How are inventors supposed to avoid Chinese copycats?

[madoka]

I've been noticing a lot of new products rapidly get copied for a lot less by the Chinese. I recently bought a portable laptop stand ($75 by Roost) and once it was successful, it was copied and sold for a lot less ($25) by various Chinese manufacturers.

Sometimes the original makers used Chinese factories to manufacture their products, only to see the same factory churn out copies themselves. Or the Chinese just saw a successful product and made a reasonable copy of it. Literally everything from Yeti tumblers to Airbus A320s have been copied by the Chinese:

http://www.nextbigfuture.com/2017/0...expects-2030-iteration-to-be-competitive.html

Since 2008, Airbus has been building A320s in a final assembly plant in Tianjin, China, a joint venture with a Chinese manufacturing consortium that must have helped lay the groundwork for the homegrown airplane.

So if you've invented a novel product, how would you manufacture and sell it without cheap knockoffs from flooding the market?

 

[GagHalfrunt]

Two solutions:

1) Manufacture something so cheap that there's no money in knock offs. You don't see a lot of counterfeit Bic pens.

2) Manufacture something so expensive that there's not a big enough buyers market to bother. Seen any Chinese Bugatti Veyron copies on the road?

 

[Newbian]

Go after the stores that illegally sell them and hope you can get a big payoff from it otherwise you will waste a lot of money.

Best thing is to get your brand name recognized more so people go for that instead of knockoffs and the stores see that and sell it instead.

 

[Crono]

Better quality control, branding, marketing, and customer service. People still pay for premium products over knockoffs if there's enough reason to.

If you just make a commodity product and don't stand behind it, you don't stand a chance in the market.

 

[Red Squirrel]

It's an inivitable thing, but one advantage of buying the real thing is normally you'll get better support, quality and you'll get the product faster. So some people may still want to buy yours vs the chinese rip off. Also, don't make your product in China. Iphone rip offs etc are made easy because at night when they shut down the factory, they just run their own production with the same tooling etc since it's already setup, and make a bunch of rip off versions. They literally have the bluprints and everything. Essentially, it's already China making the phone and Apple putting their logo on it, so the Chinese workers can just put a different logo on it and sell it.

On one hand, if someone has the manufacturing capability they should be allowed to make something even if it's similar to another thing. But on the other hand, I hate the fact that if you want to make something it needs to be CSA, UL etc approved for you to be able to legally sell it, yet China can make a cheap rip off and they don't require those certifications and they can sell it anywhere they want. THAT I find is BS. Either allow us to produce and sell stuff without being required to have it certified, or require China to have to go through the same process too to export here.

 

[Sonikku]

China hurts innovation because they rob much of the fruit from innovating. If every country was like China our technology may have sat at a stand still.

 

[rh71]

Watch shark tank? Many use China (referred to as "overseas") to produce for cheaper because sellers need to cut costs to increase margins. Investors love that. Unless you have deep pockets and genuinely care about your product, it usually goes that route.

As for copying, unfortunate but that could also bring an obscure product some attention.

 

[Sonikku]

As soon as one industry moves "overseas" they all have to, or they can't compete on price. It's like a domino effect.

 

[Red Squirrel]

Yeah globalization in general is a very bad thing because of that. If you want to try to do the right thing and keep production local it's much harder. The government sure as hell does not help this situation either because of all the trade deal BS and other crap that actually helps make it cheaper to buy from or get something manufactured overseas. It's ridiculous really.

 

[Azuma Hazuki]

OP: you really can't. This is the nature of the globalization beast: the invisible hand of the free market has a middle finger, and it expresses its gesture with Mandarin profanity. If humans weren't so damn greedy...

 

[madoka]

Better quality control, branding, marketing, and customer service. People still pay for premium products over knockoffs if there's enough reason to.

If you just make a commodity product and don't stand behind it, you don't stand a chance in the market.

But see, I don't see a way around it for most inventors. Take for example Roost laptop stands. The inventor obviously spent a great deal of time engineering a new product. He starts selling them at $75 and is successful because there's nothing else like it. But soon copycats sell the same stand for $25. I don't care how great your customer service or marketing is. If your competitors sell the same item for one-third the price, then you're doomed. And there's so many of them now, you can't even target them for lawsuits.

I feel for the original inventor and his fate is what got me thinking about this issue again. I don't see a way around it since China will continue to allow such copying to continue.

 

[who?]

https://www.law360.com/ip/articles/68160/wal-mart-settles-with-adidas-in-trademark-case
http://articles.latimes.com/1997/dec/21/local/me-928

 

[quikah]

But see, I don't see a way around it for most inventors. Take for example Roost laptop stands. The inventor obviously spent a great deal of time engineering a new product. He starts selling them at $75 and is successful because there's nothing else like it. But soon copycats sell the same stand for $25. I don't care how great your customer service or marketing is. If your competitors sell the same item for one-third the price, then you're doomed. And there's so many of them now, you can't even target them for lawsuits.

Don't try selling something that probably cost $5-$10 to produce for $75?

 

[deustroop]

Watch shark tank? Many use China (referred to as "overseas") to produce for cheaper because sellers need to cut costs to increase margins. Investors love that. Unless you have deep pockets and genuinely care about your product, it usually goes that route.

Capitalism at work for you!

 

[Ruptga]

The biggest problem for most startups is cash-flow, so if you can make enough to cover your capital investment and pay some bills you might find that it's not impossible to compete with China. Don't use a Chinese manufacturer, and get whatever patents and trademarks you can before you go to market. They will still copy you, but if you don't literally hand them your product and you protect yourself from domestic copycats then you might be able to make enough money and build enough of a customer base that you can survive by the time the copies show up on Amazon for half of what you're charging. You have to sell your customers on quality though, the Chinese will always win a race to the bottom.

 

[Red Squirrel]

But see, I don't see a way around it for most inventors. Take for example Roost laptop stands. The inventor obviously spent a great deal of time engineering a new product. He starts selling them at $75 and is successful because there's nothing else like it. But soon copycats sell the same stand for $25. I don't care how great your customer service or marketing is. If your competitors sell the same item for one-third the price, then you're doomed. And there's so many of them now, you can't even target them for lawsuits.

I feel for the original inventor and his fate is what got me thinking about this issue again. I don't see a way around it since China will continue to allow such copying to continue.

Yeah it is a serious issue and the fact that they are advantaged does not help. They don't need any kind of certification or have other regulations etc on what they make, but we do. Shipping from there is cheaper from shipping domestically too. If the playing field was at least level it would help but clearly the government does not care. Considering how they seem so strong on trade deals they actually WANT it this way.

I'd say the trick would be to try to make your money within the first year or so. And don't get it made in China as you're just handing them everything. If you make it yourself, then they need to make all their own tooling, reverse engineering etc. It will take longer. By then, hopefully you made your money.

Also be sure to make it clear to customers/potential customers that it's made domestically, lot of people are actually starting to care more about that. Just look at the whole French's thing. Lot of people switched to French's after what Heinz did. They shut down the tomato plant and put lot of people out of a job, but French's came in and reopened the plant for their own ketchup. I think they even make it here in Canada too now.

 

[Darwin333]

On one hand, if someone has the manufacturing capability they should be allowed to make something even if it's similar to another thing. But on the other hand, I hate the fact that if you want to make something it needs to be CSA, UL etc approved for you to be able to legally sell it, yet China can make a cheap rip off and they don't require those certifications and they can sell it anywhere they want. THAT I find is BS. Either allow us to produce and sell stuff without being required to have it certified, or require China to have to go through the same process too to export here.

Are you sure about that? The only thing I have intimate knowledge of being UL tested are solar power inverters but I know for a fact that each and every one MUST be UL certified regardless if it's a "knock-off design" or not. How do they get around the UL certification requirements?

 

[Red Squirrel]

Are you sure about that? The only thing I have intimate knowledge of being UL tested are solar power inverters but I know for a fact that each and every one MUST be UL certified regardless if it's a "knock-off design" or not. How do they get around the UL certification requirements?

I doubt sites like Ebay and Amazon even check certifications so that's how they get away with it. And would we want them to censor stuff anyway? Kinda a double edge sword. But don't think you'd ever find that stuff at a B&M store as they most likely have a proper supply chain that checks that stuff.

But if you put your non UL approved stuff on Ebay or Amazon and someone gets harmed, then you'll probably get sued. But China can do it and I doubt you can sue someone in China.

I'm not sure about US/Canada but I'm pretty sure I've heard some countries will also prohibit you from exporting stuff that's not certified. But yet they can import all the crap from China such as light bulbs with exposed mains referenced LED modules.

Also tons of questionable inverters on Ebay/Amazon, they don't usually say if it's UL approved but if price is too good to be true I doubt it's approved.

All in all it just seems the playing field is really unfair in this respect making it very hard to even produce/sell domestically. Heck, kids arn't even allowed to set up lemonade stands anymore. It's gotten ridiculous.

 

[zinfamous]

I think it's nearly impossible because of nebulous international trademark laws, unless your company has serious clout (eg: $$$$$$$$ for Chinese officials).

IIRC, that is a what was supposed to be a big deal as part of the TPP: China agreeing to honor US trademarks (with the necessary agreement that they would actually enforce them within the country, obviously). But I'm not sure if that had the teeth that were promised (I honestly do not know), or if the concern for international liability against US companies operating overseas was as worrisome as advertised--enough so to scuttle the deal. (It makes sense that this could be very bad for US companies, obviously; but again--I'm not sure this was also as concerning as the critics advertised)

 

[zinfamous]

Two solutions:

1) Manufacture something so cheap that there's no money in knock offs. You don't see a lot of counterfeit Bic pens.

2) Manufacture something so expensive that there's not a big enough buyers market to bother. Seen any Chinese Bugatti Veyron copies on the road?

Not on the road, but this is probably a contender. Looks real enough!

 

[zinfamous]

Don't try selling something that probably cost $5-$10 to produce for $75?

heh, yeah. I do watch Shark Tank and that's a big deal. Primary issue with an inventor, is if their product is patentable, and even if it is, how "cheap and easy" is the design to replicate, anyway? Meaning, unless you have the type of money to successfully declare that you patented a rectangle (), you aren't going to stand a chance if the brilliant and elegant simplicity of your design (like the OP's laptop stand), is its own worst enemy.

 

[highland145]

Not on the road, but this is probably a contender. Looks real enough!

Is that shopped?

 

[zinfamous]

Is that shopped?

actually, it's legit.

:sneaky:

 

[highland145]

actually, it's legit.

:sneaky:

Hmm. Kind of like a bear ride.

 

[madoka]

2) Manufacture something so expensive that there's not a big enough buyers market to bother. Seen any Chinese Bugatti Veyron copies on the road?

The Chinese have made everything from the wooden Veyron:

To the Veyron made from cigarette packs:

To more legit copies of even the Pagani and LaFerrari:

Although I get your point. From what I hear, the Chinese haven't figured out how to replicate 3d Tourbillon watches yet.