Correlation does not prove causation. Switzerland has less restrictions than the US and even allows ex-militia members to keep their fully auto military rifles, yet has a smaller murder rate than Canada. Same with Israel.
Good GAWD your ass must be on fire!
Still in fairy tale land, I see. The vast majority of criminals are repeat offenders.
Until you address the will to kill, you wont make any headway in this. All gun laws will do is disarm law abiding citizens... creating an open season on them.
If he knows you don't have a gun, he will do whatever the hell he wants since he knows you are unarmed but he is.
Further, someone who just wants to steal stuff isn't going to risk becoming a murderer when he can just run away and hit someone else.
No, one is NOT too many. Every year, at least ONE person is killed on stairs, by cars, by drinking DRANO, with someone's bare hands, with a pencil, etc, etc, etc. PEOPLE DIE. This is a fact of life. You can ban everything in the world that could possibly kill someone and people would STILL BE KILLED!
Are you nuts? Do you truly believe this? A criminal is going to say "Well since no homeowner is armed, I don't need to be..."
That's the stupidest thing I will hear anyone say all day, and it's only 9:30AM.
A criminal is going to say "If no homeowner is armed, if I come armed, I'll be able to do whatever I please!"
Not if that one is you. I'll gladly trade one accidental death for the millions of crimes prevented each year by the use of guns.
Amused
Elite Member
- Apr 14, 2001
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Yes. But "too many" is not enough to take away my freedom. It IS enough to actively educate people on gun safety.
If we took away freedoms because people died, we'd all live in bubble suits inside padded rooms. Denying people their freedom is NOT the way to save lives.
Actually, I think last time there was a long gun debate, someone pulled up the mortality stats of gunshots vs. sta[/b]bings, and if you are attacked with a knife you are more likely to die than if someone shoots you. Mainly because most people have no idea how to shoot... look at the guy who shot 50 cent (just an example that most people have heard about)... he emptied the clip out of his 9mm from a distance of no more than 5 feet, hit him 9 times... and didnt kill him. If you st[/b]ab someone with a knife, it's easier to have no idea wtf you are doing and kill them, since there is no limit on how many times you can st[/b]ab them in a row (except practicality), and just about every vital organ is 4" or less from the skin. Anyway, if someone wants to look up the stats to confirm it (or disprove it, this is an IIRC), please do so... I'm off to class.
Here we go again. My death has been remarked a few times in this thread. This is exactly the mentality guns in society promotes.
Your comments are living proof of why guns in society are bad!
Someone who has spent his life in a country with so many violent, armed criminals will never believe this. However, there are countries outside of your borders where people are not in constant fear for their lives when on the streets of the largest cities.
I am done. As is typical America, there are too many outspoken, egocentric people in this thread. You guys can keep your guns and all the negativity that goes with them.
Remember fewer rights does not always result in a lower quality of life.
Remember fewer rights does not always result in a lower quality of life.
There's only one person here who is in constant fear of something. There is no crime-free society, guns or not. There is no murder-free society, guns or not.
The only thing I'm scared of is gun-control ninnies trying to erode my constitutional rights. I don't even OWN a freaking gun, I'm just against people re-writing the constitution out of their own irrational fears.
I would have to say the guy saying "I don't like guns so NO ONE should like guns" is the outspoken egotist. Fewer rights does result in a lower quality of life. One's rights should only end where the rights of others begin.
Linflas
Lifer
- Jan 30, 2001
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Doggone it what do you know we aren't #1 for total crime.
I think if I lived in one of the "top 10" I might worry a bit more about my own crime problem rather than US gun laws.
JulesMaximus
No Lifer
- Jul 3, 2003
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This is the most ridiculous mess of assumtions I've ever read. Where did you learn these "facts"? Off the HCI website?
The last assumption takes the cake. Look at the cities and countries with the worst violent crime. They tend to have the strictest gun control laws. How do reconcile that fact?
Linflas
Lifer
- Jan 30, 2001
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But that is really a function of how they are raised. Kids raised with discipline generally listen to what they are told. When I was a kid we did not have anything other than toy guns in our house but many of my friends parents had guns. We knew better than to ever mess with them even when we were alone in the house because it was something instilled at a very early age.
Vic
Elite Member
- Jun 12, 2001
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No, immaturity is only quoting a portion of my previous post in order to obscure the argument and make yourself look better.
What you said was that, in less than 100 years, humans had evolved beyond the need for firearms. And what I asked was why you were insulting us with such bullsh!t. Evolution cannot work on a population sample of hundreds of millions or even billions in only 3-4 generations and (unless you're a complete idiot) you should know this. So why have you been insulting us with these obvious lies? Which is why you deserve to be insulted.
Now, is that clear? Or do I need to draw you a picture?
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