Hey government! (An edited for clarity rant)

[heyheybooboo]

A quarter acre 'lot size' or disturbed area is roughly 10k SF (150x67).

A 2-story frame house around 2,500 SF would have a building envelop no bigger than 50x40 feet. If your well is placed in one corner of the disturbed area and your drain field is a minimum 100' from the well you could establish up to 5 lines 60 feet in length (probably more if your drain lines worked on a partial 'diagonal' ). That should give you more than enough room for the drain lines (on 12' centers) and a repair area.

You are looking at around $250 SF for a 2,500 SF home at $600k.

Not exactly a McMansion but a long way from an 'EconoBox' ...

 

[Farang]

By that logic we should have dropped the Seahawks and the Mariners in the early 90s

 

[AreaCode7O7]

Originally posted by: heyheybooboo
A quarter acre 'lot size' or disturbed area is roughly 10k SF (150x67).

A 2-story frame house around 2,500 SF would have a building envelop no bigger than 50x40 feet. If your well is placed in one corner of the disturbed area and your drain field is a minimum 100' from the well you could establish up to 5 lines 60 feet in length (probably more if your drain lines worked on a partial 'diagonal' ). That should give you more than enough room for the drain lines (on 12' centers) and a repair area.

You are looking at around $250 SF for a 2,500 SF home at $600k.

Not exactly a McMansion but a long way from an 'EconoBox' ...

Want a job? (Additionally complicated by boundary areas around the NGPE but you can still put a septic in an area like that.)

 

[Craig234]

Originally posted by: Farang
By that logic we should have dropped the Seahawks and the Mariners in the early 90s

The sports franchises are terribly 'screw the taxpayer' abuses for years now - including specifically IMO the efforts by billionare Paul Allen in Seattle to fleece the public.

 

[AreaCode7O7]

Originally posted by: Deeko

Originally posted by: AreaCode707

Originally posted by: Deeko
You can afford a 600k mortgage and you're bitching and moaning that you can't afford a house?

I live in King County and I'm buying a house this year on a single income. Sounds like you just don't know how to manage your money.

I'm buying something that I can rent out should I have to leave the area. By the time I sell, it is very doubtful the value will have dropped - and considering the money I will not have thrown away while renting, it will clearly be a net gain.

Could buy a home, but shouldn't. I said I WOULD own a home right now, if it wasn't for the gov. It's the poor decisions leading into the current bad economy that have made home purchase a seriously bad financial decision. Hopefully you pick up an under-market place so you don't wind up losing much on it.

So you're planning on buying a house, and then immediately selling it after the value drops, assuming that it does? You really are a financial genius!

Not all life revolves around real estate. For personal reasons I won't be in this area for more than 4-5 years. My financial genius tells me not to buy because there's not a chance in hell I'll break even on the sale.

 

[Deeko]

Its cute that you cut off the bottom part of my reply that addressed that issue, but thank you for your beautiful insight that life doesn't revolve around real estate! You've really changed my outlook!

:roll:

edit: Oh, and even if you lost money on the transaction, compare that amount lost (which you obviously can't assume right now) to the amount you are throwing at rent that is 100% lost. Keep whining that you can't afford a house on two 6-figure incomes though :roll:

 

[AreaCode7O7]

Originally posted by: Deeko
Its cute that you cut off the bottom part of my reply that addressed that issue, but thank you for your beautiful insight that life doesn't revolve around real estate! You've really changed my outlook!

:roll:


edit: Oh, and even if you lost money on the transaction, compare that amount lost (which you obviously can't assume right now) to the amount you are throwing at rent that is 100% lost. Keep whining that you can't afford a house on two 6-figure incomes though :roll:

Didn't know you'd take it personally. I typically clip posts to only include the pieces I'm responding to so the readability is better. Edited back in for you.

Edited the "can't afford" piece for clarity. I don't think anyone can afford to knowingly make poor financial choices. Rent lost over that period of time is a drop in the bucket compared to the ding on house value.

 

[yllus]

It'd irritate the hell out of me to look at the Social Security part of my paystub if I was an American. The account balance of our state pension plan is pretty screwed as well but it's not as bad as down there AFAIK.

I'm not sure how many of us can really complain about the mortgage situation having gotten out of hand. I know I made a good chunk of money while the going was good. We were all certainly misled to a large extent, but I can't help but think that we, the layman investor, failed to do our due diligence as well. We were happy enough not asking too many questions as long as our returns were bountiful year after year.

I think that the quote-unquote saving of the housing industry was a necessary part of selling the bailout to the American public, which I support at least in theory. The chances of a bank extending credit to businesses up here is getting a little dicey. I am hoping it doesn't get worse.

I think what your county is doing in disallowing you to do well nigh anything with property you and you alone own is disgusting. I understand that there probably need to be some reasonable checks and balances when it comes to developing property, but the environmental requirements thing (it's happening up here too) is BS. If you wanted the land that thoroughly protected, don't let it be sold into private hands, or buy it back at market value + XX%. A friend of mine whose father owns a farm where he raises cattle is screwed when he retires. She doesn't want to continue the family business. There aren't any buyers. And thanks to environmental regulations, she's not allowed to develop the lands (or sell them to someone who would). Good luck paying those property taxes!

 

[AreaCode7O7]

Originally posted by: yllus
I'm not sure how many of us can really complain about the mortgage situation having gotten out of hand. I know I made a good chunk of money while the going was good. We were all certainly misled to a large extent, but I can't help but think that we, the layman investor, failed to do our due diligence as well. We were happy enough not asking too many questions as long as our returns were bountiful year after year.

I guess I just hit the bad luck timing, because when the going was good I was just getting going in my work and savings. Now that I'm capable of making a move, all the moves are bad. If the government would have either kept more of a hand in to begin with, or less of a hand in to end with, there'd be a decent set of choices between good and bad real estate moves.

 

[AreaCode7O7]

Originally posted by: Deeko
Its cute that you cut off the bottom part of my reply that addressed that issue, but thank you for your beautiful insight that life doesn't revolve around real estate! You've really changed my outlook!

:roll:

edit: Oh, and even if you lost money on the transaction, compare that amount lost (which you obviously can't assume right now) to the amount you are throwing at rent that is 100% lost. Keep whining that you can't afford a house on two 6-figure incomes though :roll:

Hey Deeko

I know from way back in the day reading your posts that you've always been a reasonable poster. Sorry if my P&N rant wound up being irritating; it's just my way of venting that I'm basically boxed into a rent-only, no-dogs, no-gardens, no-nails-in-the-wall situation without being willing to take on an enormous amount of risk. Given my situation of needing to leave in 4-5 years and also considering that I've got a total of 7 people (housemates) that I need to provide a roof for (which puts us in the 600k range of purchase) I really do feel just flat out of options and only have til the end of January to get it all sorted out and make sure we have a place to live.

I usually consider myself responsible for my own decisions and I'll enjoy them if they're good and eat them if they're bad. I just can't stand that through government intervention that the housing market is in this weird not-here, not-there position where good purchase decisions involve the most responsible to put their necks on the line while the least responsible are "bailed out".

 

[Dissipate]

Another slave citizen begging for pennies back from their task masters. /thread

 

[heyheybooboo]

Originally posted by: AreaCode707

Originally posted by: heyheybooboo
A quarter acre 'lot size' or disturbed area is roughly 10k SF (150x67).

A 2-story frame house around 2,500 SF would have a building envelop no bigger than 50x40 feet. If your well is placed in one corner of the disturbed area and your drain field is a minimum 100' from the well you could establish up to 5 lines 60 feet in length (probably more if your drain lines worked on a partial 'diagonal' ). That should give you more than enough room for the drain lines (on 12' centers) and a repair area.

You are looking at around $250 SF for a 2,500 SF home at $600k.

Not exactly a McMansion but a long way from an 'EconoBox' ...

Want a job? (Additionally complicated by boundary areas around the NGPE but you can still put a septic in an area like that.)

Don't tempt me All I need is a good excuse.

I don't know what da bidness is like in WA (I'm in western NC) but I would suggest acting as your own GC and using modular if possible.

The 'boxes' are shipped in and set on your foundation with a crane. We can go 3 stories here in what is called type-III construction (typical of apartment and condo buildings). The crane can set your roof trusses (and dormer components) and your home can be 'dried-in' and less than 2 weeks.

Depending upon the topography of your land your foundation/basement could effectively be unfinished bonus space, garage, storage area, hubby's dog house, etc. The manufacturer will have staff engineers to spec and redesign foundation requirements for building code compliance.

It's easy for us to put in full basements (we're mountain boys) but you could build on concrete slab ...

The 'modular' units here comply with the state building code and can be spec'ed with 6-inch walls. You can customize anything - of course, the further from the norm the greater the additional expense. I can't personally stand 'cheesy' exterior siding and trim.

A typical 'unit' or box can be most any size that will fit on a flat-bed truck. You can easily set 6-8 boxes/day. You may also specify earthquake and high-wind qualification (I live in a 120-mph zone) and any requirement you or your local/state inspectors can dream of - and you can pay for ... LOL.

This is not a recommendation but check these guys out.

 

[MovingTarget]

Can you afford a home? From what you've posted, it seems so, but you don't consider it a sound investment at the moment. That, I think, is part of the problem we've had in Real Estate the past few years - the whole property/house as an investment angle. Perhaps you should not think of it as an investment that is supposed to yield a return like stocks, bonds, mutual funds, etc. It is something that can provide stability in you life as...quite literally...a roof over your head. You seem to have no qualms renting for the moment due to your current situation, so why the rant? Be happy with where you are making money elsewhere and having the ability to pack up/move on a much shorter notice to persue your lifestyle or change your circumstances, unlike if you owned a home. It just seems like more whining that you can't make extra cash off of every facet of your life.

 

[Deeko]

Originally posted by: AreaCode707

Originally posted by: Deeko
Its cute that you cut off the bottom part of my reply that addressed that issue, but thank you for your beautiful insight that life doesn't revolve around real estate! You've really changed my outlook!

:roll:

edit: Oh, and even if you lost money on the transaction, compare that amount lost (which you obviously can't assume right now) to the amount you are throwing at rent that is 100% lost. Keep whining that you can't afford a house on two 6-figure incomes though :roll:

Hey Deeko

I know from way back in the day reading your posts that you've always been a reasonable poster. Sorry if my P&N rant wound up being irritating; it's just my way of venting that I'm basically boxed into a rent-only, no-dogs, no-gardens, no-nails-in-the-wall situation without being willing to take on an enormous amount of risk. Given my situation of needing to leave in 4-5 years and also considering that I've got a total of 7 people (housemates) that I need to provide a roof for (which puts us in the 600k range of purchase) I really do feel just flat out of options and only have til the end of January to get it all sorted out and make sure we have a place to live.

I usually consider myself responsible for my own decisions and I'll enjoy them if they're good and eat them if they're bad. I just can't stand that through government intervention that the housing market is in this weird not-here, not-there position where good purchase decisions involve the most responsible to put their necks on the line while the least responsible are "bailed out".

Sorry if I came across callous, I just get annoyed when people complain about things I don't think are complain-able

Anyway, how much are you paying in rent? If its comparable to a 600k house, I would estimate it in the 3K/month range at least. Over the course of five years, 3k/month in rent is 180k. If you lost 25% on a 600k house (which really is just an assumption - for all we know, we could be closer to bottoming out than that), that's 150k lost. So it might not be as bad as you think.

 

[Eeezee]

You're whining because you don't want a mortgage? Purchasing a house now when prices are low (or within 6 months when they'll probably be at their lowest) is a very sound investment (edit: In the long run). You fail.

 

[StageLeft]

I read your post and was like where does this person live, California? Clicked your ! icon and, yep, California. I also don't really understand how people can live there, like how do they pay for a house.

 

[Deeko]

Originally posted by: Skoorb
I read your post and was like where does this person live, California? Clicked your ! icon and, yep, California. I also don't really understand how people can live there, like how do they pay for a house.

King County = Seattle Metro region

 

[StageLeft]

Originally posted by: Deeko

Originally posted by: Skoorb
I read your post and was like where does this person live, California? Clicked your ! icon and, yep, California. I also don't really understand how people can live there, like how do they pay for a house.

King County = Seattle Metro region

So the OP has moved? I would apologize for not reading more, and I will, but it's a bit empty because I often post without reading the whole thread

 

[AreaCode7O7]

Originally posted by: MovingTarget
Can you afford a home? From what you've posted, it seems so, but you don't consider it a sound investment at the moment. That, I think, is part of the problem we've had in Real Estate the past few years - the whole property/house as an investment angle. Perhaps you should not think of it as an investment that is supposed to yield a return like stocks, bonds, mutual funds, etc. It is something that can provide stability in you life as...quite literally...a roof over your head. You seem to have no qualms renting for the moment due to your current situation, so why the rant? Be happy with where you are making money elsewhere and having the ability to pack up/move on a much shorter notice to persue your lifestyle or change your circumstances, unlike if you owned a home. It just seems like more whining that you can't make extra cash off of every facet of your life.

Not really so worried about investment as in gaining money, but am worried about losing money since I'll have to uproot relatively soon after buying (and would then need the money to buy a permanent home). My reason for wanting to buy is simply quality of life, as I mentioned. Gardens, bees, putting pictures up, having pets, etc.

 

[AreaCode7O7]

Originally posted by: Deeko

Originally posted by: AreaCode707

Originally posted by: Deeko
Its cute that you cut off the bottom part of my reply that addressed that issue, but thank you for your beautiful insight that life doesn't revolve around real estate! You've really changed my outlook!

:roll:

edit: Oh, and even if you lost money on the transaction, compare that amount lost (which you obviously can't assume right now) to the amount you are throwing at rent that is 100% lost. Keep whining that you can't afford a house on two 6-figure incomes though :roll:

Hey Deeko

I know from way back in the day reading your posts that you've always been a reasonable poster. Sorry if my P&N rant wound up being irritating; it's just my way of venting that I'm basically boxed into a rent-only, no-dogs, no-gardens, no-nails-in-the-wall situation without being willing to take on an enormous amount of risk. Given my situation of needing to leave in 4-5 years and also considering that I've got a total of 7 people (housemates) that I need to provide a roof for (which puts us in the 600k range of purchase) I really do feel just flat out of options and only have til the end of January to get it all sorted out and make sure we have a place to live.

I usually consider myself responsible for my own decisions and I'll enjoy them if they're good and eat them if they're bad. I just can't stand that through government intervention that the housing market is in this weird not-here, not-there position where good purchase decisions involve the most responsible to put their necks on the line while the least responsible are "bailed out".

Sorry if I came across callous, I just get annoyed when people complain about things I don't think are complain-able

Anyway, how much are you paying in rent? If its comparable to a 600k house, I would estimate it in the 3K/month range at least. Over the course of five years, 3k/month in rent is 180k. If you lost 25% on a 600k house (which really is just an assumption - for all we know, we could be closer to bottoming out than that), that's 150k lost. So it might not be as bad as you think.

Point in the math. Based on rentals we're looking at, we're probably closer to 2300/m.

 

[yowolabi]

Originally posted by: AreaCode707

Originally posted by: MovingTarget
Can you afford a home? From what you've posted, it seems so, but you don't consider it a sound investment at the moment. That, I think, is part of the problem we've had in Real Estate the past few years - the whole property/house as an investment angle. Perhaps you should not think of it as an investment that is supposed to yield a return like stocks, bonds, mutual funds, etc. It is something that can provide stability in you life as...quite literally...a roof over your head. You seem to have no qualms renting for the moment due to your current situation, so why the rant? Be happy with where you are making money elsewhere and having the ability to pack up/move on a much shorter notice to persue your lifestyle or change your circumstances, unlike if you owned a home. It just seems like more whining that you can't make extra cash off of every facet of your life.

Not really so worried about investment as in gaining money, but am worried about losing money since I'll have to uproot relatively soon after buying. My reason for wanting to buy is simply quality of life, as I mentioned. Gardens, bees, putting pictures up, having pets, etc.

I was about to tear into you for treating your home as an investment also, and then I read the whole thread. You have a legitimate problem, in that it probably is a bad financial decision to buy a house for 5 years and then sell it at a loss when you move. If you kept the house and rented it out, in time it would pay off.

Alternatively, can't you simply rent someone else's house instead of buying your own?

 

[StageLeft]

Originally posted by: AreaCode707

Originally posted by: MovingTarget
Can you afford a home? From what you've posted, it seems so, but you don't consider it a sound investment at the moment. That, I think, is part of the problem we've had in Real Estate the past few years - the whole property/house as an investment angle. Perhaps you should not think of it as an investment that is supposed to yield a return like stocks, bonds, mutual funds, etc. It is something that can provide stability in you life as...quite literally...a roof over your head. You seem to have no qualms renting for the moment due to your current situation, so why the rant? Be happy with where you are making money elsewhere and having the ability to pack up/move on a much shorter notice to persue your lifestyle or change your circumstances, unlike if you owned a home. It just seems like more whining that you can't make extra cash off of every facet of your life.

Not really so worried about investment as in gaining money, but am worried about losing money since I'll have to uproot relatively soon after buying. My reason for wanting to buy is simply quality of life, as I mentioned. Gardens, bees, putting pictures up, having pets, etc.

You can rent a house, that's really the ticket for you now, especially with the market as it is and apparently there are a good number of homes for sale.

The economics in California are screwed, though. $100k income like you have in, for example, Rochester NY where I am now will secure you a new four bedroom house with a huge yard in a top-notch school system and not stress the bank to do it at all.

 

[AreaCode7O7]

Originally posted by: Skoorb

Originally posted by: AreaCode707

Originally posted by: MovingTarget
Can you afford a home? From what you've posted, it seems so, but you don't consider it a sound investment at the moment. That, I think, is part of the problem we've had in Real Estate the past few years - the whole property/house as an investment angle. Perhaps you should not think of it as an investment that is supposed to yield a return like stocks, bonds, mutual funds, etc. It is something that can provide stability in you life as...quite literally...a roof over your head. You seem to have no qualms renting for the moment due to your current situation, so why the rant? Be happy with where you are making money elsewhere and having the ability to pack up/move on a much shorter notice to persue your lifestyle or change your circumstances, unlike if you owned a home. It just seems like more whining that you can't make extra cash off of every facet of your life.

Not really so worried about investment as in gaining money, but am worried about losing money since I'll have to uproot relatively soon after buying. My reason for wanting to buy is simply quality of life, as I mentioned. Gardens, bees, putting pictures up, having pets, etc.

You can rent a house, that's really the ticket for you now, especially with the market as it is and apparently there are a good number of homes for sale.

The economics in California are screwed, though. $100k income like you have in, for example, Rochester NY where I am now will secure you a new four bedroom house with a huge yard in a top-notch school system and not stress the bank to do it at all.

I actually am in WA; I just wish I was in CA. King County is the home of MS, Amazon, T-Mobile and (formerly) WaMu and a multitude of other smaller tech companies, which drives the real estate prices up. We haven't yet had as much of a fall as other areas, and I consider it likely to eventually catch up.

 

[Deeko]

Originally posted by: AreaCode707

I actually am in WA; I just wish I was in CA. King County is the home of MS, Amazon, T-Mobile and (formerly) WaMu and a multitude of other smaller tech companies, which drives the real estate prices up. We haven't yet had as much of a fall as other areas, and I consider it likely to eventually catch up.

A friend of mine that works in the finance sector told me that his industry is raving about the Seattle area. When I told him I was looking to buy there this year he said it was a great idea, as its one of the few real estate markets in the country that has a positive outlook.

Just because KC hasn't crashed like the rest of the country doesn't mean it will.

 

[AreaCode7O7]

Originally posted by: Deeko

Originally posted by: AreaCode707

I actually am in WA; I just wish I was in CA. King County is the home of MS, Amazon, T-Mobile and (formerly) WaMu and a multitude of other smaller tech companies, which drives the real estate prices up. We haven't yet had as much of a fall as other areas, and I consider it likely to eventually catch up.

A friend of mine that works in the finance sector told me that his industry is raving about the Seattle area. When I told him I was looking to buy there this year he said it was a great idea, as its one of the few real estate markets in the country that has a positive outlook.

Just because KC hasn't crashed like the rest of the country doesn't mean it will.

The continued slow downhill slide of median house prices isn't a bright encounter though. http://seattletimes.nwsource.c...97803_homesales07.html