Highly impressed by NVidia's reference cooler!

Carfax83

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So, with all the bashing going on with the reference cooler or the GTX 1080 Ti, I thought I'd make a thread to show how impressed I am with this cooler :D

It's been over 6 years since I've had a reference cooler on a GPU. The last time was when I had two GTX 580s, and they were loud as hell in an annoying way. They sounded like blow dryers, and weren't particularly effective out of the box. In fact, when I bought two EVGA high flow brackets for my 580s, they shaved off about 4 to 5 degrees if I recall.

And while my Titan Xp's blower is loud as hell, it's not an annoying sound. The most accurate description I can give is that it sounds like a high pitched static sound. But the cooling ability is actually very good. My idle temps are about 30c on the desktop with no other programs open, and about 32c with Edge browser open.

During gaming at stock clocks, the fan will rev up to about 53% and the temp will hit 83 or 84c, but it's dead silent. I cannot hear the fan at all over my system fans. Also, at stock fan curve, the GPU will usually be running in the high 1600s to low 1700s or there abouts in Mass Effect Andromeda, which is a graphically heavy game. In lighter games like Doom, it will be in the 1700s consistently, with the framerates hitting 200 FPS at times.

The point though, is that the GPU is always above stock boost, which is 1584 and does not drop anywhere near the stock clock. Some of you might be thinking "well duh," but given some of the criticisms I have seen leveled at the stock cooler, you'd think that it had issues serious issues with throttling, but this isn't the case.

NVidia has done some significant improvements on the cooler, even since the original Titan X Pascal. HardOCP did a comparison between a GTX 1080 Ti and a Titan X Pascal overclocked to the same settings, and the GTX 1080 Ti's load temp was a whopping 8 degrees cooler than the Titan X Pascal, and that's with a higher boost clock as well.

As far as my personal overclocking experience goes, it depends on the game. Sustaining above 2ghz is not feasible in graphically intensive titles with the fan speed at 75%. From my experience so far, the clock speed will usually drop below 2ghz, and be in the low to mid 1900s in games like the Witcher 3 maxed out. It doesn't drop below 1900 at all from what I've seen though

But how much better would a top notch open air cooler really be? I don't think that an open air cooler could maintain above 2ghz either in graphically heavy games. That was my experience with my Zotac Amp Extreme GTX 1080 when I had it. It would automatically boost to above 2ghz, but would drop down and be in the upper 1900s and stay there in intense situations.

The only way to get 2ghz and above constantly would be to go water, but investing in water just for 100mhz or less extra on the core doesn't seem worth it to me at all.

That said, I don't plan on doing much overclocking anyway. I've always found GPU overclocking annoying, which is why I've always bought the fastest stock clocked models so that I don't have to manually overclock them. But the Titan Xp at stock clocks is plenty fast enough for me :D
 

ZGR

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Oct 26, 2012
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I think that is quite poor to be honest. I hate how Nvidia's boost is thermally integrated; and having those temps would want me to go water ASAP.

You are leaving much performance off the table by using the reference cooler. An aftermarket overclocked 1080 ti will be just as quiet and still hit the same framerates.

Pascal thrives on low temperatures and throttles hard, especially past 70 celcius.

An open air cooler can absolutely maintain a 2ghz 1080 ti. The real question is how quiet it will be. At 1.8-1.9 GHz? I bet that is near inaudible if dual/triple fan during stress test.

It may sound trivial for a 1070 or 1080, but 100-200 mhz is a lot for a Titan Xp. These cards have a lot more cores and bandwidth. You just got the full fat GP102 I think it deserves the best thermals as well.

I am glad Nvidia is finally offering a fully unlocked Titan, but this reference cooler crap needs to end. It will always be barely acceptable.
 

Rubycon

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It's FAR from dead silent [sic] at 53%. Your reference (noise floor) is high enough due to the rest of the parts of your system that it's not noticeable.
It's definitely not annoying like 5800 ultra or the whine of high speed server fans, etc.


It does get the heat out of the case whereas the open style tend to be good case heaters.
HOWEVER, those boards (Strix, Classified, et al.) often use custom boards with far more robust power delivery (dual 8 pin PEG connectors) and thus with waterblock attached, can achieve mile high overclocks with ease.
 

Carfax83

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You are leaving much performance off the table by using the reference cooler. An aftermarket overclocked 1080 ti will be just as quiet and still hit the same framerates.

I don't think I'm leaving any performance off the table necessarily. I can still overclock if I want, I just can't be bothered. My card will run at 2ghz+, but it won't be able to sustain it in heavy graphics situations. Well, maybe with the fan at 100% LOL!

An open air cooler can absolutely maintain a 2ghz 1080 ti. The real question is how quiet it will be. At 1.8-1.9 GHz? I bet that is near inaudible if dual/triple fan during stress test.

The catch was under graphics intensive scenarios. Let me give you an example of what I consider graphics intensive scenarios. Witcher 3 is a GPU intensive title we can all agree right? There are some places in that game where the GPU is hit especially hard. One of those places is in this screenshot that I took when I had my Zotac Amp Extreme GTX 1080.

The framerate in this screenshot is 50 FPS, which is much lower than average for this card. The reason why it's so low is because of the shadows which is on ultra, and the unicorn which has hairworks enabled. Despite the card running at over 2ghz, it throttled down to below 2ghz or so after a few minutes in this area.

YVVhkM.png


I have no doubt that an aftermarket 1080 Ti would throttle down below 2ghz in this same area as well.

It may sound trivial for a 1070 or 1080, but 100-200 mhz is a lot for a Titan Xp. These cards have a lot more cores and bandwidth. You just got the full fat GP102 I think it deserves the best thermals as well.

Are you sure about that? Look at this TPU review:

Gigabyte Aorus GTX 1080 Ti Extreme

perfrel_2560_1440.png


If you look at all the benches, you'll notice that the gain in performance for the aftermarket model vs the reference model is very small. I surmise this is because most games today are shader bound, so shader efficiency and shader count make a bigger difference than clock speed up to a certain point. For the GTX 1080 Ti, the optimal clock speed is probably around 1.9ghz. Above that, the gain in speed starts to taper off, as you can see by this graph:

Scaling-1080Ti.png


I am glad Nvidia is finally offering a fully unlocked Titan, but this reference cooler crap needs to end. It will always be barely acceptable.

I am not really bashing open air coolers even though it may seem like it. I used open air coolers for years, and only now have I gone back to a reference cooler. All I am saying is that there are pros and cons for each, and that the reference cooler isn't nowhere as bad as most people think.
 
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Carfax83

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It's FAR from dead silent [sic] at 53%. Your reference (noise floor) is high enough due to the rest of the parts of your system that it's not noticeable.

Yeah that's probably right. My system fans are definitely on the loud side. But even when I set them at a lower speed, I still can't hear the GPU fan.

It does get the heat out of the case whereas the open style tend to be good case heaters.

Yeah, this is one of the biggest pluses of the reference cooler. I've already noticed that my main 140mm and 200mm exhaust fans blow much cooler air now after a lengthy gaming session than before.
HOWEVER, those boards (Strix, Classified, et al.) often use custom boards with far more robust power delivery (dual 8 pin PEG connectors) and thus with waterblock attached, can achieve mile high overclocks with ease.

What do you think about that graph I posted above? It's from THWG and it shows a custom water cooler overclocked GTX 1080 Ti FE at 2.1ghz. As you can see, performance gains starts to level out significantly after 1.9ghz.

I'm guessing it has to do with shader efficiency. Pascal shader cores, while very efficient have a sweet spot in terms of clock speed where going above results in marginal gains.
 

JoeRambo

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What do you think about that graph I posted above? It's from THWG and it shows a custom water cooler overclocked GTX 1080 Ti FE at 2.1ghz. As you can see, performance gains starts to level out significantly after 1.9ghz.

Fun fact is that it does not need default volts for 1.9Ghz either. With some undervolting and card lottery, 0.9V is plenty for 1.9Ghz as long as you can keep temps low.
some guy from reddit:

https://i.imgur.com/2RmYOMB.jpg

That is sub 200w in game and thermals/noise are happy as well.
 
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OatisCampbell

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I ended up with a 1080 Ti FE, it was time for the R290 to go. Tax return was here, Vega was not, and I feared a. 1080 Ti gouging b. delay on Vega c. unknown Vega performance.

Definitely leaves 5-10% of the performance untapped, might end up getting one of the Hybrid kits if I see one on Ebay or EVGA lowers price. ($150 for a AIO seems high to me)

The build quality seems very good though, and I like the look of the thing. I wouldn't call it "quiet" gaming, but I wouldn't call it "annoying" either.(I had the IceQ fan on my 290) I like that it sends the heat out of my case.

We've seen much worse reference coolers over the years than this one. (FX5800, GTX480, R290 come to mind) At roughly the same price the open air coolers make more sense.
 

Yakk

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It's not quiet, really not, or very efficient, but it does looks ok though.
 

Headfoot

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My Gigabyte Gaming 1080 Ti with 3 fans is inaudible over my CPU water cooler pump even pushing maxed graphics on witcher 3 at 5760x1080. So glad I didn't go with the reference cooler
 

Bacon1

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i really think you are one of these guys who likes everything nvidia does

Gotta justify that $1200 purchase somehow. I sure know that I wouldn't want my $1200 GPU to be able to be run at full power / speeds and would be happy when it thermal throttled while actually gaming.

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OatisCampbell

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Gotta justify that $1200 purchase somehow. I sure know that I wouldn't want my $1200 GPU to be able to be run at full power / speeds and would be happy when it thermal throttled while actually gaming.
I've never spent near $1200 on computer part (too poor) but I think if I bought that one I'd justify the purchase with "It's faster than everything else, even throttled.".

But that's just me.

My guess is chipmakers like NVIDIA and AMD don't sell reference parts with the best HSF because they want to allow their partners (EVGA, Sapphire, Etc) to have that market differentiation.

The NVIDIA parts pretty much run above their advertised clock speed, 1080 Ti is supposed to boost to 1582 by spec, but AT found it averaged higher than that in every game with the reference HSF:

http://www.anandtech.com/show/11180/the-nvidia-geforce-gtx-1080-ti-review/16

Technically you could say ANY card is "cheating the owner out of some performance" if it doesn't have a full water block and a good full water system attached. (or LN2 if you want to go to a pointless extreme)

The 1080Ti cooler obviously isn't the best, but it's in the ballpark for reference coolers:

http://www.guru3d.com/articles_pages/geforce_gtx_1080_ti_review,10.html

I'm pretty satisfied with it, obviously if I would have known there would be Gaming Xs and the like within $50 so soon In would have waited. Still might go Vega if AMD brings it and I can get a good price for the Ti. :)
 

Carfax83

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i really think you are one of these guys who likes everything nvidia does

Oh look, the resident anti NVidia troll :D

FYI, nothing is wrong with the reference cooler. In fact, AMD probably wish they could design a blower this effective. The reference cooler does a good job all things considering, and is a lot more flexible than open air coolers which only work well in systems with high ventilation and do poorly in multi GPU.

Again let me reiterate. This post isn't about putting down open air coolers or water cooling. It's just an opinion of someone that hasn't used a reference cooled GPU in several years. This Titan Xp with the reference blower has made me realize that open air coolers aren't 100% superior to reference blowers.

There are pros and cons.
 

Carfax83

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My Gigabyte Gaming 1080 Ti with 3 fans is inaudible over my CPU water cooler pump even pushing maxed graphics on witcher 3 at 5760x1080. So glad I didn't go with the reference cooler

Good for you. Mine is also inaudible as well on the Witcher 3 at 1440p max settings at high framerates. It's funny how certain people took this post as though I'm somehow bashing open air coolers. I used open air coolers for years, and never had a problem with them.

Only now after using a reference type cooler again do I see that open air coolers are not inherently superior to reference coolers. With open air coolers, there is a trade off for increased cooling performance, namely that the heat is dumped into your chassis to increase the temp of your other components. If you have good ventilation, then this isn't a problem. But in PCs with a smaller chassis or poor ventilation, then obviously a reference cooler would be superior. Same with multi GPU.

So obviously, open air coolers aren't ideal in every situation. Same thing with water cooling. Water cooling has vastly superior cooling performance to air cooling, but it comes at the cost of convenience.
 

Carfax83

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Gotta justify that $1200 purchase somehow. I sure know that I wouldn't want my $1200 GPU to be able to be run at full power / speeds and would be happy when it thermal throttled while actually gaming.

I said several times in my OP that it doesn't throttle. Under the heaviest load, the GPU remains ABOVE stock boost clock with the stock fan curve. The only time when it throttles is when it's overclocked, and even then it doesn't drop below 1924mhz. That to me is acceptable considering it only has a single fan.

And I don't have to justify anything. I buy what I want, when I want. And since I am so impressed by this Titan Xp, I will probably buy another Titan GPU for Volta, provided it's the full fat die :D
 
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Bouowmx

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Depends on the working definition of throttling. If throttling is below rated boost, then pretty much all solutions can be classified as no throttling. If throttling is below absolute maximum GPU Boost (which reduces frequency beginning near 50 C), then almost no solutions, except liquid cooling and liquid nitrogen, can be classified as no throttling.
 
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Rubycon

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Yeah that's probably right. My system fans are definitely on the loud side. But even when I set them at a lower speed, I still can't hear the GPU fan.



Yeah, this is one of the biggest pluses of the reference cooler. I've already noticed that my main 140mm and 200mm exhaust fans blow much cooler air now after a lengthy gaming session than before.


What do you think about that graph I posted above? It's from THWG and it shows a custom water cooler overclocked GTX 1080 Ti FE at 2.1ghz. As you can see, performance gains starts to level out significantly after 1.9ghz.

I'm guessing it has to do with shader efficiency. Pascal shader cores, while very efficient have a sweet spot in terms of clock speed where going above results in marginal gains.

Just based on one game?
No.
Keeping it cool, increasing power limits and higher ram clocks will guarantee a better experience. This is the realm of a custom block and enough (radiator) capacity to keep coolant temps close to ambient - especially if this coolant is also cooling the host CPU.
 

happy medium

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If throttling is below absolute maximum GPU Boost (which reduces frequency beginning near 50 C),

I think its 58 C when Pascal starts to throttle.
And it has 6 different throttling points after that, each giving you less boost.
 

woozle64

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Aug 13, 2016
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I really like the overall build quality/feel of my FE 1080 Ti from evga, but the FE fan is almost unbearably loud. It's easily the loudest thing in the room, only upside is that it's not coil whine.

I'm definitely getting a hybrid cooler for it at some point
 

moonbogg

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The new Xp is a beast and it takes a 1080ti OC'd to the ragged edge on water to even come close, and it still can't beat it. So the halo effect is real as the card can't be touched. If it were me, I'd personally throw a water block on it and push the performance that much further. I found that once I went water cooling, the initial investment is the only part that stings. Add an extra $130 to the cost of whatever card you get and you are rewarded with silent, cool, non throttling performance at maximum OC all the time. My rig is so quiet I can hear my wife turning the page of her book in the next room. Its completely quiet and it stays like that whether idle or under full load, gaming for hours or whatever. Its also nice to have open headphones and not have sound pollution from the PC fans leak into the headphones. Once you go water you won't want to go back. At least I don't. Also, Imagine, no more Eifel Tower hanging from your motherboard? Go water and you'll feel like a new man.
 

Carfax83

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Just based on one game?
No.
Keeping it cool, increasing power limits and higher ram clocks will guarantee a better experience. This is the realm of a custom block and enough (radiator) capacity to keep coolant temps close to ambient - especially if this coolant is also cooling the host CPU.

I'm not saying that performance won't increase from water cooling or that you won't get a better experience, because you obviously will. But performance tapering off at some point should be expected in any game, because these shader cores don't have unlimited efficiency.
 

Carfax83

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I really like the overall build quality/feel of my FE 1080 Ti from evga, but the FE fan is almost unbearably loud. It's easily the loudest thing in the room, only upside is that it's not coil whine.

I'm definitely getting a hybrid cooler for it at some point

Wow, you must have a really quiet PC if you think it's that loud! :eek: What fan speed does yours top out at on the stock fan curve? Mine tops out at 53%, which for me is inaudible.
 

Carfax83

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The new Xp is a beast and it takes a 1080ti OC'd to the ragged edge on water to even come close, and it still can't beat it. So the halo effect is real as the card can't be touched. If it were me, I'd personally throw a water block on it and push the performance that much further. I found that once I went water cooling, the initial investment is the only part that stings. Add an extra $130 to the cost of whatever card you get and you are rewarded with silent, cool, non throttling performance at maximum OC all the time. My rig is so quiet I can hear my wife turning the page of her book in the next room. Its completely quiet and it stays like that whether idle or under full load, gaming for hours or whatever. Its also nice to have open headphones and not have sound pollution from the PC fans leak into the headphones. Once you go water you won't want to go back. At least I don't. Also, Imagine, no more Eifel Tower hanging from your motherboard? Go water and you'll feel like a new man.

I've been tempted a few times believe me. The main issue I have with water cooling is the lack of convenience. I mess around with my rig all the time, and I upgrade often. Having to tear apart the water cooling system every time I change parts sounds like it would be a pain.

Also what happens if something fails or starts to leak? The only enhanced cooling I can see myself getting would be one of those hybrid coolers, but I'm not sure it would fit in my system given the "Eiffel Tower," I have strapped to my CPU. :D
 

moonbogg

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I've been tempted a few times believe me. The main issue I have with water cooling is the lack of convenience. I mess around with my rig all the time, and I upgrade often. Having to tear apart the water cooling system every time I change parts sounds like it would be a pain.

Also what happens if something fails or starts to leak? The only enhanced cooling I can see myself getting would be one of those hybrid coolers, but I'm not sure it would fit in my system given the "Eiffel Tower," I have strapped to my CPU. :D

I had those anxieties as well. Complex rotary fittings seem to be the source of most leaks from what I've read and seen. I use simple barbs. Anyway this needs to be taken to the cases and cooling forum. I highly encourage you to start a thread over there. Title it anything, just start a thread and I'll continue to rudely pressure and attempt to convert you over there.
 

Carfax83

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I don't know man. Seems like an awful lot of trouble to go through for about 5-10 extra frames per second depending on the game. :worried: And Gsync makes the games so smooth already.....