help with upgrading an older CPU

JCROCCO

Senior member
Mar 14, 2003
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How do I know if a cpu will work on my board? Is it only the bus speed and type? If my type is a socket 478 and I know the bus speed can be 533, then will any CPU regardless of clock speed run on it it they are 533 and socket 478?

For some reason, I remember that my board could go up to a 2.4GHz, it is a 1.8. I cannot find any documentaion saying the max clock speed, and I do find other socket 478 at 533 that are 2.6, 2.8 and higher. Can a mobo limit the clock speed? I am wanting to upgrade to the 2.8

Also, in my bios I have to set the multiplier to 18 for a 1.8 at 400MHz. I saw somewhere that a 2.4 at 533MHz would also be an 18 multiplier. If this is true, what would a 2.8GHz at 533MHz be?

Also, the CPU I am looking to buy has a core of PRESCOTT. Does that affect the possible ability to work on my Mobo, mine says Northbridge and Southbridge.
 

circut16

Member
Jun 21, 2001
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do you know the make and model of your mobo?
checking the manufactures web site is the most definitive way
 

JCROCCO

Senior member
Mar 14, 2003
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I do know exactly, is it a PCChips M922LU V5.0 using P4X333 Northbridge, and VT8235 Southbridge chipsets with a PGA Socket 478 with support up to 533MHz FSB.

I did check the mfr site, it does have info on the board, and about bus speed, etc, but not max CPU speed, none that I can find.

I dont know why I remember anything about 2.4 being the max, but I cant find anything to support that. If I install a 2.8 Socket 478 with 533 fsb, should it be able to work?
 

JCROCCO

Senior member
Mar 14, 2003
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Heres the info from the CPUZ. Whats weird is that is states it is an M922, not M922LU, and it also states VIA P4X266 instead of VIA P4X333 like my manual states. If it is in fact a P4x233, will it still accept a 533MHz FSB?

Number of processors 1
Number of cores 1 per processor
Number of threads 1 per processor
Name Intel Pentium 4
Code Name Willamette
Specification Intel(R) Pentium(R) 4 CPU 1.80GHz
Package Socket 478 mPGA
Family/Model/Stepping F.1.2
Extended Family/Model F.1
Brand ID 8
Core Stepping D0
Technology 0.18 um
Core Speed 1800.1 MHz
Multiplier x Bus speed 18.0 x 100.0 MHz
Rated Bus speed 400.0 MHz
Stock frequency 1800 MHz
Instruction sets MMX, SSE, SSE2
L1 Data cache (per processor) 8 KBytes, 4-way set associative, 64-byte line size
Trace cache (per processor) 12 Kuops, 8-way set associative
L2 cache (per processor) 256 KBytes, 8-way set associative, 64-byte line size

Chipset & Memory

Northbridge VIA P4X266 (VT8753) rev. 01
Southbridge VIA VT8235 rev. 00
Graphic Interface AGP
AGP Revision 3.0
AGP Transfer Rate 4x
AGP Side Band Addressing supported, enabled
Memory Type DDR
Memory Size 1024 MBytes
Memory Frequency 100.0 MHz (1:1)
DRAM Interleave none
CAS# Latency (tCL) 2.5 clocks
RAS# to CAS# (tRCD) 2 clocks
RAS# Precharge (tRP) 2 clocks
Cycle Time (tRAS) 5 clocks

System

System Manufacturer = ECS
System Name = M922
System S/N = 00000000
Mainboard Vendor ECS
Mainboard Model M922
BIOS Vendor American Megatrends Inc.
BIOS Version 07.00T
BIOS Date 04/02/01

Memory SPD

Module 1 DDR, PC2700 (166 MHz), 512 MBytes, unknown brand
Module 2 DDR, PC2700 (166 MHz), 512 MBytes, unknown brand

Software

Windows Version Microsoft Windows XP Professional Service Pack 3 (Build 2600)
DirectX Version 9.0c

 

circut16

Member
Jun 21, 2001
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old willamette ehh - yea it needs upgrading
Do you live near any major universities? Sometimes they have surplus stores open to the public.
Computers that can be had for real cheap, there are boat loads of P4's.
Some p4's are the LGA 775, 3GHz 1MB cache are some of the newest i've seen. there ussally no more than $150.00 for the whole thing.
Your time and money might be better spent there.
 

JCROCCO

Senior member
Mar 14, 2003
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Well, I do appreciate the concern, but I have found them for $22 each, and I need 4. I really need to know what the MAX CPU will work, if the 2.8 would work more importantly.

$22 for a simple upgrade and about $40 for (2) 1 gig memory will max out each machine, then I will reload windows and have a good enough setup for a few more years.

Would a CPU with a prescott core work in this mobo, and is the mobo info correct as it differs from my manual.
 

JCROCCO

Senior member
Mar 14, 2003
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Do I need to find one that is a Northbridge then? I dont quite understand, but I would like to know what I need so I can update it to the max it can support. I know they may be hard to find, any help is appreciated.
 

myocardia

Diamond Member
Jun 21, 2003
9,291
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Assuming your motherboards are version 3.3's, they will support up to a 2.66Ghz Northwood B, which has a 133 Mhz/533 Mhz quad-pumped FSB, but only after flashing them to the latest BIOS. I agree with circut16, though. You just don't seem like the type that this type of thing would work out very well for, especially when you can buy ~3 Ghz P4 computers these for $150 each or less.
 

Denithor

Diamond Member
Apr 11, 2004
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What are you planning to do with these systems?

You do realize, I hope, that a single modern dual-core processor (Intel or AMD, I don't care which) clocked at 2GHz or higher will about equal the processing power of four P4-2.8GHz processors? And consume lots less energy while working?

Now, if you decide to go forward with upgrading these systems, you want to flash the BIOS to the latest available for the motherboard. Based on the CPU compatibility chart your motherboard will support up to a Pentium4 3.06GHz processor ($80). It will also support these chips: P4 2.8GHz ($45) or the relatively cheap P4 2.66GHz ($18). Whatever you get, just make sure it's 533MHz fsb with 512k cache (not the 1MB cache, those won't work).
 

JCROCCO

Senior member
Mar 14, 2003
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Just use them for for home use, mostly small programs and internet/email. My kids do play games on them, this, and more memory, could only help. Just trying to get a few more years out of them before building new systems.

The problem is the Bios I think for this mobo has an older 2001 but the latest is only a 2002 and I cant tell if it would support the new CPU. By the info above, you can see my bios date and version, and mobo number. I see a V5.0 on the mobo, and the manual says version 5.0. I dont think it is V3.3

Also, that compatibility chart only shows the Willamette going to 2.0 GHz. Are you saying that by upgrading the bios, I could use the Northwood Processors? I can get those, they are available. Just not sure if the bios is upgraded enough to support them. How could I know?

If I could update the CPU, thats my first choice.

My second, and maybe more preferable based on price would be If I could update the mobo, keeping my case, CD?DVD and HD (I can replace mem if needed) I might consider doing that. My concern here is does adding a new MOBO and CPU do anything to the OS or the HD where I need to reinstall the OS or any programs?

Looking for reasonable options, thanks for all the help.
 

cusideabelincoln

Diamond Member
Aug 3, 2008
3,275
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Looks like you could probably pop in up to a 3.06 GHz / 533MHz FSB processor into the motherboard:
http://www.cpu-upgrade.com/mb-...HIPS/M922LU(V5.0).html

It is recommended that you reformat and reinstall Windows after upgrading the motherboard, but you don't need to after upgrading the processor only. Your best option is probably to just go a whole new route. Looks like you're already prepared to spend $60 on upgrading this old machine. It's not worth the money, IMO. Current AMD processors will be much, much faster than a P4, and integrated graphics will be able to handle games well enough. And 2GB DDR2 memory is only about $30, or cheaper after rebates.

$20 Sempron 64 1.8 GHz http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16819104006
$54 Foxcon AMD 780V mobo http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16813186143
$12 After rebate 2GB OCZ DDR2 800 http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16820227198
-----
$86 after rebates and shipping (which would be free).

Although you may need to get a new power supply if it doesn't support 24-pin ATX, but everything else should transfer over.
 

JCROCCO

Senior member
Mar 14, 2003
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Is an AMD Sempron 64 1.8 GHz really that much faster than a P4 1.8?

The issue is I have 4 computers I need to do this to. $60 X 4 is cheaper than $150+ for each, figuring I would need new PS and Heat sink (model was less heat sink fan)

If I can buy the CPU and 2 gig memm for 60 or so per machine, since I dont do high end gaming, I think that would be the best way, and I dont have to reload the OS.

I am just not sure if I can flash my bios and have the Northwood work. Would I need to flash the bios first, and what if it has problems witht he existing system,or fails all together, and whos to say it will work with the Northwood after that? Does that bios chart above mean that?
 

Denithor

Diamond Member
Apr 11, 2004
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Flash the BIOS first using the 1.8GHz Willamette processors you've already got installed. Then the Northwood chips should be compatible, up to and including the 3.06GHz/533/512k model listed in my previous post. Do the flash, buy one Northwood cpu and make sure they're compatible before you decide to upgrade all four.

Besides, why upgrade all four systems? I would recommend upgrading one first and see if it works and if it really speeds things up noticeably. Also this gives you a chance to make sure the money spent will get you the performance you need (or are games & stuff still going to be slow?).

If you decide to upgrade the whole box, go for something like this setup.

AMD X2 4850e $60
780G motherboard $72
Crucial 2x2GB DDR2-800 $20AR

If you buy two processors & motherboards you can use one stick of RAM with each so your total upgrade cost per system is only $142. You could potentially upgrade two systems like this and the other two either leave alone or put in minor upgrades (2.66GHz cpu, pull the ram from the two boxes you're rebuilding, etc). For about $325 or so you could have all four systems upgraded pretty well. Two of them would handle some light gaming (even with newer games) and the other two would be well setup for email/browsing/etc.
 

JCROCCO

Senior member
Mar 14, 2003
596
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Yeah, I would only do 1 first. Since I have 4 identical computers, if 1 works, they all should.

What scares me is the bios. . . . . . . . .

The CPUz program said I have a M922. My manual says I have an M922 series, V5.0. The box that the MOBO came in said it was an M922LU v5.0. On the mobo, I cant find the model number, but I did find somewhere where it said V5.0

However, on the MFR website for their mobos, it shows M922, and M922LU versions available.

On the Bios upgrade site, they show an M922 version and an M922LU version, both say V5.0.

This is the problem . . . .

On the CPU upgrade area, it only lists M922LUV5.0 with Bios version 030310s. There is no listing for just a M922.

Back to the Bios update, the M922 does not show an update to 030310s, but the M922LU does.

I am afraid that if I download the M922LU 030310s bios and flash it to my mobo (which may be M922 and doesnt show this bios) that it can render the PC useless.

UUGGHHHHHHH
 

cusideabelincoln

Diamond Member
Aug 3, 2008
3,275
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You should trust the model number on the box that it came in if you were to trust anything at all ;) The manual says it's an M922 series, so the word series indicates it could also be an M922LU and that they use the same manual for both the M922 and M922LU. CPU-Z isn't always exact with its motherboard and chipset readings, so don't put much faith in it at all.
 

JCROCCO

Senior member
Mar 14, 2003
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Great, thanks ALL for your help.

I will try to D/L the update, flash the bios, then install a cpu and see what happens. If it works AND there seems to be a somewhat significant improvement, then I would do the other 3.

I just hope I dont have problems with the flashing of the bios.

On my mobo there is a jumper for CPU frequeancy. It is one setting for 100M and another for 133M. Since I am going to a 533 from a 400, I am assuming I will have to change teh jumper to 133. Is this correct?
 

JCROCCO

Senior member
Mar 14, 2003
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The FLASH bios did not work. UUGGHHHH!!!

I downloaded the files it told me on the website, made the bootable disk, ran it, and the program came up. It told me to hit enter. When I did it said the "chipset/flash part isnt available. The function will be invalid".
It also says the chip, code, brand, type, romsize, bootblock, navram, and voltage are all unknown. This is with the CPU the mobo came with.

I thought it would do this automatically, instead it came up with a dos program with options and I had to hit enter to start. It didnt screw up the computer at least.

The utility is a flash EPROM Programming utility V8.27.01P.

Does anyone know what this means? Could I possibly have the wrong bios update? I went off of what it said to use online, I do have the V5.0, not the 3.3.

I only tried in on 1 computer, in case it screwed up. Can it be the Chip, I do have a 2.4 chip but supposedly wont work unless I have the proper Bios that I am trying to install.

Is there a problem installing the new chip to see what happens without updating the bios? I could always put the old chip back, but can that screw something up?

Can this really that hard?
 

Denithor

Diamond Member
Apr 11, 2004
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You could try mounting the 2.4GHz chip and just see what happens, it won't mess anything up. But first I would try flashing the other boards to see if any of them will take.

Yes, it can really be that hard. It is odd that the BIOS didn't recognize the hardware, especially if it's V5.0 like you said. Which is why I suggested that you try one first before spending a bunch of money to upgrade them all and then discovering that it wouldn't work.
 

accguy9009

Senior member
Oct 21, 2007
504
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I would check out craigslist for your local area, as I often see computers
much faster than what you have for sale for less than $100.00 sometimes $ 75.00.
Companies that are replacing lots of computers sell the old ones in bulk to resellers. You are going down a very slippery slope dealing with upgrading the units you have.

I don't know where in NY you are but an example of what I am talking about
is here http://albany.craigslist.org/sys/908615856.html

You can find these locally all the time and you get to try them out usually before you
pay for them. Good luck