Home Air Conditioning Unit - Repair or Replace?

[rsutoratosu]

I actually thought about this and checked on eBay, but it doesn't look like alot of auctions ending with a sale and the price they're going for seems a bit lower than I expected.. aside from that, the manufacturer will only send replacement to a certified AC repair person, not to any end user, or so I'm told.

If you get a new unit install, have the installer help you claim the warranty piece.. maybe he'll be nice enough. Never hurt to ask

 

[corinthos]

OK, last question - i was informed that permit and inspection is necessary for installing/replacing your home AC unit.

2 of the AC people I talked to so far have already offered up that they would be willing to forgo the permit and 3rd party inspection process if I wanted to not incur that expense...

As I read more on this business of needing a permit and 3rd party inspection to make sure there is no more than 15% leakage and that the job is done right, I found that these requirements are for the protection of the home owner, since the insurance company could
come back and say you didn't get the AC permit and inspection and invalidate your insurance claim should you have a fire or something...

Question: should anyone who offers up that they're willing to do the install w/o a permit be considered suspect and should they be removed from your list of candidates to do the AC job? Is a permit and inspection really needed? Together, both would cost me an additional $800 or so.

BTW, today, this guy who runs an AC business which I found on Yelp, said he would be willing to put a new 3 ton 13 seer Goodman AC + new coil + new furnace for about $4100 total. Do you think that is reasonable or should I try to counter? Looking at prices for a new Goodman AC and coil and new furnace, I reached a total figure of $1800 cost total for parts, not including tax. So that would mean this AC guy would make $2300 purely for the labor? Maybe I could talk him down but what would be a reasonable price?

He quoted me $1500 to replace compressor under warranty, recharge the refrigerant, check for leaks in the system, labor. And $2200 for a new AC unit. Lastly, $4100 for new AC unit, new coil, new furnace...

 

[sdifox]

OK, last question - i was informed that permit and inspection is necessary for installing/replacing your home AC unit.

2 of the AC people I talked to so far have already offered up that they would be willing to forgo the permit and 3rd party inspection process if I wanted to not incur that expense...

As I read more on this business of needing a permit and 3rd party inspection to make sure there is no more than 15% leakage and that the job is done right, I found that these requirements are for the protection of the home owner, since the insurance company could
come back and say you didn't get the AC permit and inspection and invalidate your insurance claim should you have a fire or something...

Question: should anyone who offers up that they're willing to do the install w/o a permit be considered suspect and should they be removed from your list of candidates to do the AC job? Is a permit and inspection really needed? Together, both would cost me an additional $800 or so.

BTW, today, this guy who runs an AC business which I found on Yelp, said he would be willing to put a new 3 ton 13 seer Goodman AC + new coil + new furnace for about $4100 total. Do you think that is reasonable or should I try to counter? Looking at prices for a new Goodman AC and coil and new furnace, I reached a total figure of $1800 cost total for parts, not including tax. So that would mean this AC guy would make $2300 purely for the labor? Maybe I could talk him down but what would be a reasonable price?

He quoted me $1500 to replace compressor under warranty, recharge the refrigerant, check for leaks in the system, labor. And $2200 for a new AC unit. Lastly, $4100 for new AC unit, new coil, new furnace...

Permit and inspection depends on your local bylaw. As far as I know, you don't need a permit to replace existing hvac if it is the same type.

 

[ajskydiver]

Join Angie's List.

I did after a bad experience with an A/C company and have since found and used a plumbing co, water damage mitigation, window screen replacement, etc. that all had the best reviews and their work/professionalism was what should be standard.

Mention you found them on Angie's List seems to help as well. After the first A/C company offered me $100 to remove the bad review, which I didn't, I knew that what customers write there matters.

It is well worth the money.

 

[Jeffg010]

I just had to get a replacement part for my furnace/AC last month, it cost me $900 with parts and labor.

The guy working on it said I had the one best units, Amana. They offer 10 year warranty on all parts and labor. The guy working on it looked it up and I only had 5 year warranty on mine. It was 10 year old unit. He said Amanas should last 15+ years.

http://www.amana-hac.com/

 

[Scarpozzi]

A lot of people around here install Goodman AC units. They typically come with a 10 year warranty and a 2.5ton system can be purchased for $1200-1500.... They're really cheap compared to the competition. Ductwork is expensive and there are some other things to consider (condensation pumps, plumbing, etc).

You can probably just replace your compressor for $900 plus labor, but you want a matched system if possible to get better efficiency out of it. Also consider your air handler. There are multi-speed air handlers that can maximize heating efficiency too. J

Just research options...expected life of a heat pump/ac unit is 10-15 years. I would guess 10 years is a good minimum number to rely on....so you're almost there with your current unit. I'd go ahead and replace it with a full unit. I personally have an American Standard dual-fuel heat pump that kicks to natural gas when the temp goes under 40 degrees. Its saves me money in the winter and is pretty efficient in the summer.

 

[bunker]

Here's an update on the situation:

It appears that indeed the compressor is BAD in my AC. It is under warranty by manufacturer but the total labor to install is about $700. This is a Trane X11 R22 unit.

So here are my options:

1. Replace compressor only ($700 labor; part under warranty - assuming it's honored)
2. Replace entire AC with new unit ($1500 for new Goodman R22 unit ; includes installation)

H

DO NOT, I repeat, DO NOT get an R22 unit. Real R22 is expensive as hell since it's supposed to be phased out by 2020. I just got a quote for $1500 to repair my coolant line and recharge the system with 9 lbs of R22. The actual labor and repair to the line was $300.
http://www.epa.gov/ozone/title6/phaseout/22phaseout.html

 

[Sea Moose]

There could be a mouse in your ac

 

[skull]

OK, last question - i was informed that permit and inspection is necessary for installing/replacing your home AC unit.

2 of the AC people I talked to so far have already offered up that they would be willing to forgo the permit and 3rd party inspection process if I wanted to not incur that expense...

As I read more on this business of needing a permit and 3rd party inspection to make sure there is no more than 15% leakage and that the job is done right, I found that these requirements are for the protection of the home owner, since the insurance company could
come back and say you didn't get the AC permit and inspection and invalidate your insurance claim should you have a fire or something...

Question: should anyone who offers up that they're willing to do the install w/o a permit be considered suspect and should they be removed from your list of candidates to do the AC job? Is a permit and inspection really needed? Together, both would cost me an additional $800 or so.

BTW, today, this guy who runs an AC business which I found on Yelp, said he would be willing to put a new 3 ton 13 seer Goodman AC + new coil + new furnace for about $4100 total. Do you think that is reasonable or should I try to counter? Looking at prices for a new Goodman AC and coil and new furnace, I reached a total figure of $1800 cost total for parts, not including tax. So that would mean this AC guy would make $2300 purely for the labor? Maybe I could talk him down but what would be a reasonable price?

He quoted me $1500 to replace compressor under warranty, recharge the refrigerant, check for leaks in the system, labor. And $2200 for a new AC unit. Lastly, $4100 for new AC unit, new coil, new furnace...

Sure beat up the A/C guy on price thats all labor he doesn't have to have a truck, tools, liability insurance, workmans comp, health insurance he doesn't need gas in his truck or insurance on it. God forbid he has an office/shop. Owning a business isn't risky. I'm sure he doesn't want a return on his investment for all of the above or 6 figures a year for putting up with you retards. $4100 for furnace and air is cheap as shit I'd be worried about the quality of labor at that price. You homeowners kill me.

 

[DCal430]

DO NOT, I repeat, DO NOT get an R22 unit. Real R22 is expensive as hell since it's supposed to be phased out by 2020. I just got a quote for $1500 to repair my coolant line and recharge the system with 9 lbs of R22. The actual labor and repair to the line was $300.
http://www.epa.gov/ozone/title6/phaseout/22phaseout.html

He really doesn't much have much a choice, but to go with R22, unless he wants to spend thousands more and replace the coils as well. Though in the end it could be worth it.

But 8 years only seems so short for such failure.

 

[DCal430]

Actually does anyone know a reasonable cost to replace an HVAC system, furnace, coil, AC unit, assuming natural gas furnace. What you should expect to pay for quality installation and unit.

 

[iwajabitw]

Ok,having worked in HVAC for 20yrs I say replace the compressor. An 8 yr old unit is at least 10-12 SEER, you will not gain anything by installing a 13. Make sure to get a good company that will properly install, vacuum the system microns to the units specs usually 250-500 microns, install proper filter dryers, then calculate the refrigerant charge while using superheat and subcooling methods. A proper tech should do a load analysis, delta t, static pressure testing. This will ensure the duct work is adequate and not leaking as well as tell you if your getting proper latent cooling. Bigger is not better. For 1325sft a properly designed system will cool excellent with a 1.5 ton unit. I would suspect your compressor has probably died do to short cycling because the unit is over sized. Longer run times are always better, removes more humidity and the compressor doesn't get short cycles. Here in AL oversizing for cooling is a problem.

 

[iwajabitw]

As for Goodman, they used to be called Ganetrol, then became Goodman and bought out Amana. Old Amana plant down the road has Goodman on jt now. I don't prefer them but have installed when applicable with few problems. The biggest being leaky king valves. For budget systems I usually will install a Payne by Carrier or a Nordyne product.

 

[Hugo Drax]

never replace just the outside unit and keep the inside unit. Anyone quoting that is a hack.

 

[Leyawiin]

there is no way the new AC unit is 1800.. check around prices.. its probably cheaper to fix teh compressor

That's what I was thinking. People that sold me my house replaced it just a few years before I bought it (like 2008). Its a rooftop one and the neighbor next door said it cost them $5,000.

 

[iwajabitw]

Oh and the price of R22 has dropped by about half. It was over $500 for a 30lb jug last summer, $260 last week, but all of companies didnt adjust there prices accordingly. HVAC has a huge mark up. For everyone, make sure you get reputable people that will back up the repair install. Also, check up on your insulation, window caulking, and filters as needed. And get those 3M filters out of there. They cause nothing but trouble, TOO restrictive unless you had your HVAC installer design the system with it in mind.

 

[iGas]

I would replace instead of repair, because the cost of a new compressor is high and then you have to add the labor on top.

 

[IronWing]

FYI, necro thread. Necromancer was spam-banned and post deleted.

 

[WackyDan]

That labor doesn't seem all that bad actually.

For an 8 year old unit, I would repair it. You should be able to squeeze 15 years out of that and your furnace. Like others have said, you should try to replace your HVAC as a matched unit.

We installed a new Trane HVAC in 2007. For the first four years we kept having call backs to top off the system. One place diagnosed the issue as a high pressure/low pressure solenoid and gave me a labor quote of $1400. Next place that came out actually sent a well seasoned HVAC guy and he checked for leaks and found that the coil was leaking. They charged $1600 labor. I found another place that would have been around $1200, but they couldn't get the parts from Trane as the other HVAC service already had a warranty claim for those parts under my serial number.

In the end, I was pissed but mostly at Trane. The HVAC guy told me that a leak in an aluminum coil is extremely rare. The fact we had the leak since new told me the other HVAC service we had used should have caught it in the early stages because back then Trane would have covered parts and labor. Lessons learned about HVAC.

I expect to get 15 years+ out of this setup. As far as refridegerant goes, I wouldn't worry too much. The price will go up but it will still be readily available and it won't break the bank if you have to top the unit off a couple times until you are ready to replace the whole HVAC unit. Our unit has been perfect for the last few years since that big repair up until a few weeks back and we needed a capacitor as well... Which is a bad sign your compressor is about to go.

 

[tortoise]

People that sold me my house replaced it just a few years before I bought it (like 2008). Its a rooftop one and the neighbor next door said it cost them $5,000.

Paid around $7800 for a replacement 2014, 3 ton, 16 seer, American Standard heat pump. Although the 3 year old condenser fan motor & capacitor, 5 year old contactor, and original compressor seem to be working well (no reset trips) on the 15 year old unit, it had zero refrigerant pressure . . most likely a leak in the ground level outside condenser or attic heat exchanger.

 

[thescreensavers]

Ok,having worked in HVAC for 20yrs I say replace the compressor. An 8 yr old unit is at least 10-12 SEER, you will not gain anything by installing a 13. Make sure to get a good company that will properly install, vacuum the system microns to the units specs usually 250-500 microns, install proper filter dryers, then calculate the refrigerant charge while using superheat and subcooling methods. A proper tech should do a load analysis, delta t, static pressure testing. This will ensure the duct work is adequate and not leaking as well as tell you if your getting proper latent cooling. Bigger is not better. For 1325sft a properly designed system will cool excellent with a 1.5 ton unit. I would suspect your compressor has probably died do to short cycling because the unit is over sized. Longer run times are always better, removes more humidity and the compressor doesn't get short cycles. Here in AL oversizing for cooling is a problem.

In my apartment, we have a 1.5 ton for 1000 sq.ft.. but get this when the apartment was build in the 80s someone tried to save a buck and went with 1/4" copper line. The Line coming out of the Roof unit and Air Handler is 3/8ths.. fuckers so basically it runs all night to get to 73F in the apartment.

 

[OutHouse]

OP I would check two things that are easy fixes that you can do yourself. Check the capacitor and then check the relay.

A/C guys are notorious on telling home owners the whole unit is shot and you need to replace it when all you need is a 40 dollar part.


EDIT**** iwajabitw you suck. why did you necro this?

 

[skull]

Keep it coming guys I love this. I've learned you home owners think both these guys are too expensive and too cheap at the same time. I've learned amanas better than goodman even though they are the same fucking thing literally made on the same line just different brand. Most of all I learned that homeowners are genuinely idiots and that I should charge a shit ton more.

Oh and for the american standard owners they are made by trane and just as shitty as every other piece of shit brand. As all makes use the same brand parts and have the same bullshit problems.

That and SEER is bullshit its made up by these companies under ideal conditions which mean nothing in the real world.

I try and give customers great deals with the cheaper equipment because I know its all bad. Now I know what they say behind my back. Here you guys are knocking brands and contractors when you don't know a fucking thing. I think I'm going to switch to carrier and rape everybody like my competitors.

 

[Adul]

Hi All,

About 2 seasons ago, cold air stopped coming from our home AC unit, but the fan was still working. Had someone come out and take a look at it, and they said the capacitor went bad, so we had it replaced and cool air started flowing again until. We enjoyed cool AC for about a year, then the AC again stopped working. Had the same guy come out and look at the AC unit and he said this time the problem was a bad compressor. He said it is still under warranty but that labor to replace the compressor would be well over $1000.

Since that price seemed quite high, we had another guy come out to examine the AC unit and give us a repair estimate as well as an estimate for replacing the entire AC unit. He said if we could get the compressor replaced under warranty, he could fix the AC for about $750. When asked how much a new unit would cost (we have a Trane - for a 1350 sq ft house), he said he could get an equivalent model new and installed for around $1400-$1600.

My question: The AC unit is like 8 years old only. Given the $750 price range to repair (provided I can get a replacement compressor from Trane under warranty), and price to get a brand new unit + installation ($1400-$1600), which option would make the most sense?

On one hand, if I get the AC fixed, I can save about $650-850. It's possible something else could go wrong with the unit in the future, but would it be safe to say that the big ticket items have been fixed and addressed, so whatever else could go wrong with the unit would be minor? Then again, labor to get those minor items addressed would be a good amount of money.

On the other hand, if I get a brand new unit, I could reasonably expect it to be problem free for years.

I'd appreciate some experienced input and feedback if you guys can share some experienced advice on this matter.

This sounds like a similar situation to what happened to me. It just led to a chain of events. At some point you cut your losses.

- We had the fan die on unit, replaced with a new one. $600ish dollars
- Since the A/C unit ran the whole day in the Arizona heat without this fan blowing I knew that compressor had to be fried. Sure enough it dies 1 month later, replaced it under warranty with Freon fill-up (which is no longer made as of this year). 850 bucks after a couple quotes.
- Unit dies again a few weeks later, same company that did compressor comes out to replace capacitor 450 bucks. ( should have been replaced with compressor, at least a good company will do that)
- The next year A/c Ran ok, but it did not cool as well, it cost more to run, etc
- We turn the A/C on a warm spring day, there is no cool air. We had a our yearly service scheduled with our normal company (not the company that did the compressor) so they took a look. No refrigerant is in the system. Shoddy workmanship with compressor which means it leaked.

We could get it fixed, but at this point I am tired of throwing money at it. It was only 7 years old too. We opted to get a new SEER 15 unit installed, added whole house air filtration, and some other little things. Cost 8800 bucks after rebates and discounts.

This year our bills where a good 100+ cheaper to run the A/C during the summer with a cooler house. We got a LENNOX signature series unit with 10 year warranty. We should be problem free for a while.

 

[Mayne]

As a guy that does this for a living. Just get a new a/c.