Health insurance costs for 2014 - didn't expect that

[spinejam]

So this mandated insurance that I'll be purchasing soon will have no deductibles / low co-pays right?

 

[techs]

http://kff.org/report-section/2013-summary-of-findings/

The key findings from the survey, conducted from January through May 2013, include modest increases in premiums for both single coverage (5%) and family coverage (4%). Covered workers generally face similar premium contributions and cost-sharing requirements in 2013 compared to 2012. However, the percentage of covered workers enrolled in plan with a general annual deductible increased in 2013, to over three quarters of covered workers (78%). Additionally, over half (58%) of covered workers at small firms (3-199 workers) now have a deductible of a $1,000 dollars or more. The percentage of firms (57%) which offer health benefits to at least some of their employees and the percentage of workers covered at those firms (62%) are statistically unchanged from 2012. The percentage of covered workers enrolled in grandfathered health plans – those plans exempt from many provisions of the Affordable Care Act (ACA) – declined to 36% of covered workers from 48% in 2012 and 56% in 2011. Firms offering health benefits continue to offer wellness and health promotion programs: 77% of firms offer at least one wellness program, 24% offer employees health risk assessments, and 57% offer at least one disease management program. Small percentages of these firms use financial incentives in order to encourage workers to participate or complete these activities.

In 2013, the average annual premiums for employer-sponsored health insurance are $5,884 for single coverage and $16,351 for family coverage. The single premium is 5% higher and the family premium is 4% higher than the 2012 average premiums. During the same period workers’ wages increased 1.8% and inflation increased 1.1%.2 Over the last 10 years, the average premium for family coverage has increased 80% (Exhibit A).

 

[Engineer]

Let people buy what they can afford. If they only want major medical, they should be able to buy that. I shouldn't have to pay for your Viagra, nor should you be paying for my birth control or pregnancy care.

Let people buy out of state. Let's get some competition going to drive DOWN the cost of coverage, which will encourage more people to buy.

Well, good luck.

Other items that you might like to help reduce costs:


Hospitals and medical clinics can tell you to fuck off if you can't pay up front (or don't have insurance). That will surely drive costs down for the rest that can afford care as the care providers won't have to pass on the costs from the 'dead'beats.

Offer financing but make it like student loans in that it can never be discharged via bankruptcy. That way, the rest of the paying customers won't have to pay for these non-paying assholes. Also allow the care providers to go after immediate family, possessions or garnish wages if payment is not received (from financing) in a timely manner.

Unrestricted abortions as they would be much cheaper than the resulting pregnancies. Otherwise, if you can't afford the pregnancy, you can see the rule above (unless you can find someone willing to pay your bill - maybe in return to allow them to adopt your child).

Allow unlimited, foreign doctors to enter the country on visas, especially ones from low wage countries since they will often lower compensation. Also allow other foreign workers in such as nurses, janitors, etc. to help lower the costs.

Remove all lawsuits (patient must sign consent form before treatment - you wan't treatment, sign the form and pay up front) so that doctors don't have to carry malpractice insurance.

Lower standards down for hospitals as far as cleanliness, disposal of hazardous stuff, etc.

Require a published, up front price list for all procedures.

 

[alkemyst]

Let people buy what they can afford. If they only want major medical, they should be able to buy that. I shouldn't have to pay for your Viagra, nor should you be paying for my birth control or pregnancy care.

Let people buy out of state. Let's get some competition going to drive DOWN the cost of coverage, which will encourage more people to buy.

This goes back to the idea that "I don't have kids so why do I have to pay for schools in my property taxes!?!"

In England, insurance is awesome. The doctor actually greets you in lobby and you aren't waiting normally other than for true emergencies. They don't over book there.

What we have done was allow for BS lawsuits and allowed our health care providers to charge too much. Sadly now many of those doctors are able to say no to malpractice insurance and are able to file bankruptcy to save their ass for true medical errors.

It's one thing you get blinded in LASIK for instance. That shit happens. It's another thing when the doctor leaves sponges inside you or cuts off the wrong limb.

I really don't get the insurance debate other than people want something for nothing.

At around 18 I started carrying my own Blue Cross / Blue Shield plan. My car payment was $225 at the time (1990), my insurance payment was $125 and by 23 or so around $175 a month. I then landed a job with group coverage at around $50 a month for about the same coverage.

 

[Red Squirrel]

It's this stuff that makes me happy to be Canadian. If I need medical help, I just go and get it, and don't have to even think about the financial side of it.

 

[techs]

Well, good luck. Might throw in there that hospitals and medical clinics can tell you to fuck off if you can't pay up front (or don't have insurance). That will surely drive costs down for the rest that can afford care as the care providers won't have to pass on the costs from the 'dead'beats.

We used to do that. Then those muckraking newspapers were printing stories daily about people who were left to die outside hospitals because they didn't have insurance or cash to pay for treatment.

People just don't have the guts to let a seven year old die on the steps of an emergency room because the parents didn't have the 25 dollars for asthma medication.

Of course there are those instances where a person might be brought to an ER without their wallet or i.d. Just because a few hundred thousand people might be refused treatment and die becuase they didn't have their wallet people got all upset.

We must be strong and accept that people will die needlessly once we go back to the policies of the 1930's.

 

[alkemyst]

I don't know. I do know this though....if we don't do something, the people, as they lose more and more, will take it themselves. It's already happening and will get worse as time goes on.

You can cheer lead the profits and more of them but you will get a socialist state at some point (just like job offshoring). Hope you enjoy the results...and Obamacare is just a start.

OH, and I'll say this though: I was referring to insurance company profits in my original postings above, not so much R&D. Any time you have a middle man taking a large share for very little value added service, you get a shitty system like we have now. There is no reason whatsoever that an acetaminophen tablet should cost $10 at a hospital....none.

Because every 1 person that can pay for the pill has 20 or more behind them that want it free.

 

[nickbits]

It's this stuff that makes me happy to be Canadian. If I need medical help, I just go and get it, and don't have to even think about the financial side of it.

Not me. I think it stinks. You get what you pay for.

 

[Engineer]

We used to do that. Then those muckraking newspapers were printing stories daily about people who were left to die outside hospitals because they didn't have insurance or cash to pay for treatment.

People just don't have the guts to let a seven year old die on the steps of an emergency room because the parents didn't have the 25 dollars for asthma medication.

Of course there are those instances where a person might be brought to an ER without their wallet or i.d. Just because a few hundred thousand people might be refused treatment and die becuase they didn't have their wallet people got all upset.

We must be strong and accept that people will die needlessly once we go back to the policies of the 1930's.

So? As long as it makes it cheaper for those that can afford it and more profitable for the providers, what's the problem?

 

[Engineer]

Because every 1 person that can pay for the pill has 20 or more behind them that want it free.

Fuck em. Let them eat cake.

 

[alkemyst]

Fuck em. Let them eat cake.

I would agree, but they are the ones that wouldn't get on Medicaide while our nation decided to change instead of require.

 

[Engineer]

I would agree, but they are the ones that wouldn't get on Medicaide while our nation decided to change instead of require.

Get rid of Medicaid and Medicare. People need to start paying for their own damn care. Fuck em. If you can't afford it, sorry about your luck.

 

[alkemyst]

Get rid of Medicaid and Medicare. People need to start paying for their own damn care. Fuck em. If you can't afford it, sorry about your luck.

Umm we are paying for Medicare!

 

[sixone]

Well, good luck.

Other items that you might like to help reduce costs:


Hospitals and medical clinics can tell you to fuck off if you can't pay up front (or don't have insurance). That will surely drive costs down for the rest that can afford care as the care providers won't have to pass on the costs from the 'dead'beats.

Hospitals cannot legally turn away a person with a life-threatening issue.

I have a friend who chooses not to have health insurance. She was hospitalized for four days, with diverticulitis. $40,000 bill was in part written off by the hospital, and the rest was paid by a local charity.

Offer financing but make it like student loans in that it can never be discharged via bankruptcy. That way, the rest of the paying customers won't have to pay for these non-paying assholes. Also allow the care providers to go after immediate family, possessions or garnish wages if payment is not received (from financing) in a timely manner.

There will always be some who can't pay, and who aren't deadbeats. We've been trying to eradicate poverty for decades now, and it's not going anywhere, either.

Going after relatives will never fly, and shouldn't.

Unrestricted abortions as they would be much cheaper than the resulting pregnancies. Otherwise, if you can't afford the pregnancy, you can see the rule above (unless you can find someone willing to pay your bill - maybe in return to allow them to adopt your child).

Never happen.

Allow unlimited, foreign doctors to enter the country on visas, especially ones from low wage countries since they will often lower compensation. Also allow other foreign workers in such as nurses, janitors, etc. to help lower the costs.

Remove all lawsuits (patient must sign consent form before treatment - you wan't treatment, sign the form and pay up front) so that doctors don't have to carry malpractice insurance.

Lower standards down for hospitals as far as cleanliness, disposal of hazardous stuff, etc.

Only if they are accredited by a private medical certification system. We should get rid of licensing altogether, and eliminate any kind of government involvement. People should instead be directed to a licensing system that is accountable, if a physician or staff is incompetent, negligent, or fraudulent.

Require a published, up front price list for all procedures.

Goes to far. Require a written estimate for any procedure beyond a simple office visit, to be presented at the time the doctor recommends it. Patient can shop if they like - but probably won't.

 

[sixone]

It's this stuff that makes me happy to be Canadian. If I need medical help, I just go and get it, and don't have to even think about the financial side of it.

That's because you're young and healthy. I bet you won't be singing the same tune in 30 years.

 

[Engineer]

Umm we are paying for Medicare!

Not enough to cover the costs though. End it.

 

[alkemyst]

Not enough to cover the costs though. End it.

It's the way most of our programs work like a typical gym membership. Even regular insurance relies on more people paying in than using it.

With ObamaCare like Medicaid you will have more and more using every opportunity to get doctor's notes and other BS. There is a reason Medicaid now limits you to one or two visits per person month now unless medically necessary.

The 'medically necessary' part is scary to me. I rarely go to a doctor now...as I age I am sure that will increase. Also will I get told at 75 if I need a hip replacement; it's not financially prudent to give me one?

You aren't seeing the forest through the trees.

I personally have no problem paying for my healthcare out of my pocket and relying on keeping a group-policy job to do it effectively.

 

[Engineer]

Hospitals cannot legally turn away a person with a life-threatening issue.

I have a friend who chooses not to have health insurance. She was hospitalized for four days, with diverticulitis. $40,000 bill was in part written off by the hospital, and the rest was paid by a local charity.

It should have been tough luck then. The $40,000 was passed on to the rest of the actual paying customers. She should have died.

There will always be some who can't pay, and who aren't deadbeats. We've been trying to eradicate poverty for decades now, and it's not going anywhere, either.

Again, sorry about their luck. Why should their inability to pay drive up the costs for those that can afford care?

Going after relatives will never fly, and shouldn't.

Spouse and immediate children should be responsible for the bill. Make it part of the finance contract. The rest of the paying people shouldn't have to eat it nor should the care providers and their share holders.

Never happen.

Should be provided as a cheaper alternative. Otherwise, the pregnant mom and resulting baby should be denied care if the mother can't pay or someone else is paying for her.

Only if they are accredited by a private medical certification system. We should get rid of licensing altogether, and eliminate any kind of government involvement. People should instead be directed to a licensing system that is accountable, if a physician or staff is incompetent, negligent, or fraudulent.

Set up a voluntary 'Doctors List' like 'Angie's list'. Much cheaper and will give actual testimony from those that have used the services.

Goes to far. Require a written estimate for any procedure beyond a simple office visit, to be presented at the time the doctor recommends it. Patient can shop if they like - but probably won't.

Other businesses are stuck playing by that rule. Put your price list out there and people can take it or leave it.

I can feel the savings already.

 

[Engineer]

It's the way most of our programs work like a typical gym membership. Even regular insurance relies on more people paying in than using it.

Gym goes out of business if it loses money. Medicare is losing money. Time to go out of business. If the people don't have enough money for care, fuck em.

 

[sixone]

It should have been tough luck then. The $40,000 was passed on to the rest of the actual paying customers. She should have died.

Clearly you're no longer capable of having a civil discussion. Please take the earliest opportunity to fuck off.

 

[Engineer]

Clearly you're no longer capable of having a civil discussion. Please take the earliest opportunity to fuck off.

I just made health care cheaper for those that can afford it. What, you don't like the results? Just because your deadbeat friend didn't buy insurance and cover herself should not force the rest of the paying customers to pay for her care, you don't like the results?

Too bad....you asked for ideas and I'm giving you exactly what you wanted. Just because it's your friend, you now change the rules. Sorry....she should have had to pay up front since she CHOSE to not get insurance. Tough luck.

 

[sixone]

I just made health care cheaper for those that can afford it. What, you don't like the results? Just because your deadbeat friend didn't buy insurance and cover herself should not force the rest of the paying customers to pay for her care, you don't like the results?

Too bad....you asked for ideas and I'm giving you exactly what you wanted. Just because it's your friend, you now change the rules. Sorry....she should have had to pay up front since she CHOSE to not get insurance. Tough luck.

Cheaper isn't good enough. The goal for the whole mess is BETTER for everyone, not just for the people you deem worthy.

Why don't you work on some WORKABLE ideas, instead of trying to regurgitate other peoples in order to smear them with it? You're not a politician, stop acting like one.

 

[Engineer]

Cheaper isn't good enough. The goal for the whole mess is BETTER for everyone, not just for the people you deem worthy.

Why don't you work on some WORKABLE ideas, instead of trying to regurgitate other peoples in order to smear them with it? You're not a politician, stop acting like one.

Regurgitate? Your ideas came directly from the current GOP 'replacement' of Obamacare playbook. Many of my ideas came from directly from me. You don't like them because it involved your friend?

I guess in your world, since you think insurance is the best answer, that those that cannot afford insurance are not deemed worthy.

My ideas would provide not only cheaper healthcare for those that can afford it, it would provide higher profits for the care providers since they would be paid and not have to write off the deadbeats.

The profits could then provide even better treatments for the people who can afford it.

Win - win for those involved.

The rest, can either do something about their lives to upgrade them and get insurance (or choose to buy it) or hope that the charities out there will take care of them. My church just opened a free health care clinic in Haiti. Maybe we could get the churches to do the same for those here who cannot afford to buy their healthcare.

 

[sixone]

Regurgitate? Your ideas came directly from the current GOP 'replacement' of Obamacare playbook. Many of my ideas came from directly from me. You don't like them because it involved your friend?

You said my friend should have been refused care, and allowed to die. Great idea - and you just claimed it for your own.

This is exactly why nothing gets done well, in DC. Like most politicians, you're more worried about who's supporting an idea than whether it's an improvement over what we have now. Unfortunately, most voters do that shit, too.

The fathers of our Constitution tried to protect us from people like you.

 

[Engineer]

You said my friend should have been refused care, and allowed to die. Great idea - and you just claimed it for your own.

This is exactly why nothing gets done well, in DC. Like most politicians, you're more worried about who's supporting an idea than whether it's an improvement over what we have now. Unfortunately, most voters do that shit, too.

The fathers of our Constitution tried to protect us from people like you.

She had an option to buy insurance. Why should the paying customers pick up her tab (and don't be so blind to think that the hospital didn't pass that on to the paying customers including any costs involved in trying to collect the payment from her). To keep her from dying (since she couldn't pay), you (and other friends and family) could have paid the bill for her? Why didn't you?

If someone doesn't buy insurance or cannot pay for the services, should they be given treatment for whatever they come down with and have it written off?