History: Iran's Democracy Destroyed by U.S.

[NoStateofMind]

If Americans Knew What We Did to Iran, Would We Still Talk About Using Force?

Hands on buzzers, for 500 points: this democratic leader was overthrown in 1953 by a US-organized coup in retaliation for nationalizing oil resources previously controlled by the British.

Who is Prime Minister Mohammad Mossadegh?

If you're a little rusty on the history of U.S.-Iran relations, here's a 6-minute video review:

CIA Overthrow the Democracy of Iran

If more Americans knew about this history, could our leaders blather on about supporting freedom and democracy in the Middle East they way they do? Would news media take them seriously if they did so? Would American pundits be so cavalier about the idea of bombing Iran, in flagrant violation of international law? Could people make fun of Senator Barack Obama for supporting real diplomacy with Iran and get away with it?

I don't claim that it would be impossible for U.S. politicians to talk about bombing Iran if "every schoolboy knew" what the United States did in Iran in 1953. But surely it would be more difficult.

Even with this as evidence, people will still support foeign wars and occupations in the "interests" of the U.S.

No wonder countries don't trust us, I wouldn't either.

Enjoy the history lesson.

 

[jpeyton]

The US has a long history of meddling in the affairs of other nations, to our benefit. Unfortunately, it usually has blowback or other consequences decades down the line.

 

[Farang]

This just in: the sky is blue.

 

[Aimster]

Well for the U.S it was good because we installed a regime that was able to fight the Soviets for us.
If the Shah had stayed in power 10 more years, then they would have been very capable of fighting the Soviets. All we had to do was sit back and watch.

The U.S never assisted the Shah at the end of his regime. We allowed the Shah's regime to collapse. What a terrible mistake that was.

If we are going to install a puppet regime, we better make sure it doesn't collapse. Especially after we take democracy away from them.
U.S could have given Iran billions in economic relief money in the late 1970s. Did it? NO. If the U.S had done so, the regime would not have collapsed.

Yet we do it to Egypt, Israel and Turkey. Wtvr.

 

[NaughtyGeek]

For bonus points, who was the head of the CIA when Iran threw us back out?

 

[NoStateofMind]

Originally posted by: NaughtyGeek
For bonus points, who was the head of the CIA when Iran threw us back out?

Bush sr? Its a guess.

 

[Martin]

Along the same lines, I thought this was good, and a bit funny:

What if Iran were America (And We Were Iran)

 

[colonel]

Guatemala

 

[LtPage1]

Originally posted by: Aimster
Well for the U.S it was good because we installed a regime that was able to fight the Soviets for us.
If the Shah had stayed in power 10 more years, then they would have been very capable of fighting the Soviets. All we had to do was sit back and watch.

The U.S never assisted the Shah at the end of his regime. We allowed the Shah's regime to collapse. What a terrible mistake that was.

If we are going to install a puppet regime, we better make sure it doesn't collapse. Especially after we take democracy away from them.
U.S could have given Iran billions in economic relief money in the late 1970s. Did it? NO. If the U.S had done so, the regime would not have collapsed.

Yet we do it to Egypt, Israel and Turkey. Wtvr.

:Q The Shah's government was more repressive than Saddam Hussein on a bad day. Those billions you wish we'd handed that fascist would have gone straight into military hardware to be used on his own people.

The current government is a direct result of our support of a hyper-repressive dictator who would never have been in power at all without our help. Yeah, I think a moderate democracy in the Middle East would be nice to have right about now.

Dear god, man. There were some really, REALLY stupid and immoral aspects to American foreign policy during the Cold War, and our support of the Shah comes in the top 10 list no problem.

 

[bamacre]

We have a long list of "friends" who end up later being enemies. Why would anyone want to be our friend?

 

[Craig234]

Originally posted by: Farang
This just in: the sky is blue.

What an idiotic post. Matters of life and death are being decided in the US with most voters unaware of the facts of this history, and you post that.

 

[Craig234]

Originally posted by: Aimster
Well for the U.S it was good because we installed a regime that was able to fight the Soviets for us.
If the Shah had stayed in power 10 more years, then they would have been very capable of fighting the Soviets. All we had to do was sit back and watch.

The U.S never assisted the Shah at the end of his regime. We allowed the Shah's regime to collapse. What a terrible mistake that was.

If we are going to install a puppet regime, we better make sure it doesn't collapse. Especially after we take democracy away from them.
U.S could have given Iran billions in economic relief money in the late 1970s. Did it? NO. If the U.S had done so, the regime would not have collapsed.

Yet we do it to Egypt, Israel and Turkey. Wtvr.

The mistake was in our overthrowing their democracy, which oh by the way had nothing to do with the Soviets and was for doing what England asked to keep cheaper oil.

You're a war criminal in principle for your desire to deny freedom and democracy to the people of Iran for your nation's greed.

The people of Iran would have had as much right to shoot you as you would to shoot someone trying to overthrow your government to install a tyrant for their benefit.

 

[Craig234]

Originally posted by: bamacre
We have a long list of "friends" who end up later being enemies. Why would anyone want to be our friend?

Stop choosing friends who are right-wing murdering thugs, and that can get better.

Lots of people want the US to be a friend - not an exploitave bully who cooperates in a criminal enterprise with the US where they get security in power and privilege in exchange for selling out their national interest to the US, such as with the Shah's willingness to sell oil cheap to the west.

That was the new colonialism - instead of occupying them, put a puppet in place to do it.

 

[Exterous]

I am surprised that people are surprised about this. We have a long history of meddling (Monroe Doctrine anyone?) as does every country that was/is a word power
Some quick ones that come to mind
England, France, German, Japan, China, Russia, Spain, even going back to Persia, Rome, Egypt (its a very very long list)

 

[piasabird]

Iran has done all the damage to itself. We did not force them to become a terrorist state or to attack Iraq in a long bloody war. Evil people just do evil things. The USA never forced people in Iran to be Muslim Extremists.

 

[Farang]

Originally posted by: Craig234

Originally posted by: Farang
This just in: the sky is blue.

What an idiotic post. Matters of life and death are being decided in the US with most voters unaware of the facts of this history, and you post that.

The OP is not anything shocking.. it is a well known fact. Even if some Americans don't know about it specifically they are aware that the U.S. overthrows governments that don't act in its self-interest.

 

[StageLeft]

Originally posted by: piasabird
Iran has done all the damage to itself. We did not force them to become a terrorist state or to attack Iraq in a long bloody war. Evil people just do evil things. The USA never forced people in Iran to be Muslim Extremists.

If I sell an angry kid on crack a bunch of handguns, I didn't force him to use them, either.

The OP is not anything shocking.. it is a well known fact. Even if some Americans don't know about it specifically they are aware that the U.S. overthrows governments that don't act in its self-interest.

Well known, not by many. I have no doubt that the majority of AMericans are quite content indeed with their ideas of US altruism.

 

[Drift3r]

One extreme tends to lead to another polar opposite extreme in it's response.

 

[Robor]

Originally posted by: Craig234

Originally posted by: Farang
This just in: the sky is blue.

What an idiotic post. Matters of life and death are being decided in the US with most voters unaware of the facts of this history, and you post that.

Don't be so jumpy. Farang is simply telling the truth. I think the people know the facts but recently the fear mongering by the Bush administration makes them think it's a necessary evil. You know, 'fight them over there...'.

 

[Vic]

Isn't Aimster an Iranian living in the US? I'm sure Craig knows more than him on this subject...

One of my best friends is a Persian, who grew up in Tehran under the Shah, and he's no fan of the current "democratic" theocracy in place right now. OTOH he doesn't want the US to attack Iran just because "Ahmadinejad is an idiot." His opinion (and I agree) is that it's just a lot of posturing between him and Bush, just like between Chavez and Bush. More show than reality.

I think most Americans, even those who consider themselves informed, really have no clue about Iran and the conditions there. It's a modern country with modern people. Tehran is like the New York City of the Middle East (but in the mountains). I think the only things I don't like about the culture are the alcohol prohibition and what they call popular music (disco is still alive and well in Iran, let me tell ya).

 

[Corn]

Originally posted by: Craig234

Originally posted by: Aimster
Well for the U.S it was good because we installed a regime that was able to fight the Soviets for us.
If the Shah had stayed in power 10 more years, then they would have been very capable of fighting the Soviets. All we had to do was sit back and watch.

The U.S never assisted the Shah at the end of his regime. We allowed the Shah's regime to collapse. What a terrible mistake that was.

If we are going to install a puppet regime, we better make sure it doesn't collapse. Especially after we take democracy away from them.
U.S could have given Iran billions in economic relief money in the late 1970s. Did it? NO. If the U.S had done so, the regime would not have collapsed.

Yet we do it to Egypt, Israel and Turkey. Wtvr.

The mistake was in our overthrowing their democracy, which oh by the way had nothing to do with the Soviets and was for doing what England asked to keep cheaper oil.

You're a war criminal in principle for your desire to deny freedom and democracy to the people of Iran for your nation's greed.

The people of Iran would have had as much right to shoot you as you would to shoot someone trying to overthrow your government to install a tyrant for their benefit.

Quoted for posterity. This has got to be one of the most worthless, insulting, and deranged posts ever composed here in P&N. Seek professional help Craig, you obviously need it.

 

[Mavtek3100]

Originally posted by: Martin
Along the same lines, I thought this was good, and a bit funny:

What if Iran were America (And We Were Iran)

That is an awesome article I thoroughly enjoyed it! Thanks for posting it! It really needs a topic of it's own!

 

[techs]

If any country did to America what America did to Iran we would nuke the crap out of them.

 

[TastesLikeChicken]

Originally posted by: Martin
Along the same lines, I thought this was good, and a bit funny:

What if Iran were America (And We Were Iran)

Interesting article but it's not quite apples to apples. First of all, Iran had a Constitutional Monarchy. The Shah had authority under that agreement and after Mossadeq made moves to increase his power and dissolve the parliament (Yeah, he wasn't exactly pro-democracy), the Shah dismissed him, which was completely within his authority to do, and Mossadeq refused to leave.

We need to stop pretending that the US overthrew Iran's democracy. That's highly revisionist. Iran's democracy, what little there was, was already down the tubes due to machinations within their own government. Not only that, but the US backed the Shah who was still in power and were encouraging him to do what he was authorized to do under Iran's Constitution.

But the revisionists of history love to twist this beyond recognition and pretend as if it's all our meddling that caused the problems in Iran. Baloney.

 

[ElFenix]

the US did such a great job of it that the guy we were supporting had to flee the country.

Originally posted by: Exterous
I am surprised that people are surprised about this. We have a long history of meddling (Monroe Doctrine anyone?) as does every country that was/is a word power
Some quick ones that come to mind
England, France, German, Japan, China, Russia, Spain, even going back to Persia, Rome, Egypt (its a very very long list)

the backbone of the monroe doctrine was the english navy, so i'm not certain how good an example it is.

not to mention the monroe doctrine was more about keeping france and spain from attempting to take back south america than anything else. it's not a very good example of meddling.