Even more like the stupid a$$ that you worship who coined the moronic slogan in the first place.
Even more like the stupid a$$ that you worship who coined the moronic slogan in the first place.
Only a partisan tool or ideological dunce would believe that the primitive culture and religious facism would cease to threaten civilized nations if the US were to just hide in a hole.
So BBond, delirious Bush-hating aside, what would you do to help in "the global struggle against violent extremism (war on terror)?" Pass out living wills to all Americans?
My point was never that they didn't disagree with this war, nor did not agree with the 1991 Gulf War.
My point in fact was, that whether they agree or disagree with us; they aren't a whole lot of help anyways because America bears the burden no matter what happens.
If you could stop cut and pasting for awhile and contribute some original thought to the thread that would be great.
Then again, you're cutting and pasting is probably far less annoying than the your actual thoughts so just continue to cut and paste.
- Aug 23, 2003
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Ideally, right after 9/11, this is what should have happened:
1) Full scale invasion of Afghanistan.
2) Complete eradication of the Taliban.
3) Corner, capture, or kill any trace of al-Qaeda in Afghanistan.
4) Capture Osama bin Laden.
5) Use intelligence from captured Taliban/al-Qaeda to weed out terrorists in other countries.
Of course, a FULL scale invasion of Afghanistan never happened. The Taliban and al-Qaeda still exist in remote regions of Afghanistan. Osama bin Laden is still at large. Intelligence has been gathered, and terrorists have been caught/killed, but unfortunately we undid any progress we made the moment we invaded Iraq. Our actions ENABLED our enemies to radicalize more people at a faster rate than ever before.
We never fully applied the "with us or against us" edict Bush issued; it was a talking point with Iraq, but completely ignored in the case of Saudi Arabia, Iran, and Pakistan.
Sensing a pattern here yet?
Afghanistan was our FIRST and most important chance to show the world we meant business. Afghanistan was supposed to be a model for other Arab nations. If we put half the men and half the money we've spent in Iraq into Afghanistan, I have no doubts Osama would be in jail awaiting trial, and Afghanistan would be a beacon for the Arab world. But we half-assed it right after we chased the Taliban and al-Qaeda into the mountains.
The sad fact is, our war on terror has gone so far off track with Iraq that I see no recovery in our favor until we pull out of the region. By then, who knows how many more attacks will have occurred.
Most intelligence experts agree that al-Qaeda's strength hasn't been diminished to the point where they aren't a serious threat. Those same experts agree that it isn't a question of *if* they will attack us again, but *when*.
Spend a couple hundred billion to capture al-Qaeda all around the world with the support of your allies, or spend a couple hundred billion to fight a war alone that created more terrorists.
Doesn't make much sense to think that a full scale military operation in one country is going to help us eradicate a disjointed, worldwide terrorist network like al-Qaeda. So why dedicate so much money and manpower to one country in the Middle East who had no weapons and was not a threat?
1) Full scale invasion of Afghanistan.
2) Complete eradication of the Taliban.
3) Corner, capture, or kill any trace of al-Qaeda in Afghanistan.
4) Capture Osama bin Laden.
5) Use intelligence from captured Taliban/al-Qaeda to weed out terrorists in other countries.
Of course, a FULL scale invasion of Afghanistan never happened. The Taliban and al-Qaeda still exist in remote regions of Afghanistan. Osama bin Laden is still at large. Intelligence has been gathered, and terrorists have been caught/killed, but unfortunately we undid any progress we made the moment we invaded Iraq. Our actions ENABLED our enemies to radicalize more people at a faster rate than ever before.
We never fully applied the "with us or against us" edict Bush issued; it was a talking point with Iraq, but completely ignored in the case of Saudi Arabia, Iran, and Pakistan.
Sensing a pattern here yet?
Afghanistan was our FIRST and most important chance to show the world we meant business. Afghanistan was supposed to be a model for other Arab nations. If we put half the men and half the money we've spent in Iraq into Afghanistan, I have no doubts Osama would be in jail awaiting trial, and Afghanistan would be a beacon for the Arab world. But we half-assed it right after we chased the Taliban and al-Qaeda into the mountains.
The sad fact is, our war on terror has gone so far off track with Iraq that I see no recovery in our favor until we pull out of the region. By then, who knows how many more attacks will have occurred.
Most intelligence experts agree that al-Qaeda's strength hasn't been diminished to the point where they aren't a serious threat. Those same experts agree that it isn't a question of *if* they will attack us again, but *when*.
Spend a couple hundred billion to capture al-Qaeda all around the world with the support of your allies, or spend a couple hundred billion to fight a war alone that created more terrorists.
Doesn't make much sense to think that a full scale military operation in one country is going to help us eradicate a disjointed, worldwide terrorist network like al-Qaeda. So why dedicate so much money and manpower to one country in the Middle East who had no weapons and was not a threat?
We can start by pulling all our troops out of Saudia Arabia.
If it were possible I would say pull everything we have out of Iraq tomorrow and tell them to have a nice day. The more we interfere in the middle east the more problems we have.
The big problem is Al-qeada has this plan from Muslims to take over the world. I dont know how you can combat these people. If we do nothing they will weasel into every country and destabilise the entire planet.
As far as I am concered there is no such thing as a good Muslim.
This might be hurtful mean and full of hate but that is what I feel. If muslims keep attacking western civilization what can we do about this?
I think it is either us or them.
I dont have any good peaceful or logical way to deal with illogical terrorists or why Muslims feel the need to use violence to get their way. The problem is we want a nice conventional war and Muslims do not fight nice conventional wars. They would rather chop off the heads of all westerners. If they want a brutal war with no care for civilian casualties, I say lets give them tit for tat.
If they attack civilians in Iraq we should return the favor and bomb Domascus.
I think we are just kidding ourselves if we think we can do any good in the Middle East. I am for a realistic approach to this. Having trials for people at Gitmo is unrealistic. They were combatants with no uniforms. That is what we call spies, and the sentence for all spies should be a firing squad or having their heads lopped off like it is customary in their country. If you prefer just set up a gas chamber.
If it were possible I would say pull everything we have out of Iraq tomorrow and tell them to have a nice day. The more we interfere in the middle east the more problems we have.
The big problem is Al-qeada has this plan from Muslims to take over the world. I dont know how you can combat these people. If we do nothing they will weasel into every country and destabilise the entire planet.
As far as I am concered there is no such thing as a good Muslim.
This might be hurtful mean and full of hate but that is what I feel. If muslims keep attacking western civilization what can we do about this?
I think it is either us or them.
I dont have any good peaceful or logical way to deal with illogical terrorists or why Muslims feel the need to use violence to get their way. The problem is we want a nice conventional war and Muslims do not fight nice conventional wars. They would rather chop off the heads of all westerners. If they want a brutal war with no care for civilian casualties, I say lets give them tit for tat.
If they attack civilians in Iraq we should return the favor and bomb Domascus.
I think we are just kidding ourselves if we think we can do any good in the Middle East. I am for a realistic approach to this. Having trials for people at Gitmo is unrealistic. They were combatants with no uniforms. That is what we call spies, and the sentence for all spies should be a firing squad or having their heads lopped off like it is customary in their country. If you prefer just set up a gas chamber.
I wonder why we always seem to bear the burden... We had way more global support in the Gulf War and didn't have this kind of animosity from Europe... and the rest of the world in general...
Europe is useless right? I guess that means we can invade any country we please as it's not like they can stop us!
Please...
Good point, I beileve that we should have primarly foucused on Iran/Saudia Arabia as they've got much stronger ties to terrorism than Iraq.
Not sure what I would do to end terrorists support in SA, but the youth in Iran is something you can relay on. They don't care for there goverment at all.
1. Continue the course in Iraq\Afghanistan
2. Put pressure on terrorist sponsering states like SA to cut it out. If they dont find a way to put pressure on them without direct war
3. Coddle the Euros. They dont want to lift a finger or pull their head out of the sand. But we need them in this war.
4. Get an Israeli\Palastinian solution. Once this is ironed out one of the pillars of these nutjobs justification is destroyed.
5. Ween ourselves off ME oil. Drill away in the artic or rockies. If we can become self sustaining then it destroys another justification for the nutjobs. It also puts pressure on states like SA to deal with the situation.
6. Educate people with western values. If the majority of people in the ME can come out of the oppression they live in then maybe they will not have the fuel needed to blow themselves up for some power hungry idiots.
Other options
1. Build a huge wall around the ME and not allow anybody out and nobody can go in. Let them have the land and they can eat themselves alive
2. Turn the place into a sheet of glass and sell the silicon to Intel.
2. Put pressure on terrorist sponsering states like SA to cut it out. If they dont find a way to put pressure on them without direct war
3. Coddle the Euros. They dont want to lift a finger or pull their head out of the sand. But we need them in this war.
4. Get an Israeli\Palastinian solution. Once this is ironed out one of the pillars of these nutjobs justification is destroyed.
5. Ween ourselves off ME oil. Drill away in the artic or rockies. If we can become self sustaining then it destroys another justification for the nutjobs. It also puts pressure on states like SA to deal with the situation.
6. Educate people with western values. If the majority of people in the ME can come out of the oppression they live in then maybe they will not have the fuel needed to blow themselves up for some power hungry idiots.
Other options
1. Build a huge wall around the ME and not allow anybody out and nobody can go in. Let them have the land and they can eat themselves alive
2. Turn the place into a sheet of glass and sell the silicon to Intel.
- Aug 23, 2003
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Bwahahahahaha. OMFG, someone get this guy a reality check, he is a bit too far down the road with no way home.
Do you know what ETHNIC CLEANSING is, piasabird?
Your solution is to give them "tif for tat"? So I guess we better start hiring former al-Qaeda to train our troops.
Yes, I'm sure ALL Muslims want to behead westerners and dominate the world. :roll:
Bombing Damascus? So just pick a spot in the world that has Muslims and drop some bombs at will?
Executing all detainees......holy sh1t that is fvcked up.
Your best solution to combat is terrorist network of extremists Muslims is to commit genocide against 1.3 billion people. I'm sure that will end terrorism in its tracks. :roll:
You might not find a lot of people who share your views on Anandtech. Try here instead.
I already posted an answer to this question, so I'll just lift it for this thread.
I editted it slightly for clarity.
My proposal for winning the war on terror:
1. End the War on (some) Drugs. I pity the fool who doesn't realize the true effect this would have on our planet.
2. Commit to staying absolutely dedicated to the rights and freedoms of citizens no matter how many times we are attacked.
3. Provide increases in funding for education, here and abroad, investment in further solidifying the internet as a free network that no one country can lock down, and continuely increase the number and size of "transfer student" type programs. (basically, efforts to break down cultural boundries and build respect for each other)
4. Find, and fairly try, all perpertrators of terrorism. Never sentence them to death (that's what they want), but sentence them to life in prison without a chance for getting out.
5. Put more pressure on the Muslim community to condemn terrorism and to educate its populus why terrorism is wrong.
I editted it slightly for clarity.
My proposal for winning the war on terror:
1. End the War on (some) Drugs. I pity the fool who doesn't realize the true effect this would have on our planet.
2. Commit to staying absolutely dedicated to the rights and freedoms of citizens no matter how many times we are attacked.
3. Provide increases in funding for education, here and abroad, investment in further solidifying the internet as a free network that no one country can lock down, and continuely increase the number and size of "transfer student" type programs. (basically, efforts to break down cultural boundries and build respect for each other)
4. Find, and fairly try, all perpertrators of terrorism. Never sentence them to death (that's what they want), but sentence them to life in prison without a chance for getting out.
5. Put more pressure on the Muslim community to condemn terrorism and to educate its populus why terrorism is wrong.
Definitely. Let's cut off Isreal. If we're not interested in support muslim theocracies, why are we supporting a jewish one?
How about ween ourselves off OIL. Look up and understand the concept of Peak Oil, and you'll realize that the solution to ME oil is not NA oil, it's other energy sources.
Arrogant idea, IMO. Western values tend to be such glowing gems as materialism, imperialism, greed, arrogance, and capitalism. When it comes to peace and freedom, there are plenty of eastern cultures with similarly respectable beliefs... thus making those qualities something other than western.
I'd prefer a place called Asshole Island. The ME is too large and too interesting of a place to throw to the dogs forever... plus you got to respect the fact that not everyone in that area is a facist / extremist.
europe didn't do squat in the first gulf war. in fact it was bc of the UN we couldn't topple saddam then.
1. so the people overthrow the existing stable govts and cut off oil to US now oil is $30/gal
2. and let iran nuke them kill all the jews holocaust all over again
3. isolate ourselves while the world consolidates in globalization and gains power against us
4. yea whatever
islamists want every country to wave the crescent flag. they don't want to live side by side in peace...
Bush Sr wrote in his book that it would have been a terriable idea to further invade Iraq during the first war. He chose not to, not the UN. Get your facts straight.
Which is why I support the war in Iraq.
We could very feasibly, and for much less cost monetarily and especially with American lives, simply reduce any middle eastern country we feel is guilty to rubble.
Instead we got rid of Saddam and are trying to win over the hearts and minds which is no simple task.
I don't think you understand what real force is if we truly just wanted payback rather than solving the problem.
- Aug 23, 2003
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Sorry, but the US cannot simply reduce any country it wants into rubble. Doesn't matter how feasible it sounds to you. We have a system of checks and balances that prevents it.
Payback is hard to administer to a disjointed, worldwide network of terrorists like al-Qaeda. You can't fight that war with bombs (unless you want to drop those bombs on cells from the Afghani mountainsides to neighborhoods in the UK).
Getting rid of Saddam...winning the "hearts and minds"...you have all the talking points down, verbatim. Where were they before the war started, though?
Nobody in their right mind would have considered invading Iraq as the next logical step in the war on terror. No connection with 9/11, no WMDs, no immediate threat...Afghanistan, Pakistan, and Saudi Arabia should have been our focal points. How much did invading Iraq and removing Saddam weaken al-Qaeda?
"Peace cannot be kept by force, it can only be achieved by understanding." -Albert Einstein
Obligatory comment:
OMG ANYTHING BUT WHAT BUSH DOES
Obligatory comment:
OMG ANYTHING BUT WHAT BUSH DOES
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