How bad is the 6800's video issue?

[NotoriousJTC]

I gotta get up and running with a new video card ASAP... So ive been doing research the past 2-3 hours and it looks like the Geforce 6800 is right about where i need to be in terms of price/performance. Then i stumble upon this news that the card has some sort of major problem with the video processing.


I use this computer to watch a lot of media. Movies, TV eps, etc... In many varying formats, Divx/Xvid, wmv, mpeg1/2, etc. Does this problem effect any of that?

 

[Dahak]

The video processing issue would affect those formats that you have listed, but seeing as it has no been enabled yet I would not have any conser for it. All it was its to help off load the work that the cpu will be doing when Encoding(creating). Has nothing to do with decoding (playing)

It's still a awsome card

 

[Zucarita9000]

I use this computer to watch a lot of media. Movies, TV eps, etc... In many varying formats, Divx/Xvid, wmv, mpeg1/2, etc. Does this problem effect any of that?

Go with ATI then. ATI had always had superior video performance, as Matrox does. An All-In-Wonder Radeon X800 would be a great choice if you do a lot of video.

 

[NotoriousJTC]

Originally posted by: Dahak
The video processing issue would affect those formats that you have listed, but seeing as it has no been enabled yet I would not have any conser for it. All it was its to help off load the work that the cpu will be doing when Encoding(creating). Has nothing to do with decoding (playing)

It's still a awsome card

That takes a load off of my mind. Thanks.

I primarily decode and do very little encoding (usually resampling), but what did you mean by, "not been enabled yet" ? This isn't a "feature" that is on 24/7? If i were attempt an encode before it was enabled would it work without problems?

 

[NotoriousJTC]

Originally posted by: Zucarita9000

I use this computer to watch a lot of media. Movies, TV eps, etc... In many varying formats, Divx/Xvid, wmv, mpeg1/2, etc. Does this problem effect any of that?

Go with ATI then. ATI had always had superior video performance, as Matrox does. An All-In-Wonder Radeon X800 would be a great choice if you do a lot of video.

Unfortunately, the X800's are just a bit out of my price range.

 

[LTC8K6]

Consider a 6600GT, the pvp works on those I believe.

 

[NotoriousJTC]

Is the playback/decode quality still a real concern though?


All i want/need is anything equivalent to that of what i got from my Geforce4 4400 Ti...

 

[Zucarita9000]

Perhaps an All-In-Wonder 9800 Pro? Should be around $250 by now.

 

[Sideswipe001]

Originally posted by: NotoriousJTC
Is the playback/decode quality still a real concern though?


All i want/need is anything equivalent to that of what i got from my Geforce4 4400 Ti...

I'm not sure that anyone's fully explained the problem here, so Il'l try to see if I can do it, as I understand it.

The 6800 series came with a highly touted chip onboard that would be able to handle doing movie encoding/decoding (both). The benefit here would be that the processor wouldn't have to do that work; basically freeing up the processor for other things.

What ended up happening was that this chip was found to have some sort of "flaw" in it, meaning that it doesn't do anything now. They never enabled it in the drivers. I've never heard if there's something physically wrong with it, or if it's just getting a driver to make it work right; but from what I guess it's something physically wrong.

The end result is not that you end up encoding or decoding at degregated quality; it's just that you'll have to put up with the CPU doing all the work.

 

[BenSkywalker]

All i want/need is anything equivalent to that of what i got from my Geforce4 4400 Ti...

Any current board will be fine. The problem with the 6800GT's video processor is that it doesn't work- but none of the other boards out besides the 6600 have the capabilities it was supposed to anyway. The video processor on the 6800s was supposed to offload the CPU of tasks that have always been handled by the CPU anyway. You aren't missing anything you have had previously going with a 6800, you just aren't getting anything new in terms of decoding/encoding.

 

[DAPUNISHER]

Originally posted by: Dahak
The video processing issue would affect those formats that you have listed, but seeing as it has no been enabled yet I would not have any conser for it. All it was its to help off load the work that the cpu will be doing when Encoding(creating). Has nothing to do with decoding (playing)

It's still a awsome card

That is an erroneous statement. The programmable video processor is supposed to offload encoding and decoding of the supported formats from the CPU. At this time it doesn't work for WMV HD and the new $20 DVD decoder software from nV is needed for the DVD decode function to work and offload from the CPU. The WMV HD is the only one that may bonk if the system isn't at least a XP 3200+ but since there isn't much of that content out your encoding&decoding will be fine just still done by the CPU as it has in the past instead of the PVP, at least for now.

 

[gobucks]

Yeah, it's a bummer that the feature doesn't work, but going to an ATI card won't give you that feature either. With all other video cards, the decoding work is done by the CPU, so it's not like it's lacking something, just that an advertised feature is flawed. As such, you should base your decision on how it performs in graphics benchmarks, and the fact is, the 6800 and 6800GT own the competition, the only tie is the X800XT, which sounds out of your price range.

On another note, if you are considering a plain 6800, I suggest, like others, that you look at a 6600GT instead. It's about $100 cheaper ($188 at pricewatch for the XFX with dual DVI, great deal), performs on par with the 6800 (slightly faster on lower resolutions, slightly slower in eye candy modes, but all around pretty close), it supports SLI, and its Video Processor thingy apparenty actually works for MPEG2, HD-MPEG2, and WMA. Only downside is, it's currently PCIe only, which means you have to wait a few weeks for a good PCIe motherboard, or for the AGP version of the card which is due out soon.

 

[DAPUNISHER]

Yeah, it's a bummer that the feature doesn't work, but going to an ATI card won't give you that feature either. With all other video cards, the decoding work is done by the CPU, so it's not like it's lacking something,

Although ATi uses a different method the X800 shows it is offloading part of the decoding process from the CPU Text IIRC I read they have a way for the work to be done in shaders. BTW, while that shows the 6800GT working, it is the PCIe flavor.

Here is a more dramatic example of how big a difference the PVP can make for decoding WMV HD Text

 

[VirtualLarry]

Are there any ATI AIW cards that are using the Rage Theater 500 (?) chipset yet? That seemed to have some impressive capabilities in it, and for a more HTPC/PVR-oriented setup, might be better choice.

 

[BentValve]

I almost took my vanilla 6800 back but I gave it some time and kept tweaking and its really turning out to be quite an impressive card...id say a solid 100% improvement over my retail 9800 Pro was.


For me there are no video issues..ok maybe some slight issues here and there but thats with any card.


I think the BFG 6800 OC @ $299 is a great deal..if you get it for $250 its a bargain IMO..especially considering I paid $399 for my 9800 Pro and there were no other options for a good card beside a 9700.

Id be hesitant to drop $399 on a GT ...to me Id rather save the cash and go with the plain 6800 or go full out and just get an Ultra.


As far as ATI cards go , the benches show the X800XT on top but I have read quite a few times that overall the 6800s still come out on top for real world gaming.

 

[igloo15]

Lets put it this way I have a 6800gt and I have zero problems watching videos. I don't create videos but watching I have zero problems.

 

[rbV5]

Originally posted by: VirtualLarry
Are there any ATI AIW cards that are using the Rage Theater 500 (?) chipset yet? That seemed to have some impressive capabilities in it, and for a more HTPC/PVR-oriented setup, might be better choice.

AIW X800XT will use Theater 200 rather than theater 550. Look for some add-on tuners soon using Theater 550 (and it does look like a great VIVO chip)

I use this computer to watch a lot of media. Movies, TV eps, etc... In many varying formats, Divx/Xvid, wmv, mpeg1/2, etc. Does this problem effect any of that?

Only in that CPU usage would be lower if the proccessor were working properly. It could have an effect on video decoding if you use a fair amount of post processing like resize filters, deinterlacing ect..in other words, if you are not a videophile/HTPC enthusiast or multitasking with your PVR rig and just playing video's, its probably not going to be an issue except on perhaps some HD material.

If you were looking at a flexible, programmable, hardware encoder to take up to 60% of the encoding load, or 95% of of the decoding load that could handle present and future video codecs...you might want to wait on Nvidia's fix before jumping in.

 

[Thermalrock]

is it true that the video processor of the 6800gt pci e works?

 

[Zero Plasma]

does this flaw apply to the ultra and gt also?

 

[DAPUNISHER]

Originally posted by: Smoke0
does this flaw apply to the ultra and gt also?

The entire 68series AGP line is definitely effected, what the deal is with the PCIe I can't say for certain. Xbit had theirs' working so I'm under the impression it works at least on some of them, but I have read conflicting reports about that so who knows?

BTW, if anyone wants to follow the drama just hit the video forum

 

[piasabird]

What about the standalone TV cards. How do they decode and encode. eVGA is coming out with a TV card with dual tuners and they claim you can encode on two channels and watch TV on a third channel. So what is the big deal?

 

[ViRGE]

Originally posted by: piasabird
What about the standalone TV cards. How do they decode and encode. eVGA is coming out with a TV card with dual tuners and they claim you can encode on two channels and watch TV on a third channel. So what is the big deal?

All the encoding is handled by the TV card, the decoding for watching(if it's an MPEG2 stream) is split between the CPU and the video card(which has decoded MPEG2 for years now).

PS All this talk of extra decoding is moot at this point. Even ATI's video abilities are crippled at this point, since only MPEG2 works. WMV acceleration is apparently disabled(something about initially bad drivers, and now waiting on MS to enable WMV acceleration in WMP), and none of the MPEG4 codecs can interface with the ATI card

 

[VirtualLarry]

Originally posted by: DAPUNISHER

Originally posted by: Smoke0
does this flaw apply to the ultra and gt also?

The entire 68series AGP line is definitely effected, what the deal is with the PCIe I can't say for certain. Xbit had theirs' working so I'm under the impression it works at least on some of them, but I have read conflicting reports about that so who knows?

BTW, if anyone wants to follow the drama just hit the video forum

Uhh, DAPUNISHER, the interface-ambiguous 6800 card in that review, was the PCI-e model, not the AGP model. So there are zero public reviews suggesting that the PVP in the 6800 AGP is working, thus far. info here

 

[ViRGE]

Originally posted by: VirtualLarry

Originally posted by: DAPUNISHER

Originally posted by: Smoke0
does this flaw apply to the ultra and gt also?

The entire 68series AGP line is definitely effected, what the deal is with the PCIe I can't say for certain. Xbit had theirs' working so I'm under the impression it works at least on some of them, but I have read conflicting reports about that so who knows?

BTW, if anyone wants to follow the drama just hit the video forum

Uhh, DAPUNISHER, the interface-ambiguous 6800 card in that review, was the PCI-e model, not the AGP model. So there are zero public reviews suggesting that the PVP in the 6800 AGP is working, thus far. info here

I think he knew that, but with Nvidia's AGP bridge, it's entirely possible for a PCIe version to just be the AGP version. The fully working(and PCIe native) version will be the NV45.

 

[DAPUNISHER]

Originally posted by: VirtualLarry

Originally posted by: DAPUNISHER

Originally posted by: Smoke0
does this flaw apply to the ultra and gt also?

The entire 68series AGP line is definitely effected, what the deal is with the PCIe I can't say for certain. Xbit had theirs' working so I'm under the impression it works at least on some of them, but I have read conflicting reports about that so who knows?

BTW, if anyone wants to follow the drama just hit the video forum

Uhh, DAPUNISHER, the interface-ambiguous 6800 card in that review, was the PCI-e model, not the AGP model. So there are zero public reviews suggesting that the PVP in the 6800 AGP is working, thus far. info here

Yeah I knew it was PCIe as indicated by mentioning xbit had theirs' working I did word it poorly though. The reason even the xbit results don't seem concrete to me is this indicating nv45 may also be affected. Heck, even B3D claimed to have a nv40 6800GT working back in early september. With all these conflicting reports on both the AGP and PCIe versions I'm thoroughly confused.