Carb, that's a somewhat eloquently expressed sentence you put together there for the local environment, present company excepted of course. Is that your own work or a paraphrase of some famous thinker like Marks?
I read in Egypt whole groups would go somehwere and erect a whole village out of mud. Somebody in the government was trying to get mortgages going so people would have to buy them instead. There was something of an uproar as it was sure to create greater poverty. Time was you could homestead here too.
LunarRay
Diamond Member
- Mar 2, 2003
- 9,993
- 1
- 76
If you see a person in a wheel chair trying to cross the street you might express sympathy and/or outrage at the motorists who never stop to allow passage... that disability you can see but, the one of the mind that manifests itself in behavior such as homelessness is seen as anything but a disability... it is a more profound disability and ought to attract a more profound response... but then, this is America where only the lazy are homeless...
Originally posted by: 0roo0roo
we stop underfunding mental institutionsi think reagan cut the hell out of it. decided they were better off on the street
It's a much more complex problem with a very long history. Saying simply that "Reagan cut the hell out of it " doesn't even match the truth or begin to scratch the surface.
Broken Promises -- The Story of Deinstitutionalization
Mentally Ill Offenders in the Criminal Justice System:
Read those two stories and then we'll start to have a discussion and not just mindless bashing of a political party. Moonie, you may of course continue in your mindless bashing, you have it down to an artform and I and the other members of this board expect nothing else from you.
Since you cannot legislate compassion or self-initiative, you cannot fix it. All systems fail because people are diseased. Cure the individual and you take the only path that exists towards curing the society.
In our capitalistic society, it is of course easier to either:
1) Bash the "corporate climbing" social mantra of success that defines the one who makes 100 million as a success. Don't those corporate/entertainment/athletic pigs realize that there is no fundamental difference in lifestyle between one hundred million and twenty million. He could give the other 80 million away and not feel it.
2) Bash the lazy bum who doesn't understand the great freedom of our economic system and has no self-initiative. After all, doesn't he know that even God only helps those who helps themselves?
In a communistic society, no doubt the polarization would take a different form, but it amounts to the same thing:
1) Blame the system.
2) Blame the individual.
There is another way. Our society is capitalistic and emphasizes the individual. Therefore it will never work to impose socialistic mindsets by law. The chemotherapy of socialistic values that would "cure" the cancer of rampant consumerism would itself kill the organism of our society, as chemotherapy often does. Some would argue that the chemotherapy of socialism is already killing the American economy, and they would have a valid point.
The other way is to take the prevailing energy of self-initiative and and ambition and ride it with one subtle difference: redefining what it means to be a success.
The "cure" for a healthy response to homelessness lies not in "fixing homelessness," because that will never happen. Jesus said, "The poor you will have with you always." The cure lies in subtly redefining success so that those who are a "'success" in our culture don't feel like they are a success until they discover the secret power of contentment: IF I were truly a successful person, I would only feel a need for nutrition and warmth. Physically, my actual needs truly stop there. Once they are met, what is it that drives me to consume and consume and consume?
Why do I have this drive to consume while the homeless person does not? Am I so positive that I am really so healthy and the homeless person is so sick?
Saul of Tarsus found another way. Originally the ruthless social climber, he later wrote the following:
I am not praising your generosity because I am in need, fo I have learned to be content whatever the circumstances. I know what it is to have need, and I know what it is to have plenty. I have learned the secret of being content in any and every situation, whether well fed or hungry, whether living in plenty or in want
But godliness with contentment is great gain. For we brought nothing into the world, and we can take nothing out of it. But if we have food and clothing [i.e: nutrition and warmth], we will be content with that. People who want to get rich fall into a temptation and a trap and into many harmful desires the plunge mankind into ruin and destruction
It is pointless to say, "I don't believe that Bible crap." One cannot compartmentalize. Saul of tarsus (aka the Apostle Paul) experienced something that our culture does not have: contentment. In that contentment, he discovered a great compassion for the poor, and thus freely gave to help them.
That doesn't mean throw money at them. Nor does it mean that we pass legislation forcing the rich to give a certain amount back.
There is a chasm within humanity. Call it politics, call it economics, call it religion, call it whatever. Human argument has no ability to cross that chasm and find a working solution, because everyone feels threatened by the other side. In a capitalistic society, most will fall on the side of rampant individualism and are blind to the excesses of that individualism.
Yet the cure for rampant individualism is not found in socialism, it is found in the individuals. When the corporate CEO recognizies that he is in a society that favors making as much as he can, than he should make as much as he can (legally and ethically). But that doesn't mean he has to hoard it. How big does his barn need to be? He can make as much as he can, pay his taxes, and than give of himslef and his money to make a difference. He will be happier that way, though he may not currently believe that. When he truly discovers what he must selfishly pursue to make himself happy, he will find even his selfishness has become sacred and an agent of healing, not just for himself, but for those he meets.
You are the cancer. You can also be the cure.
In our capitalistic society, it is of course easier to either:
1) Bash the "corporate climbing" social mantra of success that defines the one who makes 100 million as a success. Don't those corporate/entertainment/athletic pigs realize that there is no fundamental difference in lifestyle between one hundred million and twenty million. He could give the other 80 million away and not feel it.
2) Bash the lazy bum who doesn't understand the great freedom of our economic system and has no self-initiative. After all, doesn't he know that even God only helps those who helps themselves?
In a communistic society, no doubt the polarization would take a different form, but it amounts to the same thing:
1) Blame the system.
2) Blame the individual.
There is another way. Our society is capitalistic and emphasizes the individual. Therefore it will never work to impose socialistic mindsets by law. The chemotherapy of socialistic values that would "cure" the cancer of rampant consumerism would itself kill the organism of our society, as chemotherapy often does. Some would argue that the chemotherapy of socialism is already killing the American economy, and they would have a valid point.
The other way is to take the prevailing energy of self-initiative and and ambition and ride it with one subtle difference: redefining what it means to be a success.
The "cure" for a healthy response to homelessness lies not in "fixing homelessness," because that will never happen. Jesus said, "The poor you will have with you always." The cure lies in subtly redefining success so that those who are a "'success" in our culture don't feel like they are a success until they discover the secret power of contentment: IF I were truly a successful person, I would only feel a need for nutrition and warmth. Physically, my actual needs truly stop there. Once they are met, what is it that drives me to consume and consume and consume?
Why do I have this drive to consume while the homeless person does not? Am I so positive that I am really so healthy and the homeless person is so sick?
Saul of Tarsus found another way. Originally the ruthless social climber, he later wrote the following:
I am not praising your generosity because I am in need, fo I have learned to be content whatever the circumstances. I know what it is to have need, and I know what it is to have plenty. I have learned the secret of being content in any and every situation, whether well fed or hungry, whether living in plenty or in want
But godliness with contentment is great gain. For we brought nothing into the world, and we can take nothing out of it. But if we have food and clothing [i.e: nutrition and warmth], we will be content with that. People who want to get rich fall into a temptation and a trap and into many harmful desires the plunge mankind into ruin and destruction
It is pointless to say, "I don't believe that Bible crap." One cannot compartmentalize. Saul of tarsus (aka the Apostle Paul) experienced something that our culture does not have: contentment. In that contentment, he discovered a great compassion for the poor, and thus freely gave to help them.
That doesn't mean throw money at them. Nor does it mean that we pass legislation forcing the rich to give a certain amount back.
There is a chasm within humanity. Call it politics, call it economics, call it religion, call it whatever. Human argument has no ability to cross that chasm and find a working solution, because everyone feels threatened by the other side. In a capitalistic society, most will fall on the side of rampant individualism and are blind to the excesses of that individualism.
Yet the cure for rampant individualism is not found in socialism, it is found in the individuals. When the corporate CEO recognizies that he is in a society that favors making as much as he can, than he should make as much as he can (legally and ethically). But that doesn't mean he has to hoard it. How big does his barn need to be? He can make as much as he can, pay his taxes, and than give of himslef and his money to make a difference. He will be happier that way, though he may not currently believe that. When he truly discovers what he must selfishly pursue to make himself happy, he will find even his selfishness has become sacred and an agent of healing, not just for himself, but for those he meets.
You are the cancer. You can also be the cure.
shiner
Lifer
- Jul 18, 2000
- 17,112
- 1
- 0
In the past I thought this issue could be solved. I volunteered in soup kitchens, gave money to charity, bought clothes to give to the homeless, took my old clothes to them, gave them rides to a shelter or place where they could get food, from time to time I would directly give them money for food, I have hired them to do some lawn work, etc, etc, etc?.. No more. I've seen too many of them sell or trade the clothes off their back for a drink or something worse. I've seen too many of them turn a job down when it was offered. I've had them steal from me when I had given them a job at my home so that they would have some money and hopefully get on the road to turning their life around. True there are some that are mentally ill, but the overwhelming majority that I have met and dealt with have been addicts of some sort or another. Addicts that refused to get any type of help. Addicts who would rather have people give them money for nothing than to actually work for it. Addicts who when confronted with their problem become violent and tell you that you have no right to tell them how to live. Never again will I give them money, clothes, or help of any kind. Now my efforts go towards helping the elderly or disadvantaged children. Adults that choose to live their lives in the gutter deserve no kindness from me. In my opinion the only way to help them would be with a healthy dose of Zyklon B.
shinerburke:
Do not become disillusioned. Even if you did everything perfectly, for every ten homeless lepers that you provided the resources to be cured, only one would actually be cured. And the one who is cured won't be cured simply by changing his physical circumstances. He is cured only if his heart is also changed. Ask Jesus; he knows.
Do it because of the wholeness it generates in you, not because of the failure of others to respond appropriately.
Still, one wants to actually help people. That means that I cannot give them my shoes if they are only going to sell them to get drugs. I haven't helped them; I've only furthered their drug habit. Compassion is essential but must also be discerning. "Be as harmless as doves but as shrewd as serpents."
Still, I cannot continue to give unless I have discovered the blessing of giving. I want that blessing. I cannot get it until I defy my own selfishness; yet my self wins in the end. In "losing," I win. If I refuse to be taken for a loss, I guarantee my own defeat.
Do not become disillusioned. Even if you did everything perfectly, for every ten homeless lepers that you provided the resources to be cured, only one would actually be cured. And the one who is cured won't be cured simply by changing his physical circumstances. He is cured only if his heart is also changed. Ask Jesus; he knows.
Do it because of the wholeness it generates in you, not because of the failure of others to respond appropriately.
Still, one wants to actually help people. That means that I cannot give them my shoes if they are only going to sell them to get drugs. I haven't helped them; I've only furthered their drug habit. Compassion is essential but must also be discerning. "Be as harmless as doves but as shrewd as serpents."
Still, I cannot continue to give unless I have discovered the blessing of giving. I want that blessing. I cannot get it until I defy my own selfishness; yet my self wins in the end. In "losing," I win. If I refuse to be taken for a loss, I guarantee my own defeat.
the nazis dealt with it by sending them to concentration camps and killing them.
that's probably not the best solution.
Part of living in a free society is giving people the choice to unplug from productive, normal existence. People should support charities that care for those people.
Turning into a socialist country where you get paid for doing nothing should not be an option.
that's probably not the best solution.
Part of living in a free society is giving people the choice to unplug from productive, normal existence. People should support charities that care for those people.
Turning into a socialist country where you get paid for doing nothing should not be an option.
I agree. To add to that: I don't think there is a "fix" for problems like this. You can throw as much money as you want at it and it is not going to ever significantly decrease. So what can you do?
Volunteer. Talk to them. By them a sandwich now and then. Donate old clothes and blankets. Donate money to charitable organizations. But don't look for a "fix". Its not a broken faucet, or even a broken "society".
It is a natural occurance that will always occur, and the best you can do is to keep on loving them and showing them respect, some will turn their lives around, and many of them won't. Just my humble experience with the homeless.
Hi Carbonyl:
Thanks for the encouragement. Someone at AT must like me. It was actually a couple of years ago, when I was just <300 posts, when I came back from vacation and found myself designated "elite."
Since then I've had to wear a neck brace to support my obscenely swollen head
Thanks for the encouragement. Someone at AT must like me. It was actually a couple of years ago, when I was just <300 posts, when I came back from vacation and found myself designated "elite."
Since then I've had to wear a neck brace to support my obscenely swollen head
Hi Athanasius, it's nice to see you posting again. I realize I never redid my lost PM. It's nice too to see somebody present a real, essential view of the problem here. One tends to be called a dreamer so often, happened to me here again and I didn't even say anything, that one, at least me, tends to focus on smaller goals like presenting possible limitations in points of view. Anyway I certainly agree with your posts here but I do differ somewhat on the scope of the revolution required. When I look at the problem of selfishness and the problem of addiction I see a structural, rather than perhaps a demonic origin. I think that capitalism is competition and competition is hostility. Capitalism creates hostility and hostility, hate, creates more hate especially the hate put into language, put downs. These putdowns are what create the feelings of inferiority, as you, I'm sure, well know I believe. Once we have been taught by language that we are worthless we have two roads, to prove we are not with hostility, successfully compete achieve get acquire demonstrate our superiority, or fail, withdraw into pain obvious self loathing and destructive behavior like alcoholism and addiction. To ask men to be content is no less difficult, it seems to me, than to ask them to change the system that produces their illness. We can hope for a cure among the successful or we can hope to change a system that causes mental illness with two poles, sick winners and losers. Thanks CPA for the spelling correction. I thought oo was pronounces like in zoo and losers let the animals go free.
Hi Moonbeam:
You are correct, this is where we disagree. But perhaps not in the way that you might think. I do view the problem as "demonic" in origin, as long as people carefully dfefine what they mean by "demonic."
But you seem to say that the structural problem has some type of malignancy that the individuals within the structure do not themselves have. Certainly the sum of malignancy can become greater than the individual parts that make it up.
But the sum or structure is ultimately what I would call a symptom. treating symptoms never can bring a cure. That doesn't mean we do nothing. No doubt some feel like the symptoms of excessive consumerism are so severe as to demand treatment.
But then one has to come up with a treatment plan for the system that the system will voluntarily embrace. No medicine is taken consistently if the physician must relay on his ability to ram it down the patient's throat.
Besides, the proverb holds true: "Physician, heal thyself." No insane man accurately diagnosis his own insanity. If the system is insane, it does not follow that I am sane enough to provide a cure.
But, if I focus on the individual, I get to the root cause and I eliminate factors that I cannot control. This is the brilliance of Jesus. He did not revolutionize the system. Take slavery as one example. He did not abolish slavery. He simply taught masters to recognize that they were also slaves and taught slaves to look past their human masters and focus on Him. If the individuals within the abusive structure of slavery had actually done that, would the system of slavery really been so abusive? Individuals acting in grace can transcend the evils of most systems.
That slavery lends itself to abuse is obvious. But it is only a system, and therefore only a symptom. That doesn't mean you never treat the symptom. In American History, I believe the wholesale, ethnic-based slave trade was so severe a symptom that it had to be addressed. It took the radical cancer surgery of war to address it. But abolishing slavery did nothing to change human hearts.
Abolish slavery and you create a Ku Klux Klan. The disease simply generates another symptom. All viruses do that. Yet the building block is the single cell. Cure enough cells and you give the organism a fighting chance.
Their is no external cure for capitalism. Did the Marxist revolution make a better world? Marxist Atheism murdered 50 million people and was just a rife with corruption and selfishness as capitalism.
You are correct, this is where we disagree. But perhaps not in the way that you might think. I do view the problem as "demonic" in origin, as long as people carefully dfefine what they mean by "demonic."
But you seem to say that the structural problem has some type of malignancy that the individuals within the structure do not themselves have. Certainly the sum of malignancy can become greater than the individual parts that make it up.
But the sum or structure is ultimately what I would call a symptom. treating symptoms never can bring a cure. That doesn't mean we do nothing. No doubt some feel like the symptoms of excessive consumerism are so severe as to demand treatment.
But then one has to come up with a treatment plan for the system that the system will voluntarily embrace. No medicine is taken consistently if the physician must relay on his ability to ram it down the patient's throat.
Besides, the proverb holds true: "Physician, heal thyself." No insane man accurately diagnosis his own insanity. If the system is insane, it does not follow that I am sane enough to provide a cure.
But, if I focus on the individual, I get to the root cause and I eliminate factors that I cannot control. This is the brilliance of Jesus. He did not revolutionize the system. Take slavery as one example. He did not abolish slavery. He simply taught masters to recognize that they were also slaves and taught slaves to look past their human masters and focus on Him. If the individuals within the abusive structure of slavery had actually done that, would the system of slavery really been so abusive? Individuals acting in grace can transcend the evils of most systems.
That slavery lends itself to abuse is obvious. But it is only a system, and therefore only a symptom. That doesn't mean you never treat the symptom. In American History, I believe the wholesale, ethnic-based slave trade was so severe a symptom that it had to be addressed. It took the radical cancer surgery of war to address it. But abolishing slavery did nothing to change human hearts.
Abolish slavery and you create a Ku Klux Klan. The disease simply generates another symptom. All viruses do that. Yet the building block is the single cell. Cure enough cells and you give the organism a fighting chance.
Their is no external cure for capitalism. Did the Marxist revolution make a better world? Marxist Atheism murdered 50 million people and was just a rife with corruption and selfishness as capitalism.
hehe, well perhaps the revolution I had in mind wasn't so far from the one you suggest:
A: You are correct, this is where we disagree. But perhaps not in the way that you might think. I do view the problem as "demonic" in origin, as long as people carefully dfefine what they mean by "demonic."
M: I was of course revering to the work of the Devil or some evil force in the world as opposed to a persistant illusion of evil arising out of a system, the duality of naming with language where the word tree and some actual tree represent the difference between conception and actual perception.
A: But you seem to say that the structural problem has some type of malignancy that the individuals within the structure do not themselves have. Certainly the sum of malignancy can become greater than the individual parts that make it up.
M: Well here again our difference shows. Yes, I'm saying that man is born good, not evil and that he is corrupted by the illusion of duality. The malignancy is the dilusion. Since nobody can escape being born into it it's pretty big.
A: But the sum or structure is ultimately what I would call a symptom. treating symptoms never can bring a cure. That doesn't mean we do nothing. No doubt some feel like the symptoms of excessive consumerism are so severe as to demand treatment.
M: Well I'm just recommending we see the root cause as what it is, a false ego structure created to defend against the painful loss of true self to duality, the illusion that being told there's something wrong with us makes it so.
A: But then one has to come up with a treatment plan for the system that the system will voluntarily embrace. No medicine is taken consistently if the physician must relay on his ability to ram it down the patient's throat.
M: I agree. I just think that man does not see the true source of his problem and does nothing but fight symptoms. I only hope to point to something I think is deeper, the ultimate source of the problem, the illusion of good and evil. I can't ram that down somebody's throat. I can only point.
A: Besides, the proverb holds true: "Physician, heal thyself." No insane man accurately diagnosis his own insanity. If the system is insane, it does not follow that I am sane enough to provide a cure.
M: The sick Christian can see Christ as his answer before he knows grace. Sick or healthy, if the illusion I point to is real, some may see even if I don't. In all truth systems there is the problem of the need for a guide. Those who are awake can awaken the sleeping. Words from somebody who was awake maybe sometimes do too.
A: But, if I focus on the individual, I get to the root cause and I eliminate factors that I cannot control. This is the brilliance of Jesus. He did not revolutionize the system. Take slavery as one example. He did not abolish slavery. He simply taught masters to recognize that they were also slaves and taught slaves to look past their human masters and focus on Him. If the individuals within the abusive structure of slavery had actually done that, would the system of slavery really been so abusive? Individuals acting in grace can transcend the evils of most systems.
M: I agree. I just think there are more than one kind of transcendence. There is grace and there is walking through hell and seeing it for illusion. One can transcend the illusion sin through the faith that one is forgiven and remember the beginning and when one bought into the illusion and, as an adult, realize it was a lie.
A: That slavery lends itself to abuse is obvious. But it is only a system, and therefore only a symptom. That doesn't mean you never treat the symptom. In American History, I believe the wholesale, ethnic-based slave trade was so severe a symptom that it had to be addressed. It took the radical cancer surgery of war to address it. But abolishing slavery did nothing to change human hearts.
M: Well here I think you make my point. I want to change the system that allows putdown to go unchallenged, to make humanity aware that it has a disease, the belief as children that there is something wrong with us because we were told so through being put down.
A: Abolish slavery and you create a Ku Klux Klan. The disease simply generates another symptom. All viruses do that. Yet the building block is the single cell. Cure enough cells and you give the organism a fighting chance.
M: It's no different with Christianity. It has also been corrupted. It is the fact that there is a real truth benieth or burried within it that saves people. Serious people will always exist who penetrate to its core. That is what I like about direct truth. The idea that one has bought a lie, has been made to feel worthless through putdowns requires no faith nor demands any disbelief. It is something that anybody can test in therapy by feeling. Do you feel like the worst in the world. Feel and you will see you do. That's my faith.
A: Their is no external cure for capitalism. Did the Marxist revolution make a better world? Marxist Atheism murdered 50 million people and was just a rife with corruption and selfishness as capitalism.
M: To see that capitalism is competition and competition hostility or hate is to revolutionize one's view. The problem isn't capitalism, but hate, self hate. Convert to Marxism and leave the self hate in place and you get 50 million dead. I would hope that the idea would be to work on healing, transforming our self hate into something else while we transform the manifestation of our hate into something else too. The answer is always some third way in a world of duality dilusion.
A: You are correct, this is where we disagree. But perhaps not in the way that you might think. I do view the problem as "demonic" in origin, as long as people carefully dfefine what they mean by "demonic."
M: I was of course revering to the work of the Devil or some evil force in the world as opposed to a persistant illusion of evil arising out of a system, the duality of naming with language where the word tree and some actual tree represent the difference between conception and actual perception.
A: But you seem to say that the structural problem has some type of malignancy that the individuals within the structure do not themselves have. Certainly the sum of malignancy can become greater than the individual parts that make it up.
M: Well here again our difference shows. Yes, I'm saying that man is born good, not evil and that he is corrupted by the illusion of duality. The malignancy is the dilusion. Since nobody can escape being born into it it's pretty big.
A: But the sum or structure is ultimately what I would call a symptom. treating symptoms never can bring a cure. That doesn't mean we do nothing. No doubt some feel like the symptoms of excessive consumerism are so severe as to demand treatment.
M: Well I'm just recommending we see the root cause as what it is, a false ego structure created to defend against the painful loss of true self to duality, the illusion that being told there's something wrong with us makes it so.
A: But then one has to come up with a treatment plan for the system that the system will voluntarily embrace. No medicine is taken consistently if the physician must relay on his ability to ram it down the patient's throat.
M: I agree. I just think that man does not see the true source of his problem and does nothing but fight symptoms. I only hope to point to something I think is deeper, the ultimate source of the problem, the illusion of good and evil. I can't ram that down somebody's throat. I can only point.
A: Besides, the proverb holds true: "Physician, heal thyself." No insane man accurately diagnosis his own insanity. If the system is insane, it does not follow that I am sane enough to provide a cure.
M: The sick Christian can see Christ as his answer before he knows grace. Sick or healthy, if the illusion I point to is real, some may see even if I don't. In all truth systems there is the problem of the need for a guide. Those who are awake can awaken the sleeping. Words from somebody who was awake maybe sometimes do too.
A: But, if I focus on the individual, I get to the root cause and I eliminate factors that I cannot control. This is the brilliance of Jesus. He did not revolutionize the system. Take slavery as one example. He did not abolish slavery. He simply taught masters to recognize that they were also slaves and taught slaves to look past their human masters and focus on Him. If the individuals within the abusive structure of slavery had actually done that, would the system of slavery really been so abusive? Individuals acting in grace can transcend the evils of most systems.
M: I agree. I just think there are more than one kind of transcendence. There is grace and there is walking through hell and seeing it for illusion. One can transcend the illusion sin through the faith that one is forgiven and remember the beginning and when one bought into the illusion and, as an adult, realize it was a lie.
A: That slavery lends itself to abuse is obvious. But it is only a system, and therefore only a symptom. That doesn't mean you never treat the symptom. In American History, I believe the wholesale, ethnic-based slave trade was so severe a symptom that it had to be addressed. It took the radical cancer surgery of war to address it. But abolishing slavery did nothing to change human hearts.
M: Well here I think you make my point. I want to change the system that allows putdown to go unchallenged, to make humanity aware that it has a disease, the belief as children that there is something wrong with us because we were told so through being put down.
A: Abolish slavery and you create a Ku Klux Klan. The disease simply generates another symptom. All viruses do that. Yet the building block is the single cell. Cure enough cells and you give the organism a fighting chance.
M: It's no different with Christianity. It has also been corrupted. It is the fact that there is a real truth benieth or burried within it that saves people. Serious people will always exist who penetrate to its core. That is what I like about direct truth. The idea that one has bought a lie, has been made to feel worthless through putdowns requires no faith nor demands any disbelief. It is something that anybody can test in therapy by feeling. Do you feel like the worst in the world. Feel and you will see you do. That's my faith.
A: Their is no external cure for capitalism. Did the Marxist revolution make a better world? Marxist Atheism murdered 50 million people and was just a rife with corruption and selfishness as capitalism.
M: To see that capitalism is competition and competition hostility or hate is to revolutionize one's view. The problem isn't capitalism, but hate, self hate. Convert to Marxism and leave the self hate in place and you get 50 million dead. I would hope that the idea would be to work on healing, transforming our self hate into something else while we transform the manifestation of our hate into something else too. The answer is always some third way in a world of duality dilusion.
This is one of the single clearest takes on one of the ills that is crushing the life from humanity along with a clearly put solution.
*Applauds*
LunarRay
Diamond Member
- Mar 2, 2003
- 9,993
- 1
- 76
Apparantly God saw that man as he evolved became so "evil" that there would be over crowding in "Hell". No one, well... hardly anyone could abide by the covenant God made thru Moses to his people Israel. So he sent Jesus down along with another covenant that provided heavenly acceptance upon the acceptance of Jesus as the Way to God and Heaven. (To me Jesus is God) Jesus replied to questions regarding life on earth in a way that few can abide by... the Camel and the Needle, Love thy Neighbor, Turn the other Cheek etc. The Doctor was not sick his soul was.. Jesus was concerned with the soul of man and not the minor issues (compared to eternal life) confronting the people... But, if one were to use what he said to solve the problems of today... earthly ones.... we all would be in better stead... He also said something about "Render unto Casear... "
In this country, however, we seek to remedy any issue through use of a legislative process. Given that not everyone is in accord with the Christian ethic we have no other way to right a wrong or fund a societal inequity. Painting with a broad brush may be fine for the barn but, not for the artisan and his masterpiece.
The issue is homelessness and it is society's issue.... How do folks attain that status and what is the appropriate societal intervention is the question.
The first step is to determine if any thing should be done... to do that you must understand what causes folks to become and then accept homelessness. As I said earlier in this thread... there are many roads to the same location... some revert back to societal norms while others stay in the quagmire. Why??? How can they like it there?? They do!! I guess because they are druggies, totaly lazy bums, mentally defective, and on.. You can simply determine which types can be helped and how and try to answer the first step in the affirmative. The second step and beyond are the easiest steps.... just takes votes.
If Jesus were here in person today... I'd imagine he'd not be too quick to change the status quo in one fell swoop and wave of his hand... I'd think he would simply say to "Leave unto Bush that which is Bush's and unto God that which is God's" It, therefore, is left to us to insure Bush et. al. do as we say.... we are the Casear all of us.
In this country, however, we seek to remedy any issue through use of a legislative process. Given that not everyone is in accord with the Christian ethic we have no other way to right a wrong or fund a societal inequity. Painting with a broad brush may be fine for the barn but, not for the artisan and his masterpiece.
The issue is homelessness and it is society's issue.... How do folks attain that status and what is the appropriate societal intervention is the question.
The first step is to determine if any thing should be done... to do that you must understand what causes folks to become and then accept homelessness. As I said earlier in this thread... there are many roads to the same location... some revert back to societal norms while others stay in the quagmire. Why??? How can they like it there?? They do!! I guess because they are druggies, totaly lazy bums, mentally defective, and on.. You can simply determine which types can be helped and how and try to answer the first step in the affirmative. The second step and beyond are the easiest steps.... just takes votes.
If Jesus were here in person today... I'd imagine he'd not be too quick to change the status quo in one fell swoop and wave of his hand... I'd think he would simply say to "Leave unto Bush that which is Bush's and unto God that which is God's" It, therefore, is left to us to insure Bush et. al. do as we say.... we are the Casear all of us.
Didn't Caesar say 'Bush et al' when he got stabbed? Just trying to be sure what I'm in for here.
LunarRay
Diamond Member
- Mar 2, 2003
- 9,993
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Originally posted by: Moonbeam
Didn't Caesar say 'Bush et al' when he got stabbed? Just trying to be sure what I'm in for here.
.... and Brutus is an honorable man...
What will be will be....
And this too shall come to pass...
Ouch.... and stuff like that probably.... (notice how I spelted caesar?)
(notice how I spelted caesar?) No I didn't but we can hope Mr. Nomad Must Eliminate Error doesn't either. I don't actually see letters. I seem to read by geometry, or something. I have a theory that a lack of visual perception of words like you and I seem to have, indicated by spelling problems, is indicative of a brain disfunction the compensation for which engenders a form of cognition yielding abnormal insights into aspects of reality missed by more normative thinkers. If not, it helps as a rationalization to compensate for the shame of not being able to spell, no?
If not, it helps as a rationalization to compensate for the shame of not being able to spell, no? TRENDING THREADS
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