HELP! Biostar M7NCD Pro and Sapphire Radeon 9600 hate each other! - Partial solution found

[alexruiz]

Edited on Nov 19, 2003
I found the cause of the problem, but I still need some advice.... check last post please


I know the tilte sounds a little extreme, but I cannot think of anything less to decribe what is happening. The radeon 9600 was intended to replace a 9100 (fanless was key in the choice). System is Athlon XP 2500+ (no overclock), Biostar M7NCD Pro (Nforce 2 400 ultra), 512 MB Buffalo PC3200 CAS 2.5 (winbond BH5 chips) and powertek 500 W PSU

Well, I get the card and try to replace the 9100 in a system that is already working with no problems. I swap the card, and when I turn the power ON button, the system starts spinning the fans, but NO post, no video on the screen.

I check the conection, take the card out and reinsert it... same result. I notice that the power LED (computer ON) doesn't even turn ON , but the hardrive tries to work, fans spin and then system stops trying to access the disks.....

At first I thought "DOA", but then I decided to try it in a nother machine just to be sure (Athlon XP 1700+ palomino, ECS K7S5A). The card works perfectly in the other machine. I then try again in the biostar and same result: No post, no power LED.

I try some other cards in the biostar (sapphire radeon 9000 VIVO and Gigabyte GeForce 2 MX) and ALL of them work..... try the radeon 9600 again and NO luck! I tried also swapping power supplies between the 2 computers, but NO luck with either. I noticed also that my other cards have "3" sets of leads going in tyo the AGP slot (leads, groove, leads, groove, leads) while the radeon 9600 has only 2 (leads, groove, leads) so this means that the 9600 has leads where the others had a groove and make no contact witht he slot. I don't think this makes a difference (AGP 8x? maybe)

I am totally clueless here.... I need so me advice
Loose slot? power supply?

Help me please

Alex

 

[Killrose]

Do you have the latest bios for the M7NCD pro?

Also, try dissabling the shut down feature for CPU fan failure in bios. Maybe the 9600 is causing problems with the fan speed signal being sent? Usually on no video problems the system will fire up, and give one long, then quick double beep and hang with everything running(umm, I think). Thats what my limmited experince with these sort of problems tells me.

 

[NightRaven]

Did you switch to 8X AGP in the Bios?

 

[DAPUNISHER]

Hey Alex, *this is unrelated to the current problem* but did you ever check to see if you 9600 had the 2 ram chips on each side they said was responsible for it's terrible performance?

 

[alexruiz]

Originally posted by: DAPUNISHER
Hey Alex, *this is unrelated to the current problem* but did you ever check to see if you 9600 had the 2 ram chips on each side they said was responsible for it's terrible performance?

Yes, I checked the 9100 and it had ONLY 2 chips per side..... so it is the cause. This is a different card.

Back into the REAL problem.... I doi have the latest BIOS, but I need to check those failures modes.... and make sure that AGP 8X is enabled!

I will try to follow the directions here. Thanks

 

[Grovebaby]

I have very similar problem M7ncdp. Just put pc together. Same cpu and mem as yours. Have maddog predator GF4 card. At first it was fine, posted everything running. Didn't have floppy drive installed so I imediatly went into the bios and set to boot from cd. then went to run maxtor "maxblast" utility but it needs to start with floppy. So then put in Xp cd and started to setup. Setup started screwing up, couldn't find files (maxtor said that might happen) so decided to put floppy drive in. Also bought new flat panel monitor, so hooked that up too. went to start and no video signal. Just like yours the Hdd tries to do something but no post. thought maybe was because I had changed the boot sequence so I jumpered the cmos to set to default. nothing. tried different vid card, monitor, unhooked everthing but Hdd nothing. Help!

 

[alexruiz]

Originally posted by: Grovebaby
I have very similar problem M7ncdp. Just put pc together. Same cpu and mem as yours. Have maddog predator GF4 card. At first it was fine, posted everything running. Didn't have floppy drive installed so I imediatly went into the bios and set to boot from cd. then went to run maxtor "maxblast" utility but it needs to start with floppy. So then put in Xp cd and started to setup. Setup started screwing up, couldn't find files (maxtor said that might happen) so decided to put floppy drive in. Also bought new flat panel monitor, so hooked that up too. went to start and no video signal. Just like yours the Hdd tries to do something but no post. thought maybe was because I had changed the boot sequence so I jumpered the cmos to set to default. nothing. tried different vid card, monitor, unhooked everthing but Hdd nothing. Help!

Does the power LED turns ON, or remains OFF? Also, I think that IN YOUR specific case you have a loose connection in the AGP slot (It was working at first). You also tried a different video card and it doesn't work.

In my case, all the videocards work except the one I want.... By the way, how much memory do you have. I have a single 512 DIMM placed in the dimm slot closest to the CPU (The only ugrade planned for this baby is the additional stick later....)
I will try different memory, and I will try also placing my memory in a different slot....

I am suspicious that Biostar has issues in the AGP implementation. By the way, new BIOS (Oct 7, 2003) is NOT good. I am getting freezes in the OS here and there, and the only major change was a reflash in the MOBO. system was stable before that (I even reinstalled a ghost image of the fresh install with no drivers and it still froze, CPU temps at 39C)

 

[will889]

Biostar owners. Power down (and power off to PSU), clear cmos with AGP and ram, and battery out. Let sit 2 min. Move jumper back to save position Put stuff back in. Boot up, be sure to set optimized defaults. Now...set AGP apeture to 64, and only 64. Set fisrt boot VGA to AGP, not PCI, it's in another section of the bios - you'll find it. Alex, manually change the timings on your ram to 7-4-4 cas 2.5. Manually run your ram at 166/166. meaning use the multiplier in the drop down section (11.0x166). You also need to manually sync your ram @ 100% with your FSB @ 166 (so that your resulting freq=166) and this has to be done on expert settings. This should do it for you I hope. Try only i stick of ram in slot 1 for the install.

Grovebably I really suggest you temporarily get a floppy in your IDE chain to run low level on your maxblast - it will get you through the XP install. Minimal devices to install XP, meaning HDD on primary IDE as master (check jumper) and only obe rom device on secondary IDE - add other devices later - pull floppy device after you maxblast your HDD and get XP installed.

 

[alexruiz]

Originally posted by: Hoot
Biostar owners. Power down (and power off to PSU), clear cmos with AGP and ram, and battery out. Let sit 2 min. Move jumper back to save position Put stuff back in. Boot up, be sure to set optimized defaults. Now...set AGP apeture to 64, and only 64. Set fisrt boot VGA to AGP, not PCI, it's in another section of the bios - you'll find it. Alex, manually change the timings on your ram to 7-4-4 cas 2.5. Manually run your ram at 166/166. meaning use the multiplier in the drop down section (11.0x166). You also need to manually sync your ram @ 100% with your FSB @ 166 (so that your resulting freq=166) and this has to be done on expert settings. This should do it for you I hope. Try only i stick of ram in slot 1 for the install.
.

Wow, that was a deep process!! I will try it, but it assumes that I can see the screen, something that is not happening yet..... Anyway, I lose nothing trying it.....

thanks

Alex

 

[will889]

My bad Alex. Still try to clear your cmos, you might just get that screen

 

[alexruiz]

Originally posted by: Hoot
My bad Alex. Still try to clear your cmos, you might just get that screen

I already cleared that %*$&^% CMOS.....

 

[will889]

Sounds like a real compatibility problem with that paticular card and the mobo. Imm sure you tried the insert key and held it down as you powered up, then quicky hit the delete key?

 

[alexruiz]

Originally posted by: Hoot
Sounds like a real compatibility problem with that paticular card and the mobo. Imm sure you tried the insert key and held it down as you powered up, then quicky hit the delete key?

I haven't... I will try tonight.

 

[xSauronx]

my bro has a biostar board (has one rather...)

wouldnt work with ANY ati card

nvidia? not a aproblem at all. but ati is a no go.

i talked to another guy here on the forums, forget who, had a biostar and a ati card wouldnt work with it at all. got a different board from a different company. big pain in the ass, it would recognize the ati card in windows' but was impossible to keep from having an irq or resource conflict. absolutely impossible.

 

[alexruiz]

Well, after keep trying, I finally found the solution.

I noticed that if the video card is not fully inserted in the AGP slot, the system power LED remains ON. If I insert the video card completely in the AGP slot the system power LED never turns ON (short circuit somewhere?).

If the card is not fully inserted, the system is unable to post as there is no good contact (but system LEd ON). Well, I kept playing with how deep the card was inserted, and in some cases the card wasn't inserted evenly (well inserted in the part farther from the connectors, not well inserted in the part closer to the connectors or viceversa).

In those cases of not evenly inserted, usually the system power LED was ON, but the computer didn't post. I was very surprised that in one of those tries I heard the magic ?beep? meaning the system posted.... I see the screen, and yes, there is video signal. WinXP boots normally

The problem here is that after turning it OFF and turning it ON again the system again doesn't see the video card again (system LEd OFF, no post). Try to fumble again moving the video card until it posts again and works.

Because it seems there is a loose contact, or a short circuit I would like advice of how to keep it STEADY in the correct place. Screwing the card takes it out of the correct position. Do I need to ?tighten? the AGP slot? How do I do it? What can you suggest.


Thanks again

Alex

 

[Fern]

It seems odd that screwing in the card makes it pop out. Sounds like it's not in as well as should be. Just a guess, but use compressed air to clean out the agp slot. Maybe dust or something is fouling the slot.

 

[alexruiz]

Originally posted by: Fern
It seems odd that screwing in the card makes it pop out. Sounds like it's not in as well as should be. Just a guess, but use compressed air to clean out the agp slot. Maybe dust or something is fouling the slot.

I am also surprised that screwing the card takes it out of place. I am not really sure about the dust, as any other card works here, except the one that I want I will try it anyways!

Alex

 

[jjyiz28]

about those AGP notches this is what it means. im 99% sure on this

the orientation is when you plug the vid card in your comptuer.
one notch off center close to the outside case, means its a agp 1x/2x card board.
one notch off center close to inside of computer, agp 4x/8x.
if card/slot has both of those slots, its universal.

makes sense?? IE) lets say you have an older vid card thats 1x or 2x, and therefore has the notch closer to case.
you have a mobo that only supports 4x/8x, and it has one notch closer to inside. you try to put that card in this slot, it physically will not fit.