Help me solve this problem!

rikadik

Senior member
Dec 30, 2004
649
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Whilst sat using my laptop in the living room, I just bet with my friend that with the internet in front of me I could answer any question he asked. The question he asked:

How big would an indian elephant's ears have to be to generate enough lift by flapping them to fly?

So I need to find this out. And I have an idea how... if you work out the weight of an average house fly, and the surface area of its wings, then apply that proportionately to the weight of an indian elephant, I could work out how big the ears would have to be. For simplicity, I'm assuming the elephant would beat its ears at the same rate as the fly.

Trouble is I cant find the information needed, so help!

Cheers!
 

rikadik

Senior member
Dec 30, 2004
649
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Ah an interesting angle. So by applying the magic carpet theory, the ears become irrelevant.
 

91TTZ

Lifer
Jan 31, 2005
14,374
1
0
Originally posted by: rikadik
Whilst sat using my laptop in the living room, I just bet with my friend that with the internet in front of me I could answer any question he asked. The question he asked:

How big would an indian elephant's ears have to be to generate enough lift by flapping them to fly?

So I need to find this out. And I have an idea how... if you work out the weight of an average house fly, and the surface area of its wings, then apply that proportionately to the weight of an indian elephant, I could work out how big the ears would have to be. For simplicity, I'm assuming the elephant would beat its ears at the same rate as the fly.

Trouble is I cant find the information needed, so help!

Cheers!


You cannot work out the problem with the information provided. Obviously an elephant's ears couldn't flap at the frequency that a fly's wings can, so they'll generate less lift. Also the elephant doesn't have the muscles in its ears to flap its ears with any kind of force. And if it did have huge muscles to flap its ears, it wouldn't be an elephant anymore.

If speed wasn't a factor, then you could make a fly's wings generate enough lift to lift the elephant. The fly would just have to flap them a million times as fast.
 

olds

Elite Member
Mar 3, 2000
50,047
706
126
Originally posted by: rikadik
... if you work out the weight of an average house fly, and the surface area of its wings, then apply that proportionately to the weight of an indian elephant, I could work out how big the ears would have to be. ...
An elephant's ears and a flies' wings are made of different material and may be shaped differently. It doesn't seem that the two are relatable (sp) with any accuracy.

 

rikadik

Senior member
Dec 30, 2004
649
0
0
Originally posted by: 91TTZ
Originally posted by: rikadik
Whilst sat using my laptop in the living room, I just bet with my friend that with the internet in front of me I could answer any question he asked. The question he asked:

How big would an indian elephant's ears have to be to generate enough lift by flapping them to fly?

So I need to find this out. And I have an idea how... if you work out the weight of an average house fly, and the surface area of its wings, then apply that proportionately to the weight of an indian elephant, I could work out how big the ears would have to be. For simplicity, I'm assuming the elephant would beat its ears at the same rate as the fly.

Trouble is I cant find the information needed, so help!

Cheers!


You cannot work out the problem with the information provided. Obviously an elephant's ears couldn't flap at the frequency that a fly's wings can, so they'll generate less lift. Also the elephant doesn't have the muscles in its ears to flap its ears with any kind of force. And if it did have huge muscles to flap its ears, it wouldn't be an elephant anymore.

If speed wasn't a factor, then you could make a fly's wings generate enough lift to lift the elephant. The fly would just have to flap them a million times as fast.

So we should genetically modify the elephant? That's unethical! You disgust me. :p
 

maximus maximus

Platinum Member
Oct 17, 2004
2,140
0
0
Originally posted by: rikadik
Originally posted by: 91TTZ
Originally posted by: rikadik
Whilst sat using my laptop in the living room, I just bet with my friend that with the internet in front of me I could answer any question he asked. The question he asked:

How big would an indian elephant's ears have to be to generate enough lift by flapping them to fly?

So I need to find this out. And I have an idea how... if you work out the weight of an average house fly, and the surface area of its wings, then apply that proportionately to the weight of an indian elephant, I could work out how big the ears would have to be. For simplicity, I'm assuming the elephant would beat its ears at the same rate as the fly.

Trouble is I cant find the information needed, so help!

Cheers!


You cannot work out the problem with the information provided. Obviously an elephant's ears couldn't flap at the frequency that a fly's wings can, so they'll generate less lift. Also the elephant doesn't have the muscles in its ears to flap its ears with any kind of force. And if it did have huge muscles to flap its ears, it wouldn't be an elephant anymore.

If speed wasn't a factor, then you could make a fly's wings generate enough lift to lift the elephant. The fly would just have to flap them a million times as fast.

So we should genetically modify the elephant? That's unethical! You disgust me. :p

No.. you can ask a humming bird to do an elephant.. and then wait for the kid to be born. :)
 

FoBoT

No Lifer
Apr 30, 2001
63,089
12
76
fobot.com
put the elephant into an experimental transportal machine along with a fly
they'll be genetically melded in the transfer and you'll end up with a elefly after a few days
 

91TTZ

Lifer
Jan 31, 2005
14,374
1
0
Originally posted by: FoBoT
put the elephant into an experimental transportal machine along with a fly
they'll be genetically melded in the transfer and you'll end up with a elefly after a few days


What if you end up with a flelephant instead?
 

rikadik

Senior member
Dec 30, 2004
649
0
0
Originally posted by: maximus maximus
Originally posted by: rikadik
Originally posted by: 91TTZ
Originally posted by: rikadik
Whilst sat using my laptop in the living room, I just bet with my friend that with the internet in front of me I could answer any question he asked. The question he asked:

How big would an indian elephant's ears have to be to generate enough lift by flapping them to fly?

So I need to find this out. And I have an idea how... if you work out the weight of an average house fly, and the surface area of its wings, then apply that proportionately to the weight of an indian elephant, I could work out how big the ears would have to be. For simplicity, I'm assuming the elephant would beat its ears at the same rate as the fly.

Trouble is I cant find the information needed, so help!

Cheers!


You cannot work out the problem with the information provided. Obviously an elephant's ears couldn't flap at the frequency that a fly's wings can, so they'll generate less lift. Also the elephant doesn't have the muscles in its ears to flap its ears with any kind of force. And if it did have huge muscles to flap its ears, it wouldn't be an elephant anymore.

If speed wasn't a factor, then you could make a fly's wings generate enough lift to lift the elephant. The fly would just have to flap them a million times as fast.

So we should genetically modify the elephant? That's unethical! You disgust me. :p

No.. you can ask a humming bird to do an elephant.. and then wait for the kid to be born. :)

Ah that could work. But I've never asked a hummingbird to mate something. Well not an elephant at any rate. I wouldn't really know how to approach the situation.
 

91TTZ

Lifer
Jan 31, 2005
14,374
1
0
Originally posted by: rikadik
Originally posted by: maximus maximus
Originally posted by: rikadik
Originally posted by: 91TTZ
Originally posted by: rikadik
Whilst sat using my laptop in the living room, I just bet with my friend that with the internet in front of me I could answer any question he asked. The question he asked:

How big would an indian elephant's ears have to be to generate enough lift by flapping them to fly?

So I need to find this out. And I have an idea how... if you work out the weight of an average house fly, and the surface area of its wings, then apply that proportionately to the weight of an indian elephant, I could work out how big the ears would have to be. For simplicity, I'm assuming the elephant would beat its ears at the same rate as the fly.

Trouble is I cant find the information needed, so help!

Cheers!


You cannot work out the problem with the information provided. Obviously an elephant's ears couldn't flap at the frequency that a fly's wings can, so they'll generate less lift. Also the elephant doesn't have the muscles in its ears to flap its ears with any kind of force. And if it did have huge muscles to flap its ears, it wouldn't be an elephant anymore.

If speed wasn't a factor, then you could make a fly's wings generate enough lift to lift the elephant. The fly would just have to flap them a million times as fast.

So we should genetically modify the elephant? That's unethical! You disgust me. :p

No.. you can ask a humming bird to do an elephant.. and then wait for the kid to be born. :)

Ah that could work. But I've never asked a hummingbird to mate something. Well not an elephant at any rate. I wouldn't really know how to approach the situation.


Just spike the nectar with tequila. It'll do it, trust me.
 

randay

Lifer
May 30, 2006
11,019
216
106
Its impossible, an elephants ears were not made to generate lift. You don't need the internet to figure that one out.
 

rikadik

Senior member
Dec 30, 2004
649
0
0
Originally posted by: randay
Its impossible, an elephants ears were not made to generate lift. You don't need the internet to figure that one out.

So its a trick question? Damn... the hummingbirds just done a tequila slammer...
 

randay

Lifer
May 30, 2006
11,019
216
106
Originally posted by: rikadik
Originally posted by: randay
Its impossible, an elephants ears were not made to generate lift. You don't need the internet to figure that one out.

So its a trick question? Damn... the hummingbirds just done a tequila slammer...

If an elephant was on a conveyur belt and the belt matches the speed of the elephant but in reverse, can the elephant take off?
 

rikadik

Senior member
Dec 30, 2004
649
0
0
Originally posted by: randay
Originally posted by: rikadik
Originally posted by: randay
Its impossible, an elephants ears were not made to generate lift. You don't need the internet to figure that one out.

So its a trick question? Damn... the hummingbirds just done a tequila slammer...

If an elephant was on a conveyur belt and the belt matches the speed of the elephant but in reverse, can the elephant take off?

Hahaha. I remember that. I'm sure it had something to do with 0.88888888888888.
 

homercles337

Diamond Member
Dec 29, 2004
6,345
3
71
Flys dont fly like you think. Look up the work of michael dickinson. He's at berkeley (or at least he was when i was there, actually it looks like he might be at caltech now). The physics of fly flight are unique.
 

DrPizza

Administrator Elite Member Goat Whisperer
Mar 5, 2001
49,606
166
111
www.slatebrookfarm.com
You're trying to scale up based on surface area?
Suppose an elephant is 1000 times the length of a fly. Then, if it was proportional, the surface area of its wings would be 1 million times as great. However, mass goes up with the cube; the elephant would be 1 billion times as heavy. So, if lift is proportional to surface area, you're going to need ears 1000 times bigger than when you scale up.

oh, and btw, it's impossible.