Help me decide

[Wolfsraider]

For web apps, which is easier to learn? visual basic or c#?

I want to mess around with asp a bit.

Pro's / cons of each or learn both?

 

[Fullmetal Chocobo]

For VB and C#, do you have access to compilers? Or would it require the purchase of them? Also, is this going to be for personal or professional purposes? (IE for employment or making webpages of your own for your use)

 

[Wolfsraider]

Personal use (will use it later if I learn it for others websites) and need compliers I assume (newb here)

 

[caferace]

What is your goal? As someone who wrote his first web page 13 years ago, a simple grasp of HTML is the way to start.

Dealing with your average IDE is way overkill. Begin with the foundation, if you want your house to last.

-jim

 

[Fullmetal Chocobo]

I would go with Java, JavaScript, and/or ASP then. They require no compilers, and can be implements with notepad and a browser.

There are other variations (unix/linux/mac/freeware/etc) of compilers, but Microsoft Visual Studio is pretty much the standard as far as I've ever heard. I got the entire set really cheap via student discount. PM me if you need a link to a good website that I have ordered from, and thus are legit. (I ordered the cheapest thing I could in order to see if the place was legit or not, and they are).

What type of stuff are you trying to accomplish with your web pages. Different languages can do different things. Also, a new language to hit the web is AJAX, which can do some incredible things. That DVD renting place uses AJAX to display reviews & summaries of the DVDs when you hover the mouse over a movie title. (Sorry, can't reemmeber the name of the place though)

 

[Wolfsraider]

I can get around in html, css, php, I wanted more power and better security than those as well.

I havent heard of ajax much, javascript is ok, I really wanted to see whats possible by expanding my horizons.

 

[Wolfsraider]

Css is good but limited in what you can do, tables and frames are out although they have their uses, Php seems totally unsecure, so I am hunting for something I will enjoy to code in that offeres better security but flexible in web page construction , that can also be used to index a site and serve up the results, as well as stats etc...

 

[Wolfsraider]

Ok

Like DHTML, LAMP and SPA, Ajax is not a technology in itself, but a term that refers to the use of a group of technologies

Ah ok I see, I have used dhtml and I dont see its much different than javascript or css but it has some differences that make it useful.

 

[Fullmetal Chocobo]

I wish I had your knowledge of CSS right now. I've been working with creating XML files, and I just create them without having any way of reading or formatting them. I've gotten used to reading them manually--they really are a great way to store information.

I keep lots & lots of lists, and I've gone to doing everything in HTML, MS OneNote, MS InfoPath, and XML.

I know the type of documents I want to create--I just don't know how to create them.

 

[Fullmetal Chocobo]

Originally posted by: Wolfsraider
Ok

Like DHTML, LAMP and SPA, Ajax is not a technology in itself, but a term that refers to the use of a group of technologies

Ah ok I see, I have used dhtml and I dont see its much different than javascript or css but it has some differences that make it useful.

Sorry. I bought an AJAX book, but haven't gotten very far in it. You can borrow / use it if you want. I'm not using it, nor will I be any time soon. I'm looking for a VB or Office 2007 (for OneNote) book right now.

 

[Wolfsraider]

lol i know what i want but most of the different codes (ie css, html) all require you to adapt it their way or limit the amount of certain features used. I am hoping to beat these limitations. even if it means using 2 or 3 different versions (again css , html, asp etc)

 

[Wolfsraider]

What is one note ?

I like xml as far as flexibility in lists etc but thats all I have used it for, I am looking more for design than fuction here at this point.

 

[Wolfsraider]

google search indicates its a group editor for checking in and out so that you are not overwriting or losing information shared.

 

[Fullmetal Chocobo]

I am trying to create a collapsible <sp> tree-list document. Like windows explorer. Or it could be thought of as an outline document that can be collapsed at any level. I tried many different JS & J# versions, but I couldn't get any of them to work right. Which is a shame, because I'd love to be able to read & edit it while it was on the internet. InfoPath stuff works rather well, but you have to have the program to read it, which sucks And I haven't tried publishing OneNote notebooks online, so we'll see how that works.

I have quite a few books (ASP.NET, AJAX, etc) that you could borrow if interested. I'm not going to be using them.

 

[Wolfsraider]

Yeah thats one of the limitations I am refering to.

You can create the tree but unless its a standard tree or 2 levels at most you get problems.

I am trying to find something more flexible that can do more and WORKS lol

 

[Wolfsraider]

Its the same with css, tables are still more reliable for depth than css, sure there are workarounds but I dont like workarounds

The more code the slower the response becomes too!

 

[Fullmetal Chocobo]

Originally posted by: Wolfsraider
What is one note ?

I like xml as far as flexibility in lists etc but thats all I have used it for, I am looking more for design than fuction here at this point.

Microsoft OneNote is a program basically used for taking notes. It is a new program introduced in Office 2005 (I believe), but it's a primary component of Office 2007.

It's actually very impressive and one of the better features of Office 2007. In fact, it's the primary application I use for archiving 'please delete'. And there is a heirarchy to the documents that makes it useful for anal-retentive organized people like me.

You create a notebook, and you can type anywhere on the page--there is no left or right justification, so to speak. You can do lists, import screen images or portions of, links to web sites, etc.

If you want to try it, MS has a thing where you can try it for 2 months for free

EDIT: So far, I can pretty much get everything done with Infopath & OneNote. I love Infopath, because I can load up password protected docs on my web server, and edit them and everything else, so long as the computer I'm on has Infopath installed. And I haven't begun to reach the potental of the forms that you can create, which is wonderful for me.

 

[Wolfsraider]

Wow thank you d/l it now

 

[Fullmetal Chocobo]

I would also highly suggest trying out Infopath. There is a link there to do the trial 2-month free thing as well in there. If you have already dont work in some other languages, you shouldn't have a problem with it at all, once you get the format and methods down. It's more like VB than hard-coding langauges though. (I prefer the later) But it's amazing what you can do.

If you end up getting it, let me know, and I'll PM you the location of my forms so you can check them out and see what it possible. They are all functional, and haven't been made "pretty", but you'll get the point.

 

[Wolfsraider]

Cool tyvm I will look into that as well

 

[soni]

Seeing as no one answered your question about VB or C#.

There really isnt any difference besides the syntax of the language, so choose the language you know most about allready.
The learning curve will come when you have to lean the .Net Framework, but its the same for both languages.

For a cheap start, might i suggest you download Microsoft Visual WebDesigner Express, since its free.
A great way to start learning .Net for ASP.Net

If you are more into Linux, look into Mono and CSharpDeveloper, the .Net for *nix

 

[Wolfsraider]

Thank you! I will look into Microsoft Visual WebDesigner Express then

Much appreciated

 

[GLeeM]

There are also free "Express" versions of VB and C#.

 

[Wolfsraider]

Cool ty for the info You folks ROCK!!!!

 

[Evadman]

I learned ASP in less than a month. I do all my coding in a program called jEdit (free) it is great. If you need assistance, let me know and I would be happy to give you a hand, with ASP, SQL, whatever

Originally posted by: Fullmetal Chocobo
I know the type of documents I want to create--I just don't know how to create them.

Same goes for you or any other DC peeps. My RL job is MS SQL, VB, VBA, CSS, java, javascript, ASP, CSS, XML, DHTML, ajax, Ruby, XSLT, you name it.