Hillary tries to change the rules.. AGAIN!

[palehorse]

OK, this is getting f'n ridiculous. Clinton has finally decided to throw in the FL/MI card, and moves the g'damn goalposts again -- essentially negating the entire Rules Committee.

The scary thing is that the Democratic Party might let the crazy bitch get away with it!

Clinton campaign retools delegate math
By Christina Bellantoni
May 6, 2008

DURHAM, N.C. ? Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton's campaign yesterday tried to redefine the delegate math for securing the Democratic presidential nomination, signaling its willingness to wage a divisive battle with front-runner Sen. Barack Obama through the summer.

Mr. Obama, meanwhile, questioned Mrs. Clinton's trustworthiness heading into today's primaries in Indiana and North Carolina.

Top Clinton aides said the nominee must win based on a tally that includes delegates from Florida and Michigan, which held January primaries that were disqualified by party rules. The campaign's "Delegate Hub" Web site identifies 2,208 as the total delegates needed to be nominated, or 183 more than the threshold of 2,025 set by the Democratic National Committee's rules.

"That's what we believe is the standard for deciding this ? who has the majority of the total delegates including Michigan and Florida to decide the nomination," said Clinton strategist Geoff Garin.

The Obama campaign has long accused Team Clinton of "moving the goal posts" to avoid facing the reality that it is nearly impossible for her to catch up, and his supporters in the Democratic Party's hierarchy reacted angrily yesterday to the idea that the 2,025-delegate finish line could be changed, especially because Mr. Obama is 273 delegates from reaching that magic number according to his campaign count.

"When you totally ignore the rules, letting these people change the outcome, that doesn't pass the straight-face test," Allan Katz of Tallahassee, Fla., a member of the DNC's executive committee, told The Washington Times.

"It's not just a question of changing the rules, it's ignoring the reason the [DNC's] rules committee is there, to enforce the rules. You don't get relieved of that responsibility if you don't like the outcome," Mr. Katz said.

Mr. Garin said "neither candidate" will have the needed delegates by June 3 when the last votes are counted in South Dakota and Montana. But Mr. Obama, should he win over a large bloc of superdelegates ? elected officials and party activists who help decide the nomination ? could get to 2,025 by then.

I'd have more respect for Clinton, and her fanbois, if they'd just admit that they're willing to lie, cheat, or steal the fucking nomination if they have to!

 

[Bird222]

Is she on drugs?

 

[StageLeft]

Ah yes the final concession speech will be one in which she cries and her supporters realize, finally, that she isn't quite going to steal ALL our money to give to them and that they are in fact losers and have to admit it

 

[nageov3t]

Hillary Clinton: traveled through time to save the world from the evil robot kings, beat up Kubela Kong, single handedly fought off an army of snipers on a bosnian tarmac, and now apparently she's also a website admin (she must do it while sitting around waiting for 3 am phone calls).

if Hillary wins Indiana tonight, you can be guaranteed that FL/MI are going to make their way to the rules committee at the convention.

 

[Robor]

I read this over on Yahoo. While the FL delegates are debatable she had the gall to include MI when Obama wasn't even on the ticket. Disgusting. I hope she loses both states and this is over tomorrow.

 

[Robor]

Originally posted by: loki8481
Hillary Clinton: traveled through time to save the world from the evil robot kings, beat up Kubela Kong, single handedly fought off an army of snipers on a bosnian tarmac, and now apparently she's also a website admin (she must do it while sitting around waiting for 3 am phone calls).

if Hillary wins Indiana tonight, you can be guaranteed that FL/MI are going to make their way to the rules committee at the convention.

I have no problem with that. FL and MI are important states and the (D)'s don't need them PO'ed during the GE. The question is, how? Seat FL as is even though there was no campaigning there? I live in FL and didn't get a chance to vote for Obama. What about MI? Obama wasn't on the ballot.

 

[Lemon law]

Rules fight during political conventions are as American as Mom and Apple pie. To stay viable, Hillary has to try to move the goal posts. I doubt it will work but she must try.
She will still have to wake up and smell the coffee when Obama does go over the top. Until them, she has to pretend she is still viable.

 

[Phokus]

Can we just round up all the Clinton/Bush loving yahoos and kick them out of the country?

 

[ProfJohn]

According to an on air report Hannity did yesterday Hillary just about controls the Democrat rule committee that could vote to seat the MI and FL delegations.

Before such a vote would happen though Hillary would have to do very well in todays primaries and win WV and KY by big margins.
That would give the rules committee some cover by pointing out Hillary's strength over Obama's etc etc.

We will know more after todays results. Hillary needs to do very well in both states before the Democratic Party risks blowing itself up on behalf of the Clintons.

 

[nageov3t]

Originally posted by: Phokus
Can we just round up all the Clinton/Bush loving yahoos and kick them out of the country?

49% of the democratic party? by all means.

 

[jonks]

I think she reads P&N and does this stuff just to watch people throw fits.

 

[palehorse]

I wonder if she'll have the audacity to protest his acceptance speech after he hits 2025... would she dare?

Originally posted by: loki8481
...and now apparently she's also a website admin (she must do it while sitting around waiting for 3 am phone calls).

this new math is being parroted by her top aides and strategists, so it obviously goes well beyond her webpage.

 

[nageov3t]

Originally posted by: Robor

Originally posted by: loki8481
Hillary Clinton: traveled through time to save the world from the evil robot kings, beat up Kubela Kong, single handedly fought off an army of snipers on a bosnian tarmac, and now apparently she's also a website admin (she must do it while sitting around waiting for 3 am phone calls).

if Hillary wins Indiana tonight, you can be guaranteed that FL/MI are going to make their way to the rules committee at the convention.

I have no problem with that. FL and MI are important states and the (D)'s don't need them PO'ed during the GE. The question is, how? Seat FL as is even though there was no campaigning there? I live in FL and didn't get a chance to vote for Obama. What about MI? Obama wasn't on the ballot.

MI kinda pisses me off... it's such a clusterfuck, I really want Dean's head over it. but I wish Obama had grown a pair and didn't cockblock the new primary.

 

[Starbuck1975]

Before such a vote would happen though Hillary would have to do very well in todays primaries and win WV and KY by big margins.

Well this is the topic open for debate...define big margins in states that provide a relatively low delegate count.

The goal posts keep shifting...mathematically, the contest is essentially over...I do not understand her justifications for "fighting on", despite an ego driven sense of entitlement.

First, she had to win Texas AND Ohio by large margins...she didn't, as Obama remained close enough in the delegate count to essentially negate her gains there.

Then she had to win PA by DOUBLE DIGIT margins...she didn't.

Now she has to win Indiana...why? South Carolina is the bigger delegate prize, and Obama has the presumed lead there. Even if she wins Indiana and South Carolina, it doesn't change anything.

The superdelegates are trickling towards Obama, so she is losing that fight.

The only card left in the deck is to play MI and FL...completely unjustified IMO.

 

[RightIsWrong]

Originally posted by: loki8481

MI kinda pisses me off... it's such a clusterfuck, I really want Dean's head over it. but I wish Obama had grown a pair and didn't cockblock the new primary.

Wait. You wish that Obama had no respect for the rules set forth by the party that he is trying to gain the nomination for?

 

[mxyzptlk]

Im at the point where I just say fuck it and let the democratic party self destruct. It's not like they've been adding anything meaningful to political discourse as of late. I'm young, only 26, but throughout most of my voting career the options put up by the left have been either ineffective cooks or eerily similiar to the right in everything but name. Hillary seems poised to win the nomination via rovian tactics which is apparently the only way to reach the idiot masses who are falling for it.

So I say fuck it. If the people really want to continue down the path that the previous administrations have set, then fine.. let them. The Daily Show and Colbert Report are certain to have plenty of material for the foreseeable future.

Four more years! Four more years! Four more years! FOUR MORE YEARS!!

 

[lupi]

Anyone not realizing after the last couple weeks that in the end MI & FL will have an impact is just fooling themselves.

 

[b0mbrman]

Originally posted by: lupi
Anyone not realizing after the last couple weeks that in the end MI & FL will have an impact is just fooling themselves.

I'm clearly fooling myself. Can you explain the logical steps?

 

[Bird222]

Originally posted by: loki8481
MI kinda pisses me off... it's such a clusterfuck, I really want Dean's head over it. but I wish Obama had grown a pair and didn't cockblock the new primary.

I don't think it's fair to do a revote because these elections are not in a vacuum. The contests held now are gonna be different than they would have been at their previous date.

 

[Harvey]

Huck Fillary!

 

[nageov3t]

Originally posted by: RightIsWrong

Originally posted by: loki8481

MI kinda pisses me off... it's such a clusterfuck, I really want Dean's head over it. but I wish Obama had grown a pair and didn't cockblock the new primary.

Wait. You wish that Obama had no respect for the rules set forth by the party that he is trying to gain the nomination for?

a new primary would not have been a violation of the rules.

 

[StageLeft]

Originally posted by: b0mbrman

Originally posted by: lupi
Anyone not realizing after the last couple weeks that in the end MI & FL will have an impact is just fooling themselves.

I'm clearly fooling myself. Can you explain the logical steps?

I am quite sure one of two things will happen:

1) Obama will be winning the nomination by a relatively small margin and MI and FL will not get included.

2) Obama will win by a large margin and they will be included but not be enough to give the nod to hillary. This will be merely to assuage the whiners, but they will not be assuaged if it actually means thieving the nomination from Obama, which will piss off far more people than if Hillary loses because MI and FL are not included.

 

[jonks]

Bump for prescience. She was off a bit, as they halved the FL/MI delegates' votes, but calling her "insane" or "on drugs" or "fucking ridiculous" seems in retrospect to be pretty short sighted while Hillary's guess was proven almost right. They seated the delegates as she suspected they would, and as they needed to do in order to stand a shadow of a chance in FL/MI in the general.

So have the people here who ridiculed her math with quite vulgar terms come to an alternate conclusion? She wasn't exactly right, but she knew 2025 wasn't gonna be the mark. And now it's accepted as fact.