I've always been wondering. Why do people bash SUV, but not large sided pickup trucks? They're very similar except trucks have an open bed (for those who didn't get a camper top). Explorer and Durangos aren't considered big at all. I think the more fearsome SUVs are H2, Excursion, & Suburban that seems to be more 'dangerous' when driving closely to them. I have a Dodge RAM and I drive it as carefully as I drive my sedan. I agree that it's up to the driver and the attitude of the driver. Some drivers think it's ok to boss around the road because their SUVs are bigger. I used to think that, but now I've been extremely courteous about other drivers in my RAM, just as I'm courteous in my Passat.
Yeah, but none of those big guzzling "Sports" Utility Vehicles can actually handle anything more than a mall parking lot and perhaps a curb, with the exception of some Land Rover models, and a few other not so popular models.
Pickup drivers can be annoying, but it is usually the same number of as annoying car drivers. I think a lot of pickup truck drivers have a use for the truck, and drive it with the understanding that they have a bigger vehicle and they need to be a little more careful. However quite a few SUV drivers think that they are so "bad ass" and they can run around like they own the road. Many people think that the ideal SUV is one that feels and drives like a car but is big and bad ass, so they can do crazy things with it as if driving a car, it's surprising that more of them don't topple the way people drive them.
Vic
Elite Member
- Jun 12, 2001
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Truer words could not have been spoken.
I think my issue with SUV drivers is that, because of their false reputation for being safe merely because of their immense size and weight, they tend to have the higher percentage of incompetents compared to other vehicle types. The combination of their arrogant incompetency and heavy metal warfare against all other drivers tends to set me a bit on edge.
JulesMaximus
No Lifer
- Jul 3, 2003
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People who lift their SUVs/trucks are a menace. Cops should really crack down on these idiots. Aren't there laws stating that you can't lift vehicles? Or lift them beyond a certain point? Aren't bumpers supposed to be at a certain height on all vehicles for safety reasons? Not to mention that the higher you raise a vehicle the more likely it is to roll over if you lose control. Yeah, you go on feeling safe "Mr. King of the Road." It is an illusion.
It will only take a few bad accidents involving some jerk off with a 6" lift and oversized tires and I'd be willing to bet that the lawyers and insurance companies as well as the law will crack down on this practice.
I've talked to dealerships that get these big lifted trucks in on trade and the first thing they do (for liability reasons) is rip all that crap right off those trucks. I'm sure it hurts the value of the vehicle just like ricing out a car hurts the resale on those.
It will only take a few bad accidents involving some jerk off with a 6" lift and oversized tires and I'd be willing to bet that the lawyers and insurance companies as well as the law will crack down on this practice.
I've talked to dealerships that get these big lifted trucks in on trade and the first thing they do (for liability reasons) is rip all that crap right off those trucks. I'm sure it hurts the value of the vehicle just like ricing out a car hurts the resale on those.
I've been in situations where SUVs attempted to bully my even larger vehicle off the road. They lost once they noticed the navy blue sheet metal 6 inches away from their face.
I've been in situations where econoboxes attempted to bully my vehicle with 10x the mass off the road. They lost once they noticed the navy blue sheet metal 6 inches away from their face.
I've been in situations where semitrucks dodged some silly tart trying to bully them off the road. I got the fvck out of their way ASAP.
I-695 junction w/ I-95. Go drive through there 20 times (in the right lane) on I-695 and count the accidents that you narrowly avoid. It's not the car that's the problem - it's the driver. If you're more afraid of someone because they have a bigger car - consider this - YOU'RE ON A ROAD WITH BIGARSE TRUCKS! AND RAILROAD CROSSINGS! And maybe a B747 is gonna need to make an emergency landing!
I've been in situations where econoboxes attempted to bully my vehicle with 10x the mass off the road. They lost once they noticed the navy blue sheet metal 6 inches away from their face.
I've been in situations where semitrucks dodged some silly tart trying to bully them off the road. I got the fvck out of their way ASAP.
I-695 junction w/ I-95. Go drive through there 20 times (in the right lane) on I-695 and count the accidents that you narrowly avoid. It's not the car that's the problem - it's the driver. If you're more afraid of someone because they have a bigger car - consider this - YOU'RE ON A ROAD WITH BIGARSE TRUCKS! AND RAILROAD CROSSINGS! And maybe a B747 is gonna need to make an emergency landing!
Two of those reasons are why I don't like SUV's.
Namely, the visibility thing. If you are in a left turn lane behind an SUV, you have no way of seeing what color your light is, and you don't want to follow the SUV through if they go through because there is a cop waiting to come the other way and you don't want to run a red in front of him . . or other similar situations.
And you are in a parking lot between a Suburdan and an Explorer or OilTanker, both of which are nearly too wide for their spots, leaving you with no room to maneuver and no way to see if anyone is coming.
The gas thing doens't really piss me off that much. Neither does the braking issue. I mean, I once rearended a pick-up (no damage to either vehicle, but I was 16 and it scared the crap out of me) so I can't blame trucks and SUV's for being likely to rear-end me . . .
That assertion is nearly an urban mythe. Thething is that today, SUVs really aren't for off-road use. They truly are "Sport Utility Vehicles", nothing there says off-road.
Lets take a quick look at the name breakdown:
From distionary.com:
Sport: 4.b: Informal. One who accepts rules or difficult situations well.
I'm thinking the road ways of today are difficult situations. Pot holes the size of small cars, even the manholes are 2 inches lower than pavement level on new roads. Then throw in inclement weather. It is a fact that 4-wheel drive vehicles are safer for all in bad weather. They are not the holy grail of safeness but it does help.
Again from dictionary.com Utility: adj. 2.Designed for various often heavy-duty practical uses
To all the econo box drivers out there, what do you do when you want to purchase large household items? Like a new sofa? A stove? Maybe a 10 bags of top-soil for the yard? What about when your two kids have a couple of friends over and everyone wants to go sledding or something? "Sorry can't do that, we can't transport all the ______ at once" What about taking the boat to the lake for fine Saturday? oops, I've got a 4 banger Civic, it can't do that...
Just to make sure everyone is on the same page...
Dictionary.com definition again:
vehicle:
1. A device or structure for transporting persons or things; a conveyance.
2. A self-propelled conveyance that runs on tires; a motor vehicle.
This says that a vechile is used for transporting stuff from one place to another. Nothing about off-road use.
Here is an edmunds.com article that says, "Most people don't take their SUVs off-road, and the Escalade offers nimble and luxurious urban transportation at a price that isn't enormous. " http://www.edmunds.com/reviews/comparison/articles/96312/page011.html
Finally there is Nissan and the Murano. Its called an SUV, but even Nissan says it is for "Adventures in on roading"
JulesMaximus
No Lifer
- Jul 3, 2003
- 74,598
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Originally posted by: RGN
That assertion is nearly an urban mythe. Thething is that today, SUVs really aren't for off-road use. They truly are "Sport Utility Vehicles", nothing there says off-road.
Lets take a quick look at the name breakdown:
From distionary.com:
Sport: 4.b: Informal. One who accepts rules or difficult situations well.
I'm thinking the road ways of today are difficult situations. Pot holes the size of small cars, even the manholes are 2 inches lower than pavement level on new roads. Then throw in inclement weather. It is a fact that 4-wheel drive vehicles are safer for all in bad weather. They are not the holy grail of safeness but it does help.
Again from dictionary.com Utility: adj. 2.Designed for various often heavy-duty practical uses
To all the econo box drivers out there, what do you do when you want to purchase large household items? Like a new sofa? A stove? Maybe a 10 bags of top-soil for the yard? What about when your two kids have a couple of friends over and everyone wants to go sledding or something? "Sorry can't do that, we can't transport all the ______ at once" What about taking the boat to the lake for fine Saturday? oops, I've got a 4 banger Civic, it can't do that...
Just to make sure everyone is on the same page...
Dictionary.com definition again:
vehicle:
1. A device or structure for transporting persons or things; a conveyance.
2. A self-propelled conveyance that runs on tires; a motor vehicle.
This says that a vechile is used for transporting stuff from one place to another. Nothing about off-road use.
Here is an edmunds.com article that says, "Most people don't take their SUVs off-road, and the Escalade offers nimble and luxurious urban transportation at a price that isn't enormous. " http://www.edmunds.com/reviews/comparison/articles/96312/page011.html
Finally there is Nissan and the Murano. Its called an SUV, but even Nissan says it is for "Adventures in on roading"
This sounds like a rationalization to me.
I owned a pickup truck for 2.5 years. Times I actually needed it were...maybe 8-9 times where it really came in handy-when I actually NEEDED the utility. It probably cost me an extra $3000 in gasoline during that time period more than a fullsize car averaging 21mpg. I could easily have rented a truck for the day to do the necessary hauling (hmm 8x$20=$160).
I would estimate that 90% of 4x4 vehicles NEVER leave the pavement. Any car with decent tires is just as capable as a 4x4 in wet driving conditions and some in snowy conditions. 4x4 doesn't help you go around corners or stop any better in the snow, it only helps you move forward. Most of the cars I've seen in the ditch when the weather gets bad are 4x4s because people seem to think that they are invulnerable because they have 4 wheel drive.
I'd also be willing to bet that the goatee wearin mofos in their jacked up monster trucks wannabes have really small packages too.
toyota's next gen prius supposedly gets a whopping 80mpg. with this technology, ford might be able to bring up the explorer from 12mpg to 16!
Life sucks. Its not only people in SUV's that drive like that, you can't generalize just because one person did it to you.
i dislike suvs, i hate the way it drives, so i don't drive one. (altho cayenne did kick some ass ) my parents and my sister loves suvs, they like sitting high, and the fact that when they get in an accident, they are more likely to walk away unscathed, so they drive one.
it's a fad, get over it, drive what suits your fancy, and hate the idiots that drive like they are the only ones on the road. sure being behind a suv is freakin annoying, you can't see anything in front of you cept for their big ass when they're driving like a freakin grandma. but if you really can't stand it, join rest the of america in supersizing your vehicle.
i hate bandwagoners, and seems the suv drivers and the bashers both belong to one bandwagon or another, so just shuddup and drive on. wait did i violate the fav passtime on atot?
) my parents and my sister loves suvs, they like sitting high, and the fact that when they get in an accident, they are more likely to walk away unscathed, so they drive one. it's a fad, get over it, drive what suits your fancy, and hate the idiots that drive like they are the only ones on the road. sure being behind a suv is freakin annoying, you can't see anything in front of you cept for their big ass when they're driving like a freakin grandma. but if you really can't stand it, join rest the of america in supersizing your vehicle.
i hate bandwagoners, and seems the suv drivers and the bashers both belong to one bandwagon or another, so just shuddup and drive on. wait did i violate the fav passtime on atot?
I agree with all of these, with the statements in bold having the most impact and greatest danger on me.
The other two are true, but only minor nuisances/worries. Those will only cause minor accidents and mostly won't injure anybody.
Zenmervolt
Elite member
- Oct 22, 2000
- 24,514
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Because commercial vehicles often lack a center rearview mirror, meaning that they have no choice but to rely upon the sideview mirrors for rearward vision. In normal vehicles, the center rearview mirror obviates the need for those convex "spotter" mirrors. The lack of direct rearward vision in commercial vehicles is also a hinderance when backing up, leaving the drivers of comercial vehicles nothing to rely on but mirrors, again, this situation never comes up for normal vehicles except when towing. Not only that, but the hoodline and extreme height of most commercial vehicles creates a blind spot directly to the sideof the vehicle, necessitating convex mirrors. Once again, this is not a problem with normal vehicles. Your comparison is seriously flawed.
ZV
Zenmervolt
Elite member
- Oct 22, 2000
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Not a chance in hell that it cost you that much extra.
Average driving is about 12,000 per year. Let's be over-pessimistic and say you drive 15,000 per year (which will exagerate the difference in fuel consumption). Let's also be over-pessimistic and say that you averaged only 16 mpg with your truck (which is uncharacteristically bad) and could have gotten 30 with a car (which is an awfully fuel efficient car in America). Let's be even further pessimistic and say that the truck require Premium fuel whereas the car would only need regular (an extra $0.20 per gallon for truck fuel). And we'll say that the average price for a gallon of regular was $1.60 per gallon over that time period.
Gallons used at 16 mpg: 937.5
Gallons used at 30 mpg: 500
Extra gallons consumed by the truck: 437.5
Extra cost if truck needs premium: $887.50
Extra cost if truck burns regular: $700
Extra cost over 3 years if premium: $2,662.50
Extra cost over 3 years if truck burns regular: $2,100
And if we take a real-world example where the numbers aren't seriously fudged beforehand in your favour...
My father's Explored V8: 20 mpg.
Mom's Maxima: 26 mpg.
Fuel useage difference (at 15,000 miles per year): 173 gallons per year.
Fuel cost difference (at our local average of $1.50 per gallon of regular): $259.50
Over 3 years that is less than $800. And that's not even taking into account that the Maxima needs Premium while the Explorer runs fine on regular. (Though if we run those numbers the difference is a mere $144.10 per year premium to drive the Explorer.)
In short, unless there was a HUGE difference in fuel economy and unless your truck burned far more expensive gasoline you're not spending $1,000 extra per year on fuel for a truck. Just ain't happening.
ZV
Zenmervolt
Elite member
- Oct 22, 2000
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Yes actually, but that is beside the point.
A standard transmission is far from an "obsolete piece of equipment". The simple fact is that with the exception of towing and drag racing (given a highly tuned automatic), a standard transmission offers better control, better economy, and better durability than its automatic counterpart. It's also a helluva lot more fun, but that's not sufficient cause, though the other points are definitely sufficient.
ZV
Watch this 6 minute segment from the Discovery channel - http://www.exn.ca/video/?video=exn20030317-suv.asx
The people shown in this segment represent about 90% of the SUV drivers out there. So until the average SUV driver's mentality changes, let's continue to bash SUVs.
The people shown in this segment represent about 90% of the SUV drivers out there. So until the average SUV driver's mentality changes, let's continue to bash SUVs.
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