High End Gaming Laptop Questions.

[ZzZGuy]

Getting board sitting around waiting for a job call and realized how nice it would be to have a gaming laptop (sitting around doing nothing but reading for close to 2 weeks 4,000 km from the gaming PC gets tiring).

I'm basically looking for a high end desktop replacement laptop for games and some movies/music. Also hoping that there might be some upgradability, though I don't expect much (graphics card, cpu, ram is what I'm hoping for). I don't do much photo/movie editing, mostly just games.

I'm willing to spend the money because a car is not a option for me and I need something for the future in way of portable entertainment when I go out to the middle of no where in a work camp in the oil sands of Canada for anywhere from 2 weeks to 3 months at a time working 7 days a week (look up camps at the Syncrude website).

The other thing I have been wondering about is if something better is due out in a few months, I don't mind waiting.


Here is what I am currently looking at (it'll be 2 months minimum before I get it):

* Dell XPS M1730 ($4,708 Canadian, warranty not included)
http://www1.ca.dell.com/conten...a&l=en&s=dhs&cs=cadhs1
(anandtech review) http://www.anandtech.com/showdoc.aspx?i=3242&p=9

PROCESSOR
Intel® Core? 2 Extreme X9000 (2.8GHz/800Mhz FSB, 6MB Cache)
DISPLAY
17 inch UltraSharp TrueLife Wide-screen WUXGA
OPERATING SYSTEM (the Canadian site doesn't give the option for having both the USA one does)
Genuine Windows Vista? Ultimate Edition
MEMORY
4GB Shared Dual Channel DDR2 SDRAM at 667MHz
HARD DRIVE
RAID Performance: 400GB (2x200GB) 7200RPM
GRAPHICS CARD
NVIDIA® SLI? Dual GeForce® 8800M GTX with 1GB GDDR3 Memory
WIRELESS CARD
Intel Next-Gen Wireless-N
BLUETOOTH
Built-in Bluetooth capability (2.0 EDR)
SOUND OPTIONS
Integrated Sound Blaster Audigy HD Software Edition
PHYSICS ACCELERATOR (no option to leave it out)
AGEIA? PhysX? Physics Accelerator

* Alienware Area-51 m17x ($5,614.00 Canadian)
http://www.alienware.com/Produ...ges/notebook_m17x.aspx

Graphics Card
Dual 512MB NVIDIA® GeForce® Go 8800M GTX ? SLI Enabled
Display
17" WideUXGA 1920 x 1200 LCD with Clearview Technology ? Black
Processor
Intel® Core? 2 Extreme X9000 2.8GHz (6MB Cache 800MHz FSB)
Memory
4GB Dual Channel DDR2 SO-DIMM at 667MHz ? 2 x 2048MB
Operating System
Windows Vista® Ultimate (no option)
Hard Drive
500GB (250GB x 2) 7,200RPM (8MB Cache)
Wireless
Internal Intel® Wireless 4965 a/b/g/Draft-N Mini-Card
Sound Card
External Creative X-Fi Xtreme Audio Card
Warranty
3-Year AlienCare Toll-Free 24/7 Phone Support w/ Onsite Service

* Sager NP9262 ($4198.00 US, only left out the back pack from the price)
http://www.sagernotebook.com/p...customed.php?pid=29175

Display
17" Wide Viewing Angles WUXGA LCD with Super Glossy Surface (1920 x 1200)
Processor (Desktop CPU)
Intel® Core? 2 Quad Processor Q6700 / 8MB L2 Cache, 2.66GHz, 1066MHz FSB
Graphics Card
Dual Nvidia GeForce 8800M GTX Graphics with 512MB DDR3 Video Memory in SLI mode
Operating System
Genuine MS Windows® VISTA ULTIMATE 32/64-Bit Edition (only 2 gigs of ram offered with XP)
Memory
4GB Dual Channel DDR2 SDRAM at 800MHz - 2 X 2048MB
Hard Drive
Two 200GB 7200rpm SATA 300 Hard Drive in RAID-0
Sound Card
Built-in Intel® High Definition 5.1CH Sound System
Wireless Network Card
Intel PRO/Wireless 4965AGN - 802.11A/B/G/N Wireless LAN Module
Warranty
Sager 3 Year Limited Parts & Labor Warranty w/Three-Day Shipping Both Ways Paid + 30 days No Dead Pixel Insurance



Alienware looks to cost more for less it would seem, but it has everything I want still. I'm wondering if anyone knows some reason why this would cost more, is the cooling superior? More durable? Something I missed?
I don't like the idea of buying dell for anything high end (I'll probably have to format the damn thing to get rid of all the bloat ware) but they'll get my money if they are the best.

I used to mail myself my desktop, but that is no longer a option.

If there is something better out please do tell.

Thanks for any help you guys can give me.


Tech Specs of Nivida cards (desktop and mobile)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/C...Units#GeForce_8_series

Tech Specs of relevant Intel CPU's (desktop and mobile)
http://www.intel.com/products/...2xe/specifications.htm

 

[OmniOck]

Gaming Laptops are so gimped in their design, because more processing power creates more heat, which is hard to disperse in a laptop. Furthermore, all the parts and heat sinks need to be cut downed in size so everything would fit. I would say not to touch a gaming laptop, not just because of price, but because laptops, and gaming demands, just don't fit together. Don't even get me started with battery life in those things. Are you certain you need a gaming laptop to survive? To take a gaming laptop out of a residential environment and into the Canadian wild is just asking for trouble. It will be heavy, it'll die out on you, it'll be ridiculously hot, and what happens if the already tight parts get busted, which I would think is more likely to happen with a gaming laptop. Getting a high performance general use laptop would probably be nicer. Instead of gaming, watch some movies, read some books, study some textbook.

Excuse my little rant, just wanted to drive that point home. Onto your question. The two you listed appear almost identical, so what about warranty information and possible upgrade-ability? I remember a few years back, Alienware laptops allowed end users to upgrade the graphics card since it was mounted on the bottom.

And lastly, what about a Panasonic Toughbook, I've been looking at those.

 

[ZzZGuy]

Thanks for your comments.

Yes, I know that I'll be getting the equivalent of 8800 GT's out of the 8800M GTX's and other such gimpness. And yes I want it that much, I want it because the last job I had up there was 12 hours a day, 7 days a week for 24 days straight with no social life what-so-ever, they don't even allow woman into the male section of the camp (at least at syncrude). I had the option of taking 4 days off (i'd stay in camp) then doing another 24 days, though I took a different job for various reasons. At some point I'm going to snap, if one of these lap tops helps me last a little longer it'll be making me money off it, now if only it could help with the camp food... "Mmmm, cheerios with gravy" as a change. I want to be able to play the latest games at least medium settings (far cry 2 anyone?), I've realized consoles don't cut it and I'll be kicking myself in the ass if I get anything less then the top gaming laptops. There is also the fact I'll be getting this in a few months, the price could drop (more likely a sale).


For heat I planned on getting a cooling "tray" for lack of a better word which props the bottom off the ground and adds extra air flow. Good you mention this as I would most likely need a quality heavy duty one to help at all. I am aware that heat will be a issue which I will be looking into further for each model.

I am not overly concerned how long the battery will last in terms of how long a full charge will last you. It may be used to browse a airports internet on batter power and that's it. I intend it as a portable desk top replacement. Most camps have a power supply, so all I need is a damn good surge protector (syncrude being off the grid making their own power which has had a history of frying expensive stuff).

It really isn't that bad getting to the camps in the oil sands, it's just working there. Here is what the laptop will go through in my case.
1- 12 hour plane ride as a carry on. (sometimes this step will be skipped)
2- 4 hour bus ride (those really BIG buses)
3- 40 minute taxi ride depending on traffic
4- Carrying from check in desk to room

Oh and the dell one weighs 10 pounds.

I intend on getting a well padded back pack for carrying the laptop around and the longest warranty I can get. Frankly I'm more concerned that it will be stolen, so much so I'll be checking into theft insurance for it.

I'm not much into movies or TV, and I'm currently reading up on evolution and intelligent design, "Origin of Species" being next along with various fantasy and fiction novels, magazines (though those won't last long) and collage text books to review areas I'm getting rusty on. Heck, I'm even taking a 1/700 battle ship model with me this time to paint.

I have alternatives, but they are not as good a escape as a really good PC game (except for the very rare book like "speaker for the dead" I just finished).

-edit- Spelling and to mention I've already gone through this with my last choice to build a highish end desktop for the time. I just couldn't justify the price difference at the time and worked out. Before I began looking at laptops I was thinking of a major upgrade a few months after the next gen GPU comes out or maybe the next one). -edit-

-edit- looking up Panasonic Toughbook -edit-

 

[ZzZGuy]

-woops, just noticed the double post

 

[onlyCOpunk]

Sager 9262

Uses Quad Core Extreme desktop CPU's, up to 3 HD's, and SLI'd 8800m GTX. Cheaper the Alienware and Dell too, I don't think you can get any better then that!

 

[ZzZGuy]

wooo, thanks COpunk.

total with everything (3 year warranty included) was $4283.00, doesn't give what the price is for other countries so all I can hope for is they base it on the current US/Canadian exchange rates.

I'll have to check out what the hear issues are for that laptop, I'll add this to the OP.

 

[JAH]

Over $4K!? I suggest you check out powernotebooks.com - they're very reliable (have near perfect resellerratings.com) and very inexpensive compare to other online shops.

 

[ZzZGuy]

Looking at the specs and some reviews, Sager seems to be the best of the lot. Not to mention the cheapest of the three I've looked at so far.

 

[ZzZGuy]

Originally posted by: JAH
Over $4K!? I suggest you check out powernotebooks.com - they're very reliable (have near perfect resellerratings.com) and very inexpensive compare to other online shops.

I'll have a look at that, thanks.

-edit- the sager 9262 is about $4124.00 US compared to the setup I have listed in the OP with one or 2 small extras I think..

 

[justanothergamer]

I have a Sager for the last 2 1/2 years and have been really happy with it. I also feel their customer service and tech support is more responsive then Dell.

Oh and btw Dell owns Alienware so its 6 of one, half dozen of the other if you buy from them. And I think their markup is rediculous.

Another reseller of Sagers is XoticPC - these guys have really good service (they are a young and hungry laptop company) plus they offer a slightly wider array of laptops from the Clevo line of latop chassis. So you can go with some ASUS options if you want.

http://xoticpc.com

They also have a really good article or writeup on the three main types of laptop makers - its good to be informed on this before dropping a couple of grand on something you are going to be stuck with.

I just looked at their site. It takes a while to poke around and get the info so here is a link to the article:

http://www.xoticpc.com/laptop-...kes-laptops-ip-11.html


If I find anymore info or if I left anything out I'll post later.

 

[ZzZGuy]

Thanks for the info.

xotipcs.com price for the np9262 are about the same as sager is selling for, only difference would be in what they charge for shipping.


It's hard to justify this much money on gaming and I'm beginning to have second doubts. From what I have looked up I think I'll still go with the np9262 but I'll cut back on the features. Then again by the time I come back from work (as soon as I start >:-(, damn job hunting) I could say f*** it and go for top of the line. Still much research needs to be done.

 

[ZzZGuy]

More doubts and second guessing.

Anyway, finally landed the new job which I wish to get this laptop for (one month at a time in a work camp, no social life and 10 to 12 hour shifts 7 days a week) so depending on how that goes I'll go for broke or mid range (most likely NP5793, http://www.sagernotebook.com/p...customed.php?pid=51114 for mid range).

Sooo many laptops, this is almost as bad as building a desktop from scratch.

 

[IlllI]

well if you are willing to spend 4k on a machine, dont skip on the warranty. thats all i have for a suggestion. better safe than sorry

 

[ZzZGuy]

Originally posted by: clandren
well if you are willing to spend 4k on a machine, dont skip on the warranty. thats all i have for a suggestion. better safe than sorry

:Q
If I do end up paying 4k I'll be getting the max for warranty along with some theft insurance.

Thanks for mentioning that though.

 

[justanothergamer]

You can google that model and read reviews too which is nice. So you can have a feel for owning one before placing the order.

As far as gaming is concerned the most critical factor in a laptop is the video card. That is the one component I urge you to max out. The other pieces you can wait on or buy off of ebay and upgrade yourself.

It is a lot of coin to drop for a laptop but this is (for me anyway) a replacement for a pc. This thing goes everywhere with me. My friends house, in my living room or bedroom, when traveling. I can handle all business and social functions with it, including job hunting! Like you I am about to start a new job.

Selection is a bit tight on laptops when it comes to price. That's the biggest downside that I can't piece the whole thing out myself but oh well. Give the laptop market a few more years to mature and you will probably see more flexibility and competition.

Oh and you should be able to get XP for your OS. And if you go nuts a raid 0 array is always nice for gaming!

 

[ZzZGuy]

A little update.

I went and ordered the Sager NP5793 laptop from XoticPC.com, still in the build phase.
http://www.xoticpc.com/sager-n...evo-m570ru-p-2276.html

17" WUXGA "Glare Type" Super Clear Ultra Bright Glossy Screen (1920x1200)
T9300 @ 2.5GHz w/6MB L2 On-die cache - 800MHz FSB
GeForce 8800M GTX
4 GB of RAM
Windows XP pro (the 2 extra gigs where free)
200GB HD @ 7200RPM
3 Year warranty

I might replace the HD with a solid state when the prices are sane, and it seems the GPU is "user upgradable" and I assume the CPU is as well (if I can ever find the parts to upgrade down the road). Going to get the ZM-NC1000 notebook cooler.

I would have much preferred the Gateway P-Series FX with the 8800 GTS and 2.5 GHz dule core but I couldn't find it anywhere in Canada (and gateway does not ship to Canada). It's all I really want and at a good price, the NP5793 is a little better but costs a lot more and the best local laptop I could buy at a store was half as good as these two at $2,100 before tax. As you can guess from my OP, I'd rather go up then down in power.

Too much can happen to get a fully loaded NP9262, thus why I would have preferred the "not quite as good but cheaper" Gateway laptop. A desktop is still useless to me because at most I'd have access to it for a few days every month or two, it would also be too much of a PITA to ship up to where I work even if it did survive or not get stolen.

The money I'll save alone from having something to do other then go to strip bars makes this laptop worth the price (NOTHING to do in camp for 10 days, 4 days off with a town 40 minutes away with only a mall, 2 strip clubs and a internet/gaming cafe with nothing else of interest).

 

[DaveSimmons]

Is amazon offering Kindle in Canada yet? 125,000 books to read and download new ones in a minute.

 

[justanothergamer]

That's an outstanding setup. You will be taken care of for several years with the power you'll have on that platform.

Couple of things:

Get some Arctic Silver 5 off of eBay and re-goo your heatsinks. Both the video card and cpu. I just did that and it makes a huge difference.

Make a little platform to rest your laptop on so you don't burn your legs. Also I have a mouse pad on a clipboard that I take with me for an external mouse.

I am still looking for a wireless digital headset but in the meantime I have a plantronics DSP headset that does amazing things for sound (USB digital headset). Sound may or may not be an issue for you but it helps if you do any Ventrillo or Team Speak while gaming.

And don't forget at some point you can always reformat your setup and go to a raid 0 array with 2 hard drives for increased loading speeds.

Enjoy your rig!

 

[ZzZGuy]

@DaveSimmons

If you are suggesting that I read more books instead of paying too much for a gaming laptop, I first need a laptop to make use of what you mentioned, then I'd want to play a few games while I have a laptop with me. I also can only read so many books before I begin to lose interest (I cycle through reading, gaming and model building -fishing would be there if I had time now).

If I am mistake, then I shall have a look at that anyway.

@justanothergamer

The laptop already comes with arctic silver 5, but I will re apply the paste if there are heat issues.

I think I have a good 35 minutes of gaming on battery power. I intend to use it as a portable gaming desktop replacement that will always be plugged in at the tiny desk I have. Laptop use in bed is hard on my back (note I have a bed and a desk, that is it). I also do believe that the NC1000 notebook cooler also sits well in your lap from what I have read.

I am not overly picky with headsets (speakers not a option) as long as there is no background static and I get decent base. My internet speeds will suck (insert inappropriate terms) except at night when I'm asleep, so no MP for me.

The NP5793 only has the option of one HD, biggest thing I dislike about this laptop.

 

[gaiden2k5]

AC5 is a great point. I open up my M1710 and after 20-30 screws i reapplied AC5 on GPU and CPU, readings on the CPU went down by 5-7c which is very pleasant. I would have suggest you to get the M1730, part of using things is the experience too and i think all that 'gimpnesses' does chip in along with the lights and such. It would dazzle anyone around.

 

[PlasmaBomb]

If you are competent enough to change CPUs and GPUs, I suggest looking up some programs such as Rightmark CPU clock or Notebook hardware control and fiddling with the settings. If you undervolt the CPU and GPU you should keep the heat down and increase the life of the components, as well as battery life .

Personal experience has shown that you can drop most 65nm chips down to about 1.05V and still be stable (especially good if they start at 1.30V) saves a decent amount of heat. Your T9300 operates from 1.062V-1.150V and I haven't had a chance to fiddle with one so you might not be able to get such a large drop, but anything is better than nothing... Same goes for the GPU, if you can drop the 2D clocks and volts, just watch for artifacts...

Last point would be to take the battery out and store it if you aren't using it. The heat from the chassis means it won't last as long as it would if you had stored it somewhere cool.