Help a noob build his first computer, get a cookie!

[Chocolate Pi]

I figure this 500 Mhz Celeron isn't going to last much longer, and I'd like to play a new game or two; surely at least one or two titles have been released since Age of Empires 2, the last thing I put on it!

So, I set out to look at Pentium 4 processors and boards. Right when I've got my board, processor, and PCIe graphics card all picked out, it comes to my attention that AMD has leapfrogged Intel and is better AND cheaper. (At least for games and other things I'd be doing) So I started looking at AMD XP processors and boards. Again, after I pick out what I want, I notice that those new-fangled 64-bit processors are actually within my budget; it certainly wasn't like that the last time I heard about them! So, I read up on the new chipsets, and found that PCIe 939 boards are just coming out. Perfect timing for me!

So here's the deal: I want to build a sub-$1000 computer with upgradability as the primary factor. Unless I am totally wrong on something, that means I want Socket 939 and PCIe, right? The GA-K8NXP-9 looks like exactly what I want, hopefully it will release soon. I reckon I can get a nice mobo and case, and spend less on parts that can be easily upgraded. Right now I'm looking at an Athlon 64 3200+. (Socket 939 again) and 512 MB DDR RAM.

Here's the first problem: RAM. Processors are simple, a handful of models in a simple lineup of price/preformance for each socket. But for RAM, there are several brands, and more importantly several (uh, I dunno what you call it, DDR400, DDR500, ect...), there are special models of RAM DIMMS, dual-channel, low latancy, something about #-#-#-# timings... I have no clue what is going on, I could use a RAM summary...

At this point I'll throw in that upon putting this together there is a 0% chance I will overclock it NOW, but I probably will in coming months, after I figure out what is going on. I'd like it to be a possibility, but not a priority.

Baco to my confusion. I have the opposite problem with hard drives. Unlike RAM, I know what all the numbers mean, but I don't know how to conenct it. RAM just pops in the DIMM slot. IDE, SATA, RAID, huh?

At least I get optical drives easily enough. Video card I can figure out after I get everything else taken care of as well.

Now we have the areas I know NOTHING about: Cases, cooling ,and power. All I know is that you put your ATX mobo and various drives in a big ATX case. Now, cases typically come with fans and a PSU, but apparently many people buy different ones. I know that you need your system to get enough watts, stay cool enough, and have "clean" power with little flux on the 3.3, 5, and 12v "rails". Great, so what does this mean to me? This case looks good, but I'm a noob and might have just been wowed by the pretty colors: RAIDMAX Black Aluminum Gaming Case Um, yeah, even the smallest amount of advice an any of these areas would be great.

Lastly, should I look at OEM parts? I get what it is, but don't know if they are for me or not. I mean, I'll probably buy the CPU retail so I can get the heatsink and fan for it, right? But I'll probably get the Windows CD OEM, and most hard drives on Newegg are OEM. What is okay to get OEM, and what needs things included in the retail package to work?

I deeply thank anyone who takes the time to help me out. I would give you those cookies, but Ad-Aware deleted them all, so I had to come up with this bad joke instead. Sorry.

 

[fstime]

Hello, here we go......

Yes you most def need to get a A64 939.

CPU: AMD 64 3200+ SOCKET 939
MOBO: ASUS A8N SLI http://www.zipzoomfly.com/jsp/...jsp?ProductCode=240418
(this motherboard has 2 PCI-e 16x slots, it allows you to purchase another graphics card when you feel the time to upgrade so you can have 2x gfx cards running as one..)
Video Card: Nvidia 6800NU/GT ( BFG,EVGA,LEADTEK are all good brand names)
RAM: (now in days you need a gig Corsair value select cas latency 2.5 PC3200 DDR400
PSU: Antec 420/480 watt true power
Case: Thermaltake Tsunami
Hard drive: Seagate 160 GB ( 5 yr warranty)
Sound card (optional): Sound blaster audigy 2 (zs)
DVD rom- Sony 16x
DVD-RW: http://www.newegg.com/app/View...=27-152-035&depa=0




That will give you a top of the line PC, if you want to go even further then that you could always get a 36GB raptor hardrive along with the seagate. The memory is fine if your not ocing, cas latency usualy donesnt affect performance as long as its under 3. Note this is good memory but it isnt overclokcing memory, its great if your not ocing though.


EDIT: I really really doubt you will find a 6800 series PCI-e card for a decent price, if not just go with a regular (non-sli) s939 PCI-e mobo with 1 PCI-e 16x slot and a 6600GT.

 

[Chocolate Pi]

I looked into SLI, and I don't think it will be for me. Although future upgrades is my focus, I can't see myself ever entering the "extreme" video card market where dual cards would be helpful. Even if I get one now and another as an upgrade, by that time I'd be wanting a new DirectX-10 card instead. SLI is not particularly needed, so I'll just stick with the Ultra chipset. I can waita while, so the current lack of them on the market is not an issue. That Gigabyte board I mentioned sounds like what I want.

I expect to get 512 RAM and it be my first upgrade in a few months. But what should I look for in my RAM purchase?

As for the case and PSU, what makes them better than any other, in both facts and opinions?

Thanks for your help.

 

[JediJeb]

Congrats on taking the plunge!

Here is a link to a thread about memory http://forums.anandtech.com/me...5190&enterthread=y

As for power supplies go to the home page and search for power supply roundup, Anand did a good review/roundup a while back, that will at least give you some basics to go from.

If starting from scratch like this I would look into serial IDE drives, look for some which are SATA II as they would be more future proof, if they are even out yet, if not then SATA. Not really a big performance increase over standard IDE but little difference in price and the technology will only become more prevailant as time goes by.

OEM should be OK, usually just means no pretty box or sometimes no manual, but if you can find the manual and drivers for what you want to buy online, then why not save a little over the retail version.

Im about to take the A64 leap myself so I am doing the same kind of research you are. I hope there are several good replies and advice here to help us both out.

 

[Anubis08]

If you do not plan on OC'ing value ram will work great and you should get DDR 400 as that is the highest supported by JEDEC standard (only if you're not oc'ing). I like my system to be reliable if I put money into it so I chose Kingston value ram, but there are several others who love corsair and mushkin. I would go with either kingston or corsair. Hope this helps and welcome to the forum.

 

[Chocolate Pi]

Another good reply, thanks! I'll look at that link and find that article.

As for OEM, the only reason I'm worried about it is that I noticed OEM processors don't come with heatsinks and fans. That would be bad, right? So are any other parts like that, or are processors the only component with something other than the retail box missing? What about cables to connect the parts?

Thanks again.

 

[Shenkoa]

COOKIE??? WHERE DO I SIGN UP HERE YA GO!

This setup is very nice yet cost effective.

CPU - Athlon 64 3200+ - http://www.newegg.com/app/View...=19-103-502&depa=0
MOBO - Asus VIA K8T800 Pro - http://www.newegg.com/app/View...=13-131-510&depa=0
RAM - 2X Corsair PC 3200 Cas 2.5 - http://www.newegg.com/app/View...=20-145-026&depa=0
Video card - Price effective 6600 GT - http://www.newegg.com/app/View...=14-145-107&depa=0
Sound card - Audigy 2 ZS - http://www.newegg.com/app/View...=29-102-178&depa=0
HDD - WD Raptor 10,000 RPM - http://www.newegg.com/app/View...=22-144-160&depa=0
Case - Anything made by Antec or Lian Li
PSU - Anything made by Antec, Enermax, Thermaltake
HSF - Anything is better then stock, but you wont need better unless your overclocking

 

[JediJeb]

The HardDrives will usually come without cables OEM, but most motherboards do have them included, just have to check what is listed as being in the box. The processor would be without heatsink if OEM, but you can get some that are both better cooling and quiter like the Zalman 7000ALCu or others, check the Cases and Cooling thread to learn more about your options here.

 

[fstime]

The corsair DDR400 PC3200 ram I mentioned above is great if your not ocing, cas 2.5, im running it right now. You should really get a gig but if you cant, get 1 512 stick so you can get another later on. The gigabyte mobo is fine, get that with a 6600GT, the PSU I mentioned is affordable, being less then $100 and is made by antec, they make very good quality PSUs. The case imo is simply a very nice case, based on the coolmaster wave master which is also nice. It seems its also very popular.

 

[Chocolate Pi]

I am quickly finding an attitude that any cooling device you get with something else sucks. Is this right? (Besides cases I've seen that advertise being bundled with name-brand PSUs)

 

[ts3433]

If you want PCIe, I would suggest the following:

3200+ Winchester retail ($200)
2x512MB Corsair or Mushkin value RAM ($140)
Chaintech VNF4/Ultra ($130)
Some sort of PCIe 6600GT or 6800 ($180-200; eVGA, Leadtek, and BFG are some good board makers)
Sound card not necessary ($0, use onboard) unless you have high-end speakers ($25 for a more music-oriented Chaintech AV710, ~$80-100 for an Audigy 2 for marginal gaming improvement)
7200RPM/8MB HD from WD, Seagate, or Samsung that fits your storage needs (IDE/SATA doesn't matter much) ($x)
Case + PSU: Try an Antec Sonata (quiet, 120mm fan!), Plus1080AMG, or PlusView1000AMG (windowed variant of Plus1080AMG). All include more-than-adequate Antec TruePower PSUs (380W single-fan in the Sonata, 430W in the Performance Plus AMG cases). If you choose a different case (Antec, Cooler Master, and Lian Li are frequently recommended; if you look at others, make sure they're sturdy, have enough room, and are well-ventilated), get a quality PSU from Antec, Enermax, Seasonic, or Fortron to go with it (Thermaltake is okay, but quality's a notch below those I mentioned).

 

[Chocolate Pi]

OK, so the general concensus is that the RAIDMAX case/PSU I mentioned isn't recommended? Most these other cases are kinda dull, though their sleek black or silver looks might fit well in an office. Can I not have flashy colors AND quality? I'm a stupid noob, me like flashy!

 

[SickBeast]

You didn't give anyone a cookie.

That's how it's supposed to be used, just an FYI.

 

[Chocolate Pi]

So my lame cookie joke didn't make up for a little gif? Drats, I didn't know it was THAT bad...

 

[ts3433]

The Raidmax PSU, like any generic, will be insufficient. You don't want to find out what a PSU like that can do to your components.

As for the case, get what you want, but you'll generally be sacrificing quality (and possibly quietness). This isn't recommended. I mentioned a few brands that are known to make cases of very good quality. (They make some of their cases premodded with side windows, too, but in most cases you won't get anything beyond black or silver.)

 

[Flightsim]

Shipping can be expensive, so you might want to buy some of your heavier parts such as the case and psu from local stores like COMPUSA or Best Buy. They sometimes have good deals on hard drives and cd drives too. Of course, their inventory will be much less than what a website like newegg has, but the money you save can be worth it or spent towards better parts. Just something you might want to look in to... and good luck by the way. Once you build your own computers, you'll never go back to Dell or something. I think they rip you off, and you don't get exactly what you want like when you build your own PC.

 

[fstime]

hmmmm if its the case that bothers you, you can always get something to your prefrence, the case you had above came with some cheapo powersupply, try to find somthing you like that comes w/out a psu, then buy the psu seperatly. Like the people above mentioned, get at LEAST a 400 watt: Antec, Enermax (expensive), Forton, Sparkle, or Thermaltake. 400-480 watts.

 

[Chocolate Pi]

Great; other than brand and wattage, what should I be looking for in a PSU? There are alot of numbers there... Should I also check reviews to see how much they vary on those 12v "rail" things too?

 

[fstime]

At least 18A on the 12 and your fine.

 

[ts3433]

Look at brand, but not necessarily wattage (measurement for it is largely nonstandardized and easily abused). Instead, look at the amperage on each of the three major rails (+3.3V, +5V, +12V) and make sure they're sufficient (mostly look at the +12V rail; the others should be sufficient already and generally won't differ much between models). You should have at least 18 to 20 amps on this rail. Anything above 24 is overkill. Also read reviews to see how "clean" the power is, how quiet the unit is, how much the voltages fluctuate (there's about a 5% tolerance level as per the ATX specification), etc.

 

[Shenkoa]

Where is my cookie?????

You will be hearing from my attorney!

Good luck with the system, check the parts out I mentioned, they are all very good and highly reccomended on this board.


This setup is very nice yet cost effective.

CPU - Socket 939 Athlon 64 3200+
MOBO - Socket 939 Asus VIA K8T800 Pro
RAM - 2X Corsair PC 3200 Cas 2.5
Video card - Price effective 6600 GT
Sound card - Audigy 2 ZS
HDD - WD Raptor 10,000 RPM or Maxtor DiamondMax Plus 10
Case - Anything made by Antec or Lian Li
PSU - Anything made by Antec, Enermax, Thermaltake
HSF - Anything is better then stock, but you wont need better unless your overclocking

 

[SickBeast]

Originally posted by: Chocolate Pi
So my lame cookie joke didn't make up for a little gif? Drats, I didn't know it was THAT bad...

No, you still don't seem to understand. Giving someone a cookie is an insult. You're supposed to respond to troll-posts with cookies as to prevent flame wars.

If only you knew how to draw one before I told you that, it would have been such a noble gesture. :brokenheart:

 

[Chocolate Pi]

...Drats. These cookie customs of these hardware forums still confound me... Should I make amends by giving out cookies now? Or would that be an insult, like you said... Brownies then? Chocolate pie? Or did I just make an insult by making another bad joke? So confused...

I'm used to giving posters "cookies" for really helping you out or saying something that brightened up your day. Trolls and flamers get "lame/10"s where I come from.

 

[SickBeast]

Originally posted by: Chocolate Pi
...Drats. These cookie customs of these hardware forums still confound me... Should I make amends by giving out cookies now? Or would that be an insult, like you said... Brownies then? Chocolate pie? Or did I just make an insult by making another bad joke? So confused...

I'm used to giving posters "cookies" for really helping you out or saying something that brightened up your day. Trolls and flamers get "lame/10"s where I come from.

How to make amends:
:beer:
:wine:
:gift:

How to burn bridges:

:evil:
:brokenheart:
:thumbsdown:

No chocolate pie emoticon, sorry.

 

[Shenkoa]