Help me understand UAW Unions.

[alkemyst]

Originally posted by: 0roo0roo
ornery is whats wrong with domestic cars today. he will just never get it lol he's stuck in the past.

I am thinking that. You want vintage steel cough up the coin.

I had a 66 Mustang GT as my first car at 17...not a hooptie, a full every bolt/nut/screw removed and replaced with NOS where available

I am in a 98 Nissan 240SX SE now....planning on adding a bit of boost though

I need the weather here in S. Florida to cooperate though....most of my interior has been out since labor day

 

[Ornery]

Originally posted by: 0roo0roo
ornery is whats wrong with domestic cars today. he will just never get it lol he's stuck in the past.

If Detroit built cars like they used to, they wouldn't be in this pickle. Chrysler's got the idea...

 

[Pocatello]

The big 2 just don't offer a better when it comes to cars. The Ford Fusion is a good start, but it's assembled in Mexico, why should I buy that instead of a Honda Accord which is built by Americans?

 

[Pocatello]

Originally posted by: Ornery

Originally posted by: 0roo0roo
ornery is whats wrong with domestic cars today. he will just never get it lol he's stuck in the past.

If Detroit built cars like they used to, they wouldn't be in this pickle. Chrysler's got the idea...

Yeah, the 300C is nice car made by Canadians. But the Toyota Avalon is nicer inside and just as fast and much more reliable, and built by Americans.

 

[alkemyst]

Originally posted by: Ornery

:roll: WTF are you talking about?

I am willing to bet the Crown Vic accidents had 'old man speed' on their side.

 

[PlatinumGold]

Originally posted by: imthebadguy
UAW = Useless

this will be a FIRST for me, but i'm going to have to come to the defense of the unions.

when is the last time a CEO had any kind of negative reinforcement without actually breaking the law? what is a "failure" for a CEO? most CEO's get rewarded even as the company they managed goes out of business. some CEO's do better as their companies do worse.

Upper management is just as much to blame for the state of our economy today as the UAW is. it's stock market gambing (get rich quick scheme). all this BS by the republicans about "Capital Gains" tax breaks. that's utter nonsense. a cut in the capital gains taxes has almost ZERO impact on new business investments. it just reduces taxes on the rich for th money they made on equities. stocks, speculations, options these things all take the money away from where it needs to be, invested in real business. in inventory, in production, in marketing, in land, in building (not for the sake of real estate speculation but because you need the building).

the problem is, it's money for the sake of money. that's all it is.

it's horrendous.

money is a medium of exchange. that's it. if it is just a medium of exchange, there must be something to exchange being produced. what we've done is we've created a society that takes advantage of the differences in technology, knowledge, production capacity, of other nations. problem is, they are all catching up to us. we cannot continue to just live on the margin as that margin is getting smaller and smaller.

 

[Pocatello]

Getting rid of the Union won't solve GM or Ford problems, it's about products. German and Korean car companies have their unions too, and they don't play nice.

 

[Ornery]

So, your solution is some kind of Socialist/Communist replacement, Johann? We need some kind of nanny to care for us and our dealings with our employer? We need some kind of mob power and extortion tactics to extract what we "deserve" from "the man"?

1. :roll:

 

[alkemyst]

Originally posted by: PlatinumGold

Originally posted by: imthebadguy
UAW = Useless

this will be a FIRST for me, but i'm going to have to come to the defense of the unions.

when is the last time a CEO had any kind of negative reinforcement without actually breaking the law? what is a "failure" for a CEO? most CEO's get rewarded even as the company they managed goes out of business. some CEO's do better as their companies do worse.

Upper management is just as much to blame for the state of our economy today as the UAW is. it's stock market gambing (get rich quick scheme). all this BS by the republicans about "Capital Gains" tax breaks. that's utter nonsense. a cut in the capital gains taxes has almost ZERO impact on new business investments. it just reduces taxes on the rich for th money they made on equities. stocks, speculations, options these things all take the money away from where it needs to be, invested in real business. in inventory, in production, in marketing, in land, in building (not for the sake of real estate speculation but because you need the building).

the problem is, it's money for the sake of money. that's all it is.

it's horrendous.

money is a medium of exchange. that's it. if it is just a medium of exchange, there must be something to exchange being produced. what we've done is we've created a society that takes advantage of the differences in technology, knowledge, production capacity, of other nations. problem is, they are all catching up to us. we cannot continue to just live on the margin as that margin is getting smaller and smaller.

huh most CEO's that fail (assuming a traded company) are fired.

If you are dealing with mom and pop shops YMMV.

 

[dartworth]

I am totally convinced that Ornery recently hit his head on something?

He just babbles on and on about nonsense anymore?


And alkemyst...well you are just an idiot...

 

[Ornery]

1. Go back to your studies, comrade...

 

[dartworth]

Originally posted by: Ornery

1. Go back to your studies, comrade...

Just because you choose to work as a under paid, under trained, uninformed worker, doesn?t mean we all have too.

 

[alkemyst]

Originally posted by: dartworth
I am totally convinced that Ornery recently hit his head on something?

He just babbles on and on about nonsense anymore?


And alkemyst...well you are just an idiot...

well you are in my same classroom so I wasn't expecting otherwise.

thanks for the clarification though.

 

[Ornery]

Did it ever occur to you lazy maggots, that you can actually start your own damn business? Thank God for that, and God help you if your employees turn out to be like our resident, world-owes-me-a-living, ATOT members!

 

[dartworth]

Listen scab, don?t be jealous of union trades people having better working conditions and better wages.

 

[alkemyst]

Originally posted by: Ornery
Thank God for that, and God help you if your employees turn out to be like our resident, world-owes-me-a-living, ATOT members!

great you live by example.

 

[Ornery]

1. A Proud Union Member I'd rather have self-respect, thank you...

 

[dartworth]

The Scab

"After God had finished the rattlesnake, the toad, and the vampire, he had some awful substance left with which he made a scab."

"A scab is a two-legged animal with a corkscrew soul, a water brain, a combination backbone of jelly and glue. Where others have hearts, he carries a tumor of rotten principles."

"When a scab comes down the street, men turn their backs and angels weep in heaven, and the devil shuts the gates of hell to keep him out."

"No man (or woman) has a right to scab so long as there is a pool of water to drown his carcass in, or a rope long enough to hang his body with. Judas was a gentleman compared with a scab. For betraying his master, he had character enough to hang himself." A scab has not.

"Esau sold his birthright for a mess of pottage. Judas sold his Savior for thirty pieces of silver. Benedict Arnold sold his country for a promise of a commision in the british army." The scab sells his birthright, country, his wife, his children and his fellowmen for an unfulfilled promise from his employer.

Esau was a traitor to himself; Judas was a traitor to his God; Benedict Arnold was a traitor to his country; a scab is a traitor to his God, his country, his family and his class."

Author --- Jack London (1876-1916)

 

[Ornery]

How I Became a Socialist

• The young Jack London was anything but a socialist; he possessed an optimism stemmed from his health and strength. He was a rugged individualist who worked hard and saw the world as good. But as he details in his essay, "How I Became a Socialist", his socialist views began as his eyes were opened to the members of the bottom of the social pit. His optimism and individualism faded, and he vowed never to do more hard work than he had to. He writes that his individualism was hammered out of him, and he was reborn a socialist. London first joined the Socialist Labor Party in April, 1896. In 1901 he left the Socialist Labor Party and joined the new Socialist Party of America. In 1896 the San Francisco Chronicle published a story about the 20-year-old London who was out nightly in Oakland's City Hall Park, giving speeches on socialism to the crowds?an activity for which he was arrested in 1897. He ran unsuccessfully as the high-profile Socialist nominee for mayor of Oakland in 1901 (receiving 245 votes) and 1905 (improving to 981 votes), toured the country lecturing on socialism in 1906, and published collections of essays on socialism (The War of the Classes, 1905; Revolution, and other Essays, 1910).
  
  He customarily closed his letters "Yours for the Revolution."
  
  A socialist viewpoint is evident throughout his writing, most notably in his novel The Iron Heel. No theorist or intellectual socialist, Jack London's socialism came from the heart and his life experience.
  
  In his later years he possibly felt some ambivalence toward socialism. He was an extraordinary financial success as a writer, and wanted desperately to make a financial success of his Glen Ellen ranch. He complained about the "inefficient Italian workers" in his employ. In 1916 he resigned from the Glen Ellen chapter of the Socialist Party, but stated emphatically that he did so "because of its lack of fire and fight, and its loss of emphasis on the class struggle."

 

[dartworth]

Ornery, this is so typical of you. You just place a label on someone for what they believe in.

I am a union member, therefore I am a socialist?:roll: Because I am in a union the world owes me a job :roll:

Instead of trying to understand that there are different types of unions, and how unions operate, you just lump them all together. You are so bitter and jealous that people make a decent wage and have decent working conditions.

You already have this idea in your head about unions and it will never change. I can talk till I?m blue in the face, but it will do no good. I don?t have to defend what I believe to anyone. I am willing to explain to anyone how my union works for better understanding.

You see, it is easier to understand something when you have all the facts. Some people just don?t want to listen to them.

After all if it is on the internet, it has to be true?right?

 

[Ornery]

1. You're right. Your hero actually wasn't a Socialist... :roll:

 

[dartworth]

I could can less if he was a socialist...that wasn?t my point, but I can see that is your word for the day.

At least he had some passion about what he believed in. He didn?t go around bashing people?s ideals and beliefs.

Once again, you are proving my point that you don?t understand something, so you just trash it.

 

[Sureshot324]

Originally posted by: Black88GTA

Originally posted by: spidey07
Hence why fanboys should be required to post age and vehicles owned instead of spouting marketing propganda.

Uh, are you referring to me? I'm hardly a 'fanboy' - the only Buick I'd ever consider buying is approaching 20 years old - for the newest ones.

I'm not spouting 'marketing propaganda' either. I happen to think that the Buick division fills a space in GM's lineup that competes with other (non-GM) brands for a well-defined market, where Chevy / Pontiac seem to offer cars that appeal to the same buyers - in other words, Chevy / Pontiac compete against each other.

If GM were to axe another brand, they'd do better to cut one of those two than to do away with Buick. That's all I'm saying, and it is my honest opinion.

Chevy and pontiac are mostly the same cars. Eg pontiac pursuit is basically a cobalt with a different body, Sunfire=cavalir, etc. It doesn't cost them that much more to offer two different body styles for one car, since the rest of the car is identical. I don't see anything wrong with that.

 

[mugs]

Well this thread certainly got more interesting. The union members here certainly aren't making me any more pro-union.

 

[dartworth]

Originally posted by: mugs
Well this thread certainly got more interesting. The union members here certainly aren't making me any more pro-union.

oh damn...