House cuts released

[SMOGZINN]

Even if they can get this past the House, which is no sure thing, it will never make it past the Senate.
Really this reads like McCarthy just put everyone's pet projects in it. He is going to try to get the bill to pass the House by giving every Republican everything they want, and it still might no be enough. The real question is how does he plan to get the bill the Senate sends back to them passed with it will have basically none of these things in it?

 

[eelw]

Even if they can get this past the House, which is no sure thing, it will never make it past the Senate.
Really this reads like McCarthy just put everyone's pet projects in it. He is going to try to get the bill to pass the House by giving every Republican everything they want, and it still might no be enough. The real question is how does he plan to get the bill the Senate sends back to them passed with it will have basically none of these things in it?

That isn’t the point. He knows it won’t get a vote in the senate. But if it did, as if Biden won’t veto it. He knows his threat of holding the debt ceiling hostage is toothless. Why do you think this bill pushes it until next year. It’s an act for the brainless MAGAtards to pretend they are fighting for the people.

 

[Brainonska511]

That isn’t the point. He knows it won’t get a vote in the senate. But if it did, as if Biden won’t veto it. He knows his threat of holding the debt ceiling hostage is toothless. Why do you think this bill pushes it until next year. It’s an act for the brainless MAGAtards to pretend they are fighting for the people.

He wants to push it to next year to make it more of an election issue. He probably also wants to pass something, just to make the claim that the House has done something (even if that something is DOA) to shirk responsibility for the mess they are making.

 

[Paratus]

He wants to push it to next year to make it more of an election issue. He probably also wants to pass something, just to make the claim that the House has done something (even if that something is DOA) to shirk responsibility for the mess they are making.

Exactly. If the House passes a steaming turd he can go, "See it's Biden and the Dems in the Senate who caused the default. We passed a polished gem of a debt limit that they refused to approve"

 

[Brainonska511]

Exactly. If the House passes a steaming turd he can go, "See it's Biden and the Dems in the Senate who caused the default. We passed a polished gem of a debt limit that they refused to approve"

The spineless jellyfish of a Speaker managed to convince his caucus to pass the steaming turd of a bill, and what do you know: he wipes his hands. https://www.nytimes.com/2023/04/26/us/politics/debt-limit-vote-republicans.html

“We lifted the debt limit; we’ve sent it to the Senate; we’ve done our job,” Mr. McCarthy declared following the vote, visibly pleased with the outcome after a dayslong slog to rally Republicans around the plan.

 

[MrSquished]

This backfired on the Repugs the last time I think.

It should this time too. But would help if we had a president that was inspiring and had a good physical presence to be able to go out there on camera and denounce this nonsense. But we don't, and a lot of Dems are ok with just accepting that for some reason for the next go around. A testament to a chunk of the Dem party that is just too willing to compromise too often.

 

[Brainonska511]

This backfired on the Repugs the last time I think.

It should this time too. But would help if we had a president that was inspiring and had a good physical presence to be able to go out there on camera and denounce this nonsense. But we don't, and a lot of Dems are ok with just accepting that for some reason for the next go around. A testament to a chunk of the Dem party that is just too willing to compromise too often.

I don't know what reality your living in. The President and top democrats are consistently on camera and quoted in the news as being against this debt ceiling brinkmanship.

Not sure what being more on camera will do, since Republicans have no shame and don't give a shit about their constituents.

 

[Meghan54]

I don't know what reality your living in. The President and top democrats are consistently on camera and quoted in the news as being against this debt ceiling brinkmanship.

Not sure what being more on camera will do, since Republicans have no shame and don't give a shit about their constituents.

Consider the source.

 

[MrSquished]

I don't know what reality your living in. The President and top democrats are consistently on camera and quoted in the news as being against this debt ceiling brinkmanship.

Not sure what being more on camera will do, since Republicans have no shame and don't give a shit about their constituents.

I live in the reality of our current news cycle. I see quotes from Biden, but he should be doing press conferences taking lots of questions. But he is contained by so much handling compared to a more vibrant Cinton or Obama. If you can't tell the difference, not my bad. He is kept handled with kid gloves so he isn't out in the open much at all. Learn what is happening.

The reality of Biden https://www.nytimes.com/2023/04/21/us/politics/biden-public-appearances-media.html

"WASHINGTON — In the 100 years since Calvin Coolidge took office, only Richard Nixon and Ronald Reagan held as few news conferences each year as the current occupant of the Oval Office.

Traveling in Ireland last week, President Biden abandoned the decades-old tradition of holding a news conference while abroad. On Thursday, President Gustavo Petro of Colombia met with Mr. Biden, but the two did not hold a news conference together, another practice of his predecessors that Mr. Biden has frequently chosen to skip. After the meeting, Mr. Petro took questions from reporters — alone — at microphones in front of the West Wing.

And despite his press secretary pledging that Mr. Biden would “bring transparency and truth back to the government,” in his first two years, the president granted the fewest interviews since Mr. Reagan’s presidency: only 54. (Donald J. Trump gave 202 during the first two years of his presidency; Barack Obama gave 275.)

More than any president in recent memory, Mr. Biden, 80, has taken steps to reduce opportunities for journalists to question him in forums where he can offer unscripted answers and they can follow up. The result, critics say, is a president who has fewer moments of public accountability for his comments, decisions and actions."
-------------------------------------------------------------------


Care to tell us about this reality vs your made up world?

 

[MrSquished]

Consider the source.

I live in the reality where I understand the Republicans, what they are doing and what they are capable of, like knowing what major GQP candidates are capable of, like DeSantis and all the rest. I know how many Republicans are too far gone to be 'un-ignorated' and become part of a solution before we lose our democracy and freedom, and I also know just being content with Biden is poor sad settling by Dems - and a symptom of why the party is perceived as it is and why it finds itself where it is now. With our country teetering on the edge of fascism. I'm sorry if that bothers you.

 

[Brainonska511]

So he's just going to green lantern his way to victory on this issue by just holding some press conferences? LOL

Republicans have no shame and don't give a damn - moving words aren't going to change their minds, and they certainly don't care much about what their constituents think, so good luck on that front.

 

[MrSquished]

So he's just going to green lantern his way to victory on this issue by just holding some press conferences? LOL

Republicans have no shame and don't give a damn - moving words aren't going to change their minds, and they certainly don't care much about what their constituents think, so good luck on that front.

What are you talking about and where did I say Joe is going to woo Republicans?

Biden needs to motivate Democrats and Independents, not Republicans. There is no enthusiasm for him in most of the Dem party, and we need the young to get out and vote and many other groups, with crazy high turnout.

Haven't you noticed I know the vast majority of Republicans are unreachable and goners and will never be decent anytime in the future close enough to help save this country? I don't think any of them are reachable.

Also you claimed Biden is out there saying stuff. And as I pointed out he is not doing press conferences, and provided the proof. Little video clips are nice, but people need to hear a President who can take on some tough questions and parry incorrect arguments and shut down GQP talking points by answering questions. And he does not do that.

 

[Brainonska511]

What are you talking about and where did I say Joe is going to woo Republicans?

Biden needs to motivate Democrats and Independents, not Republicans. There is no enthusiasm for him in most of the Dem party, and we need the young to get out and vote and many other groups, with crazy high turnout.

Haven't you noticed I know the vast majority of Republicans are unreachable and goners and will never be decent anytime in the future close enough to help save this country? I don't think any of them are reachable.

Also you claimed Biden is out there saying stuff. And as I pointed out he is not doing press conferences, and provided the proof. Little video clips are nice, but people need to hear a President who can take on some tough questions and parry incorrect arguments and shut down GQP talking points by answering questions. And he does not do that.

Motivating those parties is great, but doesn't solve the immediate problem of the whole debt ceiling and June deadline.

 

[fskimospy]

So he's just going to green lantern his way to victory on this issue by just holding some press conferences? LOL

Republicans have no shame and don't give a damn - moving words aren't going to change their minds, and they certainly don't care much about what their constituents think, so good luck on that front.

I think the whole 'bully pulpit' thing is basically nonsense - Obama proved this. We had one of the most eloquent and persuasive speakers in a long time who was constantly out there speaking and promoting his agenda and in the end it didn't move the needle.

The good news is in this case I doubt it matters much. It's the mirror of crime issues - when crime goes up Democrats are often blamed even if they have nothing to do with it because, fairly or not, the public instinctually associates Democrats and liberalism with being soft on crime. Similarly when the government shuts down or shit like this happens the public instinctually associates Republicans with this sort of thing so they will get hammered by public opinion regardless.

 

[MrSquished]

Motivating those parties is great, but doesn't solve the immediate problem of the whole debt ceiling and June deadline.

It's going to be a shit show, that's why you need a president out there making quite clear why not budging to the fascist scum that is the GQP is the correct and right move for the country.

There is a high chance of an actual default no matter what though. The current GQP are bad hombres. They have no souls.

 

[MrSquished]

I think the whole 'bully pulpit' thing is basically nonsense - Obama proved this. We had one of the most eloquent and persuasive speakers in a long time who was constantly out there speaking and promoting his agenda and in the end it didn't move the needle.

The good news is in this case I doubt it matters much. It's the mirror of crime issues - when crime goes up Democrats are often blamed even if they have nothing to do with it because, fairly or not, the public instinctually associates Democrats and liberalism with being soft on crime. Similarly when the government shuts down or shit like this happens the public instinctually associates Republicans with this sort of thing so they will get hammered by public opinion regardless.

I already know you denied that anything fundamental has changed since the mid-Clinton and mid-Obama years in our political landscape that would affect any comparison to the past, so there is no talking to someone so obtuse about reality. But the fact is the political landscape has changed dramatically - it's been a huge shift - you know this guy called Trump, the GQP going full fascist, an attempted coup at the physical and bureaucratic level, a gutting of freedoms and rights across the country, a completely radical deplorable unreachable GQP base that is huge, all in the last six years, and you simply discount it and think we can just look back to the before times and gauge things the same, and you think people like DeSantis will respect core institutions like democracy. You could not be more clueless about the changes that have happened.

Well, there is no speaking to people who are this oblivious to the world around us.

 

[fskimospy]

I already know you denied that anything fundamental has changed since the mid-Clinton and mid-Obama years in our political landscape that would affect any comparison to the past, so there is no talking to someone so obtuse about reality. But the fact is the political landscape has changed dramatically - it's been a huge shift - you know this guy called Trump, the GQP going full fascist, an attempted coup at the physical and bureaucratic level, a gutting of freedoms and rights across the country, a completely radical deplorable unreachable GQP base that is huge, all in the last six years, and you simply discount it and think we can just look back to the before times and gauge things the same, and you think people like DeSantis will respect core institutions like democracy. You could not be more clueless about the changes that have happened.

Well, there is no speaking to people who are this oblivious to the world around us.

Sounds like you should stop doing it then!

 

[MrSquished]

Sounds like you should stop doing it then!

I'd like to but it's good for people to see a counterpoint to comments that ignore the reality around us.

 

[fskimospy]

I'd like to but it's good for people to see a counterpoint to comments that ignore the reality around us.

I’m not sure people see your comments that way, haha.

 

[ivwshane]

I’m not sure people see your comments that way, haha.

I see his comments as alarmist but then again these are pretty alarming times. I may not agree with the level of hysteria he shows but that’s mainly because I know what the reality is and I know that getting that upset isn’t going to change anything.

I do however appreciate that he’s concerned and engaged and that he understands the importance of the situation we are in. We need more people engaged and paying attention and not more people who have decided to throw their hands up and declare “both sides”.

My concern with him would be that such paranoia, justified or not, can lead people to be susceptible to misinformation and fraud (essentially maga for liberals). I don’t see him exhibiting that extremism yet though and I hope we won’t so what’s the issue?

 

[MrSquished]

Turns out the Biden administration was unprepared for the successful Republican vote. It's like these people just don't learn. Sigh

White House regroups after McCarthy’s debt ceiling success

Wednesday's vote is kicking off a new phase in the high-stakes standoff that will test Democrats’ ability to stay united.

www.politico.com

 

[SMOGZINN]

Turns out the Biden administration was unprepared for the successful Republican vote. It's like these people just don't learn. Sigh

White House regroups after McCarthy’s debt ceiling success

Wednesday's vote is kicking off a new phase in the high-stakes standoff that will test Democrats’ ability to stay united.

www.politico.com

I don't see where that article says that they are unprepared. It just says that passing a pie-in-the-sky bill is not going to change their stance all that much. The bill has no chance of passing the Senate. It does not matter that they managed to pass a DOA bill in the House.

“No clean debt ceiling is going to pass the House,” McCarthy said to reporters on Wednesday as he did a victory lap.

Kamala should simply state 'Only a clean debt ceiling will pass the Senate, we already told you this.' Then tomorrow the Senate needs to cut everything out of the House bill and pass it as a clean bill and send it back to the House.

 

[MrSquished]

I don't see where that article says that they are unprepared. It just says that passing a pie-in-the-sky bill is not going to change their stance all that much. The bill has no chance of passing the Senate. It does not matter that they managed to pass a DOA bill in the House.



Kamala should simply state 'Only a clean debt ceiling will pass the Senate, we already told you this.' Then tomorrow the Senate needs to cut everything out of the House bill and pass it as a clean bill and send it back to the House.

Try re-reading the article

"But once it became clear that McCarthy lacked the influence to wrangle his conference, Biden’s team reasoned, Republicans would lose most of their leverage and eventually soften their demand for concessions. The White House had harbored doubts about the bill’s chances of success even after McCarthy announced plans for a vote, privately questioning whether he could win over the last handful of conservatives trying to push the bill further to the right.".....


....

and now some are in disarray

"But Democrats’ public confidence that they’re winning the messaging war masks private concerns over how this all ultimately ends — and what damage the standoff may do to a fragile, recovering economy that’s critical to Biden’s case for re-election."

 

[SMOGZINN]

Try re-reading the article

"But once it became clear that McCarthy lacked the influence to wrangle his conference, Biden’s team reasoned, Republicans would lose most of their leverage and eventually soften their demand for concessions. The White House had harbored doubts about the bill’s chances of success even after McCarthy announced plans for a vote, privately questioning whether he could win over the last handful of conservatives trying to push the bill further to the right.".....


....

and now some are in disarray

"But Democrats’ public confidence that they’re winning the messaging war masks private concerns over how this all ultimately ends — and what damage the standoff may do to a fragile, recovering economy that’s critical to Biden’s case for re-election."

So, they didn't think he would get it passed. I'm pretty sure that they still planned for many different contingencies.
The rest of the article reads like they are simply switching to plan B.

 

[MrSquished]

So, they didn't think he would get it passed. I'm pretty sure that they still planned for many different contingencies.
The rest of the article reads like they are simply switching to plan B.

I don't see a plan. They are clearly still balancing Biden's re-election efforts with a debt-ceiling standoff and have no definite plan. If they didn't have to worry about Biden running when he probably shouldn't, different story. Biden just doesn't have the presence to parry things. He is coddled with kids gloves away from the media.