Help decide between two cameras!

[Heidfirst]

Originally posted by: ElFenix

once we're talking about printing the size of the pixels has very little influence on noise. which is why pixel peeping is silly. the two largest factors influencing noise are size of the sensor and then the technological features of the sensor (i.e. what process it uses, gapless microlenses, amplifier noise, etc.). which is why crop sensors are now able to compete with the original 5D, with it's 3+ year old tech. the other silly thing about pixel peeping is that lower numbers of pixels will always appear to have less noise because they are less accurate.

there's also a difference in type of noise & how the human eye perceives it e.g..
"We were discussing the noise characteristics of the A900 and a point that Andy made, with which I agree, is that unlike some cameras the noise on the A900 is stochastic in nature. In other words, less grid-like and more random. This makes it much less objectionable to the human eye, and so when noise characteristics are compared numerically this perceptual nuance is not factored in, yet it can mean a considerable difference in the way that we perceive noise. In other words, noise with the A900 at higher ISOs (at least up to ISO 1600 when chroma noise starts to kick in), is visually less objectionable than it is on some other cameras which claim lower noise. More film like, and less digital in other words."
http://www.luminous-landscape....ameras/sony-a900.shtml

I've seen reviews over the years where a camera whose output looked better on screen than anothers looked worse when printed. I guess that part of the maker's optimisation also includes expected viewing medium & they may differ.
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[garritynet]

Well I decided against the E520. I am pretty much set on the Pentax K20D. I like the reviews and I like that its dust and water proof. I also like the way it looks, makes me exited just thinking about owning one. I live in Houston and it rains all the freakin time and without warning. Any objections to this camera? I know its outside my budget but that was an artificial budget, I decided to extend it.

 

[andylawcc]

Originally posted by: garritynet
Well I decided against the E520. I am pretty much set on the Pentax K20D. I like the reviews and I like that its dust and water proof. I also like the way it looks, makes me exited just thinking about owning one. I live in Houston and it rains all the freakin time and without warning. Any objections to this camera? I know its outside my budget but that was an artificial budget, I decided to extend it.

only thing I can say is, like owning an olympus, is the lack of an used-lens market.

 

[GoSharks]

Originally posted by: andylawcc
only thing I can say is, like owning an olympus, is the lack of an used-lens market.

Pentaxforums.com has a active FS board, but it is true that a there will be more activity in a Canon or Nikon community. There are plenty of old manual focus lenses that are usable though.

Garritynet, make sure that you understand the limitations of the sealing system - the body is sealed, but only the DA* lenses are also sealed.

 

[garritynet]

I have been reading reviews and thread on various forums all day long and its all starting to blur.

I will reconsider the XSi and the E520 after a nights sleep but I am really liking what I read about the K20D. At what point, as far as practical real world use, dose the K20D beat out the XSi in you guys opinions? Or dose it? I plan on buying the body alone and a single DA* lens. Not sure which one.

 

[GoSharks]

The K20D is in the class above the XSi.

 

[996GT2]

Yep. K2000D (K-M) is in the class with the Rebel XS, K200D is in the class with the XSi, and K20D is in the class with the D90, etc.

 

[ElFenix]

Originally posted by: garritynet
I have been reading reviews and thread on various forums all day long and its all starting to blur.

I will reconsider the XSi and the E520 after a nights sleep but I am really liking what I read about the K20D. At what point, as far as practical real world use, dose the K20D beat out the XSi in you guys opinions? Or dose it? I plan on buying the body alone and a single DA* lens. Not sure which one.

if you're only getting one... the 16-50 is sealed. it's $650. the other sealed zoom is the 50-135.

with a k200d you're looking at about ~$1100 for a sealed kit.



xsi and k20d are in separate classes. xsi is a small consumerific body. k20d is a two wheel semi pro body. it's quite a bit larger and competes more with the 40D and D90. real world use i'd be more confident of the k20d down near the gulf or shooting at wet high school football game.

 

[garritynet]

ElFenix- How about as far as IQ and noise? Any real world difference between those two?

 

[GoSharks]

I have a K200D that is most frequently paired with the DA* 16-50mm. The K200D maxes out at ISO 1600, whereas you have 3200 (and 6400 in a pinch) on the K20D.

http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/pentaxk200d/page15.asp
http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/pentaxk20d/page18.asp

 

[ElFenix]

Originally posted by: GoSharks
I have a K200D that is most frequently paired with the DA* 16-50mm. The K200D maxes out at ISO 1600, whereas you have 3200 (and 6400 in a pinch) on the K20D.

http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/pentaxk200d/page15.asp
http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/pentaxk20d/page18.asp

good old dpreview different crops of jpeg images with noise reduction applied, or not, noise test. possibly the worst noise test ever.



the pentax guys certainly love the k20d. i've not used one.

 

[GoSharks]

Well, I thought it would be reasonable to use their tests to compare between the K200D and K20D, which on second look is not what he was asking about.

I've used the K10D which shares the body with the K20D - it is certainly excellent in terms of control layout. In how much I like the grip on the body, it goes ist* DS>K200D>K10D=K20D. I wear a medium glove, so if your hands are larger you would probably find the K10D/20D better than I find it.

 

[garritynet]

Well I decided. I am going to get a K20D.

Any body know if this kit has the Pentax Mark II kit lens or if its probably a cheap-o lens since they don't specify. I am going to send them an email but I thought I would ask you guys anyway, just in case.

 

[ElFenix]

the k20d and k200d both have the better QC lens (sample variation was apparently the only difference, the tolerances on the new lens are much better).

 

[GoSharks]

AFAIK, the K20D and K200D kits come exclusively with the Mk II kit lens.