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House approves another 50 billion for Iraq

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Originally posted by: palehorse74
cry me a river.

I too would much rather see the money spent differently, but reality dictates that we must spend the money to combat anti-western fanaticism on a global scale. -I- am willing to make the financial and physical sacrifices necessary to eliminate said fanaticism. such is life.

It makes me sick to think that some of you would argue against money that is going directly to the troops on the ground doing the work in this war... after all, supporting them financially is the least you could do to help out in this war... bah.
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What a bunch of hooey. I too have served in combat zones as part of the "war on terror." That said, it seems perfectly evident to me that our "war on terror" has little to do with rooting out and eliminating terror, and everything to do with playing out the plans that were drawn up years ago by the principals in PNAC, including but not limited to Cheney, Rumsfeld, Wolfowitz, and Feith. Our foreign policy is essentially driven by a desire to protect Israel and to strengthen our own economic position. The "war on terror"'s only demonstrable effect on terror has been to increase the number of terrorist attacks higher than it has ever been.

I understand your desire to feel that what you're doing is right (you might want to Google "cognitive dissonance" to get a sense for why I think many GIs feel that way), but as taxpayers we have every right to question a war that has likely made us less safe, and which will almost inevitably cost us more than $1,000,000,000,000. I'm all for supporting the troops - I have several close friends in Iraq, including some females with infants - but it seems to me that ending the war sooner rather than later is the best thing we can do for them. I resent your implication that opposing the war is unpatriotic or evidence that people don't support the troops - in fact I'd argue the direct opposite. I hope you stay safe, in any case.
 
Originally posted by: Slew Foot
Originally posted by: RMich
Speaking of lies we've been told... Y'all remember this? (Cut and paste from internet source)

The White House's early projections for the cost of the war and its aftermath were around $50 billion. On Sept. 15, 2002, in an interview with a newspaper, White House economic adviser Lawrence Lindsay estimated the war would be about 1 to 2 percent of the gross national product, or about $200 billion on the high end. Lindsey left the White House post several months later.

Office of Management and Budget Director Mitch Daniels called Lindsay's estimate "very, very high" and told news organizations the cost would likely be between $50 billion and $60 billion.

Just weeks before the war, White House spokesman Ari Fleisher told reporters that Iraq would be able to "shoulder much of the burden" of reconstruction because of its oil wealth.

Deputy Defense Secretary Paul Wolfowitz told Congress a month into the war something similar: "We're dealing with a country that can really finance its own reconstruction, and relatively soon."
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Yup, and the medicare drug benefit will only cost 400 billion, and SS will be solvent until 2048.
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And we only tap phones if we have a warrant. Texas never executed an innocent man while I was governor. Good job, Brownie! I promise to rebuild New Orleans. The deficit will be cut in half by 2008. I would be very careful about using our troops as nation builders. Iraq tried to buy uranium in Africa.

Hello, America! Time to wake up!
 
Remember when the American people were lead to believe that this war would "pay for itself?"

Anyway, Donvito is right about one thing. This war was likely about fulfilling the goals of PNAC first, and about rooting fanaticism from the ME second.
 
Originally posted by: jman19
Remember when the American people were lead to believe that this war would "pay for itself?"

Anyway, Donvito is right about one thing. This war was likely about fulfilling the goals of PNAC first, and about rooting fanaticism from the ME second.
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I'm sure Dumbya and the rest of his cronies have been paid back several times
 
Originally posted by: Engineer
Click me!

My comment: Goddamn spending whores in DC need their asses thrown out!!! :|

The subcommittee passed its bill as House and Senate negotiators put final touches on an emergency measure for about $67 billion the Pentagon wants immediately to cover the wars' rising costs.

The next $50 billion bridge fund, which lawmakers expect to cover about six months, would bring the cost of both wars to nearly $450 billion, and many expect that to reach $500 billion by the end of next year.
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Stupid bastards! You people want REAL tax cuts? Start by getting rid of the assholes in DC that spend money like this for EVERY stupid thing that comes along and they don't know when to quit.

Edit: And I don't mean replacing the GOP with the Democrats either. I mean replace the whole fvcking crew with a new one. Hell, illegal immigrants might be better than what we have in DC.
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why can't congres approve a bill giving the states $450 billion dollar spread between all 50 states to spend on improving the school systems. In my state (Michigan) alot of the schools in my area, have to make major budget cuts due to lack of funding and rising cost of fuel and health care. That $450 billion that been spent on iraq, sure could go to better use, like I said Schools.


 
Originally posted by: DonVito
Originally posted by: palehorse74
cry me a river.

I too would much rather see the money spent differently, but reality dictates that we must spend the money to combat anti-western fanaticism on a global scale. -I- am willing to make the financial and physical sacrifices necessary to eliminate said fanaticism. such is life.

It makes me sick to think that some of you would argue against money that is going directly to the troops on the ground doing the work in this war... after all, supporting them financially is the least you could do to help out in this war... bah.
Click to expand...

What a bunch of hooey. I too have served in combat zones as part of the "war on terror." That said, it seems perfectly evident to me that our "war on terror" has little to do with rooting out and eliminating terror, and everything to do with playing out the plans that were drawn up years ago by the principals in PNAC, including but not limited to Cheney, Rumsfeld, Wolfowitz, and Feith. Our foreign policy is essentially driven by a desire to protect Israel and to strengthen our own economic position. The "war on terror"'s only demonstrable effect on terror has been to increase the number of terrorist attacks higher than it has ever been.

I understand your desire to feel that what you're doing is right (you might want to Google "cognitive dissonance" to get a sense for why I think many GIs feel that way), but as taxpayers we have every right to question a war that has likely made us less safe, and which will almost inevitably cost us more than $1,000,000,000,000. I'm all for supporting the troops - I have several close friends in Iraq, including some females with infants - but it seems to me that ending the war sooner rather than later is the best thing we can do for them. I resent your implication that opposing the war is unpatriotic or evidence that people don't support the troops - in fact I'd argue the direct opposite. I hope you stay safe, in any case.
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Wow, well said DV. :thumbsup: Apparently, folks like PaleHorse have forgotten that a good portion of this country didn't want to go to war in Iraq in the first place. What makes anyone think we're suddenly going to support it now?
 
For the kind of money we are spending we could have given every adult Iraqi a 35,000 a year job.
THEN they would be willing to fight to keep the peace.
 
Every bit of the financing of this 'War' is as Emergency Spending.
It hasn't even been figured into the cost or debt of the country . . . yet.


 
Originally posted by: piasabird
What do propose?

A. Immediate Pullout.

B. Support the Troops.

C. I am a greedy bastard and just want all the money.
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The good old tried and true, if you don't like war you must not support the troops. It's been a while old friend, but I'm glad to see you are alive and kicking. Surely the greedy American Tax Payer must be deluded to think that money not spent on war, would be better spent on society.

Does anyone honestly think that all this government spending on the war on terror somehow is making things better? After Afghanistan, things seem to be the same, or worse off than before.

Just weeks before the war, White House spokesman Ari Fleisher told reporters that Iraq would be able to "shoulder much of the burden" of reconstruction because of its oil wealth.

Deputy Defense Secretary Paul Wolfowitz told Congress a month into the war something similar: "We're dealing with a country that can really finance its own reconstruction, and relatively soon."
Click to expand...

I thought it was never about Oil though. 😱
 
First it was $1.8B, then it was no more than $50B, then they ridiculed Kerry for estimating $300B... now it's $500B and counting. Do repugs ever live in reality, ever?
 
Originally posted by: FelixDeKat
Originally posted by: piasabird
What do propose?

A. Immediate Pullout.

B. Support the Troops.

C. I am a greedy bastard and just want all the money.
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D. Stop posting.
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If you referring to my complaining about my money being spent on a bullsh!t war, too bad. You can stay out of the thread. If you mean otherwise, you can explain.

If you and others can bitch about "entitlements" and "welfare" (something I bitch about too), I can bitch about a lie of a war and the lies of how much it was going to cost vs what it actually is costing. Like I said, if you were to receive a bill for your portion of the war, you would whine like a baby about it and you know it so don't pull that bullsh!t.
 
Originally posted by: palehorse74
Originally posted by: magomago
Palehorse, I think one of the bigger concerns is that the money will be mis spent, and we will over pay like crazy. Looking at the past financial dealing with the War on Iraq and the way CPA spend the money...it is a problem.
Listen I agree that we totally screwed up Iraq, so we have to pay the price...but we don't pay with the type of carpet bagging that is going on in Iraq. That becomes a diservice to us, and the Iraqis
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carpet bagging?
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Yes, carpet bagging. It was just earlier this year that a huge sting got a few...the sad part is for the few that were caught taking bribes for contracts, there are many that probably got away scotch free.
It angers me when our money is mis spent...I wonder how much money the government would REALLY need if we were not so wasteful
 
Originally posted by: jrenz
Hey...religious wars aren't cheap.
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Haha... Yeah...

But throwing everyone out is a big pipe dream. It's not gonna happen. If we all voted for 3rd party it might but that won't happen also...


All I can say is good luck.
 
Originally posted by: palehorse74
cry me a river.

I too would much rather see the money spent differently, but reality dictates that we must spend the money to combat anti-western fanaticism on a global scale. -I- am willing to make the financial and physical sacrifices necessary to eliminate said fanaticism. such is life.

It makes me sick to think that some of you would argue against money that is going directly to the troops on the ground doing the work in this war... after all, supporting them financially is the least you could do to help out in this war... bah.
Click to expand...

Go tell it to your idiot-in-chief...

US Bush threatens to veto supersized Iraq spending bill

Why doesn't king george support the troops???
 
I love these lyrics from "Kismet"! So appropriate for king george.

Princes come,
Princes go,
An hour of pomp and show they know;
Princes come and over the sands,
And over the sands of time they go.
Wise men come,
Ever promising the riddle of life to know,
Wise men come, Ah,
But over the sands.
The silent sands of time they go
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In twenty years Iraq will be right back to what Iraq has always been. That's why daddy bush didn't go to Baghdad. That's why daddy bush told georgie not to go to Baghdad. These people have been repelling invaders for millenia. It's second nature to them. And they always have the sands of time on their side.

Lovers come,
Lovers go.
And all that there is to know
Lovers know;
Only lovers know.
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One thing bush has never been and will never be is a lover.


 
Originally posted by: piasabird
What do propose?

A. Immediate Pullout.

B. Support the Troops.

C. I am a greedy bastard and just want all the money.
Click to expand...

You can't support the troops by advocating a pullout? That's nice, you'd rather see them being turned into hamburger than let them go home to their families.

Nobody in the Mideast other than Israel wants us there and I doubt soldiers enjoy their mandatory re-upping guarding people who hate them.

The best thing to happen for us and them is to either suck their oil dry quickly or find an alternate fuel. Then they can happily go back to the 13th century without anyone interfering.
 
Originally posted by: palehorse74
cry me a river.

I too would much rather see the money spent differently, but reality dictates that we must spend the money to combat anti-western fanaticism on a global scale. -I- am willing to make the financial and physical sacrifices necessary to eliminate said fanaticism. such is life.

It makes me sick to think that some of you would argue against money that is going directly to the troops on the ground doing the work in this war... after all, supporting them financially is the least you could do to help out in this war... bah.
Click to expand...

Hey, didnt you make claims about being shipped out soon? Seems like quite a delay if you ask me. I have longtime friends in the military (and reserves) and when they get the call its less than a week before they are gone. So, when are you leaving? Or are you just full of it?
 
Originally posted by: homercles337
Originally posted by: palehorse74
cry me a river.

I too would much rather see the money spent differently, but reality dictates that we must spend the money to combat anti-western fanaticism on a global scale. -I- am willing to make the financial and physical sacrifices necessary to eliminate said fanaticism. such is life.

It makes me sick to think that some of you would argue against money that is going directly to the troops on the ground doing the work in this war... after all, supporting them financially is the least you could do to help out in this war... bah.
Click to expand...

Hey, didnt you make claims about being shipped out soon? Seems like quite a delay if you ask me. I have longtime friends in the military (and reserves) and when they get the call its less than a week before they are gone. So, when are you leaving? Or are you just full of it?
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well beyond the fact that it's pretty much none of your business, ill school you on it anyways because I love making people eat crow.

im in a reclass school for 4 months before joining my mobilized BCT in late August. My orders were cut for 21 total months, including the school. The BCT will mobilize in late July. Myself, and those in school with me, will join the Bde in late August, after we graduate. The entire BCT, including me, will train for a few months more before going overseas. It's called a "MOB-TRAIN-DEPLOY," and the school was a once in a lifetime opportunity for me, so I agreed to go.

oh, more good news: i'll have internet access for most of my tour! so you'll never be rid of me. too bad eh?

btw, rarely do reserve/guard units get less than 30 days notice to deploy. in fact, you have to sign a waiver if that happens. When it happens at all, it is usually individual soldiers who get ASKED to go a week before a school slot or deployment. They then have the option of signing the waiver or not. If they refuse, then they'll be given the 30 days to get their sh1t in order, or the unit will find another individual to take their place.

get your facts straight or go back to the minor leagues. consider your tax dollars well spent!

now, go away. ty.
 
Originally posted by: piasabird
What do propose?

A. Immediate Pullout.

B. Support the Troops.

C. I am a greedy bastard and just want all the money.
Click to expand...

Greedy because I want my money back from a useless war? Don't even try to tell us that this has slowed terrorism.

Honestly, if you supported the troops, you would want a pullout and take them out of harms way. Supporting them doesn't mean putting them in a dangerous situation where they can be killed. That wouldn't make any sense at all.

I'm guessing you're one of the ones that bitches about excessive social spending but completely turn a blind eye towards excessive military spending. Excessive is excessive any way you look at it.

Half a trillion dollars is a buttload of cash. How are we getting this cash? Oh that's right, we're indebting ourselves to foreign countries. That's great for the strength of our dollar. :roll:
 
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