Help a Newb with a new computer

[Goothry]

Recently my older gaming laptop died on me, so now I get to build a new computer! I've decided to build one from the ground up because it seems the most fun, and cost effective relative to Dell (or other company) builds. What I'm after is solid advise on parts and questions I might have.

1. What YOUR PC will be used for. That means what types of tasks you'll be performing.
- I will be using this for gaming, searching the interwebs, watching videos, and possibly using it for work which involves a large quantity of data being pulled from a server.

2. What YOUR budget is.
- Ideally, $2k to 2.5k.

3. What country
-USA

4. IF YOU have a brand preference.
- Preferr, Intel and nVidia. Those are the two companies I know the most about (what ever that's worth), and feel comfortable with.

5. If YOU intend on using any of YOUR current parts.
- Only components/parts I plan on using are my exisiting keyboard/mouse, and using my 32 inch LCD as my monitor.

6. IF YOU have searched and/or read similar threads.
- I have searched some on what others have been doing, but I'm still a newb.

7. IF YOU plan on overclocking or run the system at default speeds.
- I don't nescessarily plan on overclocking. However, I'm not opposed to keeping this option open.

8. What resolution YOU plan on gaming with.
- Nothing fancy, 1080p.

9. WHEN do you plan to build it?
- I plan on building a new system within the current year.

Here is my proposal for a build:

1. Power supply: Silverstone Strider Gold ST85F-G 850W (170)
2. Case: Cooler Master HAF X Blue Edition RC-942-KKN3 (200)
3. Motherboard: Asus P8Z68 deluxe (270)
4. CPU: Intel Core i7-2600K (315)
5. Heatsink/fan for the CPU: Need Suggestions.
6. Memory: Open to suggestions. No idea what's good here.
7. Primary hard drive Intel 320 40GB (100)
8. Second hard Ddrive: Western Digital VelociRaptor 600GB 10k RPM (300)
9. Primary optical drive: ASUS Blue Ray Model BC-12B1ST/BLK/B/AS - OEM (70)
10. Video card: ASUS ENGTX580 GeForce 1536MB (500)
11. Operating System: Windows 7 Ultimate (180)

Please note that I'm after quality parts, not just the cheapest. I am willing to spend a few more dollars if it will last longer and perform better.

 

[Ken g6]

Start by reading Lehtv's post here. Much of the advice applies to your parts too. If you want to play BF3, 2x570 and a high-powered PSU might be worth it; otherwise probably not. Do not bother with a 580 - it's way overpriced for the performance it delivers.

CPU: Unless you're using a highly multi-threaded process to manipulate all that work data locally (not while pulling it from the server), just get a 2500K.

SSD : Crucial M4 64GB, or its 128GB cousin for $200.
Secondary hard drive: Hitachi deskstar 1TB. It's pretty fast, but if it's not fast enough, get two and RAID them. Also be aware that HDD prices [thread=2198560]are climbing rapidly[/thread].

 

[lehtv]

I plan on building a new system within the current year.

Are you going to start picking up parts immediately, or do you plan to buy everything at an unspecified time by the end of the year?

Do you want to order everything from one place; do you mind shopping from any of newegg, amazon, us.ncix or others, depending on the component? Also, do you have a Microcenter nearby?

I don't nescessarily plan on overclocking. However, I'm not opposed to keeping this option open.

Highly recommended that you do, overclocking SB is easy. Hey, it's free performance, why not

Please note that I'm after quality parts, not just the cheapest. I am willing to spend a few more dollars if it will last longer and perform better.

Noted.

1. Power supply: Silverstone Strider Gold ST85F-G 850W (170)
2. Case: Cooler Master HAF X Blue Edition RC-942-KKN3 (200)
3. Motherboard: Asus P8Z68 deluxe (270)
4. CPU: Intel Core i7-2600K (315)
5. Heatsink/fan for the CPU: Need Suggestions.
6. Memory: Open to suggestions. No idea what's good here.
7. Primary hard drive Intel 320 40GB (100)
8. Second hard Ddrive: Western Digital VelociRaptor 600GB 10k RPM (300)
9. Primary optical drive: ASUS Blue Ray Model BC-12B1ST/BLK/B/AS - OEM (70)
10. Video card: ASUS ENGTX580 GeForce 1536MB (500)
11. Operating System: Windows 7 Ultimate (180)

1. The PSU is overkill for one GTX 580, and just enough for two. Also, the Strider ST85F isn't that great (no -G suffix but can't find reviews on that one). Better high efficiency, modular choices: Corsair HX850, XFX 850w XXX, Antec HCP-850.

2. The HAF X is nice, but a full tower is hardly needed unless you're planning to Tri-SLI or to water cool a dual-GPU setup or something. I'd also consider a high quality mid-tower like Silverstone Raven RV02B-W, Corsair 500R, Silverstone FT01-BW. A good mid tower will be fine for a regular single or dual-GPU setup.

3. P8Z68-V Gen3 should be good enough.

4. 2500K vs 2600K: http://www.anandtech.com/bench/CPU/2 worth $100 for your purposes?

5. Thermalright HR-02, Silver Arrow, Archon, anything from Noctua, Scythe Mugen 3

6. 2x4GB DDR3-1600 CL9 1.5V

7. Could be bigger . E.g. Crucial M4 128GB.

8. Definitely not worth spending money on, the SSD will completely rape a Velociraptor. If you want more HDD space to benefit from fast reads and writes, set up an SSD as a cache for a 1TB HDD like Hitachi 7K1000.D.

9. Good, I suppose.

10. MSI GTX 570 Power Edition for over $100 less --> overclock to GTX 580. Or GTX 570 SLI. Or 6950 2GB Crossfire.

11. Is this needed for your work? Could potentially save $80 by going with Home Premium. Or if you need Pro features, could save $40.

 

[mfenn]

I agree with Ken and lehtv. The build you have their has the performance of an $1100 build but is dolled up to look like a $2100 one. Don't pick expensive parts "just because". You have to look at what they can actually do for you.

 

[Goothry]

Thanks for the suggestions! I'll be considering all of them before I make final cuts.

Here are a few things:
A) I choose the PSU power based on the possiblity of adding a second GPU (and/or other parts) later.
B) The SDD was going to be specifically for the operating system, and the HDD for storage of everything else.
C) The CPU was choosen based on a builder forum I read. It stated that if I like to multi-task and have a lot of programs/windows open I might want to choose the 2600k.
D) I choose the HAF X because of feed back I had read. While a full size tower may not be needed for this particular build, I don't want to limit myself with space should I choose to add more components, or build a new computer in the future.

Few things:

Lehtv, you say that the mother board I have choosen is "good enough." What, in your opinion, would be a better board to choose?

mfenn, what would you suggest I do to beef up my system to make it a 2k system that is worthy of a 2k price tag?

 

[lehtv]

Lehtv, you say that the mother board I have choosen is "good enough." What, in your opinion, would be a better board to choose?

I actually said that P8Z68-V would be good enough, as opposed to the expensive Deluxe version you had listed. Given that it's only $10 more at the moment, the P8Z68-V Pro is a good choice too.

Could you answer the below please?

Are you going to start picking up parts immediately, or do you plan to buy everything at an unspecified time by the end of the year?

Do you want to order everything from one place; do you mind shopping from any of newegg, amazon, us.ncix or others, depending on the component? Also, do you have a Microcenter nearby?

 

[dpodblood]

Holy OP you are throwing way to much money at this build! First up I would make the decision now whether or not you want 1 or 2 GPUs. Personally I find 2 GPUs aren't worth the hassle, particularly if you are only going to be running 1080p. But here is my recommendation whichever way you go:

Dual GPU: 2x HD 6950 w/ 850w PSU (If you are dead set against AMD for whatever reason go with the GTX 560Ti). Likely if you go with the 6950 you will be able to unlock the extra shaders effectively making them into 6970s.

Single GPU: GTX 570 w/ 650w PSU (or again if you aren't dead set against AMD go for a single HD 6950 and flash to 6970).

It would help if you can give us some idea of what games you plan on playing at at what detail settings. Currently there are very few games that necessitate a dual GPU set up. The Witcher 2, and Battlefield 3 would be the most prominent examples, but even so that would only be necessary at the highest graphical settings.

 

[Goothry]

I'll be buying my parts from online sources such as newegg. I don't have any microcenter nearby to buy parts from.

Holy OP you are throwing way to much money at this build! First up I would make the decision now whether or not you want 1 or 2 GPUs.

I'll be going with 1 GPU at the time I start to purchase parts. What I'm afraid of with the lower PSU is that I'll decide to get a second card (or add any other components such as more HDD/tvtuner/soundcard/ect.) at some later point in time and find that I have to once again buy a new PSU because the one I just bought is insufficient.

Games I would be playing include diablo3, bf3, sc2, and Elderscrolls.

Also, why AMD over Nvidia?

 

[lehtv]

I'll be buying my parts from online sources such as newegg. I don't have any microcenter nearby to buy parts from.

OK.

So here's the deal. A gaming PC that will handle every game on high settings (single-GPU), can be had for about $1200 without compromising substantially on features, overclockability, reliability, build quality. Most things above that I would consider to fall under the banner of "diminishing returns" in terms of the practical benefit you get. Some examples.

Standard HDD ---> WD Raptor. Not well spent money at all when the OS is already on an SSD.
Mid-range dual-GPU motherboard ---> "High-end" motherboard. Usually a mid-range board has everything you need and is reliable and overclockable (Sandy-Bridge).
2500K ---> 2600K. No difference in gaming and little difference in most other tasks.
1600Mhz CL9 memory ---> faster memory. Difference practically nonexistent on SB.

However, it is possible to spend more on something useful. Examples: SLI/Crossfire. Dedicated sound card. Case (long-term investment). High-end cooler for OC purposes. Storage space. Blu-ray.

Also, why AMD over Nvidia?

AMD dual-GPU scaling is better, but it I think that NVIDIA cards have less microstutter (Tom's hardware).

Now I'll give you a list of recommendations, keeping in mind that there won't be compromises in quality, reliability or features:

Mobo Asus P8Z68-V Pro Gen3 $208
CPU 2500K $215
Cooler Thermalright HR-02 Macho $50
RAM Mushkin Frostbyte 2x4GB 1600 $49 ($39 AR)
GPU MSI 570 Power Edition $362 OR 2x XFX 6950 2GB $560 ($500 AR) OR 2x Gigabyte GTX 570 $690 ($630 AR)
Sound Asus Xonar DX $80 ($60 AR)
HDD Hitatchi 1TB 7K1000.D $106 OR Hitachi 2TB 7K3000 $157
SSD Crucial M4 64GB $110 or M4 128GB $200 (faster & bigger)
ODD Asus Blu-ray $69
PSU XFX 850W XXX $140 ($110 AR)
Case Cooler Master HAF 932 Blue $190 OR Cooler Master HAF X Blue $220 (cos u wanted it)
OS Windows 7 Home Premium OEM $100

Total = $1679 ($1639 AR) to $2178 ($2068 AR), shipping included.

The prices of 1TB drives seem to have gone up considerably

XFX would be my personal choice for 6950 crossfire due to the design of the cooler (not too open, two very open cards like MSI would dump more heat inside the case) and the transferable lifetime warranty.

Not sure if the cords on the XFX PSU are long enough for HAF X. Should ask XFX... If they're not, then Corsair TX850 V2 $120 AR or Corsair HX850 $150 AR.

If needed, I would put any leftover money towards peripherals. E.g. a 120hz monitor or an IPS panel, or Das Keyboard Model S Professional Silent, or good headphones.

 

[T_Yamamoto]

HDD's are going up due to the flooding in Thailand

 

[lehtv]

HDD's are manufactured in Thailand...? OK. Or buttefly effect?

 

[mfenn]

HDD's are manufactured in Thailand...? OK. Or buttefly effect?

Some of it is flooding in Thailand. The rest is vendors captializing on the panic and gouging because they can.

 

[mfenn]

mfenn, what would you suggest I do to beef up my system to make it a 2k system that is worthy of a 2k price tag?

Lehtv beat me to it:

Mobo Asus P8Z68-V Pro Gen3 $208
CPU 2500K $215
Cooler Thermalright HR-02 Macho $50
RAM Mushkin Frostbyte 2x4GB 1600 $49 ($39 AR)
GPU MSI 570 Power Edition $362 OR 2x XFX 6950 2GB $560 ($500 AR) OR 2x Gigabyte GTX 570 $690 ($630 AR)
Sound Asus Xonar DX $80 ($60 AR)
HDD Hitatchi 1TB 7K1000.D $106 OR Hitachi 2TB 7K3000 $157
SSD Crucial M4 64GB $110 or M4 128GB $200 (faster & bigger)
ODD Asus Blu-ray $69
PSU XFX 850W XXX $140 ($110 AR)
Case Cooler Master HAF 932 Blue $190 OR Cooler Master HAF 932 X Blue $220 (cos u wanted it)
OS Windows 7 Home Premium OEM $100

Total = $1679 ($1639 AR) to $2178 ($2068 AR), shipping included.

A couple of comments on the above are:
- Get the 6950 2GB for the best high-end "value" (relatively speaking)
- Get the GA-Z68XP-UD3 for $150 because it's a better value while maintaining x8/x8 PCIe and USB 3.0 front panel
- G.Skill DDR3 1333 8GB is $35 with no rebate
- The Antec EA-750 is $70 AR and can have up to the full 750W on the 12V

 

[lehtv]

Yeah that mobo is a good choice too. It's not Gen3 however, and no UEFI BIOS and Bluetooth. Worth $50? Maybe not.

The cords on the Antec EA750D are not sleeved and the package lacks a power cord. Only 3 year warranty. The XFX 750W non-modular at $70 AR is a better deal, 5 year warranty. Again, assuming the cords are long enough for a HAF X. If they're not, then TX 750 V2 $95 AR (I'd get 850W for 570 SLI though).

 

[mfenn]

Good deal on the XFX 750W! That gets a :thumbsup: from me.

 

[Goothry]

Solid suggestions guys. Thanks a bunch!

Alright, here is what I was thinking. I'll probably get lazy and never upgrade to two GPUs so I'll stay at one. Additionally, I can then take the PSU back a few notches.

I plan to OC the CPU, so question on coolers. Would it be worth it to buy into WC? The reason I never considered it was because it seemed like too much trouble. However, I was looking over the corsair H60, H80, H100 article, and they seem to be relatively easier to deal with. Would these, or some other cooler like them, be good options? I am willing to spend a few more bucks on piece of mind for the cooler option.

How reliable would this option be? In your opinion is this a good investment? Or, is it highly suggested to stick with the suggested fan cooling systems you guys have pointed out?

I would appreciate your thoughts and comments.

 

[Goothry]

Another thought occured to me regarding harddrives. How much of an advantage is having a seperate SSD for the operating system vs. just using one HDD?

 

[lehtv]

Hi again

I can then take the PSU back a few notches.

PSU http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16817207014
Mobo http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813157279 or http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131773

I plan to OC the CPU, so question on coolers. Would it be worth it to buy into WC?

Personally I think it's just too much work, an aircooled system is reasonably quiet and cool if set up properly. Given how many good aftermarket CPU coolers there are that are overclocker-friendly while being reasonably quiet, I would say water cooling is most appealing for multi-GPU setups where the intention is for the system to be quiet at full GPU load.

How much of an advantage is having a seperate SSD for the operating system vs. just using one HDD?

A pretty big advantage. It'll speed up the whole operating system and programs you have installed on the SSD, and make the system feel so much snappier you'll never want to go back to HDD only. On your budget, build wouldn't be complete without one.

 

[ElFenix]

Solid suggestions guys. Thanks a bunch!

Alright, here is what I was thinking. I'll probably get lazy and never upgrade to two GPUs so I'll stay at one. Additionally, I can then take the PSU back a few notches.

I plan to OC the CPU, so question on coolers. Would it be worth it to buy into WC? The reason I never considered it was because it seemed like too much trouble. However, I was looking over the corsair H60, H80, H100 article, and they seem to be relatively easier to deal with. Would these, or some other cooler like them, be good options? I am willing to spend a few more bucks on piece of mind for the cooler option.

How reliable would this option be? In your opinion is this a good investment? Or, is it highly suggested to stick with the suggested fan cooling systems you guys have pointed out?

I would appreciate your thoughts and comments.

those integrated water cooler setups aren't any better at cooling than a high end air cooler, and are often worse.

 

[s44]

Why the Xonar? There's an small set of setups for which it makes sense, and HDMI to a TV is not one of them.

Definitely get a SSD. But if you get 64gb or less, set it up as a cache and not as a boot drive.

edit -- only game that will tax the vidcard is BF3; a single 570 will destroy the others. It will also do reasonably well on Ultra, though if you want ~60fps with MSAA you'll probably want a pair of them. I'd get a single one and spend the other $300 on Kepler in 6 months, though...

 

[mfenn]

those integrated water cooler setups aren't any better at cooling than a high end air cooler, and are often worse.

Agree. The Anandtech review today pretty much confirms it.

 

[mfenn]

Hi again

PSU http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16817207014
Mobo http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16813131773

Personally I think it's just too much work, an aircooled system is reasonably quiet and cool if set up properly. Given how many good aftermarket CPU coolers there are that are overclocker-friendly while being reasonably quiet, I would say water cooling is most appealing for multi-GPU setups where the intention is for the system to be quiet at full GPU load.

A pretty big advantage. It'll speed up the whole operating system and programs you have installed on the SSD, and make the system feel so much snappier you'll never want to go back to HDD only. On your budget, build wouldn't be complete without one.

:thumbsup: to all of this. I would say to go with the P8Z68-V LE since you are getting a case with USB 3.0.

 

[Goothry]

Ok, it was more of an after thought on a WC. I wasn't sure so I thought I should ask.

That's it for questions atm, although I'm sure I'll be back here in a day or two once I start thinking the build over again.

Also, while I have a few extra mins, I just wanted to give a special thanks to lehtv and mfenn, you guys have been more than helpful entertaining my questions. I would also like to thank ss4, El Fenix, T Yamamoto, dpodblood, and ken g6 for their input as well.

If you have any other suggestions, or questions regarding suggestions you might make, I'll be checking the forums with some regularity.

 

[mfenn]

Glad that we could help. Update this thread before you buy so that we can spot check it for last-minute deals.

 

[Goothry]

Here is an update as of now:
CPU 2500k (219)
RAM CORSAIR Vengeance 8GB (49)
PSU CORSAIR Professional Series HX650 (120)
HDD HITACHI Deskstar 7K1000.D (150)
SSD Crucial M4 CT128M4SSD2 2.5" 128GB (208)
Case COOLER MASTER HAF X (180)
OS Microsoft Windows 7 Home (100)
ODD Asus Blu-ray (68)
GPU TBD
Sound TBD
MoBo TBD
Cooler Noctua NH-C12P SE14 140mm SSO CPU Cooler (75)

The 3 GEN board that was recommended is out of stock, or at least on newegg. I'm trying to limit buying from too many places, especially since I'm unfamiliar with a few of the ones that have been used in links.

For GPU I was considering the ASUS ENGTX570 DCII GeForce GTX (350) Although, I'm starting to sway toward an AMD card, which I know even less about. I'm looking for a single card solution that will let me run games at max or near max (for the given res), but stay reasonable price wise relative to my other parts.

The sound card I might skip over until a later date.

As for the cooler, I might change that. If I had to guess what you're going to say about it is, "Is the extra 25 worth it?" To which I reply with this: :|

PSU wise I choose because of the modular design, and positive reviews.

I'm trying very hard to resist being stubborn! Options like those 2600k and 580 GPU are so shinny!

Price ATM: $1519

To throw in a place holder MoBo I'll use the ASUS P8Z68-V PRO LGA 1155 (210)

Additionally, I'll more than likely throw in D-Link DWA-556 for wireless networking (50).

Current est. end price: $1779